Like the black cab, high street shops are a thing of the past.... who cares.
I wont be crying when your industry is the next one to be on the scrap heap then.
Since I started work in 1983 I've seen coal miners, steelworkers & car manufacturers, (just to name a few) go to the wall. In the last decade in been the turn of the high street retailers, with big names like Woolworths, HMV & BHS. No-one it seems is immune. God knows what the high street will look like in another 10 years. All fast food outlets & bookies perhaps.
I don't think it will be bookies. It's too easy for people to bet online nowadays. The majority of their walk in customers are old boys who either don't have mobiles or wouldn't think to use them for betting. Once that generation are gone, that'll be the end of the traditional betting shop.
As sad as it is for Arcadia staff, I think the writing was on the wall before Covid. The high street as we know it is on its last legs. If it is to survive it needs to reinvent itself, probably as a sort of entertainment space with a bit of light retail thrown in. For that to work, I think a number of things will have to happen: 1. There'll have to be an end to the excessive rents. 2. There'll need to be a major clean up. The loutish drunkenness, the homelessness problem and the threat of violence and knife crime that make many high streets unpleasant places to go will need to be sorted out. 3. It almost goes without saying that the Covid threat will need to be eradicated.
Like the black cab, high street shops are a thing of the past.... who cares.
I wont be crying when your industry is the next one to be on the scrap heap then.
Since I started work in 1983 I've seen coal miners, steelworkers & car manufacturers, (just to name a few) go to the wall. In the last decade in been the turn of the high street retailers, with big names like Woolworths, HMV & BHS. No-one it seems is immune. God knows what the high street will look like in another 10 years. All fast food outlets & bookies perhaps.
I don't think it will be bookies. It's too easy for people to bet online nowadays. The majority of their walk in customers are old boys who either don't have mobiles or wouldn't think to use them for betting. Once that generation are gone, that'll be the end of the traditional betting shop.
As sad as it is for Arcadia staff, I think the writing was on the wall before Covid. The high street as we know it is on its last legs. If it is to survive it needs to reinvent itself, probably as a sort of entertainment space with a bit of light retail thrown in. For that to work, I think a number of things will have to happen: 1. There'll have to be an end to the excessive rents. 2. There'll need to be a major clean up. The loutish drunkenness, the homelessness problem and the threat of violence and knife crime that make many high streets unpleasant places to go will need to be sorted out. 3. It almost goes without saying that the Covid threat will need to be eradicated.
Good luck with that little lot.
Plus free parking, it is literally crazy that the high street ever thought it could compete with malls/retail parks/out of town superstores by charging people to park and then only being open when a huge chunk of your customer base is at work.
Just read on the BBC that the Arcadia situation has had a knock on effect on the proposed JD Sports takeover of Debenhams who now face a very uncertain future. If they go under then that’s around twenty five thousand jobs gone (that’s Arcadia and Debenhams combined). 2020 really has been a shocker and I can see 2021 being even worse. I know people think Brexit talk should be kept to the sub forum but if we crash out with no deal then you can expect much, much worse. I may not always like my job but at least it’s safe.
Worked in the Bromley one in late 90s when it was on the other side of the walk.
Shame.
Hopefully it can be sorted out.
My brother worked in Burton bromley when it was next to Burger King. Around 97/98 ish. I worked in Benetton in the glades.
Same time as me Suzie. Used to work Saturdays and the odd week night when they were open.
They played the same 10 song CD on loop so I've only recently been able to listen to Des'ree's Life again without having a pavlovian response of refolding a tshirt or thumbing a shirt on a hanger that was already perfectly straight.
Got two good mates at Arcadia. Fortunately both in the digital side of things and I can’t see the brand disappearing completely. Suspect it will still exist like HMV with a lot of store closures.
Dreadful news, it’s going to be a very rough ride economically over the next few years. The impact of the pandemic will be dwarfed by what’s around the corner with Brexit.
Arcadia was previously titled The Burton Group, whom i worked for from 1982 until 1990. It was one of most successful retailers in the country, the group included Burtons, Dorothy Perkins, Debenhams, Evans, John Collier, Harvey Nichols, Hamleys, Principles, Champion Sport, Top Shop, Top Man & probably a couple of other retailers i've forgotten. Chief executive/Chairman was Sir Ralph Halpern & directors included Stuart Rose, Mary Portas & Peter Ridsdale. I worked in the head office which was situated above the Top Shop on Oxford Circus. Burtons & Top Man both were sponsors of Leeds United during that period, which is how Ridsdale became involved with the club, a club he already was a fan of.
I prefer shopping on high streets without too many chain stores (somewhere like Bromley Glades is my idea of hell). Hopefully when the dust settles all these units can be filled by independents who can offer a less soul destroying retail experience.
This will be the tip of the iceberg for retail, hospitality and many other sectors. I do fear for black cabs as well, I think they will still exist post covid but in much much smaller numbers.
Was listening to an interview with the owners of an event company, PapaKata. Previously one of the leaders in the hospitality sector hiring out tents and the like for weddings and so on, shut down last month after income down 98% and unmanageable debt, a previously profitable company for 14 years.
It's going to be tough on so many people this coming period.
I prefer shopping on high streets without too many chain stores (somewhere like Bromley Glades is my idea of hell). Hopefully when the dust settles all these units can be filled by independents who can offer a less soul destroying retail experience.
Trouble is, the footprint these kinds of stores take up, means its only ever going to be replaced by another massive chain like weatherspoons or left empty. Smaller stores end up being a charity shop/coffee shop/hair dressers.
I prefer shopping on high streets without too many chain stores (somewhere like Bromley Glades is my idea of hell). Hopefully when the dust settles all these units can be filled by independents who can offer a less soul destroying retail experience.
Trouble is, the footprint these kinds of stores take up, means its only ever going to be replaced by another massive chain like weatherspoons or left empty. Smaller stores end up being a charity shop/coffee shop/hair dressers.
The highlighted bit describes Beckenham High Street.
I fear what Oxford Street will look like in a few years with large department stores converted into hotels or flats? any small independent stores will struggle to pay the rents on these huge sites. more flashing 'bargain' stores selling 3 for 2 pashmina's, phone covers and perfume hot off the back of a lorry?
Perhaps we'll see a JV between small independents to create a one stop shop in one venue is the short term answer? like an indoor market almost like concessions? The surge of street food markets has shown there is an appetite for independent flavours instead of the main take away options. It would be like walking round Etsy? not necessarily an indoor clothes market, more craft stuff?
I guess you'd need someone like the mean man that owns box park to rent the space, and invite small retailers to rent units from him?
I prefer shopping on high streets without too many chain stores (somewhere like Bromley Glades is my idea of hell). Hopefully when the dust settles all these units can be filled by independents who can offer a less soul destroying retail experience.
Trouble is, the footprint these kinds of stores take up, means its only ever going to be replaced by another massive chain like weatherspoons or left empty. Smaller stores end up being a charity shop/coffee shop/hair dressers.
The highlighted bit describes Beckenham High Street.
I worked for Arcadia for nearly 10 years. I was part of the team that set up online back in 1999/2000. We proved the online channel worked by about 2005 by which time they absorbed it from being stand alone into the brands, which I think was a mistake. I was in the room in 2005 when PG announced he’s giving himself £1.2 billion and in the same breath bollcoked us for not making the £300 million profit he wanted that year. We the online team (Zoom) were seen as them enemy to some and a nuisance to others for years, now look what’s happened. I could tell you loads of boring stories but will spare you.
I tell you this though if that fat little cunt nicks any of my pension I will not go quietly, let’s see what he does. He could plug the hole and be down to his last £600 million.
Philip Green is an arsehole who exploits every loophole going. Selling Bhs for £1 to Chappell the serial bankrupt who is now banged up in prison for not paying a 484k tax bill. Fat Phil is "penniless" as the business is in his wife's name despite spending millions on every birthday in the last 20 years flying in Brown nosing Friends to places in the sun. Green's 60's birthday cost 6 million pound 8 years ago
A large chunk of that money came from a £1.2bn dividend in 2005, the biggest in British corporate history. No tax was paid on the dividend paid to Tina Green because of her base in tax-free Monaco.
We are suppose to believe Tina Green is down to her last 950 million. Well sell your effing two super yachts and your jet if you want to be billionaires again.
A black hole no doubt exists in Arcadia pensions. Green must've Learnt those tricks from Robert Maxwell.
Arcadia staff pay more personal income tax in the UK that Green. Not for much longer though as some will be selling the big issue.
A scandal that a guy who donates to the Conservatives can get a knighthood despite paying no or very little personal income tax to the UK. I slagged off the Labour party when they do the same for their rich benefactors. Harold Wilson back in the 60's gave honours to his friend and business associates.
Demise of the high street is a separate issue and was always going to happen because of greedy landlords, high parking fees, and on line shopping. COVID-19 is just kicking a man when he is already on the floor as far as the high street businesses are concerned.
I worked for Arcadia for nearly 10 years. I was part of the team that set up online back in 1999/2000. We proved the online channel worked by about 2005 by which time they absorbed it from being stand alone into the brands, which I think was a mistake. I was in the room in 2005 when PG announced he’s giving himself £1.2 billion and in the same breath bollcoked us for not making the £300 million profit he wanted that year. We the online team (Zoom) were seen as them enemy to some and a nuisance to others for years, now look what’s happened. I could tell you loads of boring stories but will spare you.
I tell you this though if that fat little cunt nicks any of my pension I will not go quietly, let’s see what he does. He could plug the hole and be down to his last £600 million.
The DB will almost certainly go into the PPF so if you aren't drawing drops instantly (90% I think) and it changes the annual increase which only applies post 1997 accruals and generally at a lower amount. It's also capped at about 37k PA.
Time will tell if he (or I think it's Lady Green) will do the honourable thing...........
It's why, if under a certain age and they are paying a decent multiplier I always advise (i'm not qualified to by the way!) people come out and put it in a SIPP.
I worked for Arcadia for nearly 10 years. I was part of the team that set up online back in 1999/2000. We proved the online channel worked by about 2005 by which time they absorbed it frthetheom being stand alone into the brands, which I think was a mistake. I was in the room in 2005 when PG announced he’s giving himself £1.2 billion and in the same breath bollcoked us for not making the £300 million profit he wanted that year. We the online team (Zoom) were seen as them enemy to some and a nuisance to others for years, now look what’s happened. I could tell you loads of boring stories but will spare you.
I tell you this though if that fat little cunt nicks any of my pension I will not go quietly, let’s see what he does. He could plug the hole and be down to his last £600 million.
I feel for You Greenhithe; the Man is an arrogant pig.
I worked for Arcadia for nearly 10 years. I was part of the team that set up online back in 1999/2000. We proved the online channel worked by about 2005 by which time they absorbed it from being stand alone into the brands, which I think was a mistake. I was in the room in 2005 when PG announced he’s giving himself £1.2 billion and in the same breath bollcoked us for not making the £300 million profit he wanted that year. We the online team (Zoom) were seen as them enemy to some and a nuisance to others for years, now look what’s happened. I could tell you loads of boring stories but will spare you.
I tell you this though if that fat little cunt nicks any of my pension I will not go quietly, let’s see what he does. He could plug the hole and be down to his last £600 million.
The DB will almost certainly go into the PPF so if you aren't drawing drops instantly (90% I think) and it changes the annual increase which only applies post 1997 accruals and generally at a lower amount. It's also capped at about 37k PA.
Time will tell if he (or I think it's Lady Green) will do the honourable thing...........
It's why, if under a certain age and they are paying a decent multiplier I always advise (i'm not qualified to by the way!) people come out and put it in a SIPP.
I’m 55 next year and have been weighing my options up for a while now ( I have 3 pensions Arcadia final salary thingy being one). My financial advisor told me to hold fire when I suggested taking it out and putting it private last year, saying the PPF will look after us. I am seriously considering taking 25% of all of them and semi retiring, so every % counts and if that idiot steals from me I won’t be happy.
I've not shopped in any of these places for years, but it is still a sad sight to see so many shops close and jobs go. High streets are in a bad way but still fare better than shopping centres once they hit the tipping point. (look at Lee Green, Catford, just as two). What these places are now missing is anything to pull shoppers in and the rent and rates are high and deter small independents opening up. There's also the timing aspect - most high street shops shut at 5.30, so they can only be used by pensioners, people on shift work and the unemployed, most of whom don't have oodles of cash. I live in Lewisham, the High Street is not attractive. Nor is the shopping centre. And the later it gets the worse they get.
I used to live in Crystal Palace, just off the triangle. The food dominated, independent only shopping experience was far more pleasant than anything on offer in the surrounding areas. I suppose it's a formula that's only replicable in fairly affluent areas though.
Comments
As sad as it is for Arcadia staff, I think the writing was on the wall before Covid. The high street as we know it is on its last legs. If it is to survive it needs to reinvent itself, probably as a sort of entertainment space with a bit of light retail thrown in. For that to work, I think a number of things will have to happen:
1. There'll have to be an end to the excessive rents.
2. There'll need to be a major clean up. The loutish drunkenness, the homelessness problem and the threat of violence and knife crime that make many high streets unpleasant places to go will need to be sorted out.
3. It almost goes without saying that the Covid threat will need to be eradicated.
Good luck with that little lot.
They played the same 10 song CD on loop so I've only recently been able to listen to Des'ree's Life again without having a pavlovian response of refolding a tshirt or thumbing a shirt on a hanger that was already perfectly straight.
I buy virtually everything online nowadays. So much more convenient, better offers, easier returns and no parking fees.
The high street hasn't moved with the times or how the punter shops.
It was one of most successful retailers in the country, the group included Burtons, Dorothy Perkins, Debenhams, Evans, John Collier, Harvey Nichols, Hamleys, Principles, Champion Sport, Top Shop, Top Man & probably a couple of other retailers i've forgotten.
Chief executive/Chairman was Sir Ralph Halpern & directors included Stuart Rose, Mary Portas & Peter Ridsdale.
I worked in the head office which was situated above the Top Shop on Oxford Circus.
Burtons & Top Man both were sponsors of Leeds United during that period, which is how Ridsdale became involved with the club, a club he already was a fan of.
Debenhams stores are set to close after the failure of last-ditch efforts to rescue the ailing department store chain, the BBC understands.
It means all 12,000 employees are likely to lose their jobs when the chain's 124 shops cease trading.
Debenhams fell into administration for the second time in April and hopes had rested on a rescue bid from JD Sports.
But that hope faded after the collapse of retail giant Arcadia, the biggest concession operator in Debenhams.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55142724
Was listening to an interview with the owners of an event company, PapaKata. Previously one of the leaders in the hospitality sector hiring out tents and the like for weddings and so on, shut down last month after income down 98% and unmanageable debt, a previously profitable company for 14 years.
It's going to be tough on so many people this coming period.
From personal experience, the likes of Burton and Debenhams have far fewer customers than the likes of Primark, Zara, Uniqlo, Sports Direct etc
Perhaps we'll see a JV between small independents to create a one stop shop in one venue is the short term answer? like an indoor market almost like concessions? The surge of street food markets has shown there is an appetite for independent flavours instead of the main take away options. It would be like walking round Etsy? not necessarily an indoor clothes market, more craft stuff?
I guess you'd need someone like the mean man that owns box park to rent the space, and invite small retailers to rent units from him?
It's what happens next when the machines can do the work that puts our lowest earners at most risk.
I tell you this though if that fat little cunt nicks any of my pension I will not go quietly, let’s see what he does. He could plug the hole and be down to his last £600 million.
A large chunk of that money came from a £1.2bn dividend in 2005, the biggest in British corporate history. No tax was paid on the dividend paid to Tina Green because of her base in tax-free Monaco.
We are suppose to believe Tina Green is down to her last 950 million. Well sell your effing two super yachts and your jet if you want to be billionaires again.
A black hole no doubt exists in Arcadia pensions. Green must've Learnt those tricks from Robert Maxwell.
Arcadia staff pay more personal income tax in the UK that Green. Not for much longer though as some will be selling the big issue.
A scandal that a guy who donates to the Conservatives can get a knighthood despite paying no or very little personal income tax to the UK. I slagged off the Labour party when they do the same for their rich benefactors. Harold Wilson back in the 60's gave honours to his friend and business associates.
Demise of the high street is a separate issue and was always going to happen because of greedy landlords, high parking fees, and on line shopping. COVID-19 is just kicking a man when he is already on the floor as far as the high street businesses are concerned.
Time will tell if he (or I think it's Lady Green) will do the honourable thing...........
It's why, if under a certain age and they are paying a decent multiplier I always advise (i'm not qualified to by the way!) people come out and put it in a SIPP.
I feel for You Greenhithe; the Man is an arrogant pig.
High streets are in a bad way but still fare better than shopping centres once they hit the tipping point. (look at Lee Green, Catford, just as two). What these places are now missing is anything to pull shoppers in and the rent and rates are high and deter small independents opening up. There's also the timing aspect - most high street shops shut at 5.30, so they can only be used by pensioners, people on shift work and the unemployed, most of whom don't have oodles of cash.
I live in Lewisham, the High Street is not attractive. Nor is the shopping centre. And the later it gets the worse they get.