One thing yesterday I noticed about Bikey which is telling was after his header from a corner that went wide. On the video he is then shown running hard to regain his position in defence, then he got his breath back and thought about what had happened. His first instinct was to do the right thing, get in position first, recover second. Admirable. Also when sent forward against Huddersfield Bikey completely understood his duties. I have also noticed he is not shy about telling other players what their duties are. I think TBH is a little better technically, and I have made the assumption that Bikey would be respected by the other players, but in terms of setting an example, walking the walk as well as talking it, then Bikey could be a contender for captain if needed.
As I said before, if Morro isn't playing, and you drop Jacko, who do you make captain?
Yoni for me.
Good shout if Yoni was signed up full time. On loan ?
JJ has been a great captain on and off the pitch, but is in the autumn of his career.
Let the debate start ?
Surely Solly? Unlikely to make a player captain who has been at the club a month.
If he cant play every game the captaincy problem doesn't go away fully but I really don't see what the issue is. In any team you should have two or three 'captains' in the side, normally the experienced pros. JJ aside that means either TBH or Bikey, how long they have been with us matters not a jot for the rest of this season then re-address the situation next summer if need be.
As I said before, if Morro isn't playing, and you drop Jacko, who do you make captain?
Yoni for me.
Good shout if Yoni was signed up full time. On loan ?
JJ has been a great captain on and off the pitch, but is in the autumn of his career.
Let the debate start ?
Surely Solly? Unlikely to make a player captain who has been at the club a month.
If he cant play every game the captaincy problem doesn't go away fully but I really don't see what the issue is. In any team you should have two or three 'captains' in the side, normally the experienced pros. JJ aside that means either TBH or Bikey, how long they have been with us matters not a jot for the rest of this season then re-address the situation next summer if need be.
Think the issue is that being captain of a club like charlton goes much further than just leading the team, they need a rapport and connection with the crowd as well as the media.
As I said before, if Morro isn't playing, and you drop Jacko, who do you make captain?
Yoni for me.
Good shout if Yoni was signed up full time. On loan ?
JJ has been a great captain on and off the pitch, but is in the autumn of his career.
Let the debate start ?
Surely Solly? Unlikely to make a player captain who has been at the club a month.
If he cant play every game the captaincy problem doesn't go away fully but I really don't see what the issue is. In any team you should have two or three 'captains' in the side, normally the experienced pros. JJ aside that means either TBH or Bikey, how long they have been with us matters not a jot for the rest of this season then re-address the situation next summer if need be.
Think the issue is that being captain of a club like charlton goes much further than just leading the team, they need a rapport and connection with the crowd as well as the media.
Ok so if you are implying TBH or Bikey can't perform those duties and this has been put forward in a previous thread, you have someone who can relate to the media / crowd and call him 'club ' captain, JJ, whilst having one of the other two as your leader on the pitch. We may need to agree to disagree on this one :-)
Via @BelgoFoot: #cafc new boy Bulot a versatile mf who fell down Standard pecking order. Didn't want to come at first but move 'might work'
That, plus playing in front of decent sized crowds every week who actually make a noise, will win him over (hopefully).
Standard average about 23,000. All their play off games were sellouts. And they have a reputation within Belgium of kicking up a right old storm.
We don't. Lets's be honest, we don't.
You're right our crowds are more like 16,000 but what will the gate be for Wolves once everyone back from holidays and on the back of being undefeated? What will our gates climb to if we stay in the top six? We know we will average 26,000+ if we go up!
I think our crowds are more like 13 -14,000 with the published figures being 16,000, Wigan and Derby were sub 16,000 and at least for the Wigan game non renewing ST's from last season were all given a free ticket, not all of whom would have attended, but all of whom would have been counted in the crowd figure.
The captaincy issue for me is a big one... agree for now jacko should be club captain and captain on the pitch whenever he starts! If BP does decide to drop jacko then a vice captain should be appointed who leads on the pitch in his absence! Jackson should continue his leadership from the bench! And when he comes on he will not need he armband to show his leadership qualities on the pitch! Who that vice captain should be is not yet obvious.. The names mentioned are all possibilities.. It sounds like TBH has shown leadership on the pitch so far so must be up there.. and if morro gets a run in the team then he will be considered..
On the issue of Jackson and whether he starts I am erring towards he view he is on the decline and would be better off the bench with cousins inside! Although I do love the man to bits for the passion he shows.. and he played a huge part in us staying up no doubt! But then three successive managers have made him one of their first names on the team sheet.. This can't just be for set pieces and leadership?? I like to think I have a good footballing brain and can read the game well but I must be missing something?? Maybe he's one of those players who does the unnoticed stuff very well and doesn't get recognised for it..
Regardless my team would be
Igor Bulot Gudmundsson cousins buyens Wilson Wiggins TBH bikey solly Hendo
Think his gives us options off he bench with George harriott moussa etc.. It also gives balance with Wilson work rate and gud's flair..
Via @BelgoFoot: #cafc new boy Bulot a versatile mf who fell down Standard pecking order. Didn't want to come at first but move 'might work'
That, plus playing in front of decent sized crowds every week who actually make a noise, will win him over (hopefully).
Standard average about 23,000. All their play off games were sellouts. And they have a reputation within Belgium of kicking up a right old storm.
We don't. Lets's be honest, we don't.
You're right our crowds are more like 16,000 but what will the gate be for Wolves once everyone back from holidays and on the back of being undefeated? What will our gates climb to if we stay in the top six? We know we will average 26,000+ if we go up!
I think our crowds are more like 13 -14,000 with the published figures being 16,000, Wigan and Derby were sub 16,000 and at least for the Wigan game non renewing ST's from last season were all given a free ticket, not all of whom would have attended, but all of whom would have been counted in the crowd figure.
Going by the quoted gates in the Championship these last few seasons I recall the average was 18-19,000 the first season we returned then dropped due to price increases and the results / quality of football dropping. I think they are up a tad this season but still down on two years ago. The first two gates are always the lowest. Prices are back down, we are top six...can we push back up to 19,000 and then 20,000? Down to the club to promote the new look side in September! Watford and Wolves as good a chance as any to do so. There was some talk of the supporters Trust working with the club to help promote games but I don't know if the club have found a way to work this - I know Richard Murray was keen on this but I'm not in the loop anymore.
Via @BelgoFoot: #cafc new boy Bulot a versatile mf who fell down Standard pecking order. Didn't want to come at first but move 'might work'
That, plus playing in front of decent sized crowds every week who actually make a noise, will win him over (hopefully).
Standard average about 23,000. All their play off games were sellouts. And they have a reputation within Belgium of kicking up a right old storm.
We don't. Lets's be honest, we don't.
You're right our crowds are more like 16,000 but what will the gate be for Wolves once everyone back from holidays and on the back of being undefeated? What will our gates climb to if we stay in the top six? We know we will average 26,000+ if we go up!
If we're talking about atmosphere then we need to acknowledge that there are rarely more than 12,000 home fans in the ground, often far fewer. I think we could sell a few hundred more season tickets with proper promotion, but there will be no sharp acceleration of gates at this point in a season unless the extra tickets are given away and then many of them will not be used. There is a huge evidence base around this and little substance to the received wisdom that the holiday period depresses gates (the opposite is often true), while Wolves is on a Tuesday night in the school term. This is not to be negative, it is the reality of how things work. In speculating otherwise without considering the evidence you just set the club/support up to fail.
Via @BelgoFoot: #cafc new boy Bulot a versatile mf who fell down Standard pecking order. Didn't want to come at first but move 'might work'
That, plus playing in front of decent sized crowds every week who actually make a noise, will win him over (hopefully).
Standard average about 23,000. All their play off games were sellouts. And they have a reputation within Belgium of kicking up a right old storm.
We don't. Lets's be honest, we don't.
You're right our crowds are more like 16,000 but what will the gate be for Wolves once everyone back from holidays and on the back of being undefeated? What will our gates climb to if we stay in the top six? We know we will average 26,000+ if we go up!
I think our crowds are more like 13 -14,000 with the published figures being 16,000, Wigan and Derby were sub 16,000 and at least for the Wigan game non renewing ST's from last season were all given a free ticket, not all of whom would have attended, but all of whom would have been counted in the crowd figure.
Going by the quoted gates in the Championship these last few seasons I recall the average was 18-19,000 the first season we returned then dropped due to price increases and the results / quality of football dropping. I think they are up a tad this season but still down on two years ago. The first two gates are always the lowest.
Prices are back down, we are top six...can we push back up to 19,000 and then 20,000? Down to the club to promote the new look side in September! Watford and Wolves as good a chance as any to do so. There was some talk of the supporters Trust working with the club to help promote games but I don't know if the club have found a way to work this - I know Richard Murray was keen on this but I'm not in the loop anymore.
That would require a 100-200% increase in match tickets sold. It would require a volume of sales that we have never achieved since returning to The Valley, including in the Premier League.
Via @BelgoFoot: #cafc new boy Bulot a versatile mf who fell down Standard pecking order. Didn't want to come at first but move 'might work'
That, plus playing in front of decent sized crowds every week who actually make a noise, will win him over (hopefully).
Standard average about 23,000. All their play off games were sellouts. And they have a reputation within Belgium of kicking up a right old storm.
We don't. Lets's be honest, we don't.
You're right our crowds are more like 16,000 but what will the gate be for Wolves once everyone back from holidays and on the back of being undefeated? What will our gates climb to if we stay in the top six? We know we will average 26,000+ if we go up!
I think our crowds are more like 13 -14,000 with the published figures being 16,000, Wigan and Derby were sub 16,000 and at least for the Wigan game non renewing ST's from last season were all given a free ticket, not all of whom would have attended, but all of whom would have been counted in the crowd figure.
Going by the quoted gates in the Championship these last few seasons I recall the average was 18-19,000 the first season we returned then dropped due to price increases and the results / quality of football dropping. I think they are up a tad this season but still down on two years ago. The first two gates are always the lowest.
Prices are back down, we are top six...can we push back up to 19,000 and then 20,000? Down to the club to promote the new look side in September! Watford and Wolves as good a chance as any to do so. There was some talk of the supporters Trust working with the club to help promote games but I don't know if the club have found a way to work this - I know Richard Murray was keen on this but I'm not in the loop anymore.
That would require a 100-200% increase in match tickets sold. It would require a volume of sales that we have never achieved since returning to The Valley, including in the Premier League.
And how would we do that without you at the helmet healm ?
Via @BelgoFoot: #cafc new boy Bulot a versatile mf who fell down Standard pecking order. Didn't want to come at first but move 'might work'
That, plus playing in front of decent sized crowds every week who actually make a noise, will win him over (hopefully).
Standard average about 23,000. All their play off games were sellouts. And they have a reputation within Belgium of kicking up a right old storm.
We don't. Lets's be honest, we don't.
You're right our crowds are more like 16,000 but what will the gate be for Wolves once everyone back from holidays and on the back of being undefeated? What will our gates climb to if we stay in the top six? We know we will average 26,000+ if we go up!
I think our crowds are more like 13 -14,000 with the published figures being 16,000, Wigan and Derby were sub 16,000 and at least for the Wigan game non renewing ST's from last season were all given a free ticket, not all of whom would have attended, but all of whom would have been counted in the crowd figure.
Going by the quoted gates in the Championship these last few seasons I recall the average was 18-19,000 the first season we returned then dropped due to price increases and the results / quality of football dropping. I think they are up a tad this season but still down on two years ago. The first two gates are always the lowest.
Prices are back down, we are top six...can we push back up to 19,000 and then 20,000? Down to the club to promote the new look side in September! Watford and Wolves as good a chance as any to do so. There was some talk of the supporters Trust working with the club to help promote games but I don't know if the club have found a way to work this - I know Richard Murray was keen on this but I'm not in the loop anymore.
That would require a 100-200% increase in match tickets sold. It would require a volume of sales that we have never achieved since returning to The Valley, including in the Premier League.
not the only way - try to think outside the box! It actually requires an increase in: 1) Season ticket sales - plenty of fans lapsed in the last few years who might be attracted back - £275 for a play off contender is a bargain 2) More promotional games instead of just football for a fiver (+ compusory charitable donation!) 3) Utilising commited fans networks like the supporters Trust to promote certain games or certain blocks of seats 4) Keep winning games 5) Offer a deal on Premier League tickets valid for say 24 months if fans buy into the dream
Nothing is impossible unless you give up before you try!
Getting the gate back to where it was two years ago should not be a big ask unless of course there is a whole load of background negativity, you know people pissing on the fireworks, organising season ticket boycotts and the like. I'm sure there are fans who have not renewed because of the turbulence last season so perhaps it might help if those making all the noise became vociferous in backing the club and the team?
Via @BelgoFoot: #cafc new boy Bulot a versatile mf who fell down Standard pecking order. Didn't want to come at first but move 'might work'
That, plus playing in front of decent sized crowds every week who actually make a noise, will win him over (hopefully).
Standard average about 23,000. All their play off games were sellouts. And they have a reputation within Belgium of kicking up a right old storm.
We don't. Lets's be honest, we don't.
You're right our crowds are more like 16,000 but what will the gate be for Wolves once everyone back from holidays and on the back of being undefeated? What will our gates climb to if we stay in the top six? We know we will average 26,000+ if we go up!
I think our crowds are more like 13 -14,000 with the published figures being 16,000, Wigan and Derby were sub 16,000 and at least for the Wigan game non renewing ST's from last season were all given a free ticket, not all of whom would have attended, but all of whom would have been counted in the crowd figure.
Going by the quoted gates in the Championship these last few seasons I recall the average was 18-19,000 the first season we returned then dropped due to price increases and the results / quality of football dropping. I think they are up a tad this season but still down on two years ago. The first two gates are always the lowest.
Prices are back down, we are top six...can we push back up to 19,000 and then 20,000? Down to the club to promote the new look side in September! Watford and Wolves as good a chance as any to do so. There was some talk of the supporters Trust working with the club to help promote games but I don't know if the club have found a way to work this - I know Richard Murray was keen on this but I'm not in the loop anymore.
That would require a 100-200% increase in match tickets sold. It would require a volume of sales that we have never achieved since returning to The Valley, including in the Premier League.
not the only way - try to think outside the box! It actually requires an increase in: 1) Season ticket sales - plenty of fans lapsed in the last few years who might be attracted back - £275 for a play off contender is a bargain 2) More promotional games instead of just football for a fiver (+ compusory charitable donation!) 3) Utilising commited fans networks like the supporters Trust to promote certain games or certain blocks of seats 4) Keep winning games 5) Offer a deal on Premier League tickets valid for say 24 months if fans buy into the dream
Nothing is impossible unless you give up before you try!
Getting the gate back to where it was two years ago should not be a big ask unless of course there is a whole load of background negativity, you know people pissing on the fireworks, organising season ticket boycotts and the like. I'm sure there are fans who have not renewed because of the turbulence last season so perhaps it might help if those making all the noise became vociferous in backing the club and the team?
Yes, there are lots of things you can do that make small incremental differences and they should be done (I don't really think I need lessons from you in thinking outside the box, given the range of ideas I have implemented over the years), but if you delude yourself in the way that you do that there will be dramatic and early success you simply set yourself up to fail and demoralise the people responsible, which in fact is what has happened over the season ticket offer.
People at the club are sitting around rubbing their heads wondering why we have not sold more season tickets at the cheaper prices, when in fact what happened - including the drop in revenue - was entirely predictable and probably unavoidable. Ditto poor match ticket sales. Some fans have been very pissed off with the club, not because they were told to be so, but because that is how they felt. They told the club so when the staff chased non-renewals.
You might have swallowed a whole box of happy pills, other people have different views. It's hugely insulting to suggest that people who disagree with you need me or anyone else to tell them, for example, that RD's transfer activities last January made matters worse, not better.
In reality, to drive up support you have to do the work behind the scenes, day in, day out, project by project, area by area, often under the radar. Target 10,000 involved dozens of supporters working to a plan - what you have currently is one ad-hoc central promotion piled on top of another with no overarching strategy and mostly driven by the panic-stricken realisation that the gate for a particular game will be embarrassing if they don't find a way to shift more tickets.
Let us know how you get on with that research into your claim that the "first two gates are always the lowest", won't you?
If we remain unbeaten at home all season I doubt we'd average 16k of home fans The interest/support just isn't there , for now IMO premiership footy will draw em back but not in the big numbers we previously had Football is not the flavour of the month that it previously was That's not to say all avenues shouldn't be pursued in trying to get more fans Addickted
British Cycling has improved in a lot of ways because of 'the aggregation of marginal gains'.
I think Airman Brown is right when he describes the 'project by project', 'area by area' effort needed, and it takes a lot of probably tedious and unrewarding slog to achieve. Seriously Red has also mentioned some initiatives that may help.
If attendances can be improved by enough forces working together to create marginal gains, it could end with big improvements.
It is common sense to say that ad hoc work is not as good as sustained and co-ordinated work, not because it reflects on what used to happen, but because, well because it simply is common sense.
The big flanker is if we keep being successful, that success will drive attendances up however ticket sales work (unless it is simply too difficult to actually obtain a ticket when desired!).
I suppose 'glam' style effort with lounges and executive boxes can look good on a balance sheet somewhere, and justify jobs too. I can only hope there is also some roll your sleeves up kind of effort going on to build crowds at the Valley.
The days of build it and they will come are over, even 'win and they will come' is more tricky if prices are too high, or other factors make it more difficult to attend.
I sincerely hope that whoever is in charge of ticket sales and promoting support, is prepared for the longer haul where the gains may seem marginal at first, but over time aggregate to sustained improvements.
PS. I reckon personal digs at AB are a waste of effort, especially when coming from the committed cynics who have never put their heads above the parapet themselves. I suspect it is water off the ducks proverbial.
Which one? The one in which seriously_red tells Airman to "think outside the box", I take it?
Personally I think use of that phrase should carry a prison term. I never met a successful marketing manager who used it. I met a lot of useless ones who did, though.
And what is your evidence of " lot of younger interest at present.". Actually, what do you mean by this?
Maybe Prague. I think in the Championship, in general, the atmosphere and crowds both home and away can be pretty constant. I wonder if that's the same in Belgium or whether it's more like Scotland which, as we know, is pretty patchy.
Sure. In their second tier, you'd have to be right.
Would be interested to hear what some of our Belgian friends think about it, given that they support less internationally known clubs like Gent, Lierse and Kortrijk. I got the impression from @Belgian_Spur that Gent - Club Brugge is a bit like Charlton - Palace.
Which one? The one in which seriously_red tells Airman to "think outside the box", I take it?
Personally I think use of that phrase should carry a prison term. I never met a successful marketing manager who used it. I met a lot of useless ones who did, though.
And what is your evidence of " lot of younger interest at present.". Actually, what do you mean by this?
By the amount of youngsters attending matches, what do you mean evidence ? Do you know what Prague you come across as as condescending as well.
Maybe Prague. I think in the Championship, in general, the atmosphere and crowds both home and away can be pretty constant. I wonder if that's the same in Belgium or whether it's more like Scotland which, as we know, is pretty patchy.
Sure. In their second tier, you'd have to be right.
Would be interested to hear what some of our Belgian friends think about it, given that they support less internationally known clubs like Gent, Lierse and Kortrijk. I got the impression from @Belgian_Spur that Gent - Club Brugge is a bit like Charlton - Palace.
I have a seasoncard for KV Kortrijk, paid 99 euros(standing)
This impresses me. I mean how many houses/fancy cars/rolex watches and so on does a footballer need? If a player like Liam (wipe my arse with a £50 note) Ridgewell can have such distain for the dosh, then we are mugs to keep giving it to the likes of him (yeah I know...but we do). A ticket at an affordable price is a good thing, because that way the players will actually have fans to play in front of...I suppose they could hire support tho' with their arsewipe money if attendances collapse. Maybe they could hire Banksy to paint a crowd on a backdrop to play in front of.
What is baffling is that seriously_red started out on here with an obsession with surveys, to the extent that he appeared to believe that the trust's surveys were more accurate than the mass of data held by the club on where people lived.
He then moved on to quoting transfermarkt at every opportunity, not a source that I regard as very useful, but at least an attempt to understand things in terms of statistics.
When it comes to attendances, however, he wants to disregard the statistical evidence, built up over many years, and suggests we might get a substantially increased home gate for a midweek game against Wolves out of thin air. We won't.
I actually agree with him that looking at numbers is key, but he doesn't seem to want to apply that approach to attendances. We are not going to move from 2-3,000 home match sales to 6,000 plus in the short term and we are not going to do it at all in this division without putting in the hard work that moves the numbers over time.
What the summer transfers have done is begin to create an opportunity to build up support again and personally I am positive about that, which I am bound to be because it's something I was involved in for more than 20 years and long before I worked for the club.
The question is whether the current club management understands that and is willing and able to do something about it, but it requires hard work and the application of what we have learned over many years, whatever the mechanism for delivering it might be.
It is not that any one individual has a unique insight - I have said many times that it isn't rocket science - but as in any business there is a store of knowledge based on experience that in Charlton's case has been discarded by people who neither understood the club nor cared about it, which is bound to be damaging.
New ideas should certainly be examined and embraced, from whatever source, but in the meantime the lack of understanding has, for example, seen Crossbars membership plunge from 235 last season to 35 at the start of this season. That's one example of an avoidable mistake. There are others.
Charlton had their biggest increase in years when we made it to the prem league. What was noticeable then was the amount of Dads taking their young kids.Well these kids are old enough to go on their own now and the amount of yoof is certainly on the up.That is what I have noticed no hard evidence that Prague wants purely a observation.
Charlton had their biggest increase in years when we made it to the prem league. What was noticeable then was the amount of Dads taking their young kids.Well these kids are old enough to go on their own now and the amount of yoof is certainly on the up.That is what I have noticed no hard evidence that Prague wants purely a observation.
I am one of those kids raised on the prem years now go along with mates as a 20 yr old!
Comments
On loan ?
JJ has been a great captain on and off the pitch, but is in the autumn of his career.
Let the debate start ?
Also when sent forward against Huddersfield Bikey completely understood his duties. I have also noticed he is not shy about telling other players what their duties are.
I think TBH is a little better technically, and I have made the assumption that Bikey would be respected by the other players, but in terms of setting an example, walking the walk as well as talking it, then Bikey could be a contender for captain if needed.
On the issue of Jackson and whether he starts I am erring towards he view he is on the decline and would be better off the bench with cousins inside! Although I do love the man to bits for the passion he shows.. and he played a huge part in us staying up no doubt! But then three successive managers have made him one of their first names on the team sheet.. This can't just be for set pieces and leadership?? I like to think I have a good footballing brain and can read the game well but I must be missing something?? Maybe he's one of those players who does the unnoticed stuff very well and doesn't get recognised for it..
Regardless my team would be
Igor
Bulot
Gudmundsson cousins buyens Wilson
Wiggins TBH bikey solly
Hendo
Think his gives us options off he bench with George harriott moussa etc.. It also gives balance with Wilson work rate and gud's flair..
I think they are up a tad this season but still down on two years ago. The first two gates are always the lowest.
Prices are back down, we are top six...can we push back up to 19,000 and then 20,000?
Down to the club to promote the new look side in September! Watford and Wolves as good a chance as any to do so.
There was some talk of the supporters Trust working with the club to help promote games but I don't know if the club have found a way to work this - I know Richard Murray was keen on this but I'm not in the loop anymore.
helmethealm ?1) Season ticket sales - plenty of fans lapsed in the last few years who might be attracted back - £275 for a play off contender is a bargain
2) More promotional games instead of just football for a fiver (+ compusory charitable donation!)
3) Utilising commited fans networks like the supporters Trust to promote certain games or certain blocks of seats
4) Keep winning games
5) Offer a deal on Premier League tickets valid for say 24 months if fans buy into the dream
Nothing is impossible unless you give up before you try!
Getting the gate back to where it was two years ago should not be a big ask unless of course there is a whole load of background negativity, you know people pissing on the fireworks, organising season ticket boycotts and the like. I'm sure there are fans who have not renewed because of the turbulence last season so perhaps it might help if those making all the noise became vociferous in backing the club and the team?
People at the club are sitting around rubbing their heads wondering why we have not sold more season tickets at the cheaper prices, when in fact what happened - including the drop in revenue - was entirely predictable and probably unavoidable. Ditto poor match ticket sales. Some fans have been very pissed off with the club, not because they were told to be so, but because that is how they felt. They told the club so when the staff chased non-renewals.
You might have swallowed a whole box of happy pills, other people have different views. It's hugely insulting to suggest that people who disagree with you need me or anyone else to tell them, for example, that RD's transfer activities last January made matters worse, not better.
In reality, to drive up support you have to do the work behind the scenes, day in, day out, project by project, area by area, often under the radar. Target 10,000 involved dozens of supporters working to a plan - what you have currently is one ad-hoc central promotion piled on top of another with no overarching strategy and mostly driven by the panic-stricken realisation that the gate for a particular game will be embarrassing if they don't find a way to shift more tickets.
Let us know how you get on with that research into your claim that the "first two gates are always the lowest", won't you?
The interest/support just isn't there , for now
IMO premiership footy will draw em back but not in the big numbers we previously had
Football is not the flavour of the month that it previously was
That's not to say all avenues shouldn't be pursued in trying to get more fans Addickted
I think Airman Brown is right when he describes the 'project by project', 'area by area' effort needed, and it takes a lot of probably tedious and unrewarding slog to achieve. Seriously Red has also mentioned some initiatives that may help.
If attendances can be improved by enough forces working together to create marginal gains, it could end with big improvements.
It is common sense to say that ad hoc work is not as good as sustained and co-ordinated work, not because it reflects on what used to happen, but because, well because it simply is common sense.
The big flanker is if we keep being successful, that success will drive attendances up however ticket sales work (unless it is simply too difficult to actually obtain a ticket when desired!).
I suppose 'glam' style effort with lounges and executive boxes can look good on a balance sheet somewhere, and justify jobs too. I can only hope there is also some roll your sleeves up kind of effort going on to build crowds at the Valley.
The days of build it and they will come are over, even 'win and they will come' is more tricky if prices are too high, or other factors make it more difficult to attend.
I sincerely hope that whoever is in charge of ticket sales and promoting support, is prepared for the longer haul where the gains may seem marginal at first, but over time aggregate to sustained improvements.
PS. I reckon personal digs at AB are a waste of effort, especially when coming from the committed cynics who have never put their heads above the parapet themselves. I suspect it is water off the ducks proverbial.
Personally I think use of that phrase should carry a prison term. I never met a successful marketing manager who used it. I met a lot of useless ones who did, though.
And what is your evidence of " lot of younger interest at present.". Actually, what do you mean by this?
1. Club Brugge 24.116 2. Standard 21.926 3. Anderlecht 20.289 (sold out) 4. RC Genk 20.034 5. AA Gent 10.669 6. KV Mechelen 10.338 7. OHL 7.837 8. KV Kortrijk 7.664 9. Beerschot 7.601 10. Zulte Waregem 7.601 11. Cercle Brugge 7.509 12. Lierse 7.269 13. Charleroi 6.833 14. W. Beveren 5.400 15. Lokeren 4.933 16. Bergen 4.609 Average attendance10..914
I have a seasoncard for KV Kortrijk, paid 99 euros(standing)
If a player like Liam (wipe my arse with a £50 note) Ridgewell can have such distain for the dosh, then we are mugs to keep giving it to the likes of him (yeah I know...but we do).
A ticket at an affordable price is a good thing, because that way the players will actually have fans to play in front of...I suppose they could hire support tho' with their arsewipe money if attendances collapse.
Maybe they could hire Banksy to paint a crowd on a backdrop to play in front of.
He then moved on to quoting transfermarkt at every opportunity, not a source that I regard as very useful, but at least an attempt to understand things in terms of statistics.
When it comes to attendances, however, he wants to disregard the statistical evidence, built up over many years, and suggests we might get a substantially increased home gate for a midweek game against Wolves out of thin air. We won't.
I actually agree with him that looking at numbers is key, but he doesn't seem to want to apply that approach to attendances. We are not going to move from 2-3,000 home match sales to 6,000 plus in the short term and we are not going to do it at all in this division without putting in the hard work that moves the numbers over time.
What the summer transfers have done is begin to create an opportunity to build up support again and personally I am positive about that, which I am bound to be because it's something I was involved in for more than 20 years and long before I worked for the club.
The question is whether the current club management understands that and is willing and able to do something about it, but it requires hard work and the application of what we have learned over many years, whatever the mechanism for delivering it might be.
It is not that any one individual has a unique insight - I have said many times that it isn't rocket science - but as in any business there is a store of knowledge based on experience that in Charlton's case has been discarded by people who neither understood the club nor cared about it, which is bound to be damaging.
New ideas should certainly be examined and embraced, from whatever source, but in the meantime the lack of understanding has, for example, seen Crossbars membership plunge from 235 last season to 35 at the start of this season. That's one example of an avoidable mistake. There are others.