Customer Service - A thing of the past
Comments
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Have you ever been wrong in your life Fiiish? It was a crap, crass joke. Man up, admit it, apologise and move on.Fiiish said:
Except it isn't actually making fun of anyone, just the wording of the post. I don't know anyone on here who is offended by wordplay. You need to understand that not all jokes actually need to have a victim. I could have just bolded the same sections and just posted ??? and the effect would have been the same.Carter said:
I'm calm, and I worded my post so as not to sound melodramatic. I'm not creating a fuss but you have to understand it was at best naive and at worst very insensitive. You post on here loads more than I do and I'm aware there are several posters who would be upset at that sort of wordplay so I'm sure you would be too.Fiiish said:Carter/Dazzler - calm down, it was a joke at the expense of the wording of the post. My first flag was from someone who objected to my defence of disabled people so I actually do understand this.
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I don't know what he would have been scamming apart from my time. I did receive a text from Carphone Warehouse beforehand saying that they would call (my current mobile deal is coming to an end).LenGlover said:
How do you know for sure it was a genuine call and not an attempted scam?Plumstead_Micky said:I hate calls from companies who then proceed to ask you your details for security.
No, you called ME!
I had this with Carphone Warehouse last week, from a sales rep who spoke faster than a horse racing commentator.
What I do regret is not making up a name, which presumably would have made the caller terminate his annoying and time consuming call!0 -
TBH Len my own experience with HMRC on a professional basis has not been good so I have some sympathy with that view. But you lumped everyone in the public sector in together which is no more sensible than saying that everyone in the private sector is good at customer service.LenGlover said:
I don't doubt that there are good people such as you within the Public Sector but they are rarer than hens' teeth within HMRC, an organisation I have had the misfortune to need to deal with often, and that is why I made the comment I did.Bournemouth Addick said:
Unsurprisingly I disagree Len and it's interesting that all of that the list of miscreants so far are from the bigger companies not the public sector (although I am sure there remain plenty of examples too, that's not what I'm saying).LenGlover said:
It's not you. The ethos of increasing numbers of businesses these days is to extract as much money has possible for as little service as possible from customers they contemptuously regard as 'mug punters.'MuttleyCAFC said:As a grumpy old git I often rue the changes in society. One big hate of the world today is how everybody wants your money but also want to do as little as possible for it. Just come back from holiday and park and ride company damaged my car, mother (who is in a wheelchair) phoned today to say carers she relies on and pays for hadn't arrived, after cancelling CAFC player, rejoined so that I could listen to games on my holiday - waste of time as was yesterday - service terrible- several minutes behind and kept stopping!!! Is it me or is everything now completely sh*t?
I think all the Bertie Bigbollocks management consultant types who encourage this practice refer to the resulting dissatisfaction as 'customer churn' and regard it as an acceptable cost / risk.
The Chairman does it his way and you have to understand that or similar.
The only way to fight back in my experience is publicise (without being libellous or slanderous) these examples of extortion for no service and shame organisations into actually carrying out the service they have taken your money for.
I find the so called accountable Public Sector is worse than the Private Sector in general myself and loves to avoid responsibility with bureaucratic wild goose chases which lead you back to where you started!
'Complaints Policies' are an obfuscation tactic masquerading as customer service. Ignore them and go to the top.
The public sector is often labelled unaccountable. I've thought about this in the past and who I am accountable to. It's a pretty long list including:
The residents themselves or member of the public or the business primarly concerned with the issue of course
Their family, solicitor or other representative
Local community and pressure groups
My line manager
My head of service
My service director
The Chief Executive
The authorities internal complaints monitoring officer
Those officers dealing with FOI/DPA requests received
The Ombudsman
Councillors
Local MP's
The local MEP
My professional institute
Colleagues within the same authority
Colleagues outside the authority who could be based anywhere in the UK
Numerous central government agencies
At least one european government agency
The police
Social media
The local media
The national media...
...I doubt someone working in the private sector would have a similarly lengthy list tbh and if I broke it down further I could be here all night. But the point is any of the above can, do and have asked for further clarification, explanation or justification as to why I took (or didn't take) a certain decision or course of action in response to the issue being dealt with. I've seen this in action every working day for getting on for nearly 30 years now and IMO customer service has improved massively within local government during that time. I'm sure it's not perfect by any stretch and no doubt some officers and some services still have a long way to go but when I think about the levels of customer service me and my colleagues provide in what are increasingly difficult and often confrontational circumstances and under that much scrutiny I think we do a pretty bloody good job tbf.
I too could be here all day giving examples.
My major point was really around the perceived lack of accountability which I've seen raised on this and other forums on many occasions. Given the amount of people potentially questioning a course of action or decision in the public sector sometimes it's surprising that anything ever gets done!
Anyway I've squared you up on that and you won't be making the same mistake again so we're all good now eh fella ;-)1 -
Don't get uppity with me young man just because you're winning in the predictions at the momentBournemouth Addick said:
TBH Len my own experience with HMRC on a professional basis has not been good so I have some sympathy with that view. But you lumped everyone in the public sector in together which is no more sensible than saying that everyone in the private sector is good at customer service.LenGlover said:
I don't doubt that there are good people such as you within the Public Sector but they are rarer than hens' teeth within HMRC, an organisation I have had the misfortune to need to deal with often, and that is why I made the comment I did.Bournemouth Addick said:
Unsurprisingly I disagree Len and it's interesting that all of that the list of miscreants so far are from the bigger companies not the public sector (although I am sure there remain plenty of examples too, that's not what I'm saying).LenGlover said:
It's not you. The ethos of increasing numbers of businesses these days is to extract as much money has possible for as little service as possible from customers they contemptuously regard as 'mug punters.'MuttleyCAFC said:As a grumpy old git I often rue the changes in society. One big hate of the world today is how everybody wants your money but also want to do as little as possible for it. Just come back from holiday and park and ride company damaged my car, mother (who is in a wheelchair) phoned today to say carers she relies on and pays for hadn't arrived, after cancelling CAFC player, rejoined so that I could listen to games on my holiday - waste of time as was yesterday - service terrible- several minutes behind and kept stopping!!! Is it me or is everything now completely sh*t?
I think all the Bertie Bigbollocks management consultant types who encourage this practice refer to the resulting dissatisfaction as 'customer churn' and regard it as an acceptable cost / risk.
The Chairman does it his way and you have to understand that or similar.
The only way to fight back in my experience is publicise (without being libellous or slanderous) these examples of extortion for no service and shame organisations into actually carrying out the service they have taken your money for.
I find the so called accountable Public Sector is worse than the Private Sector in general myself and loves to avoid responsibility with bureaucratic wild goose chases which lead you back to where you started!
'Complaints Policies' are an obfuscation tactic masquerading as customer service. Ignore them and go to the top.
The public sector is often labelled unaccountable. I've thought about this in the past and who I am accountable to. It's a pretty long list including:
The residents themselves or member of the public or the business primarly concerned with the issue of course
Their family, solicitor or other representative
Local community and pressure groups
My line manager
My head of service
My service director
The Chief Executive
The authorities internal complaints monitoring officer
Those officers dealing with FOI/DPA requests received
The Ombudsman
Councillors
Local MP's
The local MEP
My professional institute
Colleagues within the same authority
Colleagues outside the authority who could be based anywhere in the UK
Numerous central government agencies
At least one european government agency
The police
Social media
The local media
The national media...
...I doubt someone working in the private sector would have a similarly lengthy list tbh and if I broke it down further I could be here all night. But the point is any of the above can, do and have asked for further clarification, explanation or justification as to why I took (or didn't take) a certain decision or course of action in response to the issue being dealt with. I've seen this in action every working day for getting on for nearly 30 years now and IMO customer service has improved massively within local government during that time. I'm sure it's not perfect by any stretch and no doubt some officers and some services still have a long way to go but when I think about the levels of customer service me and my colleagues provide in what are increasingly difficult and often confrontational circumstances and under that much scrutiny I think we do a pretty bloody good job tbf.
I too could be here all day giving examples.
My major point was really around the perceived lack of accountability which I've seen raised on this and other forums on many occasions. Given the amount of people potentially questioning a course of action or decision in the public sector sometimes it's surprising that anything ever gets done!
Anyway I've squared you up on that and you won't be making the same mistake again so we're all good now eh fella ;-)
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If anyone else also wants to try this route, I found www.ceoemail.com which gives direct email addresses for CEO's. Have emailed Vodafone and fingers crossed it works!Addickforlife said:Granpa said:Unfortunately the situation has worsened due to the move towards large stores in shopping malls, and the gradual disappearance of the local often family run businesses. I work for Copier King in Tonbridge who supply printers and copiers to companies. For us the customer is King, and everyone gets a great deal, I do however agree that John Lewis are an outstanding, well run company. If I ever have a serious problem with a big company, I head straight for the top asking for the MD's PA. She or he never lets me down, and always produces results.
This is what I want to do regarding my Vodafone issue that has now dragged on for over a year but have no idea how to get an email address of someone so senior. Any advice?0 -
Ok it's me in the wrong.Fiiish said:
Except it isn't actually making fun of anyone, just the wording of the post. I don't know anyone on here who is offended by wordplay. You need to understand that not all jokes actually need to have a victim. I could have just bolded the same sections and just posted ??? and the effect would have been the same.Carter said:
I'm calm, and I worded my post so as not to sound melodramatic. I'm not creating a fuss but you have to understand it was at best naive and at worst very insensitive. You post on here loads more than I do and I'm aware there are several posters who would be upset at that sort of wordplay so I'm sure you would be too.Fiiish said:Carter/Dazzler - calm down, it was a joke at the expense of the wording of the post. My first flag was from someone who objected to my defence of disabled people so I actually do understand this.
I've always thought you were a pleasant enough belligerent wind up merchant. I'll add stupid to that assumption.
Nothing personal but if you can't see how what you did was wrong then I'm not going to explain why it was not funny
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I have used then a few times, and have had nothing but good service, even when a machine went wrong, no trouble swapping it for a different machine. Good customer relationskimbo said:I must give credit to Appliance Online. I ordered a washing machine cancelled the next day (miraculous recovery) spoke to someone on a Sunday and everything was sorted. Very impressed.
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Maybe we should do more to spread the word about the good and the bad. The good companies deserve our support and custom.1
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Apologise to who? All the people who weren't offended? Beyond parody for you of all people to tell others to 'man up'.Bournemouth Addick said:
Have you ever been wrong in your life Fiiish? It was a crap, crass joke. Man up, admit it, apologise and move on.Fiiish said:
Except it isn't actually making fun of anyone, just the wording of the post. I don't know anyone on here who is offended by wordplay. You need to understand that not all jokes actually need to have a victim. I could have just bolded the same sections and just posted ??? and the effect would have been the same.Carter said:
I'm calm, and I worded my post so as not to sound melodramatic. I'm not creating a fuss but you have to understand it was at best naive and at worst very insensitive. You post on here loads more than I do and I'm aware there are several posters who would be upset at that sort of wordplay so I'm sure you would be too.Fiiish said:Carter/Dazzler - calm down, it was a joke at the expense of the wording of the post. My first flag was from someone who objected to my defence of disabled people so I actually do understand this.
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Don't apologise then, keep telling yourself you have done nothing wrong and flag away. At least 3 of us from the top of my head found what you did pretty classless at best. Insensitive and unfunny would be more accurate but we'll go with classless and ignorantFiiish said:
Apologise to who? All the people who weren't offended? Beyond parody for you of all people to tell others to 'man up'.Bournemouth Addick said:
Have you ever been wrong in your life Fiiish? It was a crap, crass joke. Man up, admit it, apologise and move on.Fiiish said:
Except it isn't actually making fun of anyone, just the wording of the post. I don't know anyone on here who is offended by wordplay. You need to understand that not all jokes actually need to have a victim. I could have just bolded the same sections and just posted ??? and the effect would have been the same.Carter said:
I'm calm, and I worded my post so as not to sound melodramatic. I'm not creating a fuss but you have to understand it was at best naive and at worst very insensitive. You post on here loads more than I do and I'm aware there are several posters who would be upset at that sort of wordplay so I'm sure you would be too.Fiiish said:Carter/Dazzler - calm down, it was a joke at the expense of the wording of the post. My first flag was from someone who objected to my defence of disabled people so I actually do understand this.
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don't mind your stuff normally but you're acting like a kid now ... it was a crass remark and you know itFiiish said:
Apologise to who? All the people who weren't offended? Beyond parody for you of all people to tell others to 'man up'.Bournemouth Addick said:
Have you ever been wrong in your life Fiiish? It was a crap, crass joke. Man up, admit it, apologise and move on.Fiiish said:
Except it isn't actually making fun of anyone, just the wording of the post. I don't know anyone on here who is offended by wordplay. You need to understand that not all jokes actually need to have a victim. I could have just bolded the same sections and just posted ??? and the effect would have been the same.Carter said:
I'm calm, and I worded my post so as not to sound melodramatic. I'm not creating a fuss but you have to understand it was at best naive and at worst very insensitive. You post on here loads more than I do and I'm aware there are several posters who would be upset at that sort of wordplay so I'm sure you would be too.Fiiish said:Carter/Dazzler - calm down, it was a joke at the expense of the wording of the post. My first flag was from someone who objected to my defence of disabled people so I actually do understand this.
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How will I sleep at night knowing I've upset three humourless and clueless people on the Internet. Think most people would agree your fake outrage at an issue you clearly don't even understand is more classless than a pretty inoffensive comment. Wind your neck in sunshine.Carter said:
Don't apologise then, keep telling yourself you have done nothing wrong and flag away. At least 3 of us from the top of my head found what you did pretty classless at best. Insensitive and unfunny would be more accurate but we'll go with classless and ignorantFiiish said:
Apologise to who? All the people who weren't offended? Beyond parody for you of all people to tell others to 'man up'.Bournemouth Addick said:
Have you ever been wrong in your life Fiiish? It was a crap, crass joke. Man up, admit it, apologise and move on.Fiiish said:
Except it isn't actually making fun of anyone, just the wording of the post. I don't know anyone on here who is offended by wordplay. You need to understand that not all jokes actually need to have a victim. I could have just bolded the same sections and just posted ??? and the effect would have been the same.Carter said:
I'm calm, and I worded my post so as not to sound melodramatic. I'm not creating a fuss but you have to understand it was at best naive and at worst very insensitive. You post on here loads more than I do and I'm aware there are several posters who would be upset at that sort of wordplay so I'm sure you would be too.Fiiish said:Carter/Dazzler - calm down, it was a joke at the expense of the wording of the post. My first flag was from someone who objected to my defence of disabled people so I actually do understand this.
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My fault, I attempted sensible dialogue with a moron and got the response and ignorance I should have expected. @Stu_of_Kunming was right.
You are a fucking idiot5 -
Okay, just be sure to let us know when we get near the minimum limit on the amount of people required to find your "joke" distasteful before you'll consider admitting you maybe, possibly, all things considered, on second thoughts, in hindsight, called that one wrong though.Fiiish said:
Apologise to who? All the people who weren't offended? Beyond parody for you of all people to tell others to 'man up'.Bournemouth Addick said:
Have you ever been wrong in your life Fiiish? It was a crap, crass joke. Man up, admit it, apologise and move on.Fiiish said:
Except it isn't actually making fun of anyone, just the wording of the post. I don't know anyone on here who is offended by wordplay. You need to understand that not all jokes actually need to have a victim. I could have just bolded the same sections and just posted ??? and the effect would have been the same.Carter said:
I'm calm, and I worded my post so as not to sound melodramatic. I'm not creating a fuss but you have to understand it was at best naive and at worst very insensitive. You post on here loads more than I do and I'm aware there are several posters who would be upset at that sort of wordplay so I'm sure you would be too.Fiiish said:Carter/Dazzler - calm down, it was a joke at the expense of the wording of the post. My first flag was from someone who objected to my defence of disabled people so I actually do understand this.
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MuttleyCAFC said:
As a grumpy old git I often rue the changes in society. One big hate of the world today is how everybody wants your money but also want to do as little as possible for it. Just come back from holiday and park and ride company damaged my car, mother (who is in a wheelchair) phoned today to say carers she relies on and pays for hadn't arrived, after cancelling CAFC player, rejoined so that I could listen to games on my holiday - waste of time as was yesterday - service terrible- several minutes behind and kept stopping!!! Is it me or is everything now completely sh*t?
We are doomed!!
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I rarely complain unless I think I've been screwed by the system, so have complained quite a lot, and sorry BA, it's nine times out of ten a government body - local council, TFL, FOI office, HMRC, DVLA. But it's not personal, and I do make a point of saying sincere thank you to any of these people if I do have a good experience because I couldn't take the crap they must face every day.
Heard on the LBC phone-in in this week a guy went to dump his bed at a tip in Dartford. It was a divan and in several pieces on the roof rack and he asked the operator to lift the bar so he could drive in. Site operative said no can't do that. Guy said what am i supposed to do then. Operative said you will have to take it off and tie the pieces on the bonnet and along the side. The guy had to drive home and do there separate journeys.
In Sainsbury the other week my wife had 1 item over the limit for the basket only queue. It was completely empty and the cashier said no my wife would have to use the normal cashiers and queue up unless she took one of the items back.
I have on several occasions contacted a company complementing them if I've been impressed and surprised by excellent service when I could reasonably have been fobbed off. I recall doing it with Enterprise car rental when I accidentally pissed them about and they couldn't have been more accommodating and Lakeland when we'd just lost part of a kitchen gadget that they just replaced by opening up a new machine and taking out the bit we needed no questions asked (pity the next customer who bought that particular machine!).
I couldn't bring myself to complete a customer feedback survey recently, I would either have lied or got the lad the sack. I just will not ever use them again.
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Yes, when I see good service I always make a point of praising it.1
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30kg luggage allowance though!The_President said:British Airways have been absolutely brilliant to me through the years - whereas , Emirates - pah, dont touch them with a barge-pole- absolute pile of dog-shit.
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Pretty sure the joke was aimed at the wording of the post, rather than disabled people.Carter said:
Nah, not wow. I'm all up for a joke but the comment about lifts and miracles was a bit unnecessary and insensitive.Fiiish said:
Wow.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Whilst Fiiiish can be a bit of a piss taker, I guarantee he wouldn't have a deliberate dig at people that are unable/have difficulty walking.
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Addickforlife Member
September 3
Granpa said:
Unfortunately the situation has worsened due to the move towards large stores in shopping malls, and the gradual disappearance of the local often family run businesses. I work for Copier King in Tonbridge who supply printers and copiers to companies. For us the customer is King, and everyone gets a great deal, I do however agree that John Lewis are an outstanding, well run company. If I ever have a serious problem with a big company, I head straight for the top asking for the MD's PA. She or he never lets me down, and always produces results.
This is what I want to do regarding my Vodafone issue that has now dragged on for over a year but have no idea how to get an email address of someone so senior. Any advice?
Addickforlife, as it happens I lost patience with Vodafone (Telefonica ) last year and decided to close my account. As a result I discovered that the whole company is riddled with people who are determined not to assist you. I would go as far as to say that their staff practice obstruction through the ranks, they even stole from me a mobile number which I had previously purchased for life, and they were using on a voicemail message.
Their MD is Ronan Dunn who passed me to Danny Lomas, from my experience I would imagine that they give a prize every year to the person who pisses off the most customers. I finally managed to close my account, and words can never describe just how much I hate that company. Never again !1 - Sponsored links:
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One of the problems is staff aren’t given the autonomy/authority to resolve problems and in that situation, they often seek to get out of the situation – rather than see it as an opportunity to put things right and regain customer satisfaction. The other issue is what I call the Virgin/Sky issue. Both are terrible when it comes to customer services so the customer has less choice to take their custom away.0
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There are too many companies out there that have to use scripts when dealing with customers.1
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HomeProtect increased my home insurance despite no claims etc.
when I tried a comparison website, as well as finding a lot of other cheaper companies for the same level of cover, there was also a quote from HP for £150 cheaper than my renewal terms.
rang them up and explained the situation and instead of at least offering reduced terms, the bloke on the other end of the phone put me on hold at least three times (clearly to speak to his supervisor) before telling me that if I did cancel the policy, they would charge me an admin fee.
didn't get arsey with him, just told him to cancel the policy there and then and that if they did write to me for an admin fee, I'd visit his home address personally and wreak havoc on his mum, dad, grandparents and any uncles or aunts who might be in the general vicinity.
to me that is poor customer service and makes me wonder how they retain repeat business.
Martin Lewis website says never just auto renew direct debit premiums as most companies don't effectively have to do anything, just ramp the price up.0 -
Pre-ordered a phone with 3 which came out today.
I turned up and they told me they didn't have it. Didn't even call me.0 -
I expect they are on a PAYG tariff and didn't want to spend money on the call.cafcnick1992 said:Pre-ordered a phone with 3 which came out today.
I turned up and they told me they didn't have it. Didn't even call me.0 -
Does it work for Charlton Athletic ?Addickforlife said:
If anyone else also wants to try this route, I found www.ceoemail.com which gives direct email addresses for CEO's. Have emailed Vodafone and fingers crossed it works!Addickforlife said:Granpa said:Unfortunately the situation has worsened due to the move towards large stores in shopping malls, and the gradual disappearance of the local often family run businesses. I work for Copier King in Tonbridge who supply printers and copiers to companies. For us the customer is King, and everyone gets a great deal, I do however agree that John Lewis are an outstanding, well run company. If I ever have a serious problem with a big company, I head straight for the top asking for the MD's PA. She or he never lets me down, and always produces results.
This is what I want to do regarding my Vodafone issue that has now dragged on for over a year but have no idea how to get an email address of someone so senior. Any advice?
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Katrien@dontyoubelieveit.co.ukFanny Fanackapan said:
Does it work for Charlton Athletic ?Addickforlife said:
If anyone else also wants to try this route, I found www.ceoemail.com which gives direct email addresses for CEO's. Have emailed Vodafone and fingers crossed it works!Addickforlife said:Granpa said:Unfortunately the situation has worsened due to the move towards large stores in shopping malls, and the gradual disappearance of the local often family run businesses. I work for Copier King in Tonbridge who supply printers and copiers to companies. For us the customer is King, and everyone gets a great deal, I do however agree that John Lewis are an outstanding, well run company. If I ever have a serious problem with a big company, I head straight for the top asking for the MD's PA. She or he never lets me down, and always produces results.
This is what I want to do regarding my Vodafone issue that has now dragged on for over a year but have no idea how to get an email address of someone so senior. Any advice?
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On the good customer service thing.
I subscribe to Which? magazine, which gives me online access to Which? Local.
Basically it is a review site for mainly, but not exclusively, tradespeople. The thing about Which is it doesn't carry adverts, and those reviewed are not members of particular trade associations (but might be), but reviewed by ordinary people.
I used Sounds Alarming in Welling because they were well reviewed there, I have found a great plumber, and all manner of other people there, and I have reviewed my experiences.
I can honestly say that anybody I have used from there has been excellent. You have to learn to read the reviews with care, date, number of reviews, number of other services reviewed by the reviewer in order to be sure they're completely credible. using that site has moved me from constant victim of cowboys to a satisfied customer.
I never thought I would say this, but I have always received good service from Bristol street in Bromley, yeah I know, cars!
I do 100% agree with rikofold that First Direct bank are the absolute best institution I have ever had dealings with. Their whole thing is about customer service (if they lose that they are sunk), and they deliver it fully time and time again. One of the best decisions I have ever made was leaving NatWest for First Direct, I know they are under the auspices of HSBC, but as a bank for the ordinary Joe jogging along they are incomparable.2 -
Seth, I've never met a first direct customer who didn't say the same thing1
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Been with First Direct since '94, never had a problem with them.rikofold said:Seth, I've never met a first direct customer who didn't say the same thing
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