Doesn't seem to be a year pass where there is not an Air Show tragedy. Great fun no doubt but is it now just too risky for for spectators and for those living in proximity to the event ?
Condolences to the families of those killed yesterday.
Well they could at least plan em better, for example, why couldn't the one yesterday have been held at the beach so the plans are flying out at sea? I'm sure there will be a perfectly good reason, but I'd love to hear it!
Plane crashes like the one killing at least 7 people in Sussex. Me brother-in-law has just got the dreaded phonecall that one of the fatalities is his best pal from work, he only got a text from him Friday to say he was looking forward to some banter this week as me brother-in-law has been away for 2 weeks
Well they could at least plan em better, for example, why couldn't the one yesterday have been held at the beach so the plans are flying out at sea? I'm sure there will be a perfectly good reason, but I'd love to hear it!
I think air shows and I've never been are as much about checking out the aircraft from the ground as well as the air displays.
Well they could at least plan em better, for example, why couldn't the one yesterday have been held at the beach so the plans are flying out at sea? I'm sure there will be a perfectly good reason, but I'd love to hear it!
I think air shows and I've never been are as much about checking out the aircraft from the ground as well as the air displays.
Maybe charter boats to take folk out or something like that, it's a lot harder to hit a boat out at sea than cars in a traffic jam next to the air field
Well they could at least plan em better, for example, why couldn't the one yesterday have been held at the beach so the plans are flying out at sea? I'm sure there will be a perfectly good reason, but I'd love to hear it!
I think air shows and I've never been are as much about checking out the aircraft from the ground as well as the air displays.
Maybe charter boats to take folk out or something like that, it's a lot harder to hit a boat out at sea than cars in a traffic jam next to the air field
Sorry but I don't think my point was clear. The aircraft are viewed on the ground at the airfield as well as in the sky. Not easy to for that to all happen at sea.
Was at the Herne Bay air show last week. Was spectacular with the Vulcan Bomber and the acrobatic teams and the red arrows. 50,000 people there! But all of the displays were over the sea. Seems a sensible way to do it - just in case...
Well they could at least plan em better, for example, why couldn't the one yesterday have been held at the beach so the plans are flying out at sea? I'm sure there will be a perfectly good reason, but I'd love to hear it!
I think air shows and I've never been are as much about checking out the aircraft from the ground as well as the air displays.
Maybe charter boats to take folk out or something like that, it's a lot harder to hit a boat out at sea than cars in a traffic jam next to the air field
Sorry but I don't think my point was clear. The aircraft are viewed on the ground at the airfield as well as in the sky. Not easy to for that to all happen at sea.
No. They're brilliant. Cars? Time to call a halt? Buses? Time to call a halt? Alcohol? Time to call a halt? Trampolines in the garden? Time to call a halt? Planes? time to call a halt?
No. They're brilliant. Cars? Time to call a halt? Buses? Time to call a halt? Alcohol? Time to call a halt? Trampolines in the garden? Time to call a halt? Planes? time to call a halt?
No, of course not.
I don't really think that comparing the use of cars, buses and even planes for that matter as modes of transport, to a stunt plane doing loop the loop over houses and busy main roads is the right comparison to make tbh. Getting in a car or on a bus or plane are calculated risks that most are willing to take to live their lives.
The way I look at it is that if someone started jumping over busy main roads in a car or on a motorbike, it'd be stopped, so why are planes any different?
Airshows are strictly regulated and the planes just as safe/maintained as the ones you use to fly abroad. There is an argument to limit the aerobatics though and simply have them fly past.
I do medical cover at an Airshow (Royal International Air Tattoo Fairford) and it has better Emergancy cover in the week before and two days after than any town or city in the UK. It is so big, that even the local area (Swindon) uses us if they can not cope with calls in the local area. People are saying that aircraft flying over main roads etc should not be allowed. So, are we planning to close Heathrow? City airport aircraft fly over docklands, are we going to close it? Yes i know they dont do "stunts" but how many commercial aircraft crash each year compaired to airshow aircraft??
You can justify commercial flights. Not sure you can justify ancient aircraft doing stunts over vast crowds and populated areas.
Don't come back with stuff about The Red Arrows. That's completely different. The plane yesterday was about 65 years old. Not up to that sort of manoeuvre. 11 people have just yesterday lost their lives.
More convinced than ever that this has to be curtailed at the very least.
I do medical cover at an Airshow (Royal International Air Tattoo Fairford) and it has better Emergancy cover in the week before and two days after than any town or city in the UK. It is so big, that even the local area (Swindon) uses us if they can not cope with calls in the local area. People are saying that aircraft flying over main roads etc should not be allowed. So, are we planning to close Heathrow? City airport aircraft fly over docklands, are we going to close it? Yes i know they dont do "stunts" but how many commercial aircraft crash each year compaired to airshow aircraft??
I don't know who said that flying over roads should not be allowed, but whoever it is is stupid. But, like I said, a plane going in a straight line to get people from A to B is a calculated risk that I think most people are happy living with (both those on the plane and those under it on the ground), but planes doing stunts over busy roads should be far more regulated if noy banned IMO. Like Dave said above, maybe it's time to limit the aerobatics and where they do it.
Just a question; leaving aside the fact that some people want to walk around the air craft at these shows, would organising this latest event so that the stunts were carried out over the water, instead of over one of the busiest main roads in the South East have been too much to ask?
If a commercial aircraft suffers an engine failure on take off or landing leading to a crash the response time for a full emergency response will be in the in the 10's of minutes. At public airshows, its less than that because of the precautions already in place. We have a two full teams with one ready for an instant response and one on a two minute response. And in the 10 years i have been doing it, we havent had a accident, but have had several Airforce aircraft declare technical emergency situations or bird strikes (including the Red Arrows last year and another national display team this year) I dont recall a older aircraft doing it! Try controlling the crowds amd local land owners. At Fairford, the aircraft are banned from flying over the crowd side of the airfield (as is the same at most airfields since the Rammstein aircrash) and not even allowed around 200 yards infront of them. This does make for good photos, but makes it a little sterile. So, lots of the public moved to the surrounding fields and now the local land owners make a lot of money using the fields as campsites or park and view areas.
And you say, dont mention the Red Arrows, but in the last few years they have lost two pilots due to incidents and technical faults with the aircraft. Should they be banned? Incidently, it was the anniversay of Flt Lt Egging death last week.
I looked up this webpage to try and get a better feel for how often these incidents happen. Interestingly (or perhaps worryingly) the Sussex incident yesterday isn't even the most recent one. If Wiki is right, 12 people have died this year from 6 different incidents.
To put this into context on a worldwide basis 2,500,000 die each year due to alcohol; 1,125,000 die annually from road traffic accidents, there are 800,000 suicides, 150,000 people die each year from measles, 20,000 from acts of terrorism. A study from Germany estimates that 2 people per year will die from playing our sport, football. Bear in mind that is just in one country. If you scale that up to worldwide a worldwide level, it is likely that more than 40 people die per year from soccer related incidents. Do we really want to ban football because it kills more than three times the number of people that air shows do?
Should we call a halt to air shows? Of course not.
At least 7 people, totally un involved in the air show have just been killed on a public road (They weren't at the show). Leaving all the other statstics out of it, is there not anyone that thinks maybe it's time to look at limiting the stuff these pilots do OVER HOUSES AND PUBLIC ROADS ETC?
Still I spose it made for some good mobile phone footage for the show goers eh
Sorry, but of the top of my head, i can think of four commercial aircraft crashes that crashed into houses, roads etc yet these aircraft are still allowed to do it, and the death toll was far higher in them than this one.
Sorry, but of the top of my head, i can think of four commercial aircraft crashes that crashed into houses, roads etc yet these aircraft are still allowed to do it, and the death toll was far higher in them than this one.
Sorry but planes ain't made to do loops, they are made to fly in a straight line, enough is enough, RIP to all them poor people.
You are talking out of your hat, a lot of the planes at airshows ARE aircraft specifically designed to carry out acrobatic displays, dogfights and such manoeuvres, including the Hunter that crashed at the weekend. If military planes could only fly in a straight line they would be fairly easy to shoot down. Military pilots spend a lot of time training to carry out these evasive flying tactics whilst experiencing high G-forces, and the aircraft are built to handle these forces. The Hunter that crashed appeared to have suffered some sort of engine power reduction.
The exceptions are usually civilian airliners who don't tend to carry out loops and rolls as this tends to disrupt the food service.
At least 7 people, totally un involved in the air show have just been killed on a public road (They weren't at the show). Leaving all the other statstics out of it, is there not anyone that thinks maybe it's time to look at limiting the stuff these pilots do OVER HOUSES AND PUBLIC ROADS ETC?
Still I spose it made for some good mobile phone footage for the show goers eh
This was a tragic accident, but it is very rare. How many people have been killed in air displays apart from these. A large number died at Farnborough some years ago in the 1950's after which they restricted the overflying of crowds. What will happen is that the rules on flight paths, height restrictions and aerobatics will be tightened up and made safer
Well they could at least plan em better, for example, why couldn't the one yesterday have been held at the beach so the plans are flying out at sea? I'm sure there will be a perfectly good reason, but I'd love to hear it!
I think air shows and I've never been are as much about checking out the aircraft from the ground as well as the air displays.
Maybe charter boats to take folk out or something like that, it's a lot harder to hit a boat out at sea than cars in a traffic jam next to the air field
At least 7 people, totally un involved in the air show have just been killed on a public road (They weren't at the show). Leaving all the other statstics out of it, is there not anyone that thinks maybe it's time to look at limiting the stuff these pilots do OVER HOUSES AND PUBLIC ROADS ETC?
Still I spose it made for some good mobile phone footage for the show goers eh
This was a tragic accident, but it is very rare. How many people have been killed in air displays apart from these. A large number died at Farnborough some years ago in the 1950's after which they restricted the overflying of crowds. What will happen is that the rules on flight paths, height restrictions and aerobatics will be tightened up and made safer
I know it's rare, but what's to be lost by regulating it? I'm not saying outlawing it, just stopping the stunts over populated areas, risking peoples lives for the sake of an afternoon's entertainment....
Well they could at least plan em better, for example, why couldn't the one yesterday have been held at the beach so the plans are flying out at sea? I'm sure there will be a perfectly good reason, but I'd love to hear it!
I think air shows and I've never been are as much about checking out the aircraft from the ground as well as the air displays.
Maybe charter boats to take folk out or something like that, it's a lot harder to hit a boat out at sea than cars in a traffic jam next to the air field
At least 7 people, totally un involved in the air show have just been killed on a public road (They weren't at the show). Leaving all the other statstics out of it, is there not anyone that thinks maybe it's time to look at limiting the stuff these pilots do OVER HOUSES AND PUBLIC ROADS ETC?
Still I spose it made for some good mobile phone footage for the show goers eh
This was a tragic accident, but it is very rare. How many people have been killed in air displays apart from these. A large number died at Farnborough some years ago in the 1950's after which they restricted the overflying of crowds. What will happen is that the rules on flight paths, height restrictions and aerobatics will be tightened up and made safer
I know it's rare, but what's to be lost by regulating it? I'm not saying outlawing it, just stopping the stunts over populated areas, risking peoples lives for the sake of an afternoon's entertainment....
Didn't I say that. Air shows are very carefully regulated ie the planes can't fly over crowds and the manouvers are inspected and agreed before hand. Planes can go wrong and in this event happened away from the air show arena. The whole of the UK is a densely populated area and the airshow routines are designed to avoid these as much as possible for safety and noise reasons. This accident is tragic but as I said earlier is very rare, and will be made as much as possible even rarer.
I was referring to your comment about the spectators going to sea in boats, which is a little impractical.
Why? If you're that into it that you wanna stand right underneath it, charter yourself a boat and if you got nixed by a Hawker, you've only got yourself to blame.
Unlike, if you're going about your everyday business and get taken out on your way to the shops
Comments
Absolute tragedy, and you are right, seem to hear about things like this quite often.
RIP to all the victims
Cars? Time to call a halt?
Buses? Time to call a halt?
Alcohol? Time to call a halt?
Trampolines in the garden? Time to call a halt?
Planes? time to call a halt?
No, of course not.
The way I look at it is that if someone started jumping over busy main roads in a car or on a motorbike, it'd be stopped, so why are planes any different?
People are saying that aircraft flying over main roads etc should not be allowed. So, are we planning to close Heathrow? City airport aircraft fly over docklands, are we going to close it?
Yes i know they dont do "stunts" but how many commercial aircraft crash each year compaired to airshow aircraft??
Don't come back with stuff about The Red Arrows. That's completely different. The plane yesterday was about 65 years old. Not up to that sort of manoeuvre. 11 people have just yesterday lost their lives.
More convinced than ever that this has to be curtailed at the very least.
Just a question; leaving aside the fact that some people want to walk around the air craft at these shows, would organising this latest event so that the stunts were carried out over the water, instead of over one of the busiest main roads in the South East have been too much to ask?
Try controlling the crowds amd local land owners.
At Fairford, the aircraft are banned from flying over the crowd side of the airfield (as is the same at most airfields since the Rammstein aircrash) and not even allowed around 200 yards infront of them. This does make for good photos, but makes it a little sterile. So, lots of the public moved to the surrounding fields and now the local land owners make a lot of money using the fields as campsites or park and view areas.
Incidently, it was the anniversay of Flt Lt Egging death last week.
To put this into context on a worldwide basis 2,500,000 die each year due to alcohol; 1,125,000 die annually from road traffic accidents, there are 800,000 suicides, 150,000 people die each year from measles, 20,000 from acts of terrorism. A study from Germany estimates that 2 people per year will die from playing our sport, football. Bear in mind that is just in one country. If you scale that up to worldwide a worldwide level, it is likely that more than 40 people die per year from soccer related incidents. Do we really want to ban football because it kills more than three times the number of people that air shows do?
Should we call a halt to air shows? Of course not.
Still I spose it made for some good mobile phone footage for the show goers eh
The exceptions are usually civilian airliners who don't tend to carry out loops and rolls as this tends to disrupt the food service.
Unlike, if you're going about your everyday business and get taken out on your way to the shops