Keep seeing on threads about the mess of the Duchatelet and previous eras and all of the "rebuilding" that needs doing and I have probably said that myself however thinking about it today in terms of actual details and required actions to undo things or relay the foundations what are they?
We are not an overly complicated business so I am just wondering what areas are requiring attention to undo the mess of the last 10 or so years.
This is being used as a reason/ explanation for the state of the playing squad so would be insightful to learn what issues are in place and how they are being addressed.
Do we have convoluted financial liabilities that are being unwound?
This is a genuine question as a joe bloggs fan who reads this forum and just turns up on a matchday I am not aware of issues off the field beyond what I read on here. So are there issues with the academy, behind the scenes*, transfer embargoes etc that are being addressed/ need to be addressed first before we can push on (or at least maintain the standard of last season)...if so perhaps there would be more understanding.
By this I don't mean stuff like Janet in accounts can't stand the clicking noise John makes when sucking his pen....just more material issues.
Of course no one would argue that the previous clowns and crooks caused huge damage to the clubs and we know about inflated leases on flats etc but are there other off the field stuff that is holding us back too?
I can't see what they are or would be and of course a club can't reveal warts n' all but would be good to know as it may shine a light the "mess" that many are talking about as needing prolonged periods to "rebuild".
7
Comments
What other than the transfer policy/ budget is the issue that requires repair and attention that is currently impacting the recruitment policy?
Ie are time attention and resources being allocated elsewhere on off the field matters because it is urgent they be addressed first to move the club forwards/ keep us as a going concern and this is therefore at a detriment at the playing side of things and we need to understand and accept this?
A football club is not an overly complicated business regardless of the previous decade of dysfunction comparative to many other vastly more complex businesses out there and I want to understand when people talk of undoing messes and rebuilding the club what this entails and how this translates to the current inadequate playing side of things.
The biggest mess imo was/is the club and it's playing facilities are two different entities.
TS tried to bring the two together (of which i'm starting to have doubts seeing as it would've cost a small fortune) but failed. He said he's got the valley and SL on a longer term expensive lease to offer some security,but what happens if he can't/won't pay the rent?
I am finding it hard to fathom as to what has improved under TS so far?
Yes ESI are gone. And yes I can get membership for my pet iguana. But other than that??
im guessing every department, playing and non playing needs investment and new bodies. Even the u-23’s have been neglected in recent years. Who do we have coming through?
everything needs work, including painting the yellow steps in all stands to filling the pt holes in the carpark
charlton as a project and not just the playing side will take a lot longer than 5 years to fix. My only gripe with Tommy is promising the unachievable
But this was known when the club was bought. The leasing aspect would have been in and nothing has changed in that respect and that can't/ won't be undone until we get to the premier league at minimum/ events mean the grounds are sold back at a reduced price.
So that's a huge mess and one we were all uncomfortable with at the time but live with as it meant we could continue as a club. It doesn't explain any rebuild / to do list item or explain why funds would be diverted from a playing budget/ recruitment strategy would be impacted by this issue.
If anything it means that investment in the valley and SL will be on the backburner as unlikely a tenant would make (significant) capital investment in the grounds until it is wholly owned.
Ownership of the ground would be great but that's not going to happen whilst in L1 and at least there's the security of the lease
I go back to something Bowyer said about us dithering over a transfer during the last window.
I wonder if in the cold light of day,TS went back through what he payed to get rid of the Southall's and Elliott's and then what he's set to pay Duchatelet on a yearly basis and decided to reign in his initial projection.
I'll give you an example. We walked out of the club shop empty handed yesterday. We would have spent at least £50, maybe nearer £100, but couldn't be bothered to wait. I know they are limited for space, but they have just a couple of tills stuck in the corner with a queue going right around the outside walls (stopping anyone not in the queue from browsing). There used to be a whole line of tills, but like everything else it's been pared back. Someone (and I don't know in this case whether it's someone within the club or some outside franchisee) has viewed the service provided as a cost, and has made cut backs. That may have been a pragmatic decision to make the shop viable. The trouble is, when you do that sort of thing across a whole business, everything goes into nose dive.
I think a related issue is lack of fan engagement. I can remember in the past the club used to get lots of things done free, or at least very cheaply, by engaging the fans to help out. People will do that, if they are genuinely excited about their club and feel a part of it. That line goodwill was very quickly severed by Duchatelet and Meire. Sandgaard has the opportunity to rebuild that culture if he wants. But it will be incredibly difficult, if people don't even want to attend The Valley for matches, let alone work parties.
Every time I hear his song, I just shudder.
Agreed. Regardless of what goes on off the field 99% of fans of any club only care about what happens on saturday/ tuesday.
That's the crux of my question really...what are the off the field issues being addressed that are detracting from maintaining the squad to the level it was at last season, let alone improving on it?
If it is just a budget thing i.e. we don't have sufficient funds to maintain a squad even of the level we had last term then fair enough and that's the reality of it and we just accept our reality and get behind the team (which we always should do anyway) and accept that this is the reality herein of remaining a going concern.
Where it has been conflated was by the hyperbole from TS and NA and whilst taken with a pinch of salt there is a world of difference of talk of "that'll be us next year", "blow through the league" and "premier league in 5 years" to having a bench of untested kids and first 11 that is a couple of injuries away from inadequacy.
We are not entitled to success but I think that expecting a competitive and adequately resourced team after expectations were set that would very much be the case and we would be competitive is not unreasonable and not unreasonable that fans are now bemused.
If it's been a case of not being in a financial position to deliver beyond this then fair enough....it makes the guitar messiah stuff even more self indulgent and unnecessary and ott in my book but so be it. But if there are other things taking resource away from the playing side then it would make it more understandable.
I think Sandgaard needs to do the whole undercover boss thing where he dons a wig and glasses and spends a few days as a paying customer away from the West stand hospitality.
Was going to say that...if there are areas and actions that need addressing where fans can help on a voluntary basis to get things back on track then as demonstrated before our fanbase would certainly help out in that respect.
Hopefully it will evolve in that respect.
The attitude towards player recruitment seems to have taken the same route. It seems to have been dominated by budget rather than numbers and quality. In any business, if you are not prepared to invest than you can not expect to compete.
I was at the Oval a couple of weeks ago. The choice.of different foods around the ground was unreal. Stalls selling foods from Curry's to Mexican.
I'm sure there would be plenty of food businesses willing to set up there mobile kitchens and serve elsewhere on the concourse. It would give more choice and free up the bar areas. Might take a bit of planning, but anyone who's been to a street food market knows they don't take up that much room.
As others have said we have been run into the ground in the last 10 years (very few times in my lifetime have Charlton not been a club in crisis).
We’re paying the price for not doing good business, early on, I know it’s naff to watch (and boy have we put up with some dross!) my opinion is coming from the fact I’m still alive to be inside a football ground regardless of what’s going on, on the pitch, I’m not taking life for granted, with what’s gone on with Covid.
Couped up like a chicken for 18 months is not good for your sanity.
Small thing, please please can we instead of singing your effing #### at the players sing ‘Craig Mcgillvaray (I know the spellings iffy) instead as the geezer had a blinder yesterday, and we still got beat, says it all really.
We need to find some absolute gems, I’m not sure I buy the line of the best deals can be done in the last couple of weeks mantra though, was Steve Gallen even at our game yesterday?
We need to build up our academy with quality players, it’s what we’ve been known for down the years, Charlton is not a quick, easy fix, regardless of what comments / aspirational ideas have come from the people at the top.
Forgot to add , you do need a sense of humour following this club, otherwise they will make you ill!
It was good to be back however!
Getting out of League 1 is the cheap bit.
Any five/seven year plans of getting to the top level will have significant total cost. But by far the biggest slice of that total cost will come at Championship level. You don't get promoted to the Premier League by spending peanuts on transfer fees and wages.
It is possible, however, to get out of League 1 for 'a few million' ... and we're clearly struggling to do that.
So, if cost is what it's all about now, we seem to be falling at the first (quite low) hurdle. And that tells me that Sandgaard went into this with very poor/inaccurate project cost estimates.
Where might this advice have come from?
One straw in the wind is Charlton TV. The speed with which Thomas and co. came in and professionalised that, so that it's apparently pretty much best in class within the EFL, was another thing that kind of set expectations high. I thought, wow, this looks like a serious commercial revolution has started. But since then nothing seems to have happened in other areas, and a lot of enthusiastic but inexperienced people have come in and made elementary mistakes. The whole attempt to develop the international fanbase, on the back of the streaming, is a case in point, but I won't elaborate as its a niche area, and there's dialogue behind the scenes.
I think the question of whether TS has the right senior person he can delegate to, is part of it. I don't blame TS for wanting to be de facto CEO for a while. But then it means that inevitably he gets bogged down in operational issues, from long distance, and dealing with a backroom team that has not been invested in for years. There are only so many hours in a day, and he's learning about a completely new business sector.
The significant investment in 1st year pros contracts are a positive, even if you don't agree with all of them.
Other things such as coaching pathways, restructuring the coaching set up, making the women's team professional, membership schemes, international fans etc etc are, on there own positive things to do. So is "improving the player identification" capability.
However if we are in league 1 it's all bloody pointless. The pool of players we can realistically sign is so small I would expect Gallen, Adkins and maybe 2 staff to be able to reel them off off the top of their head.
At the end of the day it's a football club, one that is not viable in league 1 regardless of all the positivity, wishful thinking and wanting it to be.
Get it right on the pitch, for the men's first team, first. Then start fixing everything else.
No one, well some always will, would moan about pot holes, chips, or even more significant matters if we were sat top of league 1 with 12 points.
We appear to have fixed the roof, which wasn't really broken yet ignored the fact the foundations have failed and the whole house is about to fall down.
TLDR: A lot needs fixing but in the right order.
I’m not sure about Sandgaard, I’ve always been suspicious of flamboyance in leadership roles. He reminds me of Knighton.
Maybe I'm in a minority but if the food was even decent I would probably get something every game but I'll go elsewhere from now on. Against Wednesday I bought a pint at half time and they were waiting to pour until you'd ordered, I couldn't believe my eyes. And why do they need two crap lagers on anyway.
Apart from the kids reading the line ups out (which you can't hear anyway because the sound system is about 30 years old) the actual match day experience is really shit.