With players like Cousins, I think it could depend on things like who will be captaining the team
He's loyal. For me I think it's because he's def not good enough for the prem, and it's gonna then come down to what championship club fancies paying the 'premium' English players cost. We might find that due to those 2 factors, he'll still be here past the deadline
I'd be very, very surprised. His athleticism alone is worth a punt given how much money there is at the top of the game. I'm thinking he'd cost ~5m. That's change that can be found in the couch of Prem clubs or clubs with parachute payments. From their perspective, why not take a punt on him putting it all together? Buy him for very cheap, loan him out to the Champo for a couple years in the hope that he'll mature and improve technically. We're now seeing this at every level--the top teams just stockpiling players.
I would absolutely love to be wrong, but I just can't see any way he's still with us when the window shuts. Feel free to remember this and set up a forfeit.
Technically I don't think he's a premiership player. Can do all the hard labour with that athleticism you mention, but athleticism is for me a pre-requisite im the modern game. It's that touch and finesse he lacks that won't see him ever play at the top level
With players like Cousins, I think it could depend on things like who will be captaining the team
He's loyal. For me I think it's because he's def not good enough for the prem, and it's gonna then come down to what championship club fancies paying the 'premium' English players cost. We might find that due to those 2 factors, he'll still be here past the deadline
I'd be very, very surprised. His athleticism alone is worth a punt given how much money there is at the top of the game. I'm thinking he'd cost ~5m. That's change that can be found in the couch of Prem clubs or clubs with parachute payments. From their perspective, why not take a punt on him putting it all together? Buy him for very cheap, loan him out to the Champo for a couple years in the hope that he'll mature and improve technically. We're now seeing this at every level--the top teams just stockpiling players.
I would absolutely love to be wrong, but I just can't see any way he's still with us when the window shuts. Feel free to remember this and set up a forfeit.
Technically I don't think he's a premiership player. Can do all the hard labour with that athleticism you mention, but athleticism is for me a pre-requisite im the modern game. It's that touch and finesse he lacks that won't see him ever play at the top level
Agreed and the same for JBG if his right peg was aa good as his left he'd be a Premier League player.
The other issue is the standard of the Premier League goes up year after year so unless JBG or Cousins are both going to kick on I'd say top 6 Championship / give it a go at a promoted Championship team in the Prem but go down fighting is about both players level really.
Have both players improved in the last 2 years? Difficult to say. Could they improve at clubs like Brighton and Norwich? Again difficult to tell. Personally don't think a drop down to League 1 for a season should be beyond either player although it does look like JBG at least will be on his way.
No idea. I agreed with the players sam3110 said would leave in this window. At least JBG is on his way back soon. I heard that Charlton said they want to get some out before bringing more in.
With players like Cousins, I think it could depend on things like who will be captaining the team
He's loyal. For me I think it's because he's def not good enough for the prem, and it's gonna then come down to what championship club fancies paying the 'premium' English players cost. We might find that due to those 2 factors, he'll still be here past the deadline
I'd be very, very surprised. His athleticism alone is worth a punt given how much money there is at the top of the game. I'm thinking he'd cost ~5m. That's change that can be found in the couch of Prem clubs or clubs with parachute payments. From their perspective, why not take a punt on him putting it all together? Buy him for very cheap, loan him out to the Champo for a couple years in the hope that he'll mature and improve technically. We're now seeing this at every level--the top teams just stockpiling players.
I would absolutely love to be wrong, but I just can't see any way he's still with us when the window shuts. Feel free to remember this and set up a forfeit.
Technically I don't think he's a premiership player. Can do all the hard labour with that athleticism you mention, but athleticism is for me a pre-requisite im the modern game. It's that touch and finesse he lacks that won't see him ever play at the top level
Agreed and the same for JBG if his right peg was aa good as his left he'd be a Premier League player.
The other issue is the standard of the Premier League goes up year after year so unless JBG or Cousins are both going to kick on I'd say top 6 Championship / give it a go at a promoted Championship team in the Prem but go down fighting is about both players level really.
Have both players improved in the last 2 years? Difficult to say. Could they improve at clubs like Brighton and Norwich? Again difficult to tell. Personally don't think a drop down to League 1 for a season should be beyond either player although it does look like JBG at least will be on his way.
Agreed that Cousins isn't ready for the Prem week-in-week-out right now, but that will not, unto itself, prevent a Premiership team or team with Premiership ambitions from buying him. He's only 22. Yes, he's lacking technically, but I think that side of his game is improving.
Have both players improved over the last two years? Yes, emphatically. Cousins became a first team player, one of the first names on the team sheet. He played very well in stretches last year, and was very good in the run-in this year. JBG added goals to his game, which he didn't have in Holland, and he's just finished a run to the Euro quarter-final without ever looking out of place.
As far as the price we'll get, just looking at how deals are structured it's very hard to know what we'll get. That's before you throw in the tournament boost that JBG is likely to bring, and the premium on young, English players for Cousins. I still think that the 2.5m up front we got for Gomez was quite low. I know there will be milestone payouts on that, but I think if Liverpool were to sell him today they'd get 10m+, with the difference being he played five or six Prem games.
The whole transfer market within England, and to some extent the big clubs in Europe, is a false economy. I'm not saying I necessarily agree with any of the prices listed, it's just how I see fees going these days.
The thing about when players will be shipped out is that somebody has got to want to buy them first. I'm not as convinced as some seem to be that certain players will be of any interest to anyone at the rate we might want to sell them at.
It's hard to put a value on Cousins. Many good sides lack a workhorse. In the right side, he could be valuable even though I have a lot of reservations about his ability.
With players like Cousins, I think it could depend on things like who will be captaining the team
He's loyal. For me I think it's because he's def not good enough for the prem, and it's gonna then come down to what championship club fancies paying the 'premium' English players cost. We might find that due to those 2 factors, he'll still be here past the deadline
I'd be very, very surprised. His athleticism alone is worth a punt given how much money there is at the top of the game. I'm thinking he'd cost ~5m. That's change that can be found in the couch of Prem clubs or clubs with parachute payments. From their perspective, why not take a punt on him putting it all together? Buy him for very cheap, loan him out to the Champo for a couple years in the hope that he'll mature and improve technically. We're now seeing this at every level--the top teams just stockpiling players.
I would absolutely love to be wrong, but I just can't see any way he's still with us when the window shuts. Feel free to remember this and set up a forfeit.
Technically I don't think he's a premiership player. Can do all the hard labour with that athleticism you mention, but athleticism is for me a pre-requisite im the modern game. It's that touch and finesse he lacks that won't see him ever play at the top level
Agreed and the same for JBG if his right peg was aa good as his left he'd be a Premier League player.
The other issue is the standard of the Premier League goes up year after year so unless JBG or Cousins are both going to kick on I'd say top 6 Championship / give it a go at a promoted Championship team in the Prem but go down fighting is about both players level really.
Have both players improved in the last 2 years? Difficult to say. Could they improve at clubs like Brighton and Norwich? Again difficult to tell. Personally don't think a drop down to League 1 for a season should be beyond either player although it does look like JBG at least will be on his way.
Agreed that Cousins isn't ready for the Prem week-in-week-out right now, but that will not, unto itself, prevent a Premiership team or team with Premiership ambitions from buying him. He's only 22. Yes, he's lacking technically, but I think that side of his game is improving.
Have both players improved over the last two years? Yes, emphatically. Cousins became a first team player, one of the first names on the team sheet. He played very well in stretches last year, and was very good in the run-in this year. JBG added goals to his game, which he didn't have in Holland, and he's just finished a run to the Euro quarter-final without ever looking out of place.
As far as the price we'll get, just looking at how deals are structured it's very hard to know what we'll get. That's before you throw in the tournament boost that JBG is likely to bring, and the premium on young, English players for Cousins. I still think that the 2.5m up front we got for Gomez was quite low. I know there will be milestone payouts on that, but I think if Liverpool were to sell him today they'd get 10m+, with the difference being he played five or six Prem games.
The whole transfer market within England, and to some extent the big clubs in Europe, is a false economy. I'm not saying I necessarily agree with any of the prices listed, it's just how I see fees going these days.
I probably didn't put my last point across that well.
No doubt Cousins has improved over the last 2 years you don't become Double Player Of The Year without having something about you but these days he's being linked with Brighton rather than Arsenal and I just wonder if the standard of The Premier League is improving faster than the personal improvement of Cousins and JBG which is why I feel they are probably Top 6 Championship players rather than Premier League.
Sounds like Hendo, Tex, Cousins and Guddy will certainly go. I wouldn't be suprised if we sold Lookman but had him back on a season long loan. Bauer is still injured i believe? Keeping him would be massive
With players like Cousins, I think it could depend on things like who will be captaining the team
He's loyal. For me I think it's because he's def not good enough for the prem, and it's gonna then come down to what championship club fancies paying the 'premium' English players cost. We might find that due to those 2 factors, he'll still be here past the deadline
I'd be very, very surprised. His athleticism alone is worth a punt given how much money there is at the top of the game. I'm thinking he'd cost ~5m. That's change that can be found in the couch of Prem clubs or clubs with parachute payments. From their perspective, why not take a punt on him putting it all together? Buy him for very cheap, loan him out to the Champo for a couple years in the hope that he'll mature and improve technically. We're now seeing this at every level--the top teams just stockpiling players.
I would absolutely love to be wrong, but I just can't see any way he's still with us when the window shuts. Feel free to remember this and set up a forfeit.
Technically I don't think he's a premiership player. Can do all the hard labour with that athleticism you mention, but athleticism is for me a pre-requisite im the modern game. It's that touch and finesse he lacks that won't see him ever play at the top level
Agreed and the same for JBG if his right peg was aa good as his left he'd be a Premier League player.
The other issue is the standard of the Premier League goes up year after year so unless JBG or Cousins are both going to kick on I'd say top 6 Championship / give it a go at a promoted Championship team in the Prem but go down fighting is about both players level really.
Have both players improved in the last 2 years? Difficult to say. Could they improve at clubs like Brighton and Norwich? Again difficult to tell. Personally don't think a drop down to League 1 for a season should be beyond either player although it does look like JBG at least will be on his way.
Agreed that Cousins isn't ready for the Prem week-in-week-out right now, but that will not, unto itself, prevent a Premiership team or team with Premiership ambitions from buying him. He's only 22. Yes, he's lacking technically, but I think that side of his game is improving.
Have both players improved over the last two years? Yes, emphatically. Cousins became a first team player, one of the first names on the team sheet. He played very well in stretches last year, and was very good in the run-in this year. JBG added goals to his game, which he didn't have in Holland, and he's just finished a run to the Euro quarter-final without ever looking out of place.
As far as the price we'll get, just looking at how deals are structured it's very hard to know what we'll get. That's before you throw in the tournament boost that JBG is likely to bring, and the premium on young, English players for Cousins. I still think that the 2.5m up front we got for Gomez was quite low. I know there will be milestone payouts on that, but I think if Liverpool were to sell him today they'd get 10m+, with the difference being he played five or six Prem games.
The whole transfer market within England, and to some extent the big clubs in Europe, is a false economy. I'm not saying I necessarily agree with any of the prices listed, it's just how I see fees going these days.
I probably didn't put my last point across that well.
No doubt Cousins has improved over the last 2 years you don't become Double Player Of The Year without having something about you but these days he's being linked with Brighton rather than Arsenal and I just wonder if the standard of The Premier League is improving faster than the personal improvement of Cousins and JBG which is why I feel they are probably Top 6 Championship players rather than Premier League.
A good point, although I'm not overly convinced that the bottom half of the Premier league is improving at the same rate as the top 6-8 of the Championship is. Anyway, I think it's a different (albeit interesting) discussion for another time. Your point is taken, especially with Cousins, I think a move to a top six Championship club would be very good for him.
For JBG, given he spent time in the Chelsea academy I wouldn't be surprised if he is settled in London, and the openness of the English game does suit him, but there is also always the chance that he could move abroad.
Anyway, as @Garrymanilow points out, all speculation at this point.
Cousins might be 'only' 22 - but I don't think that changes anything. Most of the top English midfielders aren't much older than that, and there is less and less appetite for PL clubs to buy English these days.
Plus I'd also argue that Cousins' ability (as in lack of good first touch) is something that isn't going to improve with time. That sort of thing you either have or you don't.
Cousins might be 'only' 22 - but I don't think that changes anything. Most of the top English midfielders aren't much older than that, and there is less and less appetite for PL clubs to buy English these days.
Plus I'd also argue that Cousins' ability (as in lack of good first touch) is something that isn't going to improve with time. That sort of thing you either have or you don't.
Completely disagree. To use the old cliche, you can't teach pace, or natural athleticism, but you can absolutely work on your first touch and your passing. I highlighted the work Gareth Barry did at Man City in his late 20s, improving his touch, vision, and positioning as an example for what JJ should be looking to do. Jordan still has a lot of time.
It's hard to put a value on Cousins. Many good sides lack a workhorse. In the right side, he could be valuable even though I have a lot of reservations about his ability.
Whatever Duchatelet gets(in HIS pocket) for him I think it is safe to say Cousins will not want to play in the 3rd division, coupled with any disillusionment with the problems at the club.
He is a Championship quality player and that is where I believe he will be by the end of August, for who I have no idea.
Cousins might be 'only' 22 - but I don't think that changes anything. Most of the top English midfielders aren't much older than that, and there is less and less appetite for PL clubs to buy English these days.
Plus I'd also argue that Cousins' ability (as in lack of good first touch) is something that isn't going to improve with time. That sort of thing you either have or you don't.
Completely disagree. To use the old cliche, you can't teach pace, or natural athleticism, but you can absolutely work on your first touch and your passing. I highlighted the work Gareth Barry did at Man City in his late 20s, improving his touch, vision, and positioning as an example for what JJ should be looking to do. Jordan still has a lot of time.
Henderson Pope Bauer Teixeira Kashi Cousins Gudmundsson Lookman Watt
Teixeira and Gudmundsson in the next couple of weeks, Henderson once Pope commits to us, and Cousins quite late on in August
This is about the closest to I have heard.
Why would Cousins go late August ?
Why wouldn't he?
I'm pretty sure that if any of our squad got a wage offer from a championship club either matching or improving their salary then they'd be keen to leave.
We're in the 3rd tier, in disarray and owned by a clueless moron with no ambition on the pitch. Would you rather be playing at grounds like Newcastle and Villa or Fleetwood and Bury?
It's hard to put a value on Cousins. Many good sides lack a workhorse. In the right side, he could be valuable even though I have a lot of reservations about his ability.
Whatever Duchatelet gets(in HIS pocket) for him I think it is safe to say Cousins will not want to play in the 3rd division, coupled with any disillusionment with the problems at the club.
He is a Championship quality player and that is where I believe he will be by the end of August, for who I have no idea.
Interesting how opinion is divided on Cousins. I felt he was PoY by default only last season - 'nobody' got my vote. He's not a free agent, so no other team gets to take a no-brainer punt on him. I'd be surprised if the better Champ teams would feel (based on last season) that he'd be an improvement over what they have already. So JC (and us) may need to set expectations low - it may be a fading team like QPR, or a lower-middle one like Bristol C who come calling. With a fee to match.
I think Cousins' future lies at full back, where his poor first touch is less of a liability. It frustrated me at time that we never tried a Cousins/Solly FB pairing, as Chris has always played well at LB when called. Liverpool had no hesitation playing Gomez at LB.
Cousins might be 'only' 22 - but I don't think that changes anything. Most of the top English midfielders aren't much older than that, and there is less and less appetite for PL clubs to buy English these days.
Plus I'd also argue that Cousins' ability (as in lack of good first touch) is something that isn't going to improve with time. That sort of thing you either have or you don't.
Completely disagree. To use the old cliche, you can't teach pace, or natural athleticism, but you can absolutely work on your first touch and your passing. I highlighted the work Gareth Barry did at Man City in his late 20s, improving his touch, vision, and positioning as an example for what JJ should be looking to do. Jordan still has a lot of time.
I think before any more players come in you will see some moved out. Prepare to see Texeira, Cousins and Henderson departing in the next couple of weeks.
It's hard to put a value on Cousins. Many good sides lack a workhorse. In the right side, he could be valuable even though I have a lot of reservations about his ability.
Whatever Duchatelet gets(in HIS pocket) for him I think it is safe to say Cousins will not want to play in the 3rd division, coupled with any disillusionment with the problems at the club.
He is a Championship quality player and that is where I believe he will be by the end of August, for who I have no idea.
Interesting how opinion is divided on Cousins. I felt he was PoY by default only last season - 'nobody' got my vote. He's not a free agent, so no other team gets to take a no-brainer punt on him. I'd be surprised if the better Champ teams would feel (based on last season) that he'd be an improvement over what they have already. So JC (and us) may need to set expectations low - it may be a fading team like QPR, or a lower-middle one like Bristol C who come calling. With a fee to match.
I think Cousins' future lies at full back, where his poor first touch is less of a liability. It frustrated me at time that we never tried a Cousins/Solly FB pairing, as Chris has always played well at LB when called. Liverpool had no hesitation playing Gomez at LB.
No offence but I assume you weren't at Millwall when Solly played left back and we were played off the park and lost 4-0.
It's hard to put a value on Cousins. Many good sides lack a workhorse. In the right side, he could be valuable even though I have a lot of reservations about his ability.
Whatever Duchatelet gets(in HIS pocket) for him I think it is safe to say Cousins will not want to play in the 3rd division, coupled with any disillusionment with the problems at the club.
He is a Championship quality player and that is where I believe he will be by the end of August, for who I have no idea.
Interesting how opinion is divided on Cousins. I felt he was PoY by default only last season - 'nobody' got my vote. He's not a free agent, so no other team gets to take a no-brainer punt on him. I'd be surprised if the better Champ teams would feel (based on last season) that he'd be an improvement over what they have already. So JC (and us) may need to set expectations low - it may be a fading team like QPR, or a lower-middle one like Bristol C who come calling. With a fee to match.
I think Cousins' future lies at full back, where his poor first touch is less of a liability. It frustrated me at time that we never tried a Cousins/Solly FB pairing, as Chris has always played well at LB when called. Liverpool had no hesitation playing Gomez at LB.
No offence but I assume you weren't at Millwall when Solly played left back and we were played off the park and lost 4-0.
We could have had Paulo Maldini at LB and still lost at Millwall...that's what we do...
I can't imagine anything will happen quickly with JBG, he'll be with us until the end of July.
He would have been concentrating on the Euros these last few weeks, the team spirit they have, I can't imagine he would have been on the phone to his agent every 5 minutes. No doubt the Iceland players will now all go home for a massive celebration as well, so that will take a few more days.
It's hard to put a value on Cousins. Many good sides lack a workhorse. In the right side, he could be valuable even though I have a lot of reservations about his ability.
Whatever Duchatelet gets(in HIS pocket) for him I think it is safe to say Cousins will not want to play in the 3rd division, coupled with any disillusionment with the problems at the club.
He is a Championship quality player and that is where I believe he will be by the end of August, for who I have no idea.
Interesting how opinion is divided on Cousins. I felt he was PoY by default only last season - 'nobody' got my vote. He's not a free agent, so no other team gets to take a no-brainer punt on him. I'd be surprised if the better Champ teams would feel (based on last season) that he'd be an improvement over what they have already. So JC (and us) may need to set expectations low - it may be a fading team like QPR, or a lower-middle one like Bristol C who come calling. With a fee to match.
I think Cousins' future lies at full back, where his poor first touch is less of a liability. It frustrated me at time that we never tried a Cousins/Solly FB pairing, as Chris has always played well at LB when called. Liverpool had no hesitation playing Gomez at LB.
No offence but I assume you weren't at Millwall when Solly played left back and we were played off the park and lost 4-0.
True, I wasn't, and had been thinking of more recent Champ appearances
Comments
weRoly has done well.The other issue is the standard of the Premier League goes up year after year so unless JBG or Cousins are both going to kick on I'd say top 6 Championship / give it a go at a promoted Championship team in the Prem but go down fighting is about both players level really.
Have both players improved in the last 2 years? Difficult to say. Could they improve at clubs like Brighton and Norwich? Again difficult to tell. Personally don't think a drop down to League 1 for a season should be beyond either player although it does look like JBG at least will be on his way.
At least JBG is on his way back soon. I heard that Charlton said they want to get some out before bringing more in.
Have both players improved over the last two years? Yes, emphatically. Cousins became a first team player, one of the first names on the team sheet. He played very well in stretches last year, and was very good in the run-in this year. JBG added goals to his game, which he didn't have in Holland, and he's just finished a run to the Euro quarter-final without ever looking out of place.
As far as the price we'll get, just looking at how deals are structured it's very hard to know what we'll get. That's before you throw in the tournament boost that JBG is likely to bring, and the premium on young, English players for Cousins. I still think that the 2.5m up front we got for Gomez was quite low. I know there will be milestone payouts on that, but I think if Liverpool were to sell him today they'd get 10m+, with the difference being he played five or six Prem games.
The whole transfer market within England, and to some extent the big clubs in Europe, is a false economy. I'm not saying I necessarily agree with any of the prices listed, it's just how I see fees going these days.
I'm not as convinced as some seem to be that certain players will be of any interest to anyone at the rate we might want to sell them at.
No doubt Cousins has improved over the last 2 years you don't become Double Player Of The Year without having something about you but these days he's being linked with Brighton rather than Arsenal and I just wonder if the standard of The Premier League is improving faster than the personal improvement of Cousins and JBG which is why I feel they are probably Top 6 Championship players rather than Premier League.
For JBG, given he spent time in the Chelsea academy I wouldn't be surprised if he is settled in London, and the openness of the English game does suit him, but there is also always the chance that he could move abroad.
Anyway, as @Garrymanilow points out, all speculation at this point.
Plus I'd also argue that Cousins' ability (as in lack of good first touch) is something that isn't going to improve with time. That sort of thing you either have or you don't.
He is a Championship quality player and that is where I believe he will be by the end of August, for who I have no idea.
His time has gone!
Why wouldn't he?
I'm pretty sure that if any of our squad got a wage offer from a championship club either matching or improving their salary then they'd be keen to leave.
We're in the 3rd tier, in disarray and owned by a clueless moron with no ambition on the pitch. Would you rather be playing at grounds like Newcastle and Villa or Fleetwood and Bury?
@Garrymanilow that comment about the transfer valuers being out in force did make me chuckle
I think Cousins' future lies at full back, where his poor first touch is less of a liability. It frustrated me at time that we never tried a Cousins/Solly FB pairing, as Chris has always played well at LB when called. Liverpool had no hesitation playing Gomez at LB.
He would have been concentrating on the Euros these last few weeks, the team spirit they have, I can't imagine he would have been on the phone to his agent every 5 minutes. No doubt the Iceland players will now all go home for a massive celebration as well, so that will take a few more days.