It's almost impossible to get it 100% right 100% of the time. How often we get it right though is an issue.
When was it obvious to everyone Deji was a potential superstar? I don't remember him being "one to watch" for the Wigan game last season?
When Doughty was packed off to Bromley on loan was there the expectation that in a year's time he would be considered a "jewel in the crown"?
If you won't play them if they aren't pros, under contract, how long does the contract have to be 1 or 2 years doesn't really make much difference, it just kicks the can. 4 or 5 years? You end up with dozens of 19-21 year olds that aren't good enough.
It's not an exact science and the answer is always clear in hindsight.
The best way to hold on to our best youngsters is to be much higher up the football pyramid than 4th bottom League One. As things stand there are two dozen or more clubs that are probably more attractive.
The best way to hold on to our best youngsters is to be much higher up the football pyramid than 4th bottom League One. As things stand there are two dozen or more clubs that are probably more attractive.
Even better if we were a cat 1 academy.
What are Roddy and Sandgaard doing about that?
Might make a difference, but what can they do if we don't own the training ground? Am I right in thinking the criteria includes certain requirements on that front?
The best way to hold on to our best youngsters is to be much higher up the football pyramid than 4th bottom League One. As things stand there are two dozen or more clubs that are probably more attractive.
Even better if we were a cat 1 academy.
What are Roddy and Sandgaard doing about that?
Might make a difference, but what can they do if we don't own the training ground? Am I right in thinking the criteria includes certain requirements on that front?
The best way to hold on to our best youngsters is to be much higher up the football pyramid than 4th bottom League One. As things stand there are two dozen or more clubs that are probably more attractive.
Even better if we were a cat 1 academy.
What are Roddy and Sandgaard doing about that?
Might make a difference, but what can they do if we don't own the training ground? Am I right in thinking the criteria includes certain requirements on that front?
Yes, but it's not just about facilities
Obviously. But they'll have to meet all criteria. Do you know if they are already active, perhaps in anticipation of getting Sparrows in due course?
I’ve said it before on other threads. I really wanna see him play on the right of a CB three. And it wouldn’t bother me if it started this season, he looks the real deal.
The best way to hold on to our best youngsters is to be much higher up the football pyramid than 4th bottom League One. As things stand there are two dozen or more clubs that are probably more attractive.
Even better if we were a cat 1 academy.
What are Roddy and Sandgaard doing about that?
Might make a difference, but what can they do if we don't own the training ground? Am I right in thinking the criteria includes certain requirements on that front?
Yes, but it's not just about facilities
I should have directly posed the question in the Roddy/Gallen Q&A, but I can't see how a Cat 1 academy is affordable for a club outside at least the Championship, with the extra coaching required.
Palace have only recently reached Cat 1 themselves, and they have a similar track record to us when it comes to producing players, indeed possibly better
@Cafc43v3r Interesting observations and for the majority of players that is correct. I saw Alfie Doughty play for U23 as a Left Midfielder and thought he was consistent but didn't think he would move up from Cafc so quickly.
Joe Gomez and Paul Walsh were outstanding at a young age and at 15 only injury was going to stop them. Saw both play at that age for Cafc at Sparrows lane and they stood out. Paul Walsh was small but had magic feet and Joe glided over the pitch and was playing with lads 2 and 3 years older when he first got into the U18'S.
I saw Deji Elerewe for the first time on Charlton TV last season, but to be honest the two CB were very similar, both were tall gangling Black lads from an African background. I thought both had potential in the two matches I saw them play. They appeared clones of each other in the style of their play. Raw but both could run with the ball. What was the name of the other lad and is he still playing in the U18'S ?
Being the one camera, it wasn't easy to see their positioning when the ball was down the other end.
Joe Gomez had the longest contract given for a young player in recent years at Cafc, even though we knew he was always going to be moving on so no gamble. Had a quiet demeanor off the pitch and his Dad was/is a good role model for Joe.
I have watched a few early qualifying rounds of the FA youth Cup this season, and seen some very promising lads. But I have noticed against weaker opposition certain players look mustard but when up against stronger teams the same lads don't turn up. Corinthians Casuals are strong this season and I hope to get to Welling United on Friday week if possible to see a more even contest after two easy wins.
I watch for Character as well as natural ability, emotional intelligence, Peripheral vision and the ability to scan the play.(Claus Jensen) A good first touch stops the second touch being a foul !
Well, we're not cyrrently playing him....only in the Pizza Hut games. In the league games when we had an injury to Innis or players were out of favour we played 35 year old Pearce.
Not really sending out the vibes that we play the youngsters is it.
Nazir Bakrin. They do both have the same gangly build and posture. Maybe they could be the modern day Ben Mee and James Tarkowski! Or Carsley and Gravesen.
Nazir Bakrin. They do both have the same gangly build and posture. Maybe they could be the modern day Ben Mee and James Tarkowski! Or Carsley and Gravesen.
Cheers Mendonca, Nazir Bakrin, I will remember that name.
Nazir Bakrin. They do both have the same gangly build and posture. Maybe they could be the modern day Ben Mee and James Tarkowski! Or Carsley and Gravesen.
Bakrin signed his first pro deal in the summer. The club keep contract length quiet for most u23s, my guess would be a 1 year deal with another 1 year option that the club can activate.
It's amazing how quickly he developed. At the of end of last season I commented he looks a great athlete with a good technique but much too light weight. A summer spent in the gym or just growing and he now looks a real prospect. I was impressed at how quick he was, seeing him at the Valley.
We should offer him first team terms and a sensible release fee £3-4m with a sell on. Feels the best for parties he can go for a sensible fee and we get something approaching a decent fee in return and he can play 30 odd games this season and develop.
Feels like this will be a Konsa situation. We sell him for not a lot and 3 years later he's worth 30-40m
Well, we're not cyrrently playing him....only in the Pizza Hut games. In the league games when we had an injury to Innis or players were out of favour we played 35 year old Pearce.
Not really sending out the vibes that we play the youngsters is it.
Pearce is 33 years old. It'll be a while yet until he's 35.
As we all know, we've had a very poor start to our season - and no doubt team morale has been low. If you were a manager would you rely on a raw inexperienced youngster in the bedrock of your defence or bring in a warrior and leader?
No one doubts Deji has the greater potential compared with Pearce. But potential is sometimes not enough. There are times when experience is needed. Maybe now.
And in anyway, they will be played when they are ready. I mean, Deji has already made his League debut. But there are other factors to consider.
It's amazing how quickly he developed. At the of end of last season I commented he looks a great athlete with a good technique but much too light weight. A summer spent in the gym or just growing and he now looks a real prospect. I was impressed at how quick he was, seeing him at the Valley.
We should offer him first team terms and a sensible release fee £3-4m with a sell on. Feels the best for parties he can go for a sensible fee and we get something approaching a decent fee in return and he can play 30 odd games this season and develop.
Feels like this will be a Konsa situation. We sell him for not a lot and 3 years later he's worth 30-40m
Maybe we have and his agent is pushing for more money and/or a lower release clause.
It's amazing how quickly he developed. At the of end of last season I commented he looks a great athlete with a good technique but much too light weight. A summer spent in the gym or just growing and he now looks a real prospect. I was impressed at how quick he was, seeing him at the Valley.
We should offer him first team terms and a sensible release fee £3-4m with a sell on. Feels the best for parties he can go for a sensible fee and we get something approaching a decent fee in return and he can play 30 odd games this season and develop.
Feels like this will be a Konsa situation. We sell him for not a lot and 3 years later he's worth 30-40m
That’s not a sensible release clause, not from our perspective anyway, he’s only gotta play half a season and he’ll be worth that these days.
And the sell on is only worth it if a championship club buy him. If another Liverpool come in for him he may never get sold on.
The best way to hold on to our best youngsters is to be much higher up the football pyramid than 4th bottom League One. As things stand there are two dozen or more clubs that are probably more attractive.
Even better if we were a cat 1 academy.
What are Roddy and Sandgaard doing about that?
Might make a difference, but what can they do if we don't own the training ground? Am I right in thinking the criteria includes certain requirements on that front?
Nothing to stop Sandgaard buying Sparrows lane now. I believe shithead is asking for about 45 million for the valley and sparrows lane. Sparrows lane will only be a small % of that.
The best way to hold on to our best youngsters is to be much higher up the football pyramid than 4th bottom League One. As things stand there are two dozen or more clubs that are probably more attractive.
Even better if we were a cat 1 academy.
What are Roddy and Sandgaard doing about that?
Might make a difference, but what can they do if we don't own the training ground? Am I right in thinking the criteria includes certain requirements on that front?
Nothing to stop Sandgaard buying Sparrows lane now. I believe shithead is asking for about 45 million for the valley and sparrows lane. Sparrows lane will only be a small % of that.
Yeh, I did wonder myself about TS buying Sparrows separately from the Valley. Can't help thinking that, for whatever reason, Duchatelet wouldn't make it easy for him.
looks as though he is moving somewhere and I am not surprised .. Adkins should have given him more game time at the start of the season, that might have engendered a little bit of loyalty in the young man. All the theories on the lines of 'don't play him, he'll be in the shop window' were nonsense as any promising player in any team anywhere in the world is well known to the scouts of the big clubs with plenty of money I hope that we squeeze the maximum amount of cash from whichever outfit he goes to and perhaps we can loan him back for a few months, as i m o we are still short of numbers (if not height) in central defence
Being honest I saw Deji play several games last season for the U23 and he was no better than the other centre back Nazir Bakrin. neither of them particularly Outshone the other. it just looks like Deji has an agent who has convinced him to follow the dollar now. shame he has more chance of competitive action with us Than he does with West Ham and that is what he needs right now
looks as though he is moving somewhere and I am not surprised .. Adkins should have given him more game time at the start of the season, that might have engendered a little bit of loyalty in the young man. All the theories on the lines of 'don't play him, he'll be in the shop window' were nonsense as any promising player in any team anywhere in the world is well known to the scouts of the big clubs with plenty of money I hope that we squeeze the maximum amount of cash from whichever outfit he goes to and perhaps we can loan him back for a few months, as i m o we are still short of numbers (if not height) in central defence
If Deji won't sign a contract we can't squeeze anything out of his next club. They just have to pay a flat fee (£150k?) and there are no sell on or appearance fees included either.
Being honest I saw Deji play several games last season for the U23 and he was no better than the other centre back Nazir Bakrin. neither of them particularly Outshone the other. it just looks like Deji has an agent who has convinced him to follow the dollar now. shame he has more chance of competitive action with us Than he does with West Ham and that is what he needs right now
It's amazing how quickly he developed. At the of end of last season I commented he looks a great athlete with a good technique but much too light weight. A summer spent in the gym or just growing and he now looks a real prospect. I was impressed at how quick he was, seeing him at the Valley.
We should offer him first team terms and a sensible release fee £3-4m with a sell on. Feels the best for parties he can go for a sensible fee and we get something approaching a decent fee in return and he can play 30 odd games this season and develop.
Feels like this will be a Konsa situation. We sell him for not a lot and 3 years later he's worth 30-40m
That’s not a sensible release clause, not from our perspective anyway, he’s only gotta play half a season and he’ll be worth that these days.
And the sell on is only worth it if a championship club buy him. If another Liverpool come in for him he may never get sold on.
It’s a sensible release clause if you compare it the the £50k we’ll get in Jan if he goes to West Ham.
The SMT have cocked this up a low release clause means we might get something instead do nothing.
Being honest I saw Deji play several games last season for the U23 and he was no better than the other centre back Nazir Bakrin. neither of them particularly Outshone the other. it just looks like Deji has an agent who has convinced him to follow the dollar now. shame he has more chance of competitive action with us Than he does with West Ham and that is what he needs right now
So is Bakrin signed up?
Yeah was on the OS in the summer, one of several u18s getting their first pro deals at the end of their scholarship.
Deji is a year younger so his youth contract will run until next summer.
Ged Roddy's expertise in Football appeared to be as the architecture of the Development fees paid to clubs when young scholars are hovered up by the big Boys.
Did Ged's plan still favour the Category A Academies big time over the vulnerability of Cat B teams like Cafc, despite Roddy saying on CAST Q+A that his template increased the amount Cat B academics received.
Steve Avory and his coaches and now Ged Roddy have to highlight the talent and potential and get the likes of Deji Elerewe signed up for longer on their 17th birthday, as they have done with Anderson.
Some kids lose their way and don't progress, but cafc have to be discerning and make those decisions. It's imperative we become a CAT A and I would expect Ged Roddy and Thomas Sandgaard to have this as a major goal as well as Championship status.
Ged Roddy's expertise in Football appeared to be as the architecture of the Development fees paid to clubs when young scholars are hovered up by the big Boys.
Did Ged's plan still favour the Category A Academies big time over the vulnerability of Cat B teams like Cafc, despite Roddy saying on CAST Q+A that his template increased the amount Cat B academics received.
Steve Avory and his coaches and now Ged Roddy have to highlight the talent and potential and get the likes of Deji Elerewe signed up for longer on their 17th birthday, as they have done with Anderson.
Some kids lose their way and don't progress, but cafc have to be discerning and make those decisions. It's imperative we become a CAT A and I would expect Ged Roddy and Thomas Sandgaard to have this as a major goal as well as Championship status.
I might be living in cloud cuckoo land, but I’m still hoping Deji is going to treat the club who have given him a chance a bit of respect and sign a new contract.
Going forward I don’t think we should let any players near the first team as a point of principle unless they’ve signed a contract, otherwise it ends up as a monumental ballsup.
This sounds like the way forward but can't they get spotted playing for the youth team anyway?. Is this next potential robbery only due to his first team appearance?
Comments
When was it obvious to everyone Deji was a potential superstar? I don't remember him being "one to watch" for the Wigan game last season?
When Doughty was packed off to Bromley on loan was there the expectation that in a year's time he would be considered a "jewel in the crown"?
If you won't play them if they aren't pros, under contract, how long does the contract have to be 1 or 2 years doesn't really make much difference, it just kicks the can. 4 or 5 years? You end up with dozens of 19-21 year olds that aren't good enough.
It's not an exact science and the answer is always clear in hindsight.
What are Roddy and Sandgaard doing about that?
Am I right in thinking the criteria includes certain requirements on that front?
Do you know if they are already active, perhaps in anticipation of getting Sparrows in due course?
Palace have only recently reached Cat 1 themselves, and they have a similar track record to us when it comes to producing players, indeed possibly better
Interesting observations and for the majority of players that is correct. I saw Alfie Doughty play for U23 as a Left Midfielder and thought he was consistent but didn't think he would move up from Cafc so quickly.
Joe Gomez and Paul Walsh were outstanding at a young age and at 15 only injury was going to stop them. Saw both play at that age for Cafc at Sparrows lane and they stood out. Paul Walsh was small but had magic feet and Joe glided over the pitch and was playing with lads 2 and 3 years older when he first got into the U18'S.
I saw Deji Elerewe for the first time on Charlton TV last season, but to be honest the two CB were very similar, both were tall gangling Black lads from an African background. I thought both had potential in the two matches I saw them play. They appeared clones of each other in the style of their play. Raw but both could run with the ball. What was the name of the other lad and is he still playing in the U18'S ?
Being the one camera, it wasn't easy to see their positioning when the ball was down the other end.
Joe Gomez had the longest contract given for a young player in recent years at Cafc, even though we knew he was always going to be moving on so no gamble. Had a quiet demeanor off the pitch and his Dad was/is a good role model for Joe.
I have watched a few early qualifying rounds of the FA youth Cup this season, and seen some very promising lads. But I have noticed against weaker opposition certain players look mustard but when up against stronger teams the same lads don't turn up. Corinthians Casuals are strong this season and I hope to get to Welling United on Friday week if possible to see a more even contest after two easy wins.
I watch for Character as well as natural ability, emotional intelligence, Peripheral vision and the ability to scan the play.(Claus Jensen) A good first touch stops the second touch being a foul !
Nazir Bakrin. They do both have the same gangly build and posture. Maybe they could be the modern day Ben Mee and James Tarkowski! Or Carsley and Gravesen.
Ben Mee; Shape Mee; Anywayyouwant Mee
Cheers Mendonca,
Nazir Bakrin, I will remember that name.
We should offer him first team terms and a sensible release fee £3-4m with a sell on. Feels the best for parties he can go for a sensible fee and we get something approaching a decent fee in return and he can play 30 odd games this season and develop.
Feels like this will be a Konsa situation. We sell him for not a lot and 3 years later he's worth 30-40m
As we all know, we've had a very poor start to our season - and no doubt team morale has been low.
If you were a manager would you rely on a raw inexperienced youngster in the bedrock of your defence or bring in a warrior and leader?
No one doubts Deji has the greater potential compared with Pearce.
But potential is sometimes not enough. There are times when experience is needed. Maybe now.
And in anyway, they will be played when they are ready.
I mean, Deji has already made his League debut. But there are other factors to consider.
I believe shithead is asking for about 45 million for the valley and sparrows lane.
Sparrows lane will only be a small % of that.
Can't help thinking that, for whatever reason, Duchatelet wouldn't make it easy for him.
I hope that we squeeze the maximum amount of cash from whichever outfit he goes to and perhaps we can loan him back for a few months, as i m o we are still short of numbers (if not height) in central defence
it just looks like Deji has an agent who has convinced him to follow the dollar now.
shame
he has more chance of competitive action with us Than he does with West Ham and that is what he needs right now
The SMT have cocked this up a low release clause means we might get something instead do nothing.
Deji is a year younger so his youth contract will run until next summer.
Did Ged's plan still favour the Category A Academies big time over the vulnerability of Cat B teams like Cafc, despite Roddy saying on CAST Q+A that his template increased the amount Cat B academics received.
Steve Avory and his coaches and now Ged Roddy have to highlight the talent and potential and get the likes of Deji Elerewe signed up for longer on their 17th birthday, as they have done with Anderson.
Some kids lose their way and don't progress, but cafc have to be discerning and make those decisions. It's imperative we become a CAT A and I would expect Ged Roddy and Thomas Sandgaard to have this as a major goal as well as Championship status.