are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
My wife is an operating theatre senior sister.
Every operation they count everything, needles, instruments, swabs etc before and after for the obvious reason that if they don't know where they are they might be in the person's body. They don't just leave them. If the count doesn't add up they keep on looking.
Should be same for this lot. If you "planted" 10 "bombs" at the beginning you make sure you have 10 "bombs" at the end. Basic stuff.
but you still hear of cases where someone has had something left inside them, not on your wife's watch obviously
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
My wife is an operating theatre senior sister.
Every operation they count everything, needles, instruments, swabs etc before and after for the obvious reason that if they don't know where they are they might be in the person's body. They don't just leave them. If the count doesn't add up they keep on looking.
Should be same for this lot. If you "planted" 10 "bombs" at the beginning you make sure you have 10 "bombs" at the end. Basic stuff.
but you still hear of cases where someone has had something left inside them, not on your wife's watch obviously
Mainly not in the UK though. And certainly not on Sister Hayes' watch.
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
My wife is an operating theatre senior sister.
Every operation they count everything, needles, instruments, swabs etc before and after for the obvious reason that if they don't know where they are they might be in the person's body. They don't just leave them. If the count doesn't add up they keep on looking.
Should be same for this lot. If you "planted" 10 "bombs" at the beginning you make sure you have 10 "bombs" at the end. Basic stuff.
but you still hear of cases where someone has had something left inside them, not on your wife's watch obviously
I read this as 'not your wife's watch' and thinking 'wow, leaving your watch inside someone is a hell of a cock up'. Dodgy strap I guess.
Bloody Moslems coming over here, leaving training exercises everywhere, turning our law into evacuation drills. #britainfirst #whitelivesmatter #voteleave
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Manchester dogs are much better sniffing out coke and heroin!
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
My wife is an operating theatre senior sister.
Every operation they count everything, needles, instruments, swabs etc before and after for the obvious reason that if they don't know where they are they might be in the person's body. They don't just leave them. If the count doesn't add up they keep on looking.
Should be same for this lot. If you "planted" 10 "bombs" at the beginning you make sure you have 10 "bombs" at the end. Basic stuff.
but you still hear of cases where someone has had something left inside them, not on your wife's watch obviously
I read this as 'not your wife's watch' and thinking 'wow, leaving your watch inside someone is a hell of a cock up'. Dodgy strap I guess.
that reminded me of the old joke with the punchline 'that's not my ring, it's my watch'
Managing director Chris Reid said: "It is a very unfortunate situation and the consequences obviously were that a lot of people were inconvenienced. "Fortunately, everybody was fine which is the most important thing."
Hmm, not a single 'sorry' or 'we made a mistake' or any concession there. Did he go to the same school of PR as Katrien?
Of course if Katrien was involved she would be demanding that the police pay for a replacement fake device to compensate for the one destroyed in the controlled explosion.
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Absolutely. Along with a dirty great sticker on the 'device' saying 'this is not a live device and is used for training purposes only'; along with a phone number written in large numerics detailing who to ring to confirm such. It really is basics.
Managing director Chris Reid said: "It is a very unfortunate situation and the consequences obviously were that a lot of people were inconvenienced. "Fortunately, everybody was fine which is the most important thing."
Hmm, not a single 'sorry' or 'we made a mistake' or any concession there. Did he go to the same school of PR as Katrien?
Of course if Katrien was involved she would be demanding that the police pay for a replacement fake device to compensate for the one destroyed in the controlled explosion.
I imagine he's been advised NOT to admit guilt in public, before the lawyers get involved.
It's the same thing as drivers in a car crash being advised not to admit guilt at the time, even if it's clear which party is to blame
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Absolutely. Along with a dirty great sticker on the 'device' saying 'this is not a live device and is used for training purposes only'; along with a phone number written in large numerics detailing who to ring to confirm such. It really is basics.
Apparently there was a phone number but it was a London-based number and not written in the correct formatting so no one recognised it as a phone number.
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Absolutely. Along with a dirty great sticker on the 'device' saying 'this is not a live device and is used for training purposes only'; along with a phone number written in large numerics detailing who to ring to confirm such. It really is basics.
That's exactly what I'd write on my bomb if I was a terrorist.
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Absolutely. Along with a dirty great sticker on the 'device' saying 'this is not a live device and is used for training purposes only'; along with a phone number written in large numerics detailing who to ring to confirm such. It really is basics.
That's exactly what I'd write on my bomb if I was a terrorist.
Even so, even armed forces and police marksmen paint dummy/training guns, ammo, explosives bright orange or green to signify that they are 'non-lethal'. It really is basic stuff.
Man Utd themselves seem to be getting a lot of flak what would appear to be the mistakes of two separate third-party firms who they trusted to do the service. The thing though is surely there is a Chief of Security or whatever the equivalent of a 'Premises Manager' is for Old Trafford who would be ultimately responsible for security, therefore they should have known that there was a training exercise during the week involving fake devices being planted, as well as being one of the first people to be informed that a device was found when it first came to light. So either this person exists and they didn't put two and two together, or the person who runs matchday security at Old Trafford had absolutely no idea this exercise took place, in which case there are serious failings in the alignment of responsibilities. I imagine there are likely statutory guidelines in place for what is a position of significant responsibility.
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Absolutely. Along with a dirty great sticker on the 'device' saying 'this is not a live device and is used for training purposes only'; along with a phone number written in large numerics detailing who to ring to confirm such. It really is basics.
Apparently there was a phone number but it was a London-based number and not written in the correct formatting so no one recognised it as a phone number.
Apparently, the device had been erroneously signed back in at the end of the exercise, so it looks like they did have a system to count the devices in and out, but somewhere this went wrong.
Given that fact, and with the safety of thousands of spectators at stake, you can't really criticise the immediate response - any doubt at all and they need to treat it like a genuine threat.
However, the one sentence which doesn't seem to ring true with the rest of the story for me is this:
The routine sweep of the ground by sniffer dogs on matchday would not have detected the contraption as it did not include explosives, and it was actually discovered by a steward who alerted security.
If the device couldn't have been expected to have been found by sniffer dogs, because it contains no explosives, then what was it doing being used in a training exercise for sniffer dogs?
I would have thought that these training devices would contain trace amounts of explosives, or else some other similar substance designed to obtain the same response from the dogs - otherwise what's the point?
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
My wife is an operating theatre senior sister.
Every operation they count everything, needles, instruments, swabs etc before and after for the obvious reason that if they don't know where they are they might be in the person's body. They don't just leave them. If the count doesn't add up they keep on looking.
Should be same for this lot. If you "planted" 10 "bombs" at the beginning you make sure you have 10 "bombs" at the end. Basic stuff.
but you still hear of cases where someone has had something left inside them, not on your wife's watch obviously
Mainly not in the UK though. And certainly not on Sister Hayes' watch.
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
My wife is an operating theatre senior sister.
Every operation they count everything, needles, instruments, swabs etc before and after for the obvious reason that if they don't know where they are they might be in the person's body. They don't just leave them. If the count doesn't add up they keep on looking.
Should be same for this lot. If you "planted" 10 "bombs" at the beginning you make sure you have 10 "bombs" at the end. Basic stuff.
A medical procedure which to date has a 100% success rate.
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Absolutely. Along with a dirty great sticker on the 'device' saying 'this is not a live device and is used for training purposes only'; along with a phone number written in large numerics detailing who to ring to confirm such. It really is basics.
Apparently there was a phone number but it was a London-based number and not written in the correct formatting so no one recognised it as a phone number.
Was it written as 0208 then?
Well, there's the confusion - Biggin Hill numbers start 01959...
Man Utd security staff reportedly checked the toilet before the ground was open and didn't find it either, it was hanging on the back of the door - doesn't paint them in a good light
are the Police not to blame. I thought the 'devices' were planted for the Police to find, if so surely they knew how many they were searching for or can no-one in the Old Bill count?
Nah, it's been said that it was a third party firm. It's not uncommon for private firms to provide search dogs and the like.
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
Absolutely. Along with a dirty great sticker on the 'device' saying 'this is not a live device and is used for training purposes only'; along with a phone number written in large numerics detailing who to ring to confirm such. It really is basics.
Apparently there was a phone number but it was a London-based number and not written in the correct formatting so no one recognised it as a phone number.
So all I have taken from this is to paint my bomb bright green or orange, stick a big old training purposes only sticker on it, and provide a helpful number to ring for more information on the bomb, which just so happens to be the detonation device for said bomb? It's all a bit too easy isn't it?
Images like the one on the left, which blow the whole thing out of proportion, show what a pathetic world we live in.
Bit weird. It's not an edited picture, it's what happened. The kid got very upset, either because the football was cancelled or because he was scared of the 'bomb' or perhaps both. That tells you what this experience was like for him. It's not blowing things out of proportion, it's just showing what happened.
Comments
You would've thought there was an inventory before and after the training exercise, and you would've also have hoped that the dogs were given a quick run-around the stadium before it opens to the public on a match day..
The MD is an ex Met Police counter terrorism advisor apparently.
Oops.
Of course if Katrien was involved she would be demanding that the police pay for a replacement fake device to compensate for the one destroyed in the controlled explosion.
Of course if Katrien was involved she would be demanding that the police pay for a replacement fake device to compensate for the one destroyed in the controlled explosion.
I imagine he's been advised NOT to admit guilt in public, before the lawyers get involved.
It's the same thing as drivers in a car crash being advised not to admit guilt at the time, even if it's clear which party is to blame
Man Utd themselves seem to be getting a lot of flak what would appear to be the mistakes of two separate third-party firms who they trusted to do the service. The thing though is surely there is a Chief of Security or whatever the equivalent of a 'Premises Manager' is for Old Trafford who would be ultimately responsible for security, therefore they should have known that there was a training exercise during the week involving fake devices being planted, as well as being one of the first people to be informed that a device was found when it first came to light. So either this person exists and they didn't put two and two together, or the person who runs matchday security at Old Trafford had absolutely no idea this exercise took place, in which case there are serious failings in the alignment of responsibilities. I imagine there are likely statutory guidelines in place for what is a position of significant responsibility.
Was it written as 0208 then?
Apparently, the device had been erroneously signed back in at the end of the exercise, so it looks like they did have a system to count the devices in and out, but somewhere this went wrong.
Given that fact, and with the safety of thousands of spectators at stake, you can't really criticise the immediate response - any doubt at all and they need to treat it like a genuine threat.
However, the one sentence which doesn't seem to ring true with the rest of the story for me is this:
The routine sweep of the ground by sniffer dogs on matchday would not have detected the contraption as it did not include explosives, and it was actually discovered by a steward who alerted security.
If the device couldn't have been expected to have been found by sniffer dogs, because it contains no explosives, then what was it doing being used in a training exercise for sniffer dogs?
I would have thought that these training devices would contain trace amounts of explosives, or else some other similar substance designed to obtain the same response from the dogs - otherwise what's the point?
It's like the start of the Addams Family song.