The 2017 Summer Transfer Rumours Thread (Deadline Day from page 264)
Comments
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We've always spent under RD, just not very well. Wouldn't rule out a young player signing for that sort of fee.7
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Alan Turing has given Roland Duchatelet a theory that you keep a clean sheet every game and rely on the opposition to score own goals.7
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I think the key is to have a very well connected manager who can loan 3-4 strong PL kids of the Kasey Palmer ilk like Huddersfield did. Add best players of League Two and some rough diamonds from League One and The Champ and/Scottish/Irish leagues.NapaAddick said:It seems to me that clubs in League One pretty much have the following options in the transfer market...
1. Buy the best players from L2 that Championship teams don't overpay for
2. Perhaps poach someone from our own league or from a club relegated from it
3. Get older players past their prime from The Championship
Is this basically true?
Cuz that is kind of bleak.
It's almost a wonder that teams gets better in our league from the transfer market at all. Can anyone think of the last time they said about some team at the end of the window... "Wow, that League One team really killed it in the transfer market this window. They are going up for sure!"
Seems like one big crapshoot. No?
Maybe a manager who had played at all levels of English football, hundreds of games and been head of the Players Union and so superbly connected and could go after players similar to Morrison, Kermy, BWP, Wiggins and Stephens?
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Also don't tie up most of your top six budget with expensive mistakes that you have to loan out.Athletico Charlton said:
I think the key is to have a very well connected manager who can loan 3-4 strong PL kids of the Kasey Palmer ilk like Huddersfield did. Add best players of League Two and some rough diamonds from League One and The Champ and/Scottish/Irish leagues.NapaAddick said:It seems to me that clubs in League One pretty much have the following options in the transfer market...
1. Buy the best players from L2 that Championship teams don't overpay for
2. Perhaps poach someone from our own league or from a club relegated from it
3. Get older players past their prime from The Championship
Is this basically true?
Cuz that is kind of bleak.
It's almost a wonder that teams gets better in our league from the transfer market at all. Can anyone think of the last time they said about some team at the end of the window... "Wow, that League One team really killed it in the transfer market this window. They are going up for sure!"
Seems like one big crapshoot. No?
Maybe a manager who had played at all levels of English football, hundreds of games and been head of the Players Union and so superbly connected and could go after players similar to Morrison, Kermy, BWP, Wiggins and Stephens?7 -
https://www.londonnewsonline.co.uk/24992/charlton-manager-explains-transfer-deals-taking-time/
Karl Robinson has explained why it has been a waiting game for Charlton Athletic in the transfer market – and defended his earlier optimism that he could strike deals quickly.
The Addicks boss had spoken about wanting at least a few new signings sorted before he headed off on a summer break.
Charlton’s season finished four weeks ago and there had been no activity beyond releasing the likes of Adam Chicksen and Roger Johnson.
The Addicks compiled a list of transfer targets with Ben Reeves, in the final weeks of his contract at Milton Keynes, right near the top of the players they want to attract.
Bradford winger Mark Marshall is another. His deal is also running down but the 30-year-old has been offered fresh terms by City, even though sources have indicated he wants a return to his London roots.
The Addicks have also made a contract offer to Swindon Town captain Nathan Thompson, another due to be a free agent.
“I expected to get one or two done early but what people need to understand is that we could have got deals done but they might not have been 100 per cent right for us,” said Robinson.
“Every single player I’m chasing is unfortunately wanted by Championship teams or bigger teams that have been relegated.
“We’re in the same bracket as a lot of clubs that have the same financial pull as ourselves. The better players do that longer to do.”
Robinson revealed after the final day win over Swindon Town that he had two potential signings in the Valley stands.
“We are waiting on one or two things with those,” he said. “Even though we have things on the table their agents have been trying things.
“I’ve been in touch with Steve [Gallen, head of recruitment] every single day. But our season finished a lot earlier than the League Two and Championship play-offs.
“There has been an awful lot riding on the results.
A lot of the business is not done until the Football League season is completely finished.
“People don’t understand that even the FA Cup final can have an effect on a League One team. There is a knock-on effect in terms of which players are loaned out and who they’ll take on pre-season trips.
“There are so many variables which can come down to our level.”4 -
All very sensible stuff from Robinson but begs the question of if he knew this why was he going on about early signings and players in the stand blah, blah, blah.
Just shut up and sign players27 -
He is an optimist and gullible maybe so he trusted agents and players at their word...........but you are right just get on with it.Henry Irving said:All very sensible stuff from Robinson but begs the question of if he knew this why was he going on about early signings and players in the stand blah, blah, blah.
Just shut up and sign players0 -
The better players do that longer to do.
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The guy is a moron. When will any one at this club learn. If you make bold statements like this - you will look a fool when it doesn't come off. Amateur hour once again.6
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I don't know why he's going on about deals not being 100% right for us. It never normally matters.7
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Stage one in a long line of familiar excuses that will truñdle on as usual until August 31st.Henry Irving said:https://www.londonnewsonline.co.uk/24992/charlton-manager-explains-transfer-deals-taking-time/
Karl Robinson has explained why it has been a waiting game for Charlton Athletic in the transfer market – and defended his earlier optimism that he could strike deals quickly.
The Addicks boss had spoken about wanting at least a few new signings sorted before he headed off on a summer break.
Charlton’s season finished four weeks ago and there had been no activity beyond releasing the likes of Adam Chicksen and Roger Johnson.
The Addicks compiled a list of transfer targets with Ben Reeves, in the final weeks of his contract at Milton Keynes, right near the top of the players they want to attract.
Bradford winger Mark Marshall is another. His deal is also running down but the 30-year-old has been offered fresh terms by City, even though sources have indicated he wants a return to his London roots.
The Addicks have also made a contract offer to Swindon Town captain Nathan Thompson, another due to be a free agent.
“I expected to get one or two done early but what people need to understand is that we could have got deals done but they might not have been 100 per cent right for us,” said Robinson.
“Every single player I’m chasing is unfortunately wanted by Championship teams or bigger teams that have been relegated.
“We’re in the same bracket as a lot of clubs that have the same financial pull as ourselves. The better players do that longer to do.”
Robinson revealed after the final day win over Swindon Town that he had two potential signings in the Valley stands.
“We are waiting on one or two things with those,” he said. “Even though we have things on the table their agents have been trying things.
“I’ve been in touch with Steve [Gallen, head of recruitment] every single day. But our season finished a lot earlier than the League Two and Championship play-offs.
“There has been an awful lot riding on the results.
A lot of the business is not done until the Football League season is completely finished.
“People don’t understand that even the FA Cup final can have an effect on a League One team. There is a knock-on effect in terms of which players are loaned out and who they’ll take on pre-season trips.
“There are so many variables which can come down to our level.”
Karl mate, can't you be a bit creative and entertaining with the excuses at least, like an owl flew off with your favourite agents phone number you had written on a piece of paper, or you visited Lourdes and a vision told you not to make signings on any day with a 'y' in it, or until you're fluent in Basque, and pass your exam, you can't deal with anybody from the Iberian peninsula?1 -
Chelsea fans apparently put him above Ashley Cole at the same age.
I really think he'll be special
They could be right from what I've seen. However I wouldn't have thought too many Chelsea fans have seen much of him,0 -
I reckon thats a typo and should read the better players do take longer to do0
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It's so reassuring to see that he is targeting players that are wanted by bigger or more successful clubs, providing a simple, ready made, excuse for failures in the transfer market this summer.Henry Irving said:https://www.londonnewsonline.co.uk/24992/charlton-manager-explains-transfer-deals-taking-time/
Karl Robinson has explained why it has been a waiting game for Charlton Athletic in the transfer market – and defended his earlier optimism that he could strike deals quickly.
The Addicks boss had spoken about wanting at least a few new signings sorted before he headed off on a summer break.
Charlton’s season finished four weeks ago and there had been no activity beyond releasing the likes of Adam Chicksen and Roger Johnson.
The Addicks compiled a list of transfer targets with Ben Reeves, in the final weeks of his contract at Milton Keynes, right near the top of the players they want to attract.
Bradford winger Mark Marshall is another. His deal is also running down but the 30-year-old has been offered fresh terms by City, even though sources have indicated he wants a return to his London roots.
The Addicks have also made a contract offer to Swindon Town captain Nathan Thompson, another due to be a free agent.
“I expected to get one or two done early but what people need to understand is that we could have got deals done but they might not have been 100 per cent right for us,” said Robinson.
“Every single player I’m chasing is unfortunately wanted by Championship teams or bigger teams that have been relegated.
“We’re in the same bracket as a lot of clubs that have the same financial pull as ourselves. The better players do that longer to do.”
Robinson revealed after the final day win over Swindon Town that he had two potential signings in the Valley stands.
“We are waiting on one or two things with those,” he said. “Even though we have things on the table their agents have been trying things.
“I’ve been in touch with Steve [Gallen, head of recruitment] every single day. But our season finished a lot earlier than the League Two and Championship play-offs.
“There has been an awful lot riding on the results.
A lot of the business is not done until the Football League season is completely finished.
“People don’t understand that even the FA Cup final can have an effect on a League One team. There is a knock-on effect in terms of which players are loaned out and who they’ll take on pre-season trips.
“There are so many variables which can come down to our level.”
Happily, he'll be able to find a couple of free agents (from MK) that will be better than those that we just failed to get in (because the agents are not playing fair by plucky him) and the club will go into the new season well prepared for the challenges ahead (mostly, in KR's case, trying to find new ways of blaming others for failures and bigging up himself for successes).2 -
We're being patient, do you see how patient we're being?Henry Irving said:https://www.londonnewsonline.co.uk/24992/charlton-manager-explains-transfer-deals-taking-time/
Karl Robinson has explained why it has been a waiting game for Charlton Athletic in the transfer market – and defended his earlier optimism that he could strike deals quickly.
The Addicks boss had spoken about wanting at least a few new signings sorted before he headed off on a summer break.
Charlton’s season finished four weeks ago and there had been no activity beyond releasing the likes of Adam Chicksen and Roger Johnson.
The Addicks compiled a list of transfer targets with Ben Reeves, in the final weeks of his contract at Milton Keynes, right near the top of the players they want to attract.
Bradford winger Mark Marshall is another. His deal is also running down but the 30-year-old has been offered fresh terms by City, even though sources have indicated he wants a return to his London roots.
The Addicks have also made a contract offer to Swindon Town captain Nathan Thompson, another due to be a free agent.
“I expected to get one or two done early but what people need to understand is that we could have got deals done but they might not have been 100 per cent right for us,” said Robinson.
“Every single player I’m chasing is unfortunately wanted by Championship teams or bigger teams that have been relegated.
“We’re in the same bracket as a lot of clubs that have the same financial pull as ourselves. The better players do that longer to do.”
Robinson revealed after the final day win over Swindon Town that he had two potential signings in the Valley stands.
“We are waiting on one or two things with those,” he said. “Even though we have things on the table their agents have been trying things.
“I’ve been in touch with Steve [Gallen, head of recruitment] every single day. But our season finished a lot earlier than the League Two and Championship play-offs.
“There has been an awful lot riding on the results.
A lot of the business is not done until the Football League season is completely finished.
“People don’t understand that even the FA Cup final can have an effect on a League One team. There is a knock-on effect in terms of which players are loaned out and who they’ll take on pre-season trips.
“There are so many variables which can come down to our level.”18 -
They could be right from what I've seen. However I wouldn't have thought too many Chelsea fans have seen much of him,croydonaddick said:
Chelsea fans apparently put him above Ashley Cole at the same age.
I really think he'll be special
Plus also Cole was on loan at The Nigels and then at Arsenal, so they wouldn't know that much about his early development either.2 -
Think you're flattering him there. Sounds just like a few more paragraphs of waffle, bullshit and false excuses.Henry Irving said:All very sensible stuff from Robinson
We've got a whole summer of this nonsense to look forward to:
"the deal wasn't 100% right for the club"
"I'm disgusted with the way certain clubs and individuals have conducted themselves"
"we were close to doing a deal, but I wasn't convinced he had the right personality to wear a Charlton shirt"
"we had a great player ready to sign with us, but he came in to meet me and within 15 seconds of me starting to talk he'd shot his own ears off. We're just not getting the luck at the moment."
etc, etc, etc. Add to that a couple of ambitious potential big-money signings, well-publicised by Rich Cawley, which unfortunately don't make it over the line (see Max Gradel, Jonson Clarke-Harris, Chris O'Grady, etc).
Skip forward to 5 August 2017:
"Naby Sarr and Nicky Ajose have been like new signings, and if we can find out where Ahmed Kashi's hiding then he'll be like a new signing as well. The toddlers I picked up from Mothercare in Lewisham will provide us with that youthful exuberance that we were missing at times last year, and we're obviously delighted to welcome Roger Johnson back into the building - Ricky Holmes departure has obviously left us with a gap to fill, but I feel really confident that RoJo can fill that void (with expletives-riddled tirades and abysmal performances)."
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Henry Irving said:
https://www.londonnewsonline.co.uk/24992/charlton-manager-explains-transfer-deals-taking-time/
Karl Robinson has explained why it has been a waiting game for Charlton Athletic in the transfer market – and defended his earlier optimism that he could strike deals quickly.
The Addicks boss had spoken about wanting at least a few new signings sorted before he headed off on a summer break.
Charlton’s season finished four weeks ago and there had been no activity beyond releasing the likes of Adam Chicksen and Roger Johnson.
The Addicks compiled a list of transfer targets with Ben Reeves, in the final weeks of his contract at Milton Keynes, right near the top of the players they want to attract.
Bradford winger Mark Marshall is another. His deal is also running down but the 30-year-old has been offered fresh terms by City, even though sources have indicated he wants a return to his London roots.
The Addicks have also made a contract offer to Swindon Town captain Nathan Thompson, another due to be a free agent.
“I expected to get one or two done early but what people need to understand is that we could have got deals done but they might not have been 100 per cent right for us,” said Robinson.
“Every single player I’m chasing is unfortunately wanted by Championship teams or bigger teams that have been relegated.
“We’re in the same bracket as a lot of clubs that have the same financial pull as ourselves. The better players do that longer to do.”
Robinson revealed after the final day win over Swindon Town that he had two potential signings in the Valley stands.
“We are waiting on one or two things with those,” he said. “Even though we have things on the table their agents have been trying things.
“I’ve been in touch with Steve [Gallen, head of recruitment] every single day. But our season finished a lot earlier than the League Two and Championship play-offs.
“There has been an awful lot riding on the results.
A lot of the business is not done until the Football League season is completely finished.
“People don’t understand that even the FA Cup final can have an effect on a League One team. There is a knock-on effect in terms of which players are loaned out and who they’ll take on pre-season trips.
“There are so many variables which can come down to our level.”
Karl couldnt you convince the likes of Reeves,Marshall and whoever that we are a club
going places under your leadership and that this is the place to be0 -
I've read those books and I think you've both simplified what they say and extrapolated the data to come to the wrong conclusions. It is very dangerous to use small samples of data to make predictions. I seem to remember you doing this when you predicted we'd be relegated based on nothing more than the last six games of us and the teams around us.NapaAddick said:In two great books.. "Soccernomics" and "The Numbers Game" the authors laid out with enormous data research what works in the transfer market....
1. Buy players age 20-23. They are old enough to be formed but still cheap. They also have the best sell-on values and are the best bang for the buck with the best upside.
2. Don't let managers run the transfer budget. On average the managers last 1.3 seasons and thus it becomes a merry go round of short term transfers and re-loading. Get a Director of Football to run it and think long-term.
3. Sell players around age 28-30, even if they are popular. You get the best value and sell before everyone else figures out that statistically players peak at age 27. Old players on long contracts kill clubs.
4. Focus on defense more than forwards. Adding one goal in a match increases table points 1.1 per match. Stopping one goal adds 1.4. The conventional wisdom is wrong. Defense actually matters more than offense.
5. When you sell a good older player, take that money and buy a few good younger ones. Repeat. Over and over.
6. Bring up through the academy. Investing in the academy has returns much, much, much higher than incoming transfers. And academy players fit in culturally quicker.
This makes sense to me and I wish we would do it. Cousins, Pope, Lookman, Konsa... that would have been a great core for the future.
In isolation most of those points seem sensible but there is always the risk that the most successful clubs can, and do, choose to manage their affairs like this, rather than the teams that manage their affairs like this become successful. It's like the fact that the most successful clubs keep their managers. Are they successful because they stick with a manager or does the manager get to keep his job because are they successful?
The main example (I think the only one in actual fact) of selling players at the top of their game and being successful was Lyon, and even though they were successful in France they had all the best players and because they were winning they were able to sign players that the other clubs couldn't - until PSG came into money and now their system looks less special. In fact after winning seven league titles back to back they haven't won one since 2008. One could argue that their system just happened to be running at a time when they had a great set of young players maturing, a bit like the Man Utd class of '92. It also hinges on having the right people in those positions. The Director of football, and his team, need to be the best around or the system doesn't work, at all. A great example of that is Charlton.
It is no secret that everything RD and KM have done was based entirely on Soccernomics. They have, literally, followed those six principles you've listed and managed to get us relegated, halved the season ticket numbers and overspent by £55m. How do you like your six rules now?
One last thing. The Premier League top scorers have been dominated by Harry Kane and Aguero in recent seasons but in 2013 van Persie won it and he was nearly 30 by the end of that season. On the basis that top scorers will be at the top of their game for, probably, eight seasons (from 23 to 31) just pure stats would suggest that the player would be over 30 once in every four seasons. The better test would be to compare how many goals a specific player gets every season and see if that tails off. Besides if you just want top scorers that are over 30 look at Spain. Messi was top scorer and he is 30 in a couple of weeks, Suarez was second and he is 30 and Ronaldo was third and he is 32. Before you make the point that Messi is, currently, only 29 see if you can find a bookie that will take a bet that any one of those three will be top scorer next season!4 - Sponsored links:
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Usually yes but not necessarily with young players, Lookman's was only 1.28 before he went for (about) 10 and still is only 4 when Everton would probably hesitate to sell him for 3-4x that.NapaAddick said:Dasilva is listed as having a value of £213k on Transfermarkt. That site is often quite far off in its values, but even if it is off by 100%, would find it well worth getting him for £400-500k, imho.
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We probably couldn't afford his wages.cafc_harry said:
Usually yes but not necessarily with young players, Lookman's was only 1.28 before he went for (about) 10 and still is only 4 when Everton would probably hesitate to sell him for 3-4x that.NapaAddick said:Dasilva is listed as having a value of £213k on Transfermarkt. That site is often quite far off in its values, but even if it is off by 100%, would find it well worth getting him for £400-500k, imho.
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"People need to understand" because "you don't understand"!
We do, Karl, we do. We understand very well what a mess our club is in and why you are relying on free transfers that you are struggling to get over the line...5 -
Indeed, because they are not free. If they are out of contract the player and, more specifically, the agent want a 'signing on fee'.Pedro45 said:"People need to understand" because "you don't understand"!
We do, Karl, we do. We understand very well what a mess our club is in and why you are relying on free transfers that you are struggling to get over the line...
The whole wanting players that Championship clubs might take and then being cross when an Agent looks to see if there are any other takers once we've made the player an offer makes me laugh as well.2 -
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SIGNING: Rovers complete the signing of @OUFCOfficial midfielder @SercombeLiam for an undisclosed fee.
Linked with us by Cawley https://www.londonnewsonline.co.uk/24742/charlton-athletic-looking-close-deal-oxford-man-outbid-luton-town/
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Oh Goody!Henry Irving said:
“I’ve been in touch with Steve [Gallen, head of recruitment] every single day. But our season finished a lot earlier than the League Two
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Dazzler21 said:
Oh Goody!Henry Irving said:
“I’ve been in touch with Steve [Gallen, head of recruitment] every single day. But our season finished a lot earlier than the League Two. And to be honest it's a pointless conversation as he can't understand a word I say.1 -
i think hes had players lined up - crusty has said no and now hes just saying what he can to keep the pressure off, when you look at league 1 this year it wouldnt be that hard to get out of it, you could quite easily do it and not even spend that much ( just need to spend it correctly ) - is karl robinson the man for that no i dont think he is and his constant drivel does my head in.4
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I have a Charlton garden gnome he can sit on the far post for an undisclosed fee.0
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Losing out on potential transfer targets to Bristol rovers, this bodes well.5
