I'd love Gwen and Josh to take legal action for assault and theft (of a season ticket) against the club. Regardless of the outcome it would ramp up the pressure. Can friends relay this?
It's quite unlikely theft would apply. The T&Cs indicate that season tickets remain the property of the club, so they would argue they were merely taking back what was always their property. (Whether the courts would agree is another matter as it's something you've paid for.) In any event if it was returned in due course, there would have been no intention to deprive permanently, so the Theft Act would be otiose. However, if the season ticket holder finds he cannot continue to use his ticket for the remainder of the season and it was paid for on credit, whether by credit card or the club's scheme, then claiming off the credit company for the unused portion of the ticket would be a plan as the club would have failed to provide the services contracted in full and would not be able to claim they had acted reasonably in the circumstances. (The debit card charge back scheme might also work.)
I've been an ST holder in the past and haven't been aware of any T&C associated. Are they within the ticket book?
I'd love Gwen and Josh to take legal action for assault and theft (of a season ticket) against the club. Regardless of the outcome it would ramp up the pressure. Can friends relay this?
It's quite unlikely theft would apply. The T&Cs indicate that season tickets remain the property of the club, so they would argue they were merely taking back what was always their property. (Whether the courts would agree is another matter as it's something you've paid for.) In any event if it was returned in due course, there would have been no intention to deprive permanently, so the Theft Act would be otiose. However, if the season ticket holder finds he cannot continue to use his ticket for the remainder of the season and it was paid for on credit, whether by credit card or the club's scheme, then claiming off the credit company for the unused portion of the ticket would be a plan as the club would have failed to provide the services contracted in full and would not be able to claim they had acted reasonably in the circumstances. (The debit card charge back scheme might also work.)
I'd love Gwen and Josh to take legal action for assault and theft (of a season ticket) against the club. Regardless of the outcome it would ramp up the pressure. Can friends relay this?
It's quite unlikely theft would apply. The T&Cs indicate that season tickets remain the property of the club, so they would argue they were merely taking back what was always their property. (Whether the courts would agree is another matter as it's something you've paid for.) In any event if it was returned in due course, there would have been no intention to deprive permanently, so the Theft Act would be otiose. However, if the season ticket holder finds he cannot continue to use his ticket for the remainder of the season and it was paid for on credit, whether by credit card or the club's scheme, then claiming off the credit company for the unused portion of the ticket would be a plan as the club would have failed to provide the services contracted in full and would not be able to claim they had acted reasonably in the circumstances. (The debit card charge back scheme might also work.)
I've been an ST holder in the past and haven't been aware of any T&C associated. Are they within the ticket book?
1 Notwithstanding possession of any ticket the Club, any police officer or authorised steward may refuse entry to (or eject from) the Ground any person:
1.1 that fails (or in the Club's reasonable opinion is likely to fail) to comply with these Ground Regulations or any reasonable instruction issued by a police officer or authorised steward; and/or
1.2 whose presence within the Ground is, or could (in the Club's reasonable opinion), constitute a source of danger, nuisance or annoyance to any other person.
Something tells me he was definitely annoying one particular person...!
1 Notwithstanding possession of any ticket the Club, any police officer or authorised steward may refuse entry to (or eject from) the Ground any person:
1.1 that fails (or in the Club's reasonable opinion is likely to fail) to comply with these Ground Regulations or any reasonable instruction issued by a police officer or authorised steward; and/or
1.2whose presence within the Ground is, or could (in the Club's reasonable opinion), constitute a source of danger, nuisance or annoyance to any other person.
Something tells me he was definitely annoying one particular person...!
Well I find Meire's presence in the ground an annoyance, and it's reasonable to believe that the thousands of other's chanting, "get out of our club" feel the same. Time to act stewards, and get this annoying rhinoplastic puppet out of our club.
I'm not sure I understand why these stewards felt is necessary to forcibly remove the banner from two fans, only to give it back to another fan a few minutes later
It has just been suggested by someone on Facebook that i put the banner up for sale on Ebay to raise funds for the protest.
Go get them replicated somewhere and whatever the cost is for a few hundred of them, invoice the protest kitty (if they accept the idea, of course!). Hand them out to willing hardy souls and get them scattered about the ground. It'd work a treat.
I'm not sure I understand why these stewards felt is necessary to forcibly remove the banner from two fans, only to give it back to another fan a few minutes later
They didn't give it back to me i snatched it from the steward. I went down to see what was going on and the stewards were arguing with a group of fans, I didn't like what i saw and thought that it wasn't right the way the stewards behaved, it's not on.
I'm not sure I understand why these stewards felt is necessary to forcibly remove the banner from two fans, only to give it back to another fan a few minutes later
They didn't give it back to me i snatched it from the steward. I went down to see what was going on and the stewards were arguing with a group of fans, I didn't like what i saw and thought that it wasn't right the way the stewards behaved, it's not on.
Wasn't there a thread on here a while back highlighting the written policy of most league clubs to banners and flags.
Ours, like Coventry's and others, had all the usual about fire certificates etc but also a note that anything deemed offensive to or about the owners would be confiscated ?
1.Yes, provided that permission has been sought in advance of the day and that they do not obstruct any of our advertising, signage, exit routes, or restrict the views of other fans. If there is a sterile area or an empty block of seats the club may permit banners to be placed in the sterile area across the unused seats or empty block. Permission to do so must first be obtained from the club. The club reserve the right to confiscate any flags or banners brought into the stadium without being approved prior to entry.
2.All banners / flags measuring more than 150cm x 150cm should be made from fire-retardant material and a fire certificate must be produced. Proof of certification may be required whenever they are brought into the stadium. Banners/flags on poles are not permitted unless the pole is under 1metre in length, and no bigger than 7mm in diameter
3.They should speak to the Safety Officer or his deputy before the day of the game, to seek permission.
4.Anything racial, homophobic or of a discriminatory, defamatory or inflammatory nature. Anything that we may feel is controversial to either of the teams or their ownerships. Anything political. Anything that could be deemed obscene.
1.Yes, provided that permission has been sought in advance of the day and that they do not obstruct any of our advertising, signage, exit routes, or restrict the views of other fans. If there is a sterile area or an empty block of seats the club may permit banners to be placed in the sterile area across the unused seats or empty block. Permission to do so must first be obtained from the club. The club reserve the right to confiscate any flags or banners brought into the stadium without being approved prior to entry.
2.All banners / flags measuring more than 150cm x 150cm should be made from fire-retardant material and a fire certificate must be produced. Proof of certification may be required whenever they are brought into the stadium. Banners/flags on poles are not permitted unless the pole is under 1metre in length, and no bigger than 7mm in diameter.
So will can bring in 149cm x 149cm and they can't do anything? Just get a few of these and put them together into a bigger banner, once inside.
The policy states 'The club reserve the right to confiscate ANY flags or banners brought into the stadium without being approved prior to entry' so that will mean a confiscation of any flag or banner no matter what the size of it
The policy states 'The club reserve the right to confiscate ANY flags or banners brought into the stadium without being approved prior to entry' so that will mean a confiscation of any flag or banner no matter what the size of it
The right and the capability are two very different things.
Just a thought and might put the club on the back foot, there was a defence lawyer offering his help, why not ask him to go with Josh when he has to see the club, just to ensure everything is undertaken in a fair and legal way, I'm sure he could find a few faults with the procedures especially if they try to get a bit stropy?
That could backfire very badly for the young man.
The people who have chat with people aren't the problem and they aren't the enemy. If people are sensible with them then the club is sensible back things can get smoothed over easily and quickly. They aren't going to "get stroppy" as they don't need to. It's a private club and they can stop people coming in if they want to. The PR disaster of banning someone for this will be well known in any case but I repeat the people who have a chat aren't the enemy here.
Agree with most of what you say ... however, judging by recent weeks I am not sure the club could see a PR disaster approaching in a month of Sundays, so banking on that could be a mistake.
If anyone really wanted to set the stewards up for a fall, you repeat the exercise but with a very old (but physically robust!), ideally female, person in charge of the offending banner. Would the stewards really be so heavy handed in that instance? And also everyone enarny shoukd immediately produce their phones and start filming.
As banners and flags are an issue I was just having a look at personalised football scarfs. You can print scarfs (black & white, if you wish) with 'ROLAND OUT' on them. The more you buy the cheaper they are. You surely couldn't be thrown out of a football stadium for wearing a scarf, could you?
Especially if we had hundreds of them dotted all over the ground.
As banners and flags are an issue I was just having a look at personalised football scarfs. You can print scarfs (black & white, if you wish) with 'ROLAND OUT' on them. The more you buy the cheaper they are. You surely couldn't be thrown out of a football stadium for wearing a scarf, could you?
Especially if we had hundreds of them dotted all over the ground.
As banners and flags are an issue I was just having a look at personalised football scarfs. You can print scarfs (black & white, if you wish) with 'ROLAND OUT' on them. The more you buy the cheaper they are. You surely couldn't be thrown out of a football stadium for wearing a scarf, could you?
Especially if we had hundreds of them dotted all over the ground.
ROLAND OUT.
Good idea, how much for how many BP ?
Well, there's the issue. I was going to buy one and it'd be about 30 euros for one. Big money. But if there was interest it'd certainly be worth looking for bulk discount, or finding a more reasonable supplier.
1.Yes, provided that permission has been sought in advance of the day and that they do not obstruct any of our advertising, signage, exit routes, or restrict the views of other fans. If there is a sterile area or an empty block of seats the club may permit banners to be placed in the sterile area across the unused seats or empty block. Permission to do so must first be obtained from the club. The club reserve the right to confiscate any flags or banners brought into the stadium without being approved prior to entry.
2.All banners / flags measuring more than 150cm x 150cm should be made from fire-retardant material and a fire certificate must be produced. Proof of certification may be required whenever they are brought into the stadium. Banners/flags on poles are not permitted unless the pole is under 1metre in length, and no bigger than 7mm in diameter
3.They should speak to the Safety Officer or his deputy before the day of the game, to seek permission.
4.Anything racial, homophobic or of a discriminatory, defamatory or inflammatory nature. Anything that we may feel is controversial to either of the teams or their ownerships. Anything political. Anything that could be deemed obscene.
it is strange that on the continent they can bring flares, smoke bombs, banners, flags and what ever else to their grounds on a regular basis. we bring in an old bed sheet with a polite request written on it and it gets taken away.
Am I missing something here? I witnessed what could legally be termed an assault on Saturday. Maybe we should all write to the police and demand they do something about it. If they think they can get away with it, they will start targeting fans.
Am I missing something here? I witnessed what could legally be termed an assault on Saturday. Maybe we should all write to the police and demand they do something about it. If they think they can get away with it, they will start targeting fans.
Unfortunately the discussion is now split between two threads, but @LouisMend contacted someone at the FSF (I think) who has already been made aware and is very keen to get in contact with Gwen. So hopefully something can be resolved there.
Comments
Well I find Meire's presence in the ground an annoyance, and it's reasonable to believe that the thousands of other's chanting, "get out of our club" feel the same. Time to act stewards, and get this annoying rhinoplastic puppet out of our club.
Ours, like Coventry's and others, had all the usual about fire certificates etc but also a note that anything deemed offensive to or about the owners would be confiscated ?
Charlton Athletic
1.Yes, provided that permission has been sought in advance of the day and that they do not obstruct any of our advertising, signage, exit routes, or restrict the views of other fans. If there is a sterile area or an empty block of seats the club may permit banners to be placed in the sterile area across the unused seats or empty block. Permission to do so must first be obtained from the club. The club reserve the right to confiscate any flags or banners brought into the stadium without being approved prior to entry.
2.All banners / flags measuring more than 150cm x 150cm should be made from fire-retardant material and a fire certificate must be produced. Proof of certification may be required whenever they are brought into the stadium. Banners/flags on poles are not permitted unless the pole is under 1metre in length, and no bigger than 7mm in diameter
3.They should speak to the Safety Officer or his deputy before the day of the game, to seek permission.
4.Anything racial, homophobic or of a discriminatory, defamatory or inflammatory nature. Anything that we may feel is controversial to either of the teams or their ownerships. Anything political. Anything that could be deemed obscene.
Just get a few of these and put them together into a bigger banner, once inside.
Volounteered for everything, always on time, passionate etc etc.
This is brilliant as well.
Great guy.
Especially if we had hundreds of them dotted all over the ground.
ROLAND OUT.
I was going to buy one and it'd be about 30 euros for one. Big money. But if there was interest it'd certainly be worth looking for bulk discount, or finding a more reasonable supplier.
http://www.footiescarves.co.uk/
Hundreds of 'Roland Out' scarves could be popular / effective.
Discussion here - http://forum.charltonlife.com/discussion/71227/outrageous-behaviour-from-our-stewards-today#latest