Joe's proved that protests don't need the Supporters' Trust to be leading them. Someone else made the sage observation that at the moment we have a two-pronged approach, and I think that's probably what's needed right now - in which case we'll take the lead on the dialogue, and others can continue leading the protests. The Trust doesn't need to be at the forefront of everything, there are very capable people not on the Trust board too.
A multi-pronged approach works when each of the parties are clearly seen to support the other, when their end goals, including timing, are closely aligned and when the opposition senses complete unity. Myself, I don't see this at the moment and I worry because anything less suits the opposition playbook and in itself is likely one of their goals.
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That's because the only common thread amongst the various voices is 'Change' which is too obvious / stupid.
One person's idea of change is very different to another's - there is no coordination and as such a lot of the noise will either fall by the road side, fail or confuse.
So what is your suggestion / solution?
I don't have one and I can't be bothered to work one out.
It doesn't matter that much to me. Not to say I don't care about the club and enjoy watching games when I can etc but there are many much bigger and far more important things and people in my life for me to get weepy over a game of football.
And yes, I did start going as a kid in the 70s with my Dad and Grandad, I worked on the turnstiles as a youth, I hitch-hiked all over the place when at Uni to see games, have spent a small fortune on STs in the past, shirts, paraphernalia.....tried to get my kids on board (failed) and still enjoy the match day experience but in my mind football is fucked and we're just a very small part of it.
The agendas on here are mixed and personal:
* Manager must have Championship experience (but we'd have that bloke from Walsall, Burton Albion and Neville)
* RD must go (but only once he's spunked a load of cash)
* KM must go (let's hire Voice of the Valley instead)
* The pitch is embarrassing (but changing it is just for show)
* Get the club talking (and then ignore and dismiss everything they say)
* Demand a fans' meeting with the CEO (but fail to ask any probing questions and then laugh at her PowerPoint skills)
* Berate snyone who doesn't think the same as you (including fans' favourite JBG who is now considered a show pony)
The list goes on. Get yourselves organised and you might have a chance of achieving whatever the F it is you want. In the meantime you are being laughed at.
Also, remember that the world of CAFC does not start and end on this website. Saturday proved that.
-----------------------------
You can't be bothered but you are happy to spend loads of time on CL berating and taking the piss out of the approach that others take - strange set of values you have.
We are 2-0 down, and our man hammers a ball in to Gudmundsson's nuts. Pole-axed, lengthy treatment. The whole stadium laughed.
It was 1-0.
Poor effort. 3/10.
AKFA's essay reads like a script for a Hovis ad.
All those drippy words about Floyd Road: what utter drivel. All that endless love for a dreary terraced street. For heaven's sake, you children were not born when we ran on to the pitch at Sell-Out Park, Lennie Lawrence taking us up to the first division.
A superb team in the play-offs: watch our Crooksy curving and hammering it from 30 yards. And Steve Gritt running over the free-kick to deceive Leeds: curled in to the box - 2-1 in extra time.
Can you imagine Simon Makienok doing anything like that?
Ahh of course, because my age is completely relevant.
No I wasn't born then, does that mean I can't care about the club or have an opinion on the current state of it?
I don't understand the relevance of anything you say here. I love being around Floyd Road, I think it's great but because you were at Selhurst Park that makes Floyd Road shit? What are you on?
Also, if you think I'm going to be dazzled by perfect grammar and some interesting sentence structure, I can assure you I won't be.
You don't come across as particularly intelligent but as a pompous, condescending old fool. Did you see what did there? Played the age card...
Cousins was better last season, moving forward - against weak opposition. Now, he passes to the stand on the west side.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
This is a discussion thread; what I think is the frustration is the tendency for it to become a polemic. I would rather it remain a discussion respectful of ALL opinion and actually whilst being happily persuaded to get into the protest I can still see fans' irritation and resentment at a touch of mawkishness. What I would like to see is the enthusiasm the protest has begun not the sentimentalism it can lead to.
Cousins was better last season, moving forward - against weak opposition. Now, he passes to the stand on the west side.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
Isn't this exactly what you are doing in your idyllic re-remembering to the play-off vs Leeds? You do recall that game was us staying up in extra time of the last game of the season which was only being played because we had failed to get the job done over 2 previous legs against a team from the division below us?
No doubt if we'd done that last season you'd be on here doing some of your flowery moaning about Leeds running rings around us or some other such clap-trap.
Personally, although I was only 4 when it happened so have had to relive the night through VHS and the stories of my Old Man (who was there), I think St Andrews was a great night in the club's history. However, unlike you, I also reckon that Tuesday night vs Watford 18 months ago was another cracking way to spend an evening but that's because I don't automatically think that anything that happened 30 years ago must be better than anything that happened last Wednesday.
Cousins was better last season, moving forward - against weak opposition. Now, he passes to the stand on the west side.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
Isn't this exactly what you are doing in your idyllic re-remembering to the play-off vs Leeds? You do recall that game was us staying up in extra time of the last game of the season which was only being played because we had failed to get the job done over 2 previous legs against a team from the division below us?
No doubt if we'd done that last season you'd be on here doing some of your flowering moaning about Leeds running rings around us or some other such clap-trap.
Personally, although I was only 4 when it happened so have had to relive the night through VHS and the stories of my Old Man (who was there), I think St Andrews was a great night in the club's history. However, unlike you, I also reckon that Tuesday night vs Watford 18 months ago was another cracking way to spend an evening but that's because I don't automatically think that anything that happened 30 years ago must be better than anything that happened last Wednesday.
You are so right the Watford game was a cracking night and this is what the owner and CEO should have built on and not be in the same/worse position 18 months later
Cousins was better last season, moving forward - against weak opposition. Now, he passes to the stand on the west side.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
Isn't this exactly what you are doing in your idyllic re-remembering to the play-off vs Leeds? You do recall that game was us staying up in extra time of the last game of the season which was only being played because we had failed to get the job done over 2 previous legs against a team from the division below us?
No doubt if we'd done that last season you'd be on here doing some of your flowering moaning about Leeds running rings around us or some other such clap-trap.
Personally, although I was only 4 when it happened so have had to relive the night through VHS and the stories of my Old Man (who was there), I think St Andrews was a great night in the club's history. However, unlike you, I also reckon that Tuesday night vs Watford 18 months ago was another cracking way to spend an evening but that's because I don't automatically think that anything that happened 30 years ago must be better than anything that happened last Wednesday.
That's a bit of a strange argument because Leeds were obviously a much bigger club than Charlton in 1987, as reflected in the fact they had about ten times as many supporters present at Birmingham. In the circumstances of playing at Selhurst it was a huge achievement for Charlton to have won promotion and then made the play-offs - you can't reinvent that as a humiliation in failing to beat Leeds over the first two games.
In addition, I've enjoyed many second-tier survival escapes since the first one in 1970 but staying in the second tier will never be the same achievement as staying in the top flight. We should expect the former. I don't think that the fact one is ancient history and the other more recent invalidates the case that beating Leeds was a far bigger event.
Cousins was better last season, moving forward - against weak opposition. Now, he passes to the stand on the west side.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
Isn't this exactly what you are doing in your idyllic re-remembering to the play-off vs Leeds? You do recall that game was us staying up in extra time of the last game of the season which was only being played because we had failed to get the job done over 2 previous legs against a team from the division below us?
No doubt if we'd done that last season you'd be on here doing some of your flowering moaning about Leeds running rings around us or some other such clap-trap.
Personally, although I was only 4 when it happened so have had to relive the night through VHS and the stories of my Old Man (who was there), I think St Andrews was a great night in the club's history. However, unlike you, I also reckon that Tuesday night vs Watford 18 months ago was another cracking way to spend an evening but that's because I don't automatically think that anything that happened 30 years ago must be better than anything that happened last Wednesday.
You are so right the Watford game was a cracking night and this is what the owner and CEO should have built on and not be in the same/worse position 18 months later
And to an extent they did - don't forget we started that season on an unbeaten run and we were all glowing with praise for this hidden gem we'd signed from Denmark. Igor got injured though and Bob lost the plot, but when Luzon came in they gave him some backing with Watt, Diarra, Johnson and Eagles and suddenly we were had outside hopes of making the playoffs with half a dozen games to go. The decision to ditch Riga didn't make sense then and it makes even less now, but overall, we didn't do too badly last season and improved on the one before - a modest but reasonable aim.
This summer we retained the manager that did well last season (avoided that mistake again) but instead ditched some players who had been important in that upturn in form (Bulot being the most inexplicable of all).
I think where they have really lost a lot of us was actually this season, not last. The absence of Championship experience in the summer signings, the refusal to bring in a loan or two (despite the clear indication last year of the difference Johnson and Eagles made) when Luzon was forced to play 12 year olds out of position due to injuries and then firing Luzon and bringing in a geography teacher who coaches the school team on a Tuesday after school.
Cousins was better last season, moving forward - against weak opposition. Now, he passes to the stand on the west side.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
Isn't this exactly what you are doing in your idyllic re-remembering to the play-off vs Leeds? You do recall that game was us staying up in extra time of the last game of the season which was only being played because we had failed to get the job done over 2 previous legs against a team from the division below us?
No doubt if we'd done that last season you'd be on here doing some of your flowering moaning about Leeds running rings around us or some other such clap-trap.
Personally, although I was only 4 when it happened so have had to relive the night through VHS and the stories of my Old Man (who was there), I think St Andrews was a great night in the club's history. However, unlike you, I also reckon that Tuesday night vs Watford 18 months ago was another cracking way to spend an evening but that's because I don't automatically think that anything that happened 30 years ago must be better than anything that happened last Wednesday.
That's a bit of a strange argument because Leeds were obviously a much bigger club than Charlton in 1987, as reflected in the fact they had about ten times as many supporters present at Birmingham. In the circumstances of playing at Selhurst it was a huge achievement for Charlton to have won promotion and then made the play-offs - you can't reinvent that as a humiliation in failing to beat Leeds over the first two games.
In addition, I've enjoyed many second-tier survival escapes since the first one in 1970 but staying in the second tier will never be the same achievement as staying in the top flight. We should expect the former. I don't think that the fact one is ancient history and the other more recent invalidates the case that beating Leeds was a far bigger event.
I'm in total agreement, I was just picking holes in Viewfinder's logic, not looking to be little that night in 87.
Cousins was better last season, moving forward - against weak opposition. Now, he passes to the stand on the west side.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
Isn't this exactly what you are doing in your idyllic re-remembering to the play-off vs Leeds? You do recall that game was us staying up in extra time of the last game of the season which was only being played because we had failed to get the job done over 2 previous legs against a team from the division below us?
No doubt if we'd done that last season you'd be on here doing some of your flowery moaning about Leeds running rings around us or some other such clap-trap.
Personally, although I was only 4 when it happened so have had to relive the night through VHS and the stories of my Old Man (who was there), I think St Andrews was a great night in the club's history. However, unlike you, I also reckon that Tuesday night vs Watford 18 months ago was another cracking way to spend an evening but that's because I don't automatically think that anything that happened 30 years ago must be better than anything that happened last Wednesday.
I was there in 87.
That was the most important result(on the pitch) in our history, no doubt about it.
I haven't read all this thread but I have read @AFKABartram excellent opening post, well done Danny. I fear RD may only sell up if we are relegated and he has made some returns on Lookman and few other of our excellent U21's and U 18's. His business plan in my mind is flawed and I cant believe he has run his non football business the same as he is ruining running us. People do have the right to say where would we be without him and I cant answer that, but I think we all know where we are likely to be with him - unless he changes tack. A good businessman will listen to his 'board' or his customer base and realise something is wrong. In KM and sadly now RM he has a board that just agree with him, BUT the customer base is telling him different, however he seems to be able to ignore them as well!! Our club is being dragged down and, for the life of me, I cant understand why he cant see that he will lose money if this continues (unless the aforementioned sales manage to bring in big bucks - otherwise known as asset striping). So what is the end game? Sadly I see League One at the end of this season and then a few years there, but he has the chance to stop this and understand his experiment is failing and failing fast. Are we any better off than when the spivs were in charge? Well we have a nice pitch and a sofa, and a lick of paint on old seats and some new seats.....all lovely, but no-one to sit in or on them and some players who are more used to playing on Charlton Park than the Valley's new pitch..............what a waste!! Come on RD do not sit and fiddle like nero....I BEG YOU!!
Thanks @FannyFanackapan. I'm passionate that this guy needs to understand what he is doing is failing, but being so far away makes it difficult. I'm hoping to come down for the Leeds game......I may just save my time and money, but that'll hardly hurt him. I could stop doing the match thread, all that hurts are the CL community, so I wont be doing that, but I feel that the excellent campaigns being delivered and supported by those in SE7 and surrounding areas may just make him sit up and take notice.....god willing!!
Great read AFKAbartram. I identify with you completely. I won't feel the same again until CAFC is run as a football club and not the mysterious and alien business that has replaced it at my second home, The Valley.
Apologies upfront for the perceived self-indulgence, but with things hopefully coming to an end soon I thought it would be good to remind myself why I was so dissatisfied and what drove me to starting engaging / assist in organising protests in the first please.
So I found this article that I wrote in 2015 after the first 'in ground protest' and I've found it quite reassuring personally to read back now what I was saying and what I was feeling at the time, and have the sense that I'm still comfortable with that a few years on (and pleased that I got involved).
Apologies upfront for the perceived self-indulgence, but with things hopefully coming to an end soon I thought it would be good to remind myself why I was so dissatisfied and what drove me to starting engaging / assist in organising protests in the first please.
So I found this article that I wrote in 2015 after the first 'in ground protest' and I've found it quite reassuring personally to read back now what I was saying and what I was feeling at the time, and have the sense that I'm still comfortable with that a few years on (and pleased that I got involved).
Comments
It doesn't matter that much to me. Not to say I don't care about the club and enjoy watching games when I can etc but there are many much bigger and far more important things and people in my life for me to get weepy over a game of football.
And yes, I did start going as a kid in the 70s with my Dad and Grandad, I worked on the turnstiles as a youth, I hitch-hiked all over the place when at Uni to see games, have spent a small fortune on STs in the past, shirts, paraphernalia.....tried to get my kids on board (failed) and still enjoy the match day experience but in my mind football is fucked and we're just a very small part of it.
The agendas on here are mixed and personal:
* Manager must have Championship experience (but we'd have that bloke from Walsall, Burton Albion and Neville)
* RD must go (but only once he's spunked a load of cash)
* KM must go (let's hire Voice of the Valley instead)
* The pitch is embarrassing (but changing it is just for show)
* Get the club talking (and then ignore and dismiss everything they say)
* Demand a fans' meeting with the CEO (but fail to ask any probing questions and then laugh at her PowerPoint skills)
* Berate snyone who doesn't think the same as you (including fans' favourite JBG who is now considered a show pony)
The list goes on. Get yourselves organised and you might have a chance of achieving whatever the F it is you want. In the meantime you are being laughed at.
Also, remember that the world of CAFC does not start and end on this website. Saturday proved that.
-----------------------------
You can't be bothered but you are happy to spend loads of time on CL berating and taking the piss out of the approach that others take - strange set of values you have.
All those drippy words about Floyd Road: what utter drivel. All that endless love for a dreary terraced street. For heaven's sake, you children were not born when we ran on to the pitch at Sell-Out Park, Lennie Lawrence taking us up to the first division.
A superb team in the play-offs: watch our Crooksy curving and hammering it from 30 yards. And Steve Gritt running over the free-kick to deceive Leeds: curled in to the box - 2-1 in extra time.
Can you imagine Simon Makienok doing anything like that?
Ha ha!
Ahh of course, because my age is completely relevant.
No I wasn't born then, does that mean I can't care about the club or have an opinion on the current state of it?
I don't understand the relevance of anything you say here. I love being around Floyd Road, I think it's great but because you were at Selhurst Park that makes Floyd Road shit? What are you on?
Also, if you think I'm going to be dazzled by perfect grammar and some interesting sentence structure, I can assure you I won't be.
You don't come across as particularly intelligent but as a pompous, condescending old fool. Did you see what did there? Played the age card...
Nothing new.
We might do well in the lower division - by-passed by Gillingham, note. Except that we will scrabble out of relegation by three points - and you and the manager will hail it is a victory. That's in the same way you think Joe Piggott is a great striker, and Callum Harriott is played out of position at Colchester.
You have low horizons. There is absolutely no reason why we shouldn't scoot through this division. We have a fabulously wealthy owner. Yet, we have hapless players, an ignorant manager, and supine supporters...
Polemic '
gets more like a spanner forum every day.
Polemic = Polish worker of Irish decent
No doubt if we'd done that last season you'd be on here doing some of your flowery moaning about Leeds running rings around us or some other such clap-trap.
Personally, although I was only 4 when it happened so have had to relive the night through VHS and the stories of my Old Man (who was there), I think St Andrews was a great night in the club's history. However, unlike you, I also reckon that Tuesday night vs Watford 18 months ago was another cracking way to spend an evening but that's because I don't automatically think that anything that happened 30 years ago must be better than anything that happened last Wednesday.
In addition, I've enjoyed many second-tier survival escapes since the first one in 1970 but staying in the second tier will never be the same achievement as staying in the top flight. We should expect the former. I don't think that the fact one is ancient history and the other more recent invalidates the case that beating Leeds was a far bigger event.
This summer we retained the manager that did well last season (avoided that mistake again) but instead ditched some players who had been important in that upturn in form (Bulot being the most inexplicable of all).
I think where they have really lost a lot of us was actually this season, not last. The absence of Championship experience in the summer signings, the refusal to bring in a loan or two (despite the clear indication last year of the difference Johnson and Eagles made) when Luzon was forced to play 12 year olds out of position due to injuries and then firing Luzon and bringing in a geography teacher who coaches the school team on a Tuesday after school.
Nothing?
Despite being dismissed and belittled as part of a group of "children", I do know what "supine" means.
Please tell me what you have specifically done that makes you different to that?
That was the most important result(on the pitch) in our history, no doubt about it.
I fear RD may only sell up if we are relegated and he has made some returns on Lookman and few other of our excellent U21's and U 18's.
His business plan in my mind is flawed and I cant believe he has run his non football business the same as he is
ruiningrunning us.People do have the right to say where would we be without him and I cant answer that, but I think we all know where we are likely to be with him - unless he changes tack.
A good businessman will listen to his 'board' or his customer base and realise something is wrong. In KM and sadly now RM he has a board that just agree with him, BUT the customer base is telling him different, however he seems to be able to ignore them as well!!
Our club is being dragged down and, for the life of me, I cant understand why he cant see that he will lose money if this continues (unless the aforementioned sales manage to bring in big bucks - otherwise known as asset striping).
So what is the end game?
Sadly I see League One at the end of this season and then a few years there, but he has the chance to stop this and understand his experiment is failing and failing fast. Are we any better off than when the spivs were in charge? Well we have a nice pitch and a sofa, and a lick of paint on old seats and some new seats.....all lovely, but no-one to sit in or on them and some players who are more used to playing on Charlton Park than the Valley's new pitch..............what a waste!!
Come on RD do not sit and fiddle like nero....I BEG YOU!!
Great minds think alike !
From: teampinokkio@cmww.nl -The only erection pills that retrieve men’s strength to succumb her
So I found this article that I wrote in 2015 after the first 'in ground protest' and I've found it quite reassuring personally to read back now what I was saying and what I was feeling at the time, and have the sense that I'm still comfortable with that a few years on (and pleased that I got involved).
Wonder if others resonate in a similar way?
If anyone has one please let us know.