Very depressing documentary for an athletics fan. Have always had my suspicions about the Salaza group, this just emphasises to me that 'legalised cheating' is absolutely endemic in the sport
Typical BBC, during the Olympics they seemed to make a point to mention the non British athletes that had served a drugs ban but not our athletes.
Remember that these were 'our' Olympics and nothing could be allowed to sully the name .. I suspect that somewhere, sometime, someplace, the vast majority of athletes have used performance enhancers which perhaps not 'illegal' in the criminal sense, are prohibited by the athletics authorities .. the Alan Wells 'story' is another example of a true Brit coming under suspicion only many years after the event
Yes, very interesting programme. Fascinated by the journalist injecting himself with EPO and no trace being picked up that it was in his system.
That's the depressing thing with it, if a bloke on his own with no knowledge can inject over a period of time (not a one time off), record huge performance gains, yet pass the detection tests, hoe easy must the evasion be for these training camps linked to doctors / labs.
Yes, very interesting programme. Fascinated by the journalist injecting himself with EPO and no trace being picked up that it was in his system.
That's the depressing thing with it, if a bloke on his own with no knowledge can inject over a period of time (not a one time off), record huge performance gains, yet pass the detection tests, hoe easy must the evasion be for these training camps linked to doctors / labs.
May give certain footballers, athletes, rugby players around the world an idea in their heads if they watched it.
This thread sounds like Cameron in 2010, criticising the BBC for running the FIFA allegations on Panorama.
What messenger? They say Salazar is at it but exonerate his top athlete. Who happens to be a British icon. Personally I'd be surprised to hear that any top sportsman is absolutely clean. The bbc are tailing every news item about this with a Farah disclaimer whilst accusing Salazar. They ran the story either too soon or are covering stuff up. IMHO.
I would imagine a lot of sportsmen/women sail very close to the wind with which supplements they take and how much. They all seem quite eager to stress that they take nothing illegal which to me says they are taking something that is not (or at present) legal.
It must be difficult if you are top athlete or sportsman. To get near the top, you have to (usually) be fairly driven already. The temptation to take "just" take little something that might help a bit must be huge. And, then, of course, it goes a step further etc. etc.
It was quite scary the way the journalist could, seemingly with little effort, obtain and use an EPO and then remain undetected.
Half of me thinks that 99% of athletes are at it, but it's hard to be sure. As I said, top athletes are not average members of the public who might be more likely to make rational decisions about health, fair play etc., they are already driven which is why they are at the top of their sport already.
Just like in cycling, I wouldn't be surprised if long distance running was rife with EPO abuse.
If his trainer and his training partner have both been caught doping (there's still no proof as of yet), I would find it hard to believe that Farah hasn't as well. But obviously the BBC doesn't want to accuse British athletes without concrete proof as the fallout would be much bigger.
The Allan Wells allegations are very interesting too.
I guess drug taking is something, like diving to get a penalty, that only "cheating foreigners" do :-)
He is a foreigner
Didn't he run the slowest time time to win it in recent memory anyway?
1980 was the year that the USA (and a few other countries and athletes) boycotted the games due to the USSR invading Afghanistan, which naturally took out many of the top competitors
I just wish the BBC had more bollox tbh, the programme although very interesting lost its credibility by not playing the recorded extracts from an alleged conversation about Alan Wells
Instead the journo wanted you to believe he had copied it word for word
Saw it, but was nothing new. There have been rumours about Salazar and his group of athletes for a while. Mainly with regards to the thyroid meds to help lose weight. Not strictly against the regulations but should be. The view was that salazars athletes all tend to have a stack of therapeutic use exemptions.
I am pretty sure that Farah, I am sad to say, is probably using something. Since his big move to oregon and Salazar he made massive (3-5%) improvements across the board. At the elite level that kind of improvement rings huge alarm bells. Especially given the relatively short time that improvement came in. Whether he is using something against the rules or is skirting the boundaries with dubious exemptions I do not know - although I have seen suggestions that he gets a little spiky when asked about the amount of exemptions he had.
As SELR said, EPO is the drug of choice for distance runners. Testosterone is for muscle density, so can't see endurance athletes using it. The "evidence" come from training notes and was explained away as a typo for a supplement with 1st four letter "test". Seems more plausible than the dark explanation but Salazar does seem to push the boundaries of what's legal.
Also as an ex-decent runner and track follower, I'd say his improvement is down to the correction of his over-striding (Dave Bedford like) where he could only accelerate by increasing leg speed (virtually impossible when tired). Now he has decent leg speed and accelerates by increasing stride length.
As SELR said, EPO is the drug of choice for distance runners. Testosterone is for muscle density, so can't see endurance athletes using it. The "evidence" come from training notes and was explained away as a typo for a supplement with 1st four letter "test". Seems more plausible than the dark explanation but Salazar does seem to push the boundaries of what's legal.
Also as an ex-decent runner and track follower, I'd say his improvement is down to the correction of his over-striding (Dave Bedford like) where he could only accelerate by increasing leg speed (virtually impossible when tired). Now he has decent leg speed and accelerates by increasing stride length.
As an ex decent runner, track follower and sports science graduate I would say adjusting your stride will not knock 45 seconds of a 10k pb at elite level. Not a hope in hell. The stride adjustment has helped but no way to the extent it has.
As SELR said, EPO is the drug of choice for distance runners. Testosterone is for muscle density, so can't see endurance athletes using it. The "evidence" come from training notes and was explained away as a typo for a supplement with 1st four letter "test". Seems more plausible than the dark explanation but Salazar does seem to push the boundaries of what's legal.
Also as an ex-decent runner and track follower, I'd say his improvement is down to the correction of his over-striding (Dave Bedford like) where he could only accelerate by increasing leg speed (virtually impossible when tired). Now he has decent leg speed and accelerates by increasing stride length.
As an ex decent runner, track follower and sports science graduate I would say adjusting your stride will not knock 45 seconds of a 10k pb at elite level. Not a hope in hell. The stride adjustment has helped but no way to the extent it has.
Distance runners improve with age. Mo was already one of the best Europeans before he hooked up with Salazar in 2011. Oxygen tents are a huge advance. Disagree with your assessment of stride length benefits. Fartlek training improved me leaps and bounds.
Comments
This thread sounds like Cameron in 2010, criticising the BBC for running the FIFA allegations on Panorama.
Personally I'd be surprised to hear that any top sportsman is absolutely clean. The bbc are tailing every news item about this with a Farah disclaimer whilst accusing Salazar. They ran the story either too soon or are covering stuff up. IMHO.
They all seem quite eager to stress that they take nothing illegal which to me says they are taking something that is not (or at present) legal.
It was quite scary the way the journalist could, seemingly with little effort, obtain and use an EPO and then remain undetected.
Half of me thinks that 99% of athletes are at it, but it's hard to be sure. As I said, top athletes are not average members of the public who might be more likely to make rational decisions about health, fair play etc., they are already driven which is why they are at the top of their sport already.
I don't that this story will go away overnight.
I guess drug taking is something, like diving to get a penalty, that only "cheating foreigners" do :-)
If his trainer and his training partner have both been caught doping (there's still no proof as of yet), I would find it hard to believe that Farah hasn't as well. But obviously the BBC doesn't want to accuse British athletes without concrete proof as the fallout would be much bigger.
Didn't he run the slowest time time to win it in recent memory anyway?
Instead the journo wanted you to believe he had copied it word for word
I am pretty sure that Farah, I am sad to say, is probably using something. Since his big move to oregon and Salazar he made massive (3-5%) improvements across the board. At the elite level that kind of improvement rings huge alarm bells. Especially given the relatively short time that improvement came in. Whether he is using something against the rules or is skirting the boundaries with dubious exemptions I do not know - although I have seen suggestions that he gets a little spiky when asked about the amount of exemptions he had.
Also as an ex-decent runner and track follower, I'd say his improvement is down to the correction of his over-striding (Dave Bedford like) where he could only accelerate by increasing leg speed (virtually impossible when tired). Now he has decent leg speed and accelerates by increasing stride length.