We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
I don't get why them being 'top dogs' is a positive thing. Top of all the knuckle-dragging mindless thug idiots? Congratulations. What an honour.
Why would anyone would want to imply that us having a 'decent mob' would be something to be proud of, either? I'd rather we never had one.
I think for a lot of people it was a youth culture of the time, just like teddy boys, mods and rockers, skinheads etc
yeah, there was the tribalistic violence, as there was in those other sub cultures mentioned, but for those involved, more often than not young lads who lived and worked in some pretty bleak surroundings, it offered so much more than that. The music of the era, the social life, the clobber, the sense of belonging, and above all the camaraderie. Was it right? Course it wasn’t. But you can see how a young lad off some rough old estate in the heart of SE London would get involved.
Its a bit sad seeing older blokes involved, just like it’s a bit sad when you see those aging mods and rockers down the coast, but I suppose some people struggle to let go of the buzz it gave them as a youngster
Millwall fan . You raise an interesting point about it being sad when older people get involved and I agree with you. Back in the late 60s and throughout the 70s most people who got involved in these shenanigans were teenager's or in their 20s. The exception to this was millwall. When I used to go to the den as a teenager the majority of millwall fans who wanted to give me a good hiding were considerably older. Even now when I go to the den I look at the knobs in the upper Dockers stand frothing at the mouth and making all sorts of threats to the away supporters and I have to laugh at how old some of them are 40 and 50 year old men acting like utter knobs. Nothing appears to have changed at millwall in this regard it's about time some of your supporters realised its not the 70s anymore .
The worrying thing about the ages are the very young who do the cutthroat thing. One video shows a kid of about 5 with his dad doing it.
We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
I don't get why them being 'top dogs' is a positive thing. Top of all the knuckle-dragging mindless thug idiots? Congratulations. What an honour.
Why would anyone would want to imply that us having a 'decent mob' would be something to be proud of, either? I'd rather we never had one.
I think for a lot of people it was a youth culture of the time, just like teddy boys, mods and rockers, skinheads etc
yeah, there was the tribalistic violence, as there was in those other sub cultures mentioned, but for those involved, more often than not young lads who lived and worked in some pretty bleak surroundings, it offered so much more than that. The music of the era, the social life, the clobber, the sense of belonging, and above all the camaraderie. Was it right? Course it wasn’t. But you can see how a young lad off some rough old estate in the heart of SE London would get involved.
Its a bit sad seeing older blokes involved, just like it’s a bit sad when you see those aging mods and rockers down the coast, but I suppose some people struggle to let go of the buzz it gave them as a youngster
Millwall fan . You raise an interesting point about it being sad when older people get involved and I agree with you. Back in the late 60s and throughout the 70s most people who got involved in these shenanigans were teenager's or in their 20s. The exception to this was millwall. When I used to go to the den as a teenager the majority of millwall fans who wanted to give me a good hiding were considerably older. Even now when I go to the den I look at the knobs in the upper Dockers stand frothing at the mouth and making all sorts of threats to the away supporters and I have to laugh at how old some of them are 40 and 50 year old men acting like utter knobs. Nothing appears to have changed at millwall in this regard it's about time some of your supporters realised its not the 70s anymore .
The worrying thing about the ages are the very young who do the cutthroat thing. One video shows a kid of about 5 with his dad doing it.
That pic of the Pompey game is not Chsrlton and Pompey having it.It was Charlton v Plod ---- Pompey weren't about that day.
We were in three pubs in Havant and Plod moved everyone out from there. Shoved us into one section in the ground and then started aiming people out.Thats till it went off.
I think this was very close to when we got booted out of The Valley ,probably the first big away game
Was there that day -think we lost .Soon after we we won 5-3 down at Brighton .Curbs scored for us .
We won 2-1, drew 1-1 ‘home’ to Portsmouth at Selhurst that year. Portsmouth were relegated we finished two places above them. The season we needed a draw away to Chelsea to avoid the playoffs.
brighton 5-3 was our promotion season.
Remember that game. Mike Flanagan scored, came running over to us and jumped up on the wire fencing in celebration. Listened to the radio in the motor on the way home and the Brighton manager (can't remember who he was) bemoaning the fact that if Brighton 'were going to go up they had to beat the likes of Charlton'. Cocky dipstick. Wonder what he made of the final table at the end of the season. Back to the punch-up stories, who remembers the FA Cup against Arsenal at Highbury - 1968?- when Charlton took the North Bank?
1969 ;-) Thousands of Charlton there that day, up the North bank & on the side. Hundreds ran riot in Holloway Road early on, many shop windows went through & mass looting of Jewellers off licences & clothes shops. Leicester coach on the way to Millwall passed us by with a few missiles thrown. Made front page headlines in the Evening News that night.
There was large article on the Charlton march to the game, the trouble at the match and damage and theft from jewellers en route in the News of the World too.
Pretty sure that there wasn't a march on that day, palace earlier that season. Those were the days of certain people making plans spread it to a few people & so the chant would start in the Covered End "Charing Cross 9 Oclock" or whatever. That day there were 2/300 at least (long time ago & dodgy memory but sure those numbers are correct ) at CX & eventually we walked up to Leicester Square got the tube (did anybody pay :-) ) & onto Holloway Road.
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Mothercare?
Don't stand for that Elfs........You What? You are standing ? Sorry mate .
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
I had a yellow Pringle diamond v neck. Wore it to Newcastle away and stood out like a sore thumb. Got dogs abuse from the geordies
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Mothercare?
Don't stand for that Elfs........You What? You are standing ? Sorry mate .
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Mothercare?
Don't stand for that Elfs........You What? You are standing ? Sorry mate .
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Mothercare?
Don't stand for that Elfs........You What? You are standing ? Sorry mate .
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Mothercare?
Don't stand for that Elfs........You What? You are standing ? Sorry mate .
We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
The last time they came was against Burnley (I think) and about 50 got a good hiding where our Police control box is now. One of those was Craig Fairbrass the actor. The afters went on for some time afterwards including my brother getting done by them on a bus.
Was this against Barnsley? We were in the Jimmy Seed as the seats were being put in the North?
Trust Millwall to turn it around to be all about them. LOL
Pretty sure it was Barnsley and the Millwall mob first tried to see if Barnsley were interested in teaming up - they weren't. We arrived at the back of the South Stand where the Millwall were grouped and when the numbers evened out it all kicked off and they fought a running rearguard out of the ground. I had great fun chasing Fairbrass up the muddy slope behind the flats in Valley Grove. He was shitting himself and covered in mud as he desperately tried to climb away. A bully who I once heard scream "I hope you die of cancer" to a Traffic Warden ticketing his Merc at The Standard. I came across him threatening a mate of mine once outside his home (old schoolboy) and asked him to pick on someone his size - he laid an egg. After many years of doing it, that was the last time Millwall ever showed up at a non-Millwall game.
Your memory is excellent sir. I knew it began with B.
Definitely Barnsley. The panic on their faces as they scrambled over the wall was amusing.
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Mothercare?
Don't stand for that Elfs........You What? You are standing ? Sorry mate .
Just to add to what Ralph said. Actual violence/fighting was only a tiny percentage of what went on, usually lasted no more than a minute and from our side never involved anyone who wasn't up for it. No regrets here.
I sort of regret those purple Lois jumbo cords I wore 😳
I used to wear those, with a nice v-neck diamond pringle sweater.
Mothercare?
Don't stand for that Elfs........You What? You are standing ? Sorry mate .
Not heard that belter before mate.
I'm here all week .
In 1987 I was voted the most fashionable ballboy of the year.
We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
The last time they came was against Burnley (I think) and about 50 got a good hiding where our Police control box is now. One of those was Craig Fairbrass the actor. The afters went on for some time afterwards including my brother getting done by them on a bus.
Was this against Barnsley? We were in the Jimmy Seed as the seats were being put in the North?
Trust Millwall to turn it around to be all about them. LOL
Pretty sure it was Barnsley and the Millwall mob first tried to see if Barnsley were interested in teaming up - they weren't. We arrived at the back of the South Stand where the Millwall were grouped and when the numbers evened out it all kicked off and they fought a running rearguard out of the ground. I had great fun chasing Fairbrass up the muddy slope behind the flats in Valley Grove. He was shitting himself and covered in mud as he desperately tried to climb away. A bully who I once heard scream "I hope you die of cancer" to a Traffic Warden ticketing his Merc at The Standard. I came across him threatening a mate of mine once outside his home (old schoolboy) and asked him to pick on someone his size - he laid an egg. After many years of doing it, that was the last time Millwall ever showed up at a non-Millwall game.
Remember him properly staring me out in the gym years ago when he walked past and I was thinking wtf is that about.
Big lump he was so not as if I was threatening him with some weird alpha male prison bullshit...it was virgin active in Bickley ffs :-)
Adds up reading your post.
Another Eastenders cast member Christian used to go there too. He never passively aggressively threatened me.
Great thread and agree with the "of its time youth subculture" narrative and imagine it would have been fun for those into it and probably appealing if you were a youngster of the time.
As @MillwallFan says it's madly out of place now days with modern society and football itself the way it's morphed and seeing it occur now especially with older participants is as out of place as if tens of mods and rockers were turning up at the seaside each weekend to kick the granny out of each other amongst families and other beachgoeers.
We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
I don't get why them being 'top dogs' is a positive thing. Top of all the knuckle-dragging mindless thug idiots? Congratulations. What an honour.
Why would anyone would want to imply that us having a 'decent mob' would be something to be proud of, either? I'd rather we never had one.
Well if we were all the same, and times didn't change then the world would be a boring place. I'm guessing you utilise social media for everything, use the phrase "Can I Get" and pay for a pint with a card. Now I don't get most of that, but that's today, and we were then. None of us are saying that the passage of time, has not put it into a different perspective. However, it was a thing of its time.
Chunes help you breath more easily.......or not........as the case may be.
We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
I don't get why them being 'top dogs' is a positive thing. Top of all the knuckle-dragging mindless thug idiots? Congratulations. What an honour.
Why would anyone would want to imply that us having a 'decent mob' would be something to be proud of, either? I'd rather we never had one.
Well if we were all the same, and times didn't change then the world would be a boring place. I'm guessing you utilise social media for everything, use the phrase "Can I Get" and pay for a pint with a card. Now I don't get most of that, but that's today, and we were then. None of us are saying that the passage of time, has not put it into a different perspective. However, it was a thing of its time.
While I can't say I agree with the sentiment, I appreciate your reply is a lot more reasoned than my post.
I can't say I agree that the world would be a more boring place. If people weren't so prone to violence then the world would be a decidedly better place. Being violent is not being different.
I also don't believe that the old days were so honourable, as others have put here, and innocent people never got caught up. They did. But when we look back on the old days, we do have a tendency to glorify them.
The Casual fashion has to be one of the best ever. Bloody expensive as a teenager. Kappa rain coat, File tracky, Lois Jeans and Diadora suedes. You had to really cool tho to carry off the Deer Stalker !!
The Casual fashion has to be one of the best ever. Bloody expensive as a teenager. Kappa rain coat, File tracky, Lois Jeans and Diadora suedes. You had to really cool tho to carry off the Deer Stalker !!
We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
The last time they came was against Burnley (I think) and about 50 got a good hiding where our Police control box is now. One of those was Craig Fairbrass the actor. The afters went on for some time afterwards including my brother getting done by them on a bus.
Was this against Barnsley? We were in the Jimmy Seed as the seats were being put in the North?
Trust Millwall to turn it around to be all about them. LOL
Pretty sure it was Barnsley and the Millwall mob first tried to see if Barnsley were interested in teaming up - they weren't. We arrived at the back of the South Stand where the Millwall were grouped and when the numbers evened out it all kicked off and they fought a running rearguard out of the ground. I had great fun chasing Fairbrass up the muddy slope behind the flats in Valley Grove. He was shitting himself and covered in mud as he desperately tried to climb away. A bully who I once heard scream "I hope you die of cancer" to a Traffic Warden ticketing his Merc at The Standard. I came across him threatening a mate of mine once outside his home (old schoolboy) and asked him to pick on someone his size - he laid an egg. After many years of doing it, that was the last time Millwall ever showed up at a non-Millwall game.
Millwall turned up at the FA cup tie at Ipswich and got a bit of a kicking in the ground. The following week, they turned up for the Barnsley match and as the Cardinal says, got another hiding. When we played Millwall in a midweek league match a few weeks later, they turned up in huge numbers and Charlton were nowhere to be seen. We were spread all over the ground. After the match they went hunting for us in Eltham High Street. They were desperate to get revenge for those kickings in subsequent weeks
That pic of the Pompey game is not Chsrlton and Pompey having it.It was Charlton v Plod ---- Pompey weren't about that day.
We were in three pubs in Havant and Plod moved everyone out from there. Shoved us into one section in the ground and then started aiming people out.Thats till it went off.
I think this was very close to when we got booted out of The Valley ,probably the first big away game
Was there that day -think we lost .Soon after we we won 5-3 down at Brighton .Curbs scored for us .
We won 2-1, drew 1-1 ‘home’ to Portsmouth at Selhurst that year. Portsmouth were relegated we finished two places above them. The season we needed a draw away to Chelsea to avoid the playoffs.
brighton 5-3 was our promotion season.
Remember that game. Mike Flanagan scored, came running over to us and jumped up on the wire fencing in celebration. Listened to the radio in the motor on the way home and the Brighton manager (can't remember who he was) bemoaning the fact that if Brighton 'were going to go up they had to beat the likes of Charlton'. Cocky dipstick. Wonder what he made of the final table at the end of the season. Back to the punch-up stories, who remembers the FA Cup against Arsenal at Highbury - 1968?- when Charlton took the North Bank?
1969 ;-) Thousands of Charlton there that day, up the North bank & on the side. Hundreds ran riot in Holloway Road early on, many shop windows went through & mass looting of Jewellers off licences & clothes shops. Leicester coach on the way to Millwall passed us by with a few missiles thrown. Made front page headlines in the Evening News that night.
There was large article on the Charlton march to the game, the trouble at the match and damage and theft from jewellers en route in the News of the World too.
It was a brilliant day out for me, almost 9, so much going on and a huge Charlton contingent....Tube train broke down on the way too....I can remember the swell of the crowd moving out of Highbury and it felt like my feet weren't touching the ground. We viewed the game from the seats that day and had a brilliant view of what was happening in the ground and on the pitch.
this is a great thread and read for someone like me who is an active participant on the dj coach, which includes lemon drizzle being handed round and sharing of football league review and Mercury newspapers
We can take the piss out of @MillwallFan and have fun doing it but they were top dogs for most of the hooligan heyday, mixing it with the likes of Chelsea West Ham Leeds. But it rankles with me when they claim to have been present at so many Charlton games. I can think of 2/3 at most
The last time they came was against Burnley (I think) and about 50 got a good hiding where our Police control box is now. One of those was Craig Fairbrass the actor. The afters went on for some time afterwards including my brother getting done by them on a bus.
Was this against Barnsley? We were in the Jimmy Seed as the seats were being put in the North?
Trust Millwall to turn it around to be all about them. LOL
Pretty sure it was Barnsley and the Millwall mob first tried to see if Barnsley were interested in teaming up - they weren't. We arrived at the back of the South Stand where the Millwall were grouped and when the numbers evened out it all kicked off and they fought a running rearguard out of the ground. I had great fun chasing Fairbrass up the muddy slope behind the flats in Valley Grove. He was shitting himself and covered in mud as he desperately tried to climb away. A bully who I once heard scream "I hope you die of cancer" to a Traffic Warden ticketing his Merc at The Standard. I came across him threatening a mate of mine once outside his home (old schoolboy) and asked him to pick on someone his size - he laid an egg. After many years of doing it, that was the last time Millwall ever showed up at a non-Millwall game.
Millwall turned up at the FA cup tie at Ipswich and got a bit of a kicking in the ground. The following week, they turned up for the Barnsley match and as the Cardinal says, got another hiding. When we played Millwall in a midweek league match a few weeks later, they turned up in huge numbers and Charlton were nowhere to be seen. We were spread all over the ground. After the match they went hunting for us in Eltham High Street. They were desperate to get revenge for those kickings in subsequent weeks
That's right, when they came in the Man of Kent i think i managed to disappear up my own backside. I should add after that gloves were off. It was anywhere, anytime. Even Sunday morning football matches.
I remember a bunch of Chelsea turning up too mid seventies and loitering around that silly little gate across the West stand car park, they at first wasn't unfriendly but towards the end of the match (no idea who we were playing) they had a little go at the Covered End and got run off...some bloke in a blue trench coat in particular thought he was a bit tasty but he ran away with the rest of them.
I remember a bunch of Chelsea turning up too mid seventies and loitering around that silly little gate across the West stand car park, they at first wasn't unfriendly but towards the end of the match (no idea who we were playing) they had a little go at the Covered End and got run off...some bloke in a blue trench coat in particular thought he was a bit tasty but he ran away with the rest of them.
Don't tell me he was chased by a bloke in a Red trench coat Tel
Comments
Big lump he was so not as if I was threatening him with some weird alpha male prison bullshit...it was virgin active in Bickley ffs :-)
Adds up reading your post.
Another Eastenders cast member Christian used to go there too. He never passively aggressively threatened me.
Great thread and agree with the "of its time youth subculture" narrative and imagine it would have been fun for those into it and probably appealing if you were a youngster of the time.
As @MillwallFan says it's madly out of place now days with modern society and football itself the way it's morphed and seeing it occur now especially with older participants is as out of place as if tens of mods and rockers were turning up at the seaside each weekend to kick the granny out of each other amongst families and other beachgoeers.
I can't say I agree that the world would be a more boring place. If people weren't so prone to violence then the world would be a decidedly better place. Being violent is not being different.
I also don't believe that the old days were so honourable, as others have put here, and innocent people never got caught up. They did. But when we look back on the old days, we do have a tendency to glorify them.
https://www.80scasualclassics.co.uk/
With everything from Fila track tops to Lois cords I expect to see you all decked out next home game
I'd look a right butterball in that gear now.
I should add after that gloves were off. It was anywhere, anytime. Even Sunday morning football matches.