There is a lot of talk of helping the poor here, which I support totally. But it is very important that the middle class get respite from the Tsunami approaching. If people are spending too much of their income on this, it will effect the economy as they won't spend it elsewhere, and create a serious recession.
Very good point. People will have to choose between say energy and eating out as often as they normally would so cut down on going out, which leads to economic downturn, job losses etc. The Government needs to do something and I’m sure they will but will it be enough.
I think we are well beyond this point for many households. Currently there are millions already in fuel poverty. Many are making the decision between buying energy or whether to eat. At all. Not cutting down on takeaways or meals out.
This situation shames the country and should lead to a fundamental shift in the basic economic model that has allowed this to develop. But it won't.
There is a lot of talk of helping the poor here, which I support totally. But it is very important that the middle class get respite from the Tsunami approaching. If people are spending too much of their income on this, it will effect the economy as they won't spend it elsewhere, and create a serious recession.
Very good point. People will have to choose between say energy and eating out as often as they normally would so cut down on going out, which leads to economic downturn, job losses etc. The Government needs to do something and I’m sure they will but will it be enough.
I think we are well beyond this point for many households. Currently there are millions already in fuel poverty. Many are making the decision between buying energy or whether to eat. At all. Not cutting down on takeaways or meals out.
This situation shames the country and should lead to a fundamental shift in the basic economic model that has allowed this to develop. But it won't.
Please don’t think I don’t realise that, my reply was in response to Muttley’s post mentioning the middle classes and their increased spending on energy which I still think is a valid point. I am fully aware that many are having to, or will soon have to, choose between keeping warm and eating. That is scandalous in this day and age.
Thank goodness I’m in a position not to need to make a decision between eating and heating but if I was one of those people needing to choose between keeping my family warm or fed then I would be very very angry. If nothing is done then there are going to be a lot of very angry people looking for someone to blame.
Following on from Mutley's point, I live in a remote location and have a heavy reliance on oil and electricity as gas is not available. The price cap model sets a cost/kW that gives a maximum cost for the average household. What it doesn't do is factor in the impact on high comsumption households (I am remote and wholly reliant on electricity / oil). What is a 70-80% for the "average household" is in fact a 200-300% rise for high consumption households.
There is no way I can afford this hike (which could be an extra £8k for me), and I know a lot of others in our village are in the same boat with zero wage inflation.
Whilst I am no great fan of Liz Truss, the moratorium on the Green Levy is the only proposal I've heard that will actually help everyone.
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
For various reasons we don't have a smart meter so I have to submit readings myself. When I don't, they (Bulb) use estimated readings. On my latest bill and statement they overestimated my electricity use by a massive 893 KwH over just 2 months since my last meter readings at the end of March. Applying their current price of 28.221p/KwH that equated to being overcharged by £252.01 in just 2 months!! The gas has also been overestimated but only by about a month's worth. Un-fucking-believable!
I complained about this of course and they have credited the overcharged amount back to my account (Bulb account, not bank account; so they've still got the money) and reduced the monthly payments a bit. I'm now going to be submitting meter readings every month and calculating how much I'm actually spending rather than the amount they want me to pay.
Bulb is another one of those energy suppliers which i m o verge on the edge of fraudulent trading .. they are being propped up by the Govt through increased energy bills for all other users .. other companies just prior to going bust have handed out bonuses and dividends to their owners/share holders, knowing the company is failing .. this is evidently OK according to company law, to my mind the recipients of this cash and those who paid it should all spend a few months in the slammer and have their bank a/cs frozen .. https://youtu.be/wNt74QfkmEw
I go back to this .. all the 'independent' providers need serious scrutiny around the salaries and dividends paid to managers, owners and investors
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
All the utilities should have remained nationalised and run by the state. We now have private companies making huge profits whilst ordinary people suffer. I used to think that privatisation was a good thing, but it's clear now that privatising the utilities has been very bad for the average person.
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
The theory of multiple operators giving customers more choice and encouraging competition doesn't take into account corporate greed. All utilities should be state owned - for national security reasons alone.
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
All the utilities should have remained nationalised and run by the state. We now have private companies making huge profits whilst ordinary people suffer. I used to think that privatisation was a good thing, but it's clear now that privatising the utilities has been very bad for the average person.
"If you’re not a socialist before you’re twenty-five, you have no heart; if you are a socialist after twenty-five, you have no head".
You certainly contradict in reverse that famous quote, Emmy! (That's no bad thing - so do I as I've been a socialist all my life).
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
All the utilities should have remained nationalised and run by the state. We now have private companies making huge profits whilst ordinary people suffer. I used to think that privatisation was a good thing, but it's clear now that privatising the utilities has been very bad for the average person.
"If you’re not a socialist before you’re twenty-five, you have no heart; if you are a socialist after twenty-five, you have no head".
You certainly contradict in reverse that famous quote, Emmy! (That's no bad thing - so do I as I've been a socialist all my life).
The last two and a half years have taught me to have completely different political view from the one I have had most of my life. It's never too late to change!
Absolute shambles, made even worse by the profits announced by the likes of Shell and Centrica. I’ll add my voice to the Marxist chorus. Greed has got out of hand. We’re reaping years of more money flowing into a smaller pool of people. The problem is that this form of greed has become entrenched in capitalist society. Good luck to any party wanting to nail their colours to nationalization for fear of the stupid dog whistling backlash they’re likely to get and the label as woke communists.
All that is happening is that too many powerful people and powerful corporations are sucking the bottom end of society dry until there is nothing left, and it’s pretty much going on unregulated. There are many on here who understand the tax system better than I do, but if we genuinely want things to change and for those at the top to not kill off those at the bottom, the very wealthy, whether it be individuals or corporations need to put more back in, a lot more. We have so many loop holes in our system that have existed for years that people have been able to take the piss out of. With this, the state of the planet and what I believe is a creaking society because of how we have behaved as a race over the last 40/50 years, we aren’t that far off proper civil unrest on a big scale.
Might sound drastic, but it’s getting worse, not better - I wouldn’t write it off
Maybe we could start be voting for people trying to change things rather than the architects of it all. The elephant in the room is the price the French are paying. I don't think they are marxists but if you advocate nationalisation for the industry you are called a marxist and reminded penison funds are shareholders.
Mind you, the Americans call us Marxists, even Tories, for wanting a National Health Service! I'm definitely not a Marxist btw. It is just logical to have one nationalised company managing this, all it needs is a list of standards stating what it is there for and how it will deliver for customers and the environment.
Let's call it what it, an absolute racket. Shell posting their highest ever profits while normal people are struggling to feed their kids.
The French Govt have protected their people by nationalising EDF, leading to a maximum of 5% increase during this period, some of us are going to see 100% rises in less than 18 months.
I was paying £92pm as recent as April 2021 on a fixed tariff. I'm up to £280pm now on the variable cap, with another increase expected after October's hike.
The amount of money being spent on building the next two nuclear power stations (Hinckley B and Sizewell C), plus the exorbitant cost per unit of electricity being charged when operational would go a long way towards subsidising electricity in France.
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
The theory of multiple operators giving customers more choice and encouraging competition doesn't take into account corporate greed. All utilities should be state owned - for national security reasons alone.
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
The theory of multiple operators giving customers more choice and encouraging competition doesn't take into account corporate greed. All utilities should be state owned - for national security reasons alone.
I think a big problem was that there were too many operators. Let's be honest, when you change from one provider to another, the gas/electricity comes from the same place. We are paying for discounted prices from companies that have gone bust. This is an industry that needs to be run by one provider for the public and the environment not many providers for the shareholders. Call me a marxist
The theory of multiple operators giving customers more choice and encouraging competition doesn't take into account corporate greed. All utilities should be state owned - for national security reasons alone.
The EU said back in April various measure to reduce energy consumption including wfh 3 times a week. Offices must waste a huge amount of energy during idle hours
Martin Lewis is now confidently predicting that the price cap increase in October will be 77%. This will push someone on current average use of £1971 per year to £3500 with a further increase in January 2023
People really need to wake up to this right now. It’s going to have a catastrophic impact.
Martin Lewis is now confidently predicting that the price cap increase in October will be 77%. This will push someone on current average use of £1971 per year to £3500 with a further increase in January 2023
People really need to wake up to this right now. It’s going to have a catastrophic impact.
Unfortunately this govt won't until its far too late. Even if people can afford it they won't be spending money elsewhere which has a cumulative effect. All while shell make 10bn profit in 3 months
It is having an effect for businesses now as people are cutting spending due to what they are seeing on the news.
That’s grim enough but come winter there are going to be people, lots of people who will simply be unable to afford to warm their homes. If nothing is done I can see riots on a poll tax scale. We seem to be sleepwalking into this.
In a speech in Birmingham, Mr Johnson said: "I know that the pressures people are facing on their cost of living and the global inflation problems that we're seeing, the energy squeeze, the cost of gas, every country around the world is feeling it.
"But my argument to you would be that sometimes you've got to go through periods of difficulty and you've got to remember that they are just inevitable."
It's alright for him to say that, he has plenty of wealthy friends who look after him, pay for his expensive wallpaper, foot the bill for his parties and the tax payer to pay for his dressing up trips, whilst the rest of us have to struggle. I heard on Sky News at lunchtime that any household with an income of less then £38K will probably be in fuel poverty this winter.
It’s not really the British way but I can see violence on the streets because of this. Pricks like Johnson advising people to “suck it up” will enrage people.
Riots more usually take place in the summer, when the days are hot and the evenings long and warm. Riots are less likely in the winter and of course most youngsters (who riot) probably won't be paying the energy bills.
Riots more usually take place in the summer, when the days are hot and the evenings long and warm. Riots are less likely in the winter and of course most youngsters (who riot) probably won't be paying the energy bills.
Ordinary fathers who can’t keep their children warm or fed might feel differently. It wasn’t only youngsters who rioted against the poll tax.
Riots more usually take place in the summer, when the days are hot and the evenings long and warm. Riots are less likely in the winter and of course most youngsters (who riot) probably won't be paying the energy bills.
Ordinary fathers who can’t keep their children warm or fed might feel differently. It wasn’t only youngsters who rioted against the poll tax.
Comments
This situation shames the country and should lead to a fundamental shift in the basic economic model that has allowed this to develop. But it won't.
There is no way I can afford this hike (which could be an extra £8k for me), and I know a lot of others in our village are in the same boat with zero wage inflation.
Whilst I am no great fan of Liz Truss, the moratorium on the Green Levy is the only proposal I've heard that will actually help everyone.
Call me a Marxist too!
You certainly contradict in reverse that famous quote, Emmy! (That's no bad thing - so do I as I've been a socialist all my life).
Mind you, the Americans call us Marxists, even Tories, for wanting a National Health Service! I'm definitely not a Marxist btw. It is just logical to have one nationalised company managing this, all it needs is a list of standards stating what it is there for and how it will deliver for customers and the environment.
I'm up to £280pm now on the variable cap, with another increase expected after October's hike.
The German city of Hanover has turned off the heating and switched to cold showers in all public buildings because of the Russian gas crisis.
It's the first big city to turn off the hot water after Russia dramatically reduced Germany's gas supply.
Germans have been told to expect sweeping gas reduction measures and extra charges on their energy bills.
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-61179640
People really need to wake up to this right now. It’s going to have a catastrophic impact.
In a speech in Birmingham, Mr Johnson said: "I know that the pressures people are facing on their cost of living and the global inflation problems that we're seeing, the energy squeeze, the cost of gas, every country around the world is feeling it.
"But my argument to you would be that sometimes you've got to go through periods of difficulty and you've got to remember that they are just inevitable."
It's alright for him to say that, he has plenty of wealthy friends who look after him, pay for his expensive wallpaper, foot the bill for his parties and the tax payer to pay for his dressing up trips, whilst the rest of us have to struggle. I heard on Sky News at lunchtime that any household with an income of less then £38K will probably be in fuel poverty this winter.
Riots are less likely in the winter and of course most youngsters (who riot) probably won't be paying the energy bills.