Jude Bellingham Dossier

Karim_myBagheri

Chunes said:

He played poorly at the last tournament but I also don't remember him being the focus of the criticism, or even in the top 5. The thing is, these days players can type their own name into the Twitter search bar and they'll 100% find the criticism they're looking for. I've got a feeling that's what KAG was doing and that's why he talks about not being rated here.

KAG was no where near good enough for several seasons with us but we kept with him, due to not having many other options, he then burst into life for a couple of months and immediately he gets his move to premier league Huddersfield. I don't begrudge him for doing that just found it bloody typical. Plus he missed that penalty in I think his last game for us. 

eaststandmike

Slartibartfast said:

bobmunro said:

eaststandmike said:

bobmunro said:

eaststandmike said:

fenlandaddick said:

Performing is all about confidence. Jude has huge talent. More than any other player I have seen in an England shirt.

What most disappoints is how close England have come to a trophy but not delivered.

It must be so frustrating to work that hard, and then not quite make it because the team could not help you reach those heights.

But those failures will help, his level can take England to a final. It just needs the right manager and environment.

I do wish he was playing over here, but conversely I think playing abroad will make him even better.

I can only assume you are young if he is most talented player you have seen in an England shirt 

I can think of a few that were better! For example, one spare spot in a starting line-up and you have to choose between Bellingham and Gascoigne - not that difficult a choice is it?

Me too Bob, and yes, Gascoigne was the first one to pop into my head.

Bobby Moore was another, skilled, unflappable, and solid in every game 

100% agree, Mike - Bobby Moore was the greatest player ever to wear the Three Lions.

What about Charlton? (Bobby, not us).

Good shout, not better than Moore but much better than Bellingham 

sirjohnhumphrey

Seems like a bit of a typical 'build them up then knock them down situation.' He's been told for years how good he is, and to be fair, a lot of what he has done for club and country has elevated him to a level above most other players in the world. At 21 he will make some huge mistakes on and off the pitch; fame and talent doesn't necessarily hide the person you are or have become. He will have strops and tantrums and feel sorry for himself at times whilst taking all the glories his talent brings. He is an international brand now and will have to do certain things that keep him in the public eye. If we want him to dominate games, have an edge, have a swagger on the pitch then he will display that off the pitch as well. Some comparisons to Gascoigne on this thread - let's not see another wasted life and talent because of the off pitch expectations of him. He seems to have a close family and hopefully that will keep him as grounded as he can.

ValleyGary

Don’t see how you can compare a 21 year old footballer now to someone playing 60 years ago. Just a completely different style of sport played by different types of athletes.

cafctom

ValleyGary said:

Don’t see how you can compare a 21 year old footballer now to someone playing 60 years ago. Just a completely different style of sport played by different types of athletes.

And a completely different lifestyle and society to operate in. 

I find it quite amazing how players in their teens/twenties at the top level get by whilst being taught to try and not react or take on board the social media opinions of millions (particularly the trolls), all whilst handling the outrageous amounts of money and adulation that come at the same time. The brain just isn’t built for it at that age. It’s inevitable they will show elements of ego or insecurity at times in that scenario.

guinnessaddick

Slartibartfast said:

Difficult to separate the two Bobby's, maybe Sir Alf got it right by making Moore captain.

One was named after us, the other a supporter.

JohnBoyUK

bobmunro said:

eaststandmike said:

fenlandaddick said:

Performing is all about confidence. Jude has huge talent. More than any other player I have seen in an England shirt.

What most disappoints is how close England have come to a trophy but not delivered.

It must be so frustrating to work that hard, and then not quite make it because the team could not help you reach those heights.

But those failures will help, his level can take England to a final. It just needs the right manager and environment.

I do wish he was playing over here, but conversely I think playing abroad will make him even better.

I can only assume you are young if he is most talented player you have seen in an England shirt 

I can think of a few that were better! For example, one spare spot in a starting line-up and you have to choose between Bellingham and Gascoigne - not that difficult a choice is it?

Bloody hell, peak Gazza was on another level.  I was only watch a reel of his 19 goals in the 90/91 season the other day.  Some of the goals he scored were outrageous.  He single-handedly dragged Spurs to the FA Cup final in that cup run.

Bellingham is nowhere near Gazza levels, yet.

North Lower Neil

JohnBoyUK said:

bobmunro said:

eaststandmike said:

fenlandaddick said:

Performing is all about confidence. Jude has huge talent. More than any other player I have seen in an England shirt.

What most disappoints is how close England have come to a trophy but not delivered.

It must be so frustrating to work that hard, and then not quite make it because the team could not help you reach those heights.

But those failures will help, his level can take England to a final. It just needs the right manager and environment.

I do wish he was playing over here, but conversely I think playing abroad will make him even better.

I can only assume you are young if he is most talented player you have seen in an England shirt 

I can think of a few that were better! For example, one spare spot in a starting line-up and you have to choose between Bellingham and Gascoigne - not that difficult a choice is it?

Bloody hell, peak Gazza was on another level.  I was only watch a reel of his 19 goals in the 90/91 season the other day.  Some of the goals he scored were outrageous.  He single-handedly dragged Spurs to the FA Cup final in that cup run.

Bellingham is nowhere near Gazza levels, yet.

Difficult one, was Gazza the 3rd best player in the world that year?  Because apparently Bellingham was this year.

JohnBoyUK

North Lower Neil said:

JohnBoyUK said:

bobmunro said:

eaststandmike said:

fenlandaddick said:

Performing is all about confidence. Jude has huge talent. More than any other player I have seen in an England shirt.

What most disappoints is how close England have come to a trophy but not delivered.

It must be so frustrating to work that hard, and then not quite make it because the team could not help you reach those heights.

But those failures will help, his level can take England to a final. It just needs the right manager and environment.

I do wish he was playing over here, but conversely I think playing abroad will make him even better.

I can only assume you are young if he is most talented player you have seen in an England shirt 

I can think of a few that were better! For example, one spare spot in a starting line-up and you have to choose between Bellingham and Gascoigne - not that difficult a choice is it?

Bloody hell, peak Gazza was on another level.  I was only watch a reel of his 19 goals in the 90/91 season the other day.  Some of the goals he scored were outrageous.  He single-handedly dragged Spurs to the FA Cup final in that cup run.

Bellingham is nowhere near Gazza levels, yet.

Difficult one, was Gazza the 3rd best player in the world that year?  Because apparently Bellingham was this year.

He was arguably the best player in the world at that point.  Spurs were skint and agreed a £8.5m fee with Lazio which would have been a world record fee at the time.  Bearing in mind that we pre-Premier League too, that was massive money.  Of course he then done in ACL in the Cup Final and then went to Lazio for a discounted £5.5m the season after.

North Lower Neil

JohnBoyUK said:

North Lower Neil said:

JohnBoyUK said:

bobmunro said:

eaststandmike said:

fenlandaddick said:

Performing is all about confidence. Jude has huge talent. More than any other player I have seen in an England shirt.

What most disappoints is how close England have come to a trophy but not delivered.

It must be so frustrating to work that hard, and then not quite make it because the team could not help you reach those heights.

But those failures will help, his level can take England to a final. It just needs the right manager and environment.

I do wish he was playing over here, but conversely I think playing abroad will make him even better.

I can only assume you are young if he is most talented player you have seen in an England shirt 

I can think of a few that were better! For example, one spare spot in a starting line-up and you have to choose between Bellingham and Gascoigne - not that difficult a choice is it?

Bloody hell, peak Gazza was on another level.  I was only watch a reel of his 19 goals in the 90/91 season the other day.  Some of the goals he scored were outrageous.  He single-handedly dragged Spurs to the FA Cup final in that cup run.

Bellingham is nowhere near Gazza levels, yet.

Difficult one, was Gazza the 3rd best player in the world that year?  Because apparently Bellingham was this year.

He was arguably the best player in the world at that point.  Spurs were skint and agreed a £8.5m fee with Lazio which would have been a world record fee at the time.  Bearing in mind that we pre-Premier League too, that was massive money.  Of course he then done in ACL in the Cup Final and then went to Lazio for a discounted £5.5m the season after.

Just looked and while the Ballon d'Or isn't always the best indicator I note Gazza came 4th in 1990, but Schillachi was 2nd for scoring 6 goals, and Brehme is probably bumped up in 3rd for scoring in the WC Final.  So maybe 2nd best behind Matthaus!

JohnBoyUK

Ah, forgot about Matthaus.  Blimey, now he was awesome.

ValleyGary

Gazza was given the freedom to let his natural raw talent blossom. He wasn't part of the new age of over tactical and strict instructions football. Even if he was, he'd tell em bollocks.

Bellingham has some serious natural talent on the ball, he's built like a tank already and he's got good athleticism. Would he be even better to watch if he was playing with the freedom allowed to Gazza?

We dont know, so i struggle to be sure when comparing.

JohnBoyUK

ValleyGary said:

Gazza was given the freedom to let his natural raw talent blossom. He wasn't part of the new age of over tactical and strict instructions football. Even if he was, he'd tell em bollocks.

Thats a fair point actually.  Venables gave Gazza a free role and licence to play anywhere he wanted, he had the likes of David Howells, Paul Stewart and Steve Sedgley mopping up behind him.  The only other bit of flair in the side was Nayim occasionally on the left.  No player gets to play like that any more.  I guess Grealish in his last season at Villa played like that but rarely do you see a player given that luxury these days.

cafctom

Bellingham is a player who stands out so much more in the flesh than on TV.

When he goes through the gears he is practically unstoppable. I’m still confident he will end up being England’s best ever player by the time it’s all said and done. 

Chris_from_Sidcup

As a kid i still remember seeing Gazza for the first time at Selhurst Park in 1989, because back then there was very limited football on tv. He was brilliant, he scored (as did Lineker) and at the end of that season the rest of the world saw him at Italia 90.

bobmunro

cafctom said:

Bellingham is a player who stands out so much more in the flesh than on TV.

When he goes through the gears he is practically unstoppable. I’m still confident he will end up being England’s best ever player by the time it’s all said and done. 

I would agree with this and hopefully Tuchel will have the sense to give him the freedom to play his own game. I've seen him many times with England but I was at Anfield last night so saw him for the first time bossing everything in a Madrid shirt. He didn't have the best of games and in reality Liverpool should have won by many more goals - but most of the players around him didn't play well, especially Mbappe who just kept running in to brick walls. But his movement, creating space for himself, using his immense physicality to invite contact and then laying it off with a perfect pass just before being clattered. When the subs were being made it was Jude who went across to Ancelotti to discuss a change in formation/tactics - almost telling his manager what should happen. Modric may have been wearing the arm band but Jude was the leader.

He is also a beast when it comes to geeing up his team mates, and certainly the Madrid players were all looking at Jude for encouragement and reassurance. He's an England captain in the making and I sincerely hope you are correct in your last comment, with Jude lifting a couple of World Cups and a Euros in between. I'll then gratefully accept the claim that he is England's best ever.

fenaddick

It’s clear he naturally has a great football brain and seems to be a sponge of knowledge. He’s only 21 too so has potential to get a lot better if he stays injury free.