I suspect they have subsidised the cost anyway. Coaches are expensive and would be more than 22quid pp for a 300+ mile round trip
No they haven't! I've done coaches in the past and know lads that do them regularly for QPR, they'll pay £20 a head, can booze on it etc... But that said £22 isn't that bad, if you're prepared to sit on a coach all that time an extra £5 won't break the bank... For the record my minibus has worked out at £30 a head
I wasn't planning on taking the coach as I normally drive or take the train, but the last time I took the coach (a long time ago admittedly!) it was 'the' Blackburn game, and I caught it at Watford Gap services; a fair number of people got on there. I presume there isn't enough business from 'norf' of the river to justify a stop there any more?
Is 42quid for a ticket and transport unreasonable? Ffs course it ain't
Of course not, but that's the wrong question. The issue is what price maximises the club's ticket and travel revenue combined, whether or not a lower price would increase take-up and whether it matters if we sell out anyway.
I wasn't planning on taking the coach as I normally drive or take the train, but the last time I took the coach (a long time ago admittedly!) it was 'the' Blackburn game, and I caught it at Watford Gap services; a fair number of people got on there. I presume there isn't enough business from 'norf' of the river to justify a stop there any more?
Makes no difference whatsoever. They just haven't thought of advertising it. Should do Lakeside Services, too. If you ring up and ask them to put it on there's no practical reason they wouldn't be able to add it.
I suspect they have subsidised the cost anyway. Coaches are expensive and would be more than 22quid pp for a 300+ mile round trip
They have not subsidised it. Quite the contrary. Check Airman Brown's posts on the subject. And nobody on here knows more about the subject than him!
But why should they? It's a business as well not a charity. Club needs to make a bit of dosh.
Proper businesses make dosh by delighting their customers so that they are happy to part with their readies again and again.
This business could have said "sorry, we are not kicking off at this day and time, because it is unreasonable to ask our customers to get up at 05.00 just to go to a frigging football match in the middle of the country"
To which the answer will have been "OK so you lose £250,000 in TV money." which is not a small amount in our current state.
So this business could have said to its customers "look, sorry to do this to you, but by accepting this ridiculous kick off time we get a whole load of dosh we would not get otherwise. But as a gesture of how much we value you as customers we are going to use 5% of this money to help get you there at a reasonable price"
That is what a properbusiness would do.
(purely my personal opinion BTW)
any chance of a real-life example of this 'proper business' to which you refer?
I wasn't planning on taking the coach as I normally drive or take the train, but the last time I took the coach (a long time ago admittedly!) it was 'the' Blackburn game, and I caught it at Watford Gap services; a fair number of people got on there. I presume there isn't enough business from 'norf' of the river to justify a stop there any more?
Makes no difference whatsoever. They just haven't thought of advertising it. Should do Lakeside Services, too. If you ring up and ask them to put it on there's no practical reason they wouldn't be able to add it.
What's also kinda interesting to a layman is how few of the pickup points are within the Greater London boundary
Well Fanny, I can only refer you back to Airman's post immediately above yours.
I'm suggesting 10-12k from the club as an investment in rebuilding the relationship with the fans. And this 10-12k is not, according to Airman's estimates a 'subsidy' but rather it is foregoing further profit from a situation which most fans would rather not be in.
We have read here that the cost of sorting out the pitch is 600k. So its hardly a matter of either/or.
Still if most people think it's OK, its none of my business to argue otherwise.
I suspect they have subsidised the cost anyway. Coaches are expensive and would be more than 22quid pp for a 300+ mile round trip
They have not subsidised it. Quite the contrary. Check Airman Brown's posts on the subject. And nobody on here knows more about the subject than him!
But why should they? It's a business as well not a charity. Club needs to make a bit of dosh.
Proper businesses make dosh by delighting their customers so that they are happy to part with their readies again and again.
This business could have said "sorry, we are not kicking off at this day and time, because it is unreasonable to ask our customers to get up at 05.00 just to go to a frigging football match in the middle of the country"
To which the answer will have been "OK so you lose £250,000 in TV money." which is not a small amount in our current state.
So this business could have said to its customers "look, sorry to do this to you, but by accepting this ridiculous kick off time we get a whole load of dosh we would not get otherwise. But as a gesture of how much we value you as customers we are going to use 5% of this money to help get you there at a reasonable price"
That is what a properbusiness would do.
(purely my personal opinion BTW)
any chance of a real-life example of this 'proper business' to which you refer?
Sure.
Amazon. if you say your parcel didn't arrive, they send you a replacement, no questions asked. Marks&Spencer. You buy some item and then decide you don't like it, you can take it back and get a refund. Fitbit. (Look it up). It was my Christmas present. After six weeks, due to my own stupidity, I lost it. To my amazement they are sending me a replacement free of charge. The RRP is about £100.
I wasn't planning on taking the coach as I normally drive or take the train, but the last time I took the coach (a long time ago admittedly!) it was 'the' Blackburn game, and I caught it at Watford Gap services; a fair number of people got on there. I presume there isn't enough business from 'norf' of the river to justify a stop there any more?
Makes no difference whatsoever. They just haven't thought of advertising it. Should do Lakeside Services, too. If you ring up and ask them to put it on there's no practical reason they wouldn't be able to add it.
What's also kinda interesting to a layman is how few of the pickup points are within the Greater London boundary
Indeed, and it bears no relation to the actual pattern of demand.
Charlton were paying under £700 to hire coaches to Sheffield two years ago. It would be astonishing if they were paying over £1,000 now ... even allowing for the fact that they may have to pay a premium to subcontract extra vehicles and to run from the coast, although probably 80 per cent of passengers will be local. Anyone who thinks Valley Away is subsidised if the fares are set against the coach hire charges is simply wrong. I dare say you could make an argument around a share of the cost of the commercial centre, but you can't run a football club without a ticket office whether you sell travel or not.
The argument for a subsidy for Sheffield is to try to ensure we sell out, which of itself generates ticket revenue of about £4 per person for the club. Charlton have chosen to target a profit from the coaches instead. If they get 50 coaches they might make £10-£15k. If they get 25 and we don't sell out the decision will look questionable, but as I've said there are no certainties either way and decisions have to be made on guesswork.
They obviously think we can sell out and they can make a profit from the coaches. Not sure I agree.
Proper business done on the pitch is how they delight their customers.
Of course, but I have always thought that a big motivated support can influence the business on the pitch, and increase my enjoyment, with the feeling that I played my part in it. The question is whether a lower travel price might result in a bigger turnout.
Well Fanny, I can only refer you back to Airman's post immediately above yours.
I'm suggesting 10-12k from the club as an investment in rebuilding the relationship with the fans. And this 10-12k is not, according to Airman's estimates a 'subsidy' but rather it is foregoing further profit from a situation which most fans would rather not be in.
We have read here that the cost of sorting out the pitch is 600k. So its hardly a matter of either/or.
Still if most people think it's OK, its none of my business to argue otherwise.
Point taken but I would rather that money was spent on something which benefits ALL supporters be it players' contracts or even better, the gaffer's.
Yes, I know very little about the financial aspects of football & our Club in particular but after the previous regime and their penny pinching, and the amount of dosh required seemingly to balance the books in the Championship, I'd be happy for RD to spend his ( and our) pennies wisely.
You refer to " rebuilding the relationship with the fans" .....If this IS necessary, then "foregoing further profit" would be a decent gesture but one which I fear would soon be forgotten should we lose at Bramall Lane ( heaven forbid) Maybe better to keep any generosity for a Wembley trip which more than 5,000 fans would benefit from ?
Proper business done on the pitch is how they delight their customers.
I'd like to see some of the cup money going into decent loan signings to make sure we can keep going through two games per week perhaps even three if there is a replay. Win a few games and this does it for a lot of fans.
Just a personal note but how I get to the game and whether we all go will have nothing to do with the coach price. The tickets are just £15 for season ticket holders so £37 all in comes in a lot less than what I paid for Stamford Bridge and White Hart Lane all those years back.
Whilst planning the car journey, I checked the route from Strood to the ground. 196 miles each way, 392 total. Most of the coaches will be doing further than that, so £22 aint that bad.................
I don't know what the right answer to this is and probably there isn't one, but I do wonder if some people think we would have taken 5,000-plus people to Middlesbrough last time we reached the sixth round if the coaches had been £22. That's the relevant comparison.
The match was live on free-to-air BBC2 but I believe there were trains too, plus our average home support at the time was about double what it is now, and it was a Thursday night, which must have put some people off. But maybe we were more blasé about big games after so many years in the Premier League.
why should I pay as much as someone travelling from say, Bexhill when they are travelling further?
it would be fairer if they were to pay, say £32 and me £12.
But it's easier from an administrative point of view isn't it? It's not fair that I give the club £800 pa to park in the West Stand car park but get none of the priority handed to those that donate a poxy £120 to Valley Gold either is it? Life's not fair get over it.
I wasn't planning on taking the coach as I normally drive or take the train, but the last time I took the coach (a long time ago admittedly!) it was 'the' Blackburn game, and I caught it at Watford Gap services; a fair number of people got on there. I presume there isn't enough business from 'norf' of the river to justify a stop there any more?
Back in the dim and distant past that might have been viable. These days, in common with other motorway service areas, there's a hefty car park charge if you are there for more than two hours (or one of those nice parking charge notices if you don't pay in advance). Probably makes the idea unrealistic.
I suspect they have subsidised the cost anyway. Coaches are expensive and would be more than 22quid pp for a 300+ mile round trip
They have not subsidised it. Quite the contrary. Check Airman Brown's posts on the subject. And nobody on here knows more about the subject than him!
But why should they? It's a business as well not a charity. Club needs to make a bit of dosh.
Proper businesses make dosh by delighting their customers so that they are happy to part with their readies again and again.
This business could have said "sorry, we are not kicking off at this day and time, because it is unreasonable to ask our customers to get up at 05.00 just to go to a frigging football match in the middle of the country"
To which the answer will have been "OK so you lose £250,000 in TV money." which is not a small amount in our current state.
So this business could have said to its customers "look, sorry to do this to you, but by accepting this ridiculous kick off time we get a whole load of dosh we would not get otherwise. But as a gesture of how much we value you as customers we are going to use 5% of this money to help get you there at a reasonable price"
That is what a properbusiness would do.
(purely my personal opinion BTW)
any chance of a real-life example of this 'proper business' to which you refer?
Sure.
Amazon. if you say your parcel didn't arrive, they send you a replacement, no questions asked. Marks&Spencer. You buy some item and then decide you don't like it, you can take it back and get a refund. Fitbit. (Look it up). It was my Christmas present. After six weeks, due to my own stupidity, I lost it. To my amazement they are sending me a replacement free of charge. The RRP is about £100.
That enough for you?
Not really. Hardly comparable to a football club surely? I was looking for examples in the same 'industry' for a similar situation.
Many clubs have been forced to play at such ridiculous times but I can't recall any following the path that you suggest.
Unfortunately it's irrelevant anyway as nothing can be done, but i was just interested in being informed about these other clubs that have apparently handled such situations more professionally than Charlton.
I wasn't planning on taking the coach as I normally drive or take the train, but the last time I took the coach (a long time ago admittedly!) it was 'the' Blackburn game, and I caught it at Watford Gap services; a fair number of people got on there. I presume there isn't enough business from 'norf' of the river to justify a stop there any more?
Back in the dim and distant past that might have been viable. These days, in common with other motorway service areas, there's a hefty car park charge if you are there for more than two hours (or one of those nice parking charge notices if you don't pay in advance). Probably makes the idea unrealistic.
That's been the case for some time and it's not a consideration for the club - otherwise it wouldn't be running from Medway Services, instead of the Medway towns. In fact, at 6am on a Sunday morning they'd be better off running from the towns, because there will be no local traffic, but they have made the mistake of assuming Valley Express levels of demand and practical issues without realising that this route is affected by the North Kent railway line for home games.
So you end up going to Sandwich at one extreme, where there may not be any passengers, but not Gillingham, Chatham, Rainham and Strood, where we would usually fill more than one coach for a game like this, at the other.
I suspect they have subsidised the cost anyway. Coaches are expensive and would be more than 22quid pp for a 300+ mile round trip
They have not subsidised it. Quite the contrary. Check Airman Brown's posts on the subject. And nobody on here knows more about the subject than him!
But why should they? It's a business as well not a charity. Club needs to make a bit of dosh.
Proper businesses make dosh by delighting their customers so that they are happy to part with their readies again and again.
This business could have said "sorry, we are not kicking off at this day and time, because it is unreasonable to ask our customers to get up at 05.00 just to go to a frigging football match in the middle of the country"
To which the answer will have been "OK so you lose £250,000 in TV money." which is not a small amount in our current state.
So this business could have said to its customers "look, sorry to do this to you, but by accepting this ridiculous kick off time we get a whole load of dosh we would not get otherwise. But as a gesture of how much we value you as customers we are going to use 5% of this money to help get you there at a reasonable price"
That is what a properbusiness would do.
(purely my personal opinion BTW)
any chance of a real-life example of this 'proper business' to which you refer?
Sure.
Amazon. if you say your parcel didn't arrive, they send you a replacement, no questions asked. Marks&Spencer. You buy some item and then decide you don't like it, you can take it back and get a refund. Fitbit. (Look it up). It was my Christmas present. After six weeks, due to my own stupidity, I lost it. To my amazement they are sending me a replacement free of charge. The RRP is about £100.
That enough for you?
Not really. Hardly comparable to a football club surely? I was looking for examples in the same 'industry' for a similar situation.
Many clubs have been forced to play at such ridiculous times but I can't recall any following the path that you suggest.
Unfortunately it's irrelevant anyway as nothing can be done, but i was just interested in being informed about these other clubs that have apparently handled such situations more professionally than Charlton.
Perhaps Walsall FC is a fair example then.
Juniors pay £46 for a 23 game season ticket, and receive a £2 cash refund at the turnstile on entry.
The logic is that WFC need to rebuild their core support from a young age, and rather than give out "free tickets", they have implemented a scheme which means the kid has to actually attend to get the refund.
As for CAFC: - the club put on free/subsidised travel for the away game at Port Vale a few years back as they thought it was a vital game for the club. They obviously don't think the same about this Cup game.
IMO, if it was £30 for ticket and travel we would sell out easily.
All of you who are complaining the coach is too expensive, you really dont realise how lucky you are. There are many fans like me living away from London who would love to have a coach service to Sheffield for £22. For the record, the amount i spend for home games going from Southampton to Charlton with a railcard is more than the amount you will have to spend on the coach to Sheffield.
£22 coach + £15 matchday ticket for a QF of the FA Cup. I dont get how anyone can complain.
To be honest i don't really think £22 to go all that way is that over priced, although a round £20 would probably have sufficed. What i don't get is why someone travelling from Worthing or Bexhill pays the same as someone travelling from Charlton when they're travelling for over 2 hours more. Is it simply because it's just easier for the club to say 'same price for everyone'?
Comments
I'm suggesting 10-12k from the club as an investment in rebuilding the relationship with the fans. And this 10-12k is not, according to Airman's estimates a 'subsidy' but rather it is foregoing further profit from a situation which most fans would rather not be in.
We have read here that the cost of sorting out the pitch is 600k. So its hardly a matter of either/or.
Still if most people think it's OK, its none of my business to argue otherwise.
Amazon. if you say your parcel didn't arrive, they send you a replacement, no questions asked.
Marks&Spencer. You buy some item and then decide you don't like it, you can take it back and get a refund.
Fitbit. (Look it up). It was my Christmas present. After six weeks, due to my own stupidity, I lost it. To my amazement they are sending me a replacement free of charge. The RRP is about £100.
That enough for you?
Yes, I know very little about the financial aspects of football & our Club in particular but after the previous regime and their penny pinching, and the amount of dosh required seemingly to balance the books in the Championship, I'd be happy for RD to spend his ( and our) pennies wisely.
You refer to " rebuilding the relationship with the fans" .....If this IS necessary, then "foregoing further profit" would be a decent gesture but one which I fear would soon be forgotten should we lose at Bramall Lane ( heaven forbid) Maybe better to keep any generosity for a Wembley trip which more than 5,000 fans would benefit from ?
Just a personal note but how I get to the game and whether we all go will have nothing to do with the coach price. The tickets are just £15 for season ticket holders so £37 all in comes in a lot less than what I paid for Stamford Bridge and White Hart Lane all those years back.
The match was live on free-to-air BBC2 but I believe there were trains too, plus our average home support at the time was about double what it is now, and it was a Thursday night, which must have put some people off. But maybe we were more blasé about big games after so many years in the Premier League.
But it's easier from an administrative point of view isn't it?
It's not fair that I give the club £800 pa to park in the West Stand car park but get none of the priority handed to those that donate a poxy £120 to Valley Gold either is it? Life's not fair get over it.
Many clubs have been forced to play at such ridiculous times but I can't recall any following the path that you suggest.
Unfortunately it's irrelevant anyway as nothing can be done, but i was just interested in being informed about these other clubs that have apparently handled such situations more professionally than Charlton.
So you end up going to Sandwich at one extreme, where there may not be any passengers, but not Gillingham, Chatham, Rainham and Strood, where we would usually fill more than one coach for a game like this, at the other.
Perhaps Walsall FC is a fair example then.
Juniors pay £46 for a 23 game season ticket, and receive a £2 cash refund at the turnstile on entry.
The logic is that WFC need to rebuild their core support from a young age, and rather than give out "free tickets", they have implemented a scheme which means the kid has to actually attend to get the refund.
As for CAFC: - the club put on free/subsidised travel for the away game at Port Vale a few years back as they thought it was a vital game for the club. They obviously don't think the same about this Cup game.
IMO, if it was £30 for ticket and travel we would sell out easily.
£22 coach + £15 matchday ticket for a QF of the FA Cup. I dont get how anyone can complain.