Savings and Investments thread

2×£25 from Ernie today. 

Chaz Hill said:

2×£25 from Ernie today. 

Same here.

Covered End said:

Banks not pay any dividends until further notice.

Bastards.

That's £38 I'll never get back.

Sooooo.....has anybody panic-bought or sold in this period?

I've kept hold of all my funds, but have just written off my potential purchase of a new yacht and flat overlooking the Valley. 

Apologies if this has been covered before, but if you wanted to open a bank account and deposit a sum that would be covered by the Government's 80k guarantee, which would you choose at the moment, other than HSBC? I was going to try Santander, but my wife raised doubts. 

mendonca said:

Sooooo.....has anybody panic-bought or sold in this period?

I've kept hold of all my funds, but have just written off my potential purchase of a new yacht and flat overlooking the Valley. 

I asked my FA if it might be cashing up all the investments and sticking the funds in the bank back in Feb, but he said to play the long game. Possibly regretting listening now.

The problem I am finding is that nobody knows how long the long game is.

Covered End said:

JamesSeed said:

Apologies if this has been covered before, but if you wanted to open a bank account and deposit a sum that would be covered by the Government's 80k guarantee, which would you choose at the moment, other than HSBC? I was going to try Santander, but my wife raised doubts. 

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/savings/

Thanks CE. Followed that advice, and sorted now. 

I had an update from JPM this afternoon. I usually go to their quarterly "Guide to the markets" which is very informative & come away with a great pack of stats & figures. Due to lockdown they just emailed it. Good reading but hard to follow when you don't have a speaker to go through it all.

Even though they have updated it to 30th March it's hard to take seriously some of the figures as we all know that things are going to get worse before they get better.

It's a shame I can't post some of the charts they include in the pack, but picking out just 2 it shows the purchasing managers index showing less than 50 for virtually all countries (above 50 & it implies companies think things are on the up, below 50 & a recession is looming) and how GDP this year around the world is expected to be minus 2%-3%.

The other thing is how short timewise the falls (or bear markets) are compared to the rises (bull markets). And that usually a bull market will outperform a bear market in terms of %'s gained & lost.

So......hang on in there & I'm sure the markets will right themselves & the pain will be short lived. 

PragueAddick said:

It's a couple of weeks since markets hit low points, and they are now about 8-10% above, despite a lacklustre day today. Movements in the last week have also been far less violent. So inevitably we can ask, did markets find a floor? 

I'm not counting on it myself. I'm in the camp that says they've gone too low to sell, and not low enough to buy. But since I'm a potential buyer, because I hold cash (more by accident than design), I've got a list of funds I would buy, and set target buy prices for them, which are generally 5% below their lowest this year (and then 10%). I managed to make a profit already from funds I bought near the bottom, most notably on Axa Framlington Biotech, which is up 13% since I bought on 17 March, but I am not talking big numbers here. I like to talk the talk, but my single biggest holding is still Premium Bonds :-)

Don't forget I'm holding all your index predictors for 31 July :-) Right now most of them (including mine) look optimistic, but let's see.

Mine was 5300 (page 55). Still think that might be in the right area after the final huge collapse that must be due soon and a minor rebound over the coming months. 

RaplhMilne said:

Addickted said:

Covered End said:

Banks not pay any dividends until further notice.

Bastards.

That's £38 I'll never get back.

So in our Capitalist Democracy, the Government once again tells Privately owned businesses what to do.  I have lost around £2000 of retirement income from the no dividend policy. An equally Lloyds shares fell another 4p taking another £3500 off my share value, so well over £60,000 down.  We will now have to lend money that will never be repaid in some cases and give holidays on mortgage, credit card and loan repayments. Oh and don’t forget the £500 interest free overdrafts. How come M&S don’t have to give out free pants, or Wetherspoon free Beer.  Holding shares in a UK bank is the worst thing I have ever done, we are just here to hold up this country , at any time of crisis. 

Yes, I appreciate these are trying times. But, I paid for the HBOS crisis, I paid to prop up the economy through PPI, and now this...... Lloyds Bank appears to be the Government's rainy day piggy bank, have a dip in for any crisis.  

Sorry Raphie, I know you used to work for them but that's no reason why you should continue to hold on them. I'm sure you don't need me to tell you that holding individual shares is a very risky strategy. If I were you I'd bite the bullet & sell them, putting the money into a more balanced portfolio. 

Covered End said:

golfaddick said:

RaplhMilne said:

Addickted said:

Covered End said:

Banks not pay any dividends until further notice.

Bastards.

That's £38 I'll never get back.

So in our Capitalist Democracy, the Government once again tells Privately owned businesses what to do.  I have lost around £2000 of retirement income from the no dividend policy. An equally Lloyds shares fell another 4p taking another £3500 off my share value, so well over £60,000 down.  We will now have to lend money that will never be repaid in some cases and give holidays on mortgage, credit card and loan repayments. Oh and don’t forget the £500 interest free overdrafts. How come M&S don’t have to give out free pants, or Wetherspoon free Beer.  Holding shares in a UK bank is the worst thing I have ever done, we are just here to hold up this country , at any time of crisis. 

Yes, I appreciate these are trying times. But, I paid for the HBOS crisis, I paid to prop up the economy through PPI, and now this...... Lloyds Bank appears to be the Government's rainy day piggy bank, have a dip in for any crisis.  

Sorry Raphie, I know you used to work for them but that's no reason why you should continue to hold on them. I'm sure you don't need me to tell you that holding individual shares is a very risky strategy. If I were you I'd bite the bullet & sell them, putting the money into a more balanced portfolio. 

I've got a load of Lloyds shares and yes maybe I'll consider selling some if they double back to the 60p range, but I'll not be selling at an all time low.

They might be at an all time low today........but come Monday that all time low could be even lower. 

Xtrackers FTSE 100 Short Daily Swap UCITS ETF

Any thoughts on this fund? *I'm not about to press enter on a hopeful trade deal, just curious*

RaplhMilne said:

Addickted said:

Covered End said:

Banks not pay any dividends until further notice.

Bastards.

That's £38 I'll never get back.

So in our Capitalist Democracy, the Government once again tells Privately owned businesses what to do.  I have lost around £2000 of retirement income from the no dividend policy. An equally Lloyds shares fell another 4p taking another £3500 off my share value, so well over £60,000 down.  We will now have to lend money that will never be repaid in some cases and give holidays on mortgage, credit card and loan repayments. Oh and don’t forget the £500 interest free overdrafts. How come M&S don’t have to give out free pants, or Wetherspoon free Beer.  Holding shares in a UK bank is the worst thing I have ever done, we are just here to hold up this country , at any time of crisis. 

Yes, I appreciate these are trying times. But, I paid for the HBOS crisis, I paid to prop up the economy through PPI, and now this...... Lloyds Bank appears to be the Government's rainy day piggy bank, have a dip in for any crisis.  

Some would say banks have been doing that for years, although probably not in the way you meant.

Have you actually looked at your investment and how it's performed over time? I assume you either were gifted some shares or purchased through SAYE etc, what did you actually pay for them v's their value, and what dividends have you received over that time.

You just keep comparing it to the recent high's, hardly a fair example.

RaplhMilne said:

Athletico Charlton said:

RaplhMilne said:

Addickted said:

Covered End said:

Banks not pay any dividends until further notice.

Bastards.

That's £38 I'll never get back.

So in our Capitalist Democracy, the Government once again tells Privately owned businesses what to do.  I have lost around £2000 of retirement income from the no dividend policy. An equally Lloyds shares fell another 4p taking another £3500 off my share value, so well over £60,000 down.  We will now have to lend money that will never be repaid in some cases and give holidays on mortgage, credit card and loan repayments. Oh and don’t forget the £500 interest free overdrafts. How come M&S don’t have to give out free pants, or Wetherspoon free Beer.  Holding shares in a UK bank is the worst thing I have ever done, we are just here to hold up this country , at any time of crisis. 

Yes, I appreciate these are trying times. But, I paid for the HBOS crisis, I paid to prop up the economy through PPI, and now this...... Lloyds Bank appears to be the Government's rainy day piggy bank, have a dip in for any crisis.  

That is an exceptionally one eyed view.  At a time when plenty of individuals and companies will be burning through cash resources and drawing on undrawn debt limits, liquidity ratios at banks will come under strain and I would have thought suspending dividends would be an eminently sensible thing to do to shore up balance sheets and allow large banks to maintain their Core Tier One Capital levels.  Dividend suspension sounds like short term pain to shareholders for long term sustainability to me.  If you hold shares you have to expect there is a chance of losing money, if you hold shares in just one company you should be aware this proves a serious risk.

Can I just sat once again, iv been investing for over 40 years, whilst not an expert, I am not a fool either.  I have a very diverse portfolio. Roughly 50% in cash deposits,  20% in Funds including Global, USA , Europe, Asia, and emerging markets, and bonds . I then hold around 30% in Uk quoted shares largely FTSE 100. Unfortunately as a former Lloyds employee, I allowed sentiment that the good days would return, let me remain overweight on Lloyds.  I hold around 72,000 which a short while 
back was worth a little over £50,000 now it’s more like £20,000. You really need to know the history of Lloyds to understand why I like many others, have always thought, the good days are around the corner.  Jesus, we finally get rid of years of bloody PPI, then Covid 19 rocks up.

Obviously now a host of other FTSE 100 firms are suspending dividends, and my position will be even worse. I would normally expect divi income of around £5-£6000.

 I kept my final salary pension, I was not prepared to go along the SIPP route and take a risk of seeing my pension wiped out by a market Crash or crashes over my retirement years.  I am very glad I did, I have a secure RPI indexed pension rolling in every month, until the day I die. 

So I totally appreciate how well off I m compared to many others. I was going to say “lucky” I am. However, it wasn’t luck, it was financial prudence, sound investment, and not living outside my means, that has put me where I am today.  I’ve taken a hit, and it could get A lot worse, but I am healthy.  I am very grateful for that, and despite my personal losses, will make A decent donation to NHS charities at the end of this to support those, who have given their lives to save the people of this country. 

I understand Lloyd's history, hoodwinked by the Government to take on the sinking ship of HBoS when, until that point they had been a stable, boring UK bank.  But on the flipside now having the biggest exposure by far to the UK mortgage market which was always going to slam them in the next recession anyway in my opinion.

I think instead of looking at the downside you should realise you are lucky.   If you had started off in your profession any time in the last 10 years there would be no final salary pension so as prudent as you may be you would never be likely to achieve the same financial security.  Plus working in many parts of the financial services today precludes you from buying a very large majority of stock options, certainly any individual stock meaning you would have massively less chance of being prudent / accumulating wealth.  But frankly even with those changes financial services employees are, in many cases, enormously lucky as they are often well paid and can, unless in a branch, sit working from a laptop at home in this time isolating and, to an extent protected from the outside madness health wise.