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Greece...

It seems Greece left the negotiation table in Brussels and wants to hold a referendum on 5 July on if to accept the final proposals of the EU, the IMF and the European Central Bank.

The situation is getting tough and extremely difficult.....
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  • It seems Greece left the negotiation table in Brussels and wants to hold a referendum on 5 July on if to accept the final proposals of the EU, the IMF and the European Central Bank.

    The situation is getting tough and extremely difficult.....

    The "situation" of Greece's budget defecit has been apparent since 2004 but nothing was effectively done about it until a decade later. The $64,000 question is whether the non-Euro EEC countries like ourselves will be asked to fund their inevitable eviction. If indeed we aren't already. Luckily, despite our importance as financial centre, we have (relatively) little exposure on their loans, only about £6.5bn. Kiss goodbye to that bankers, no bonus for you this year.
  • edited June 2015
    We are always being told that immigration is good for the economy. Why don't we send all the african immigrants landing in Italy to Greece?

  • We are always being told that immigration is good for the economy. Why don't we send all the african immigrants landing in Italy to Greece?

    They already have enough people there that sponge off the state and don't pay taxes.
  • Huskaris said:

    We are always being told that immigration is good for the economy. Why don't we send all the african immigrants landing in Italy to Greece?

    They already have enough people there that sponge off the state and don't pay taxes.
    They also have far too many wealthy people that don't pay taxes either.
  • Apparantley there is no word in the Greek language for tax. Bless the little plate smashers!
  • We are always being told that immigration is good for the economy. Why don't we send all the african immigrants landing in Italy to Greece?

    Well in fact they have almost as many as Italy.

  • We are always being told that immigration is good for the economy. Why don't we send all the african immigrants landing in Italy to Greece?

    Well in fact they have almost as many as Italy.

    They obviously need more.
  • If a country is being told that immigration is good for the economy, that's is a very superficial approach. Its all a question of if the economy needs those immigrants, respectively if immigrants can find proper jobs. It might sound a bit harsh (not meant to, though) but immigrant and immigrant is not the same.....
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  • edited June 2015
    Greece has brought its problems on itself but the problem is that the solution Europe is trying to impose on it won't solve those problems. But I can understand why there is no longer a desire to bail them out. And the big problem for Greece is that their negotiating strength (the fall out of Greece leaving the Euro) is much less of an issue than it was. Still an issue of course but now containable.

    This is the problem I have always had with the Euro. On paper it is a terrific idea in an ideal world, but Europe is not made up of equal nations.
  • Interesting article in remember from a few years back talking about Benford's law and Greece. Some good links in here. Basically, Greece cooked their books.http://www.badscience.net/2011/09/benfords-law-using-stats-to-bust-an-entire-nation-for-naughtiness/
  • Greece has brought its problems on itself but the problem is that the solution Europe is trying to impose on it won't solve those problems. But I can understand why there is no longer a desire to bail them out. And the big problem for Greece is that their negotiating strength (the fall out of Greece leaving the Euro) is much less of an issue than it was. Still an issue of course but now containable.

    This is the problem I have always had with the Euro. On paper it is a terrific idea in an ideal world, but Europe is not made up of equal nations.

    I have been looking at this a fair bit myself actually. How containable do you consider it to be? I mean one of my main thoughts is that a lot of the countries that have lent money to Greece and institutional investors would probably end up losing all the money they had lent Greece in the case of default (which of course means Greece will not be able to borrow anymore). Do you actually think it would be properly contained? I know the main thing over the past few years has been buying time for institutions etc to get their money out (apparently just 10% of the bailout cash has actually gone to the Greeks as it were) but I still think it would be pretty huge.

    As for the future of Greece. If they can't borrow money, they will have only one other choice as they seem so pig headedly stupid on any form of austerity, print money, and we all know how that ends.

    Greece actually infuriates me, they are the equivalent of that daft tart who spends money buying really nice shoes and going out 4 nights a week when she is a receptionist on £20k.
  • edited June 2015



    This is the problem I have always had with the Euro. On paper it is a terrific idea in an ideal world, but Europe is not made up of equal nations.

    I basically agree with you mate, but it is my firm opinion the euro is not responsible for Greece's problems. Had they not joined the euro zone their own currency would have the value of the Zimbabwe dollar. They would experience hyper inflation.

    Problem is also that their government acts very aggressively towards their creditors. Now it seems to be Greece v. everyone...
  • edited June 2015
    Huskaris said:

    Greece has brought its problems on itself but the problem is that the solution Europe is trying to impose on it won't solve those problems. But I can understand why there is no longer a desire to bail them out. And the big problem for Greece is that their negotiating strength (the fall out of Greece leaving the Euro) is much less of an issue than it was. Still an issue of course but now containable.

    This is the problem I have always had with the Euro. On paper it is a terrific idea in an ideal world, but Europe is not made up of equal nations.

    I have been looking at this a fair bit myself actually. How containable do you consider it to be? I mean one of my main thoughts is that a lot of the countries that have lent money to Greece and institutional investors would probably end up losing all the money they had lent Greece in the case of default (which of course means Greece will not be able to borrow anymore). Do you actually think it would be properly contained? I know the main thing over the past few years has been buying time for institutions etc to get their money out (apparently just 10% of the bailout cash has actually gone to the Greeks as it were) but I still think it would be pretty huge.

    As for the future of Greece. If they can't borrow money, they will have only one other choice as they seem so pig headedly stupid on any form of austerity, print money, and we all know how that ends.

    Greece actually infuriates me, they are the equivalent of that daft tart who spends money buying really nice shoes and going out 4 nights a week when she is a receptionist on £20k.
    Containable as in it would be unlikely now to bring down the Euro. it would cause huge problems of course as would bailing Greece out as it wouldn't set a great example to others. It really is a mess for Europe and Greece - not doubting that. Greece are playing Poker with a much weaker hand than they were previously though and I do fear for them.
  • My sons going Greece on hols in about a month, should he just take cash you reckon?
  • A month is still some time to go. Much can happen. My advice is to wait what will happen in the next few weeks. Anything can happen in the next few DAYS. Very difficult to predict.
  • My sons going Greece on hols in about a month, should he just take cash you reckon?

    Depends what type of cash, euros or something else, maybe drachmas would have made a reappearance by then?
  • My sons going Greece on hols in about a month, should he just take cash you reckon?

    Couple of sheep and goats for bartering, too.
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  • iaitch said:

    My sons going Greece on hols in about a month, should he just take cash you reckon?

    Depends what type of cash, euros or something else, maybe drachmas would have made a reappearance by then?
    I doubt it. They'd need to be designed, printed, shipped and distributed and the ATMs reprogrammed to take them. In any event how would they be able to pay anybody to print them? I'm sure De La Rue would want money up front.
  • My sons going Greece on hols in about a month, should he just take cash you reckon?

    Advise your son to take his holiday in Germany and cut out the middle man.
    I do actually hear that businesses have been massively inflating their prices in Greece at the moment due to uncertainty.
  • iaitch said:

    My sons going Greece on hols in about a month, should he just take cash you reckon?

    Depends what type of cash, euros or something else, maybe drachmas would have made a reappearance by then?
    I knew that keeping those old Drachma made sense.

    All I need now if for Spain and Portugal to default and those Peseta and Escudo notes will be worth a bundle.

  • Huskaris said:

    My sons going Greece on hols in about a month, should he just take cash you reckon?

    Advise your son to take his holiday in Germany and cut out the middle man.
    I do actually hear that businesses have been massively inflating their prices in Greece at the moment due to uncertainty.
    I was in Halkidiki about two weeks ago and all the prices in the bars and restaurants were about the same as last year, large beer 3/3.5 euros.
  • Greece will default on Tuesday.

    Why are they having a referendum next Sunday ?

    Too late boys. You will already have defaulted.

    It's all ridiculous.

    If they don't default & stump up the £1.2 billion, they will then get lent over £7 billion.

    Economics from the madhouse.
  • Unless the money from the Euro banks can keep them going until Sunday
  • I dont understand why a creditor would lend more money to someone who has nil chance of paying it back.
  • I dont understand why a creditor would lend more money to someone who has nil chance of paying it back.

    Because if you don't, and that creditor fails, it may have consequences which mean many of the other people that owe you money also struggle to pay you back.
  • Looking forward to going back there, as I guess will millions of others, when out of the poxy Euro.

    If , say, Somerset was financially knackered, what would parliament do.........Get out, only got to look at how they vote in the eurovision
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