Is this not strange? Is this a set up?
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Wheresmeticket? said:Hovi's Biscuit said:MuttleyCAFC said:If Charlton are no more, restrictions protecting the club may no longer be deemed necessary. There is no point in there being a football ground on the site so planning permissions would very likely be opened up. The land suddenly becomes very valuable.0
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I think this is closer to the truth rather than something bigger involving Roland. Phillips, Doughty, Morgan and maybe even Bonne could bring in a few million between to cover the money put in to pay the bills for a few months.4
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Yes, but it is linked to the club and protects the club from asset grabbers. So if the club is no more the restriction potentially loses its reason for being there.0
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Hovi's Biscuit said:Wheresmeticket? said:Hovi's Biscuit said:MuttleyCAFC said:If Charlton are no more, restrictions protecting the club may no longer be deemed necessary. There is no point in there being a football ground on the site so planning permissions would very likely be opened up. The land suddenly becomes very valuable.0
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The EFL kick us out and then ESI files for bankruptcy. No money to pay the directors and no money to pay Roland his £50m. But Roland has the ground and training ground without the barrier of a club.0
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MuttleyCAFC said:The EFL kick us out and then ESI files for bankruptcy. No money to pay the directors and no money to pay Roland his £50m. But Roland has the ground and training ground without the barrier of a club.1
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Well, he sits on the land and when the dust has settled he sells it as prime land for development. Probably framed as a regeneration project!2
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N01R4M said:I'm sure it was reported at the time of the takeover, that Roland made a comment to the fans along the lines of "enjoy it while you can", which struck me as odd & faintly sinister - hence why I remember it.
But I cannot now find a reference to it, and am beginning to doubt my sanity! Can anyone confirm my recollection?
If my memory is true, it would certainly fit a scenario where RD believed the club's days to be numbered.4 -
MuttleyCAFC said:To be honest, if we die, what council is just going to let a football stadium with no club to play in it rot and crumble on the land ad infinitum?0
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I honestly don't believe CAFC folding would have any advantages for Roland. Even as prime land, he isn't foolish enough and will know he's biggest chance of selling his asset at the highest price is back to CAFC. He won't get near 50m otherwise.
For me Roland has taken the deal which lands him the most cash, he doesn't want to be seen as a failure. As odd as the decision he made to tell to TN, being Roland I'm not really supprised.
I generally do not think when he made this deal it was to end CAFC.5 - Sponsored links:
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If the club has folded and Roland can sell the land then there's also the cost of pulling down the stadium and as someone mentioned earlier the cost of cleaning the soil.
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Wheresmeticket? said:If CAFC disappear, what happens to the property?
That's where the money is.
If RD holds on to the property and sells the club to be mismanaged to extinction he frees up a lot of property for his money. A lot more than he would ever make from a football club.Roland then not only gains financially, but also gets one over on the Charlton fans who gave him
a hard time.But if Charlton ceased to exist would the council automatically change the designation of the land as only for leisure use? I’m not sure.3 -
JamesSeed said:Wheresmeticket? said:If CAFC disappear, what happens to the property?
That's where the money is.
If RD holds on to the property and sells the club to be mismanaged to extinction he frees up a lot of property for his money. A lot more than he would ever make from a football club.Roland then not only gains financially, but also gets one over on the Charlton fans who gave him
a hard time.But if Charlton ceased to exist would the council automatically change the designation of the land as only for leisure use? I’m not sure.0 -
Scoham said:JamesSeed said:Wheresmeticket? said:If CAFC disappear, what happens to the property?
That's where the money is.
If RD holds on to the property and sells the club to be mismanaged to extinction he frees up a lot of property for his money. A lot more than he would ever make from a football club.Roland then not only gains financially, but also gets one over on the Charlton fans who gave him
a hard time.But if Charlton ceased to exist would the council automatically change the designation of the land as only for leisure use? I’m not sure.0 -
ShootersHillGuru said:MuttleyCAFC said:To be honest, if we die, what council is just going to let a football stadium with no club to play in it rot and crumble on the land ad infinitum?1
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Hovi's Biscuit said:Wheresmeticket? said:Hovi's Biscuit said:MuttleyCAFC said:If Charlton are no more, restrictions protecting the club may no longer be deemed necessary. There is no point in there being a football ground on the site so planning permissions would very likely be opened up. The land suddenly becomes very valuable.0
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charltonkeston said:ShootersHillGuru said:MuttleyCAFC said:To be honest, if we die, what council is just going to let a football stadium with no club to play in it rot and crumble on the land ad infinitum?
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JamesSeed said:Wheresmeticket? said:If CAFC disappear, what happens to the property?
That's where the money is.
If RD holds on to the property and sells the club to be mismanaged to extinction he frees up a lot of property for his money. A lot more than he would ever make from a football club.Roland then not only gains financially, but also gets one over on the Charlton fans who gave him
a hard time.But if Charlton ceased to exist would the council automatically change the designation of the land as only for leisure use? I’m not sure.1 -
AmandaHoldensLegs said:JamesSeed said:Wheresmeticket? said:If CAFC disappear, what happens to the property?
That's where the money is.
If RD holds on to the property and sells the club to be mismanaged to extinction he frees up a lot of property for his money. A lot more than he would ever make from a football club.Roland then not only gains financially, but also gets one over on the Charlton fans who gave him
a hard time.But if Charlton ceased to exist would the council automatically change the designation of the land as only for leisure use? I’m not sure.2 -
AmandaHoldensLegs said:JamesSeed said:Wheresmeticket? said:If CAFC disappear, what happens to the property?
That's where the money is.
If RD holds on to the property and sells the club to be mismanaged to extinction he frees up a lot of property for his money. A lot more than he would ever make from a football club.Roland then not only gains financially, but also gets one over on the Charlton fans who gave him
a hard time.But if Charlton ceased to exist would the council automatically change the designation of the land as only for leisure use? I’m not sure.10 - Sponsored links:
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This is putting me off renewing my season ticket.2
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We have to force the EFL to act in some way before the club is drained of everything.
Looks urgent.0 -
N01R4M said:I'm sure it was reported at the time of the takeover, that Roland made a comment to the fans along the lines of "enjoy it while you can", which struck me as odd & faintly sinister - hence why I remember it.
But I cannot now find a reference to it, and am beginning to doubt my sanity! Can anyone confirm my recollection?
If my memory is true, it would certainly fit a scenario where RD believed the club's days to be numbered.
'"Enjoy the moment"" a Roland quote.
When i first read this the alarm bells started to ring .
LOOKING back on this site last night i came across what i think is the first mention of this Roland Quote.......Jan 2nd 2020 7-16pm Sale of Charlton Ding Dong.
@airman brown refers to it,as he had been watching ""Rolands rambling nonsense""on sky he did say enjoy the moment.0 -
Let’s play a game. let's call it the Nimer game. You are looking to buy a football club. There is a club that ticks a lot of the boxes but the current owner is asking a lot of money for it. You decide you need somebody to front this serious financial undertaking. The most qualified person seems to be a failure with no impressive entries on his CV who with a tiny amount of digging you find, recently couldn’t afford to pay his solicitor’s legal fees.
So you talk to the owner and without doing proper due diligence you agree a price double what anybody else has indicated they were willing to pay for it. You provided a legal guarantee that you would pay this money, but because you were in a hurry to buy the club and invest in players to keep it in the division, you decided to take on the loss making part of it for £1. You were willing to commit yourself to the ridiculous £50plus million price but you weren’t going to pay it now or check if the club was worth it.
Then after making such a desperate commitment because it was so urgent, you find that the League the club is paying in won’t accept you as a fit and proper owner. But actually, it is worse than that, you don’t even test them. You hold off on actually giving them the information they need to decide. (this is something I think we could really get some more info from Southall on if we were willing to hold our noses) You decide not to pay a penny in, when the reason you rushed in was this was so desperately needed. Then this loser fronting your group starts getting angry because he is not seeing money coming in and he doesn’t understand why……………..
Is this a fair summary and if so, is it believable that Nimer would do this or have any expectation that he could be liable for £50m plus at any point?
For me, there was no rush to purchase the club. We know that now as the reason given for the rush did not play out. It was too reckless to be true to commit to paying £50m in those circumstances. At least fail the EFL test and we might identify a stumbling block. By not submitting the evidence, it shows a knowledge that the test would be failed. This was all a scam to separate the club from its assets. The ridiculous price was needed to stop a knight in shining armour coming to the rescue. The holder of the assets has to be in on it to some extent. Whether that be from his idea, which I personally doubt, or by agreeing to pay when approached by chancers who promised they could do it for him.
What is worrying is that as long as there is a club, the assets are not worth as much as they could be ................
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You can’t rule out that an abandoned Valley might eventually secure consent for residential development but it is very far from bring prime land in London terms. Duchatelet has a scheme to justify his value but it has never been tested with Greenwich and it’s obvious overdevelopment.
The site has severe access problems for vehicles in terms of large scale residential redevelopment - the level crossing, the width restriction in Church Lane, the turn in Floyd Road, Ransom Walk and the chalk cliffs. There are soil issues and a major sewer. There is a bloody great football stadium to demolish and there is the current designation of the land as community open space to overcome.All of these things limit the number of homes you can build and the council, even if it cooperated, would want a large element to be social and/or affordable housing, which it can make a condition. Most important, development has costs of itself. These include fixed upfront payments in respect of additional services needed from the council, as well as materials, plant, labour, legals etc. The profit, to be shared with any builder, isn’t the difference between the price of the land and the sale price of the homes. It’s that latter figure net of all the other costs.Even if you could build 400 properties you’d struggle to justify spending £50m on the land given all the uncertainties that lie in the way, even if you had it. And there is no scenario I can see that someone doesn’t have to pay the ex-directors £7m on top. They must be paid if CAFC goes out of business. If the club cannot pay then Roland must.
Of course, if a ticket is available in this lottery for £1 most people would snap it up. Elliott may well have bought one. But so what?3 -
But you know well enough that Roland isn't all there. The question is more whether he believes he can get top dollar for the assets without the club. That is surely all that matters. Do you honestly think he doesn't? All of his comments and his valuation seems to suggest he does.0
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Airman Brown said:You can’t rule out that an abandoned Valley might eventually secure consent for residential development but it is very far from bring prime land in London terms. Duchatelet has a scheme to justify his value but it has never been tested with Greenwich and it’s obvious overdevelopment.
The site has severe access problems - the level crossing, the turn in Floyd Road, Ransom Walk and the chalk cliffs. There are soil issues and a major sewer. There is a bloody great football stadium to demolish and there is the current designation of the land as community open space to overcome.All of these things limit the number of houses you can build and the council, even if it cooperated, would want a large element to be social and/or affordable housing. Most important, development has costs of itself. The profit isn’t the difference between the price of the land and the sale price of the homes. It’s that figure net of all the other costs.Even if you could build 400 properties you’d struggle to justify spending £50m on the land given all the uncertainties that lie in the way, even if you had it. And there is no scenario I can see that someone doesn’t have to pay the ex-directors £7m on top.
Of course, if a ticket is available in this lottery for £1 most people would snap it up. Elliott may well have bought one. But so what?
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AndyG said:Airman Brown said:You can’t rule out that an abandoned Valley might eventually secure consent for residential development but it is very far from bring prime land in London terms. Duchatelet has a scheme to justify his value but it has never been tested with Greenwich and it’s obvious overdevelopment.
The site has severe access problems - the level crossing, the turn in Floyd Road, Ransom Walk and the chalk cliffs. There are soil issues and a major sewer. There is a bloody great football stadium to demolish and there is the current designation of the land as community open space to overcome.All of these things limit the number of houses you can build and the council, even if it cooperated, would want a large element to be social and/or affordable housing. Most important, development has costs of itself. The profit isn’t the difference between the price of the land and the sale price of the homes. It’s that figure net of all the other costs.Even if you could build 400 properties you’d struggle to justify spending £50m on the land given all the uncertainties that lie in the way, even if you had it. And there is no scenario I can see that someone doesn’t have to pay the ex-directors £7m on top.
Of course, if a ticket is available in this lottery for £1 most people would snap it up. Elliott may well have bought one. But so what?0 -
Southall is irrelevant here. The question is whether we believe Nimer ever had intention of giving up £50m for the club. If the answer is no, then there is a scam going on. It seems to be quite an elaborate one with multiple parties involved. Where is the money to make it worth their while? Is it not possible, based on some evidence, that Roland thinks the land is worth a lot of money without the club. That is all that is needed, whether he is right or wrong.
You know I sing your praises Airman. You are always the biggest champion of our beloved club. But isn't what you are saying, what people have been trying to say to Duchatelet for a while without much success?0