Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
I don't think you need to wear masks outdoors, it's only in enclosed spaces.
Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
If you are "comfortably" social distanced, outside in a park, you do not need to wear a mask.
Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
I don't think you need to wear masks outdoors, it's only in enclosed spaces.
It wouldn't concern me in a large open space and it required to wear one. Although in some countries you do
Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
I don't think you need to wear masks outdoors, it's only in enclosed spaces.
It wouldn't concern me in a large open space and it required to wear one. Although in some countries you do
And this is what makes me cry. I believe we are not far off the wearing of face masks at all times outside your household. Here we are though 6 months on and the government are telling us they cant pinpoint the outbreaks better? All the time through this pandemic the supermarkets have remained opened. Even in the height over 50% of people didnt wear masks probably higher. Off the back of this i dont remember hardly any supermarkets having to shut because of an outbreak in the supermarket. I could be wrong though and supermarkets could of been the superspreader. I do think though 6 months on we should have a better idea how the cases are spreading. Im being told its the youngsters , does the 6 rule make much difference to them though. They could meet with one set of friends in the morning and another set of friends in the afternoon. Of course some will say if we can cut the virus by 1% by wearing a mask all the time its worth doing.
Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
I don't think you need to wear masks outdoors, it's only in enclosed spaces.
It wouldn't concern me in a large open space and it required to wear one. Although in some countries you do
And this is what makes me cry. I believe we are not far off the wearing of face masks at all times outside your house.
Concerns me also, may as well be in full lockdown as far as I’m concerned.
Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
I don't think you need to wear masks outdoors, it's only in enclosed spaces.
It wouldn't concern me in a large open space and it required to wear one. Although in some countries you do
And this is what makes me cry. I believe we are not far off the wearing of face masks at all times outside your household. Here we are though 6 months on and the government are telling us they cant pinpoint the outbreaks better? All the time through this pandemic the supermarkets have remained opened. Even in the height over 50% of people didnt wear masks probably higher. Off the back of this i dont remember hardly any supermarkets having to shut because of an outbreak in the supermarket. I could be wrong though and supermarkets could of been the superspreader. I do think though 6 months on we should have a better idea how the cases are spreading. Im being told its the youngsters , does the 6 rule make much difference to them though. They could meet with one set of friends in the morning and another set of friends in the afternoon. Of course some will say if we can cut the virus by 1% by wearing a mask all the time its worth doing.
How would we have known? We gave up trying to track and trace at the peak and no one was tested.
41 years of Sod You , promoted by the House of Goons, has realised a very Sod You society. The result is The World Of Selfish. It is a truly shit place in which to live.
Was in Greenwich Park yesterday. A distinct lack of masks and a lot of people. People were social distancing but I was surprised at the very casual approach to mask wearing.
It was lovely weather and I think people were glad to enjoy the day. I never really felt uncomfortable.
I don't think you need to wear masks outdoors, it's only in enclosed spaces.
It wouldn't concern me in a large open space and it required to wear one. Although in some countries you do
And this is what makes me cry. I believe we are not far off the wearing of face masks at all times outside your household. Here we are though 6 months on and the government are telling us they cant pinpoint the outbreaks better? All the time through this pandemic the supermarkets have remained opened. Even in the height over 50% of people didnt wear masks probably higher. Off the back of this i dont remember hardly any supermarkets having to shut because of an outbreak in the supermarket. I could be wrong though and supermarkets could of been the superspreader. I do think though 6 months on we should have a better idea how the cases are spreading. Im being told its the youngsters , does the 6 rule make much difference to them though. They could meet with one set of friends in the morning and another set of friends in the afternoon. Of course some will say if we can cut the virus by 1% by wearing a mask all the time its worth doing.
I'd strongly suggest Supermarkets played a big part in the spread during the strict lockdown. Even in the 1-2 months into the full lockdown - thousands were still catching and spreading and thousands were being hospitalised.
It's an enclosed space, no one was wearing masks and often 100 people were in a shop at the same time - this was one of the few places people came across each other.
Although good rules were put in place, such as one way systems etc, they were rarely enforced.
I spent the last week oooop North and could not believe how few people were wearing face masks out in public and in the shops.
Very very few people in Hull, Harrogate and Knaresborough were wearing face coverings, but the worst was York, where hundreds of tourists and locals were crowded in the main shopping centres and Shambles market. The sheer volume of people made social distancing impossible.
Found it very intimidating as I get out so rarely nowadays because of shielding and my own difficulties wearing mouth/nose coverings.
I was in Hong Kong in February and the contrast was crazy. I didn't see a single person without a mask inside or outside, this was before the government made it mandatory too. This is a hugely densely populated city, with close proximity to China which managed to keep Corona deaths lower than my hometown, despite much of the economy remaining open.
I know it's part of their culture but you'd like to hope people could make it part of ours to save lives, sadly not
I was in Hong Kong in February and the contrast was crazy. I didn't see a single person without a mask inside or outside, this was before the government made it mandatory too. This is a hugely densely populated city, with close proximity to China which managed to keep Corona deaths lower than my hometown, despite much of the economy remaining open.
I know it's part of their culture but you'd like to hope people could make it part of ours to save lives, sadly not
I wouldn't trust any figures from any part of China!
I was in Hong Kong in February and the contrast was crazy. I didn't see a single person without a mask inside or outside, this was before the government made it mandatory too. This is a hugely densely populated city, with close proximity to China which managed to keep Corona deaths lower than my hometown, despite much of the economy remaining open.
I know it's part of their culture but you'd like to hope people could make it part of ours to save lives, sadly not
I wouldn't trust any figures from any part of China!
Hong Kong is a different kettle of fish to China - if anything the government would want to inflate covid numbers to quell the protests when they passed the security law.
My partner spent the last 6 months in HK and things have managed to go on there and hospitals are not stretched at all - in fact they only ever had a handful of hospital cases at a time.
It's also worth noting that Hong Kong is a lot more transparent with its cases than the UK - going as far as stating the specific flat blocks that cases are in. It's ignorant to write off their successful corona virus model of wearing masks everywhere, social distancing and being hygenic.
As for China, whether initial figures are under reported or not, they have coronavirus under control now - I guess that's what can be achieved when the government has the control to physcially stop people leaving their houses during a lockdown
I was in Hong Kong in February and the contrast was crazy. I didn't see a single person without a mask inside or outside, this was before the government made it mandatory too. This is a hugely densely populated city, with close proximity to China which managed to keep Corona deaths lower than my hometown, despite much of the economy remaining open.
I know it's part of their culture but you'd like to hope people could make it part of ours to save lives, sadly not
I wouldn't trust any figures from any part of China!
My partner spent the last 6 months in HK and things have managed to go on there and hospitals are not stretched at all - in fact they only ever had a handful of hospital cases at a time.
We are only having a handful of hospital cases at a time over the past couple of months.
Indeed, even with the current 'spike', the number of cases and related deaths are probably less than for influenza over the same period.
I was in Hong Kong in February and the contrast was crazy. I didn't see a single person without a mask inside or outside, this was before the government made it mandatory too. This is a hugely densely populated city, with close proximity to China which managed to keep Corona deaths lower than my hometown, despite much of the economy remaining open.
I know it's part of their culture but you'd like to hope people could make it part of ours to save lives, sadly not
I wouldn't trust any figures from any part of China!
My partner spent the last 6 months in HK and things have managed to go on there and hospitals are not stretched at all - in fact they only ever had a handful of hospital cases at a time.
We are only having a handful of hospital cases at a time over the past couple of months.
Indeed, even with the current 'spike', the number of cases and related deaths are probably less than for influenza over the same period.
We have had hospital admissions in the triple figures daily consistently, coming down into double figures for August. Hong Kong was single figures weekly.
Although the former is still low, when compared to influenza, the worry is the exponential rise that can come when numbers start increasing like they are now.
Over 40k Covid-related deaths in the UK is horrific.
But as a result of a focussed Covid approach which has left many treatments in abeyance, or means people are scared to get treatment, non-Covid deaths are likely to be exponentially higher. And if Covid receives primary support again in the Winter, it will be far worse.
This is not me saying this ... read senior consultants and surgeons all over the internet, NHS and private ... they are very worried.
As I said, it’s a horrible choice, but there will need to be a choice as to where the NHS concentrates its focus ... it cannot do both.
A few years ago I had bowel cancer and went through many months of treatment including radiotherapy for a number of weeks. I only recently had the full all-clear which is wonderful. However, if my problem had been this year, there is a distinct possibility I would not have been so lucky ... and many people are going through this now.
My wife’s mammogram was delayed by six months ... she finally had it done a couple of weeks and is all clear ... but the six month delay could have caused problems and will no doubt do so for some. My sister-in-law has metastatic breast cancer. Her treatment has fortunately only been minimally impacted, but she knows of quite a number of others whose treatment has been severely impacted which will result in an earlier death.
There are hundreds of thousands of such stories around. Covid cannot be our prime focus over the coming months as it was earlier in the year.
The awful fact is that we face a decision on how many people will die ... my belief is that non-Covid issues must now take priority.
I understand why others may think differently, but as I said before, this is not a zero risk scenario.
Are you suggesting that Covid patients should just be allowed to die?
By taking measures to stop the further spread of Covid, we will have a better chance of treating both Covid and non Covid patients.
Please don’t put words in my mouth ... that’s a deplorable thing to do. Not going to bother discussing with you if that’s how you want to behave.
I said we have no choice but to find a balance. Whichever approach is taken will lead to many deaths, but we are not capable of covering everything, no country is. Decisions need to be made on how we can save the most lives.
Stopping the further spread of Covid does little to help those I mentioned in my previous posts ... and these now far outnumber those at risk of being hospitalised by Covid.
You have really pissed me off with your insinuation I want to leave people to die. My son was seriously ill with Covid in March ... so you are on my ‘ignore’ mode from now on.
I am in broad agreement with you.
What confuses me is that there was much trumpeting of the 'Nightingale' hospitals which were built and supposed to deal with COVID-19 whilst the 'ordinary' NHS hospitals dealt with 'ordinary' demand.
Somehow, despite all the photo opportunities, that never quite happened as the Nightingale hospitals remained empty prior to being dismantled (how much money was wasted on that charade) and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service.
As I've said before this has become a Political Pandemic. There have been cock-ups on all sides and the ordinary punters are the ones that suffer. Rather like football fans suffering the punishment for the incompetence of the EFL in properly vetting owners as we know ourselves.
There is no longer, if there ever was, any public accountability from our political masters.
How many years have you paid home insurance and your home not burned down? What a waste of money right?
Not an accurate analogy.
Insurance is to protect against something that MIGHT happen not something that HAS happened.
We were told back in March or whenever that the Nightingale hospitals would be used as COVID centres whilst the existing ordinary hospitals would continue in the normal way for everything else. The whole rationale of the original 'lockdown' was to attempt to minimise the number of COVID cases to reduce the pressure on Nightingale hospitals so we were told. We weren't told they wouldn't be used at all or barely.
What has happened instead is that COVID cases were admitted into ordinary hospitals or care homes whilst the Nightingale Hospitals remained virtually empty and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service with non COVID ailments being ignored sometimes with fatalities as a result.
The justification for oppressing the populus with 'masks, face coverings, muzzles,' whichever description you prefer, and allowing only six members of families to meet is allegedly to try to avoid a 'second wave' of COVID. If that really is /was the case then why have the Nightingale hospitals been dismantled already? It doesn't make clinical sense.
Hence why I say it is a political pandemic. Jenny Harries used to pontificate with Boris at one time but she got put back in her box because she had the temerity to say that 'masks' weren't effective and could even be counter productive.
Compulsory gagging of the populus is all about making it look as if the politicians are doing something and arse covering.
Had someone tell me I couldn't pass them on the escalator this morning at London Bridge. We were both wearing masks and he just stood in the way when I tried to pass. Was polite and I wasn't confrontational but is passing someone on an escalator a faux pas?
Had someone tell me I couldn't pass them on the escalator this morning at London Bridge. We were both wearing masks and he just stood in the way when I tried to pass. Was polite and I wasn't confrontational but is passing someone on an escalator a faux pas?
Well I guess if we're all following the guidelines then it would mean you aren't keeping to the 1m+ rule though whether that is actually intended when you are sitting close to someone for long periods or not I'm not quite sure. I'd imagine the risk of transmission from passing someone on an escalator is very small but maybe we should try and keep our distance at all times.
I imagine that person wasn't British as clearly the correct way to respond is tut and mutter something under your breath mask.
Over 40k Covid-related deaths in the UK is horrific.
But as a result of a focussed Covid approach which has left many treatments in abeyance, or means people are scared to get treatment, non-Covid deaths are likely to be exponentially higher. And if Covid receives primary support again in the Winter, it will be far worse.
This is not me saying this ... read senior consultants and surgeons all over the internet, NHS and private ... they are very worried.
As I said, it’s a horrible choice, but there will need to be a choice as to where the NHS concentrates its focus ... it cannot do both.
A few years ago I had bowel cancer and went through many months of treatment including radiotherapy for a number of weeks. I only recently had the full all-clear which is wonderful. However, if my problem had been this year, there is a distinct possibility I would not have been so lucky ... and many people are going through this now.
My wife’s mammogram was delayed by six months ... she finally had it done a couple of weeks and is all clear ... but the six month delay could have caused problems and will no doubt do so for some. My sister-in-law has metastatic breast cancer. Her treatment has fortunately only been minimally impacted, but she knows of quite a number of others whose treatment has been severely impacted which will result in an earlier death.
There are hundreds of thousands of such stories around. Covid cannot be our prime focus over the coming months as it was earlier in the year.
The awful fact is that we face a decision on how many people will die ... my belief is that non-Covid issues must now take priority.
I understand why others may think differently, but as I said before, this is not a zero risk scenario.
Are you suggesting that Covid patients should just be allowed to die?
By taking measures to stop the further spread of Covid, we will have a better chance of treating both Covid and non Covid patients.
Please don’t put words in my mouth ... that’s a deplorable thing to do. Not going to bother discussing with you if that’s how you want to behave.
I said we have no choice but to find a balance. Whichever approach is taken will lead to many deaths, but we are not capable of covering everything, no country is. Decisions need to be made on how we can save the most lives.
Stopping the further spread of Covid does little to help those I mentioned in my previous posts ... and these now far outnumber those at risk of being hospitalised by Covid.
You have really pissed me off with your insinuation I want to leave people to die. My son was seriously ill with Covid in March ... so you are on my ‘ignore’ mode from now on.
I am in broad agreement with you.
What confuses me is that there was much trumpeting of the 'Nightingale' hospitals which were built and supposed to deal with COVID-19 whilst the 'ordinary' NHS hospitals dealt with 'ordinary' demand.
Somehow, despite all the photo opportunities, that never quite happened as the Nightingale hospitals remained empty prior to being dismantled (how much money was wasted on that charade) and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service.
As I've said before this has become a Political Pandemic. There have been cock-ups on all sides and the ordinary punters are the ones that suffer. Rather like football fans suffering the punishment for the incompetence of the EFL in properly vetting owners as we know ourselves.
There is no longer, if there ever was, any public accountability from our political masters.
How many years have you paid home insurance and your home not burned down? What a waste of money right?
Not an accurate analogy.
Insurance is to protect against something that MIGHT happen not something that HAS happened.
We were told back in March or whenever that the Nightingale hospitals would be used as COVID centres whilst the existing ordinary hospitals would continue in the normal way for everything else. The whole rationale of the original 'lockdown' was to attempt to minimise the number of COVID cases to reduce the pressure on Nightingale hospitals so we were told. We weren't told they wouldn't be used at all or barely.
What has happened instead is that COVID cases were admitted into ordinary hospitals or care homes whilst the Nightingale Hospitals remained virtually empty and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service with non COVID ailments being ignored sometimes with fatalities as a result.
The justification for oppressing the populus with 'masks, face coverings, muzzles,' whichever description you prefer, and allowing only six members of families to meet is allegedly to try to avoid a 'second wave' of COVID. If that really is /was the case then why have the Nightingale hospitals been dismantled already? It doesn't make clinical sense.
Hence why I say it is a political pandemic. Jenny Harries used to pontificate with Boris at one time but she got put back in her box because she had the temerity to say that 'masks' weren't effective and could even be counter productive.
Compulsory gagging of the populus is all about making it look as if the politicians are doing something and arse covering.
I don't remember being told that (I am not saying you are wrong).
I seem to remember the Nightingales being for extra capacity.
In fact from the NHS.
NHS Nightingale London was established in less than a fortnight on the site of the Excel centre in London’s Docklands, as part of extra back-up capacity for the NHS to treat coronavirus patients if it is needed.
Had someone tell me I couldn't pass them on the escalator this morning at London Bridge. We were both wearing masks and he just stood in the way when I tried to pass. Was polite and I wasn't confrontational but is passing someone on an escalator a faux pas?
There were notices up a while back saying not to. Before marks were required on public transport
Over 40k Covid-related deaths in the UK is horrific.
But as a result of a focussed Covid approach which has left many treatments in abeyance, or means people are scared to get treatment, non-Covid deaths are likely to be exponentially higher. And if Covid receives primary support again in the Winter, it will be far worse.
This is not me saying this ... read senior consultants and surgeons all over the internet, NHS and private ... they are very worried.
As I said, it’s a horrible choice, but there will need to be a choice as to where the NHS concentrates its focus ... it cannot do both.
A few years ago I had bowel cancer and went through many months of treatment including radiotherapy for a number of weeks. I only recently had the full all-clear which is wonderful. However, if my problem had been this year, there is a distinct possibility I would not have been so lucky ... and many people are going through this now.
My wife’s mammogram was delayed by six months ... she finally had it done a couple of weeks and is all clear ... but the six month delay could have caused problems and will no doubt do so for some. My sister-in-law has metastatic breast cancer. Her treatment has fortunately only been minimally impacted, but she knows of quite a number of others whose treatment has been severely impacted which will result in an earlier death.
There are hundreds of thousands of such stories around. Covid cannot be our prime focus over the coming months as it was earlier in the year.
The awful fact is that we face a decision on how many people will die ... my belief is that non-Covid issues must now take priority.
I understand why others may think differently, but as I said before, this is not a zero risk scenario.
Are you suggesting that Covid patients should just be allowed to die?
By taking measures to stop the further spread of Covid, we will have a better chance of treating both Covid and non Covid patients.
Please don’t put words in my mouth ... that’s a deplorable thing to do. Not going to bother discussing with you if that’s how you want to behave.
I said we have no choice but to find a balance. Whichever approach is taken will lead to many deaths, but we are not capable of covering everything, no country is. Decisions need to be made on how we can save the most lives.
Stopping the further spread of Covid does little to help those I mentioned in my previous posts ... and these now far outnumber those at risk of being hospitalised by Covid.
You have really pissed me off with your insinuation I want to leave people to die. My son was seriously ill with Covid in March ... so you are on my ‘ignore’ mode from now on.
I am in broad agreement with you.
What confuses me is that there was much trumpeting of the 'Nightingale' hospitals which were built and supposed to deal with COVID-19 whilst the 'ordinary' NHS hospitals dealt with 'ordinary' demand.
Somehow, despite all the photo opportunities, that never quite happened as the Nightingale hospitals remained empty prior to being dismantled (how much money was wasted on that charade) and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service.
As I've said before this has become a Political Pandemic. There have been cock-ups on all sides and the ordinary punters are the ones that suffer. Rather like football fans suffering the punishment for the incompetence of the EFL in properly vetting owners as we know ourselves.
There is no longer, if there ever was, any public accountability from our political masters.
How many years have you paid home insurance and your home not burned down? What a waste of money right?
Not an accurate analogy.
Insurance is to protect against something that MIGHT happen not something that HAS happened.
We were told back in March or whenever that the Nightingale hospitals would be used as COVID centres whilst the existing ordinary hospitals would continue in the normal way for everything else. The whole rationale of the original 'lockdown' was to attempt to minimise the number of COVID cases to reduce the pressure on Nightingale hospitals so we were told. We weren't told they wouldn't be used at all or barely.
What has happened instead is that COVID cases were admitted into ordinary hospitals or care homes whilst the Nightingale Hospitals remained virtually empty and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service with non COVID ailments being ignored sometimes with fatalities as a result.
The justification for oppressing the populus with 'masks, face coverings, muzzles,' whichever description you prefer, and allowing only six members of families to meet is allegedly to try to avoid a 'second wave' of COVID. If that really is /was the case then why have the Nightingale hospitals been dismantled already? It doesn't make clinical sense.
Hence why I say it is a political pandemic. Jenny Harries used to pontificate with Boris at one time but she got put back in her box because she had the temerity to say that 'masks' weren't effective and could even be counter productive.
Compulsory gagging of the populus is all about making it look as if the politicians are doing something and arse covering.
I don't remember being told that (I am not saying you are wrong).
I seem to remember the Nightingales being for extra capacity.
In fact from the NHS.
NHS Nightingale London was established in less than a fortnight on the site of the Excel centre in London’s Docklands, as part of extra back-up capacity for the NHS to treat coronavirus patients if it is needed.
Over 40k Covid-related deaths in the UK is horrific.
But as a result of a focussed Covid approach which has left many treatments in abeyance, or means people are scared to get treatment, non-Covid deaths are likely to be exponentially higher. And if Covid receives primary support again in the Winter, it will be far worse.
This is not me saying this ... read senior consultants and surgeons all over the internet, NHS and private ... they are very worried.
As I said, it’s a horrible choice, but there will need to be a choice as to where the NHS concentrates its focus ... it cannot do both.
A few years ago I had bowel cancer and went through many months of treatment including radiotherapy for a number of weeks. I only recently had the full all-clear which is wonderful. However, if my problem had been this year, there is a distinct possibility I would not have been so lucky ... and many people are going through this now.
My wife’s mammogram was delayed by six months ... she finally had it done a couple of weeks and is all clear ... but the six month delay could have caused problems and will no doubt do so for some. My sister-in-law has metastatic breast cancer. Her treatment has fortunately only been minimally impacted, but she knows of quite a number of others whose treatment has been severely impacted which will result in an earlier death.
There are hundreds of thousands of such stories around. Covid cannot be our prime focus over the coming months as it was earlier in the year.
The awful fact is that we face a decision on how many people will die ... my belief is that non-Covid issues must now take priority.
I understand why others may think differently, but as I said before, this is not a zero risk scenario.
Are you suggesting that Covid patients should just be allowed to die?
By taking measures to stop the further spread of Covid, we will have a better chance of treating both Covid and non Covid patients.
Please don’t put words in my mouth ... that’s a deplorable thing to do. Not going to bother discussing with you if that’s how you want to behave.
I said we have no choice but to find a balance. Whichever approach is taken will lead to many deaths, but we are not capable of covering everything, no country is. Decisions need to be made on how we can save the most lives.
Stopping the further spread of Covid does little to help those I mentioned in my previous posts ... and these now far outnumber those at risk of being hospitalised by Covid.
You have really pissed me off with your insinuation I want to leave people to die. My son was seriously ill with Covid in March ... so you are on my ‘ignore’ mode from now on.
I am in broad agreement with you.
What confuses me is that there was much trumpeting of the 'Nightingale' hospitals which were built and supposed to deal with COVID-19 whilst the 'ordinary' NHS hospitals dealt with 'ordinary' demand.
Somehow, despite all the photo opportunities, that never quite happened as the Nightingale hospitals remained empty prior to being dismantled (how much money was wasted on that charade) and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service.
As I've said before this has become a Political Pandemic. There have been cock-ups on all sides and the ordinary punters are the ones that suffer. Rather like football fans suffering the punishment for the incompetence of the EFL in properly vetting owners as we know ourselves.
There is no longer, if there ever was, any public accountability from our political masters.
How many years have you paid home insurance and your home not burned down? What a waste of money right?
Not an accurate analogy.
Insurance is to protect against something that MIGHT happen not something that HAS happened.
We were told back in March or whenever that the Nightingale hospitals would be used as COVID centres whilst the existing ordinary hospitals would continue in the normal way for everything else. The whole rationale of the original 'lockdown' was to attempt to minimise the number of COVID cases to reduce the pressure on Nightingale hospitals so we were told. We weren't told they wouldn't be used at all or barely.
What has happened instead is that COVID cases were admitted into ordinary hospitals or care homes whilst the Nightingale Hospitals remained virtually empty and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service with non COVID ailments being ignored sometimes with fatalities as a result.
The justification for oppressing the populus with 'masks, face coverings, muzzles,' whichever description you prefer, and allowing only six members of families to meet is allegedly to try to avoid a 'second wave' of COVID. If that really is /was the case then why have the Nightingale hospitals been dismantled already? It doesn't make clinical sense.
Hence why I say it is a political pandemic. Jenny Harries used to pontificate with Boris at one time but she got put back in her box because she had the temerity to say that 'masks' weren't effective and could even be counter productive.
Compulsory gagging of the populus is all about making it look as if the politicians are doing something and arse covering.
I don't remember being told that (I am not saying you are wrong).
I seem to remember the Nightingales being for extra capacity.
In fact from the NHS.
NHS Nightingale London was established in less than a fortnight on the site of the Excel centre in London’s Docklands, as part of extra back-up capacity for the NHS to treat coronavirus patients if it is needed.
If it IS insurance, given the talk of a second wave, why have they been dismantled?
I thought that they had been more mothballed than dismantled. I even think the one in Exeter was turned into a cancer screening centre to help with the backlog of people who needed screening.
Put it this way, if there was a second wave, I think that a lot of the infrastructure of the Nightingales is still there, and it would be even quicker to recommission.
If it IS insurance, given the talk of a second wave, why have they been dismantled?
Presumably because they've got solid data from the first wave that they've used to more accurately model the second wave and determined the extra capacity will not be needed. Either that or they just didn't want to pay for these facilities to sit empty until a second wave arrives. Other possibility is they're in complete denial and believe there won't be a second wave.
The Manchester Nightingale Hospital has a capacity of 1000 beds and has not been dismantled. It is on standby and occupies The Manchester Convention Centre.
Over 40k Covid-related deaths in the UK is horrific.
But as a result of a focussed Covid approach which has left many treatments in abeyance, or means people are scared to get treatment, non-Covid deaths are likely to be exponentially higher. And if Covid receives primary support again in the Winter, it will be far worse.
This is not me saying this ... read senior consultants and surgeons all over the internet, NHS and private ... they are very worried.
As I said, it’s a horrible choice, but there will need to be a choice as to where the NHS concentrates its focus ... it cannot do both.
A few years ago I had bowel cancer and went through many months of treatment including radiotherapy for a number of weeks. I only recently had the full all-clear which is wonderful. However, if my problem had been this year, there is a distinct possibility I would not have been so lucky ... and many people are going through this now.
My wife’s mammogram was delayed by six months ... she finally had it done a couple of weeks and is all clear ... but the six month delay could have caused problems and will no doubt do so for some. My sister-in-law has metastatic breast cancer. Her treatment has fortunately only been minimally impacted, but she knows of quite a number of others whose treatment has been severely impacted which will result in an earlier death.
There are hundreds of thousands of such stories around. Covid cannot be our prime focus over the coming months as it was earlier in the year.
The awful fact is that we face a decision on how many people will die ... my belief is that non-Covid issues must now take priority.
I understand why others may think differently, but as I said before, this is not a zero risk scenario.
Are you suggesting that Covid patients should just be allowed to die?
By taking measures to stop the further spread of Covid, we will have a better chance of treating both Covid and non Covid patients.
Please don’t put words in my mouth ... that’s a deplorable thing to do. Not going to bother discussing with you if that’s how you want to behave.
I said we have no choice but to find a balance. Whichever approach is taken will lead to many deaths, but we are not capable of covering everything, no country is. Decisions need to be made on how we can save the most lives.
Stopping the further spread of Covid does little to help those I mentioned in my previous posts ... and these now far outnumber those at risk of being hospitalised by Covid.
You have really pissed me off with your insinuation I want to leave people to die. My son was seriously ill with Covid in March ... so you are on my ‘ignore’ mode from now on.
I am in broad agreement with you.
What confuses me is that there was much trumpeting of the 'Nightingale' hospitals which were built and supposed to deal with COVID-19 whilst the 'ordinary' NHS hospitals dealt with 'ordinary' demand.
Somehow, despite all the photo opportunities, that never quite happened as the Nightingale hospitals remained empty prior to being dismantled (how much money was wasted on that charade) and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service.
As I've said before this has become a Political Pandemic. There have been cock-ups on all sides and the ordinary punters are the ones that suffer. Rather like football fans suffering the punishment for the incompetence of the EFL in properly vetting owners as we know ourselves.
There is no longer, if there ever was, any public accountability from our political masters.
How many years have you paid home insurance and your home not burned down? What a waste of money right?
Not an accurate analogy.
Insurance is to protect against something that MIGHT happen not something that HAS happened.
We were told back in March or whenever that the Nightingale hospitals would be used as COVID centres whilst the existing ordinary hospitals would continue in the normal way for everything else. The whole rationale of the original 'lockdown' was to attempt to minimise the number of COVID cases to reduce the pressure on Nightingale hospitals so we were told. We weren't told they wouldn't be used at all or barely.
What has happened instead is that COVID cases were admitted into ordinary hospitals or care homes whilst the Nightingale Hospitals remained virtually empty and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service with non COVID ailments being ignored sometimes with fatalities as a result.
The justification for oppressing the populus with 'masks, face coverings, muzzles,' whichever description you prefer, and allowing only six members of families to meet is allegedly to try to avoid a 'second wave' of COVID. If that really is /was the case then why have the Nightingale hospitals been dismantled already? It doesn't make clinical sense.
Hence why I say it is a political pandemic. Jenny Harries used to pontificate with Boris at one time but she got put back in her box because she had the temerity to say that 'masks' weren't effective and could even be counter productive.
Compulsory gagging of the populus is all about making it look as if the politicians are doing something and arse covering.
I often agree with your posts @LenGlover however I think you are wrong on the wearing of face coverings. There is far more evidence that they do help stop the transmission, than there is that says it doesn't.
I also believe that the Nightingale Hospitals have been largely mothballed so that they can be brought back into use if necessary.
My concern is that if we have to wear facemasks in the open, then after the pandemic is over this will a) slowly creep into our culture and b) be required all the time to reduce other diseases, so the government can spend less on the NHS.
I do not want my children growing up in a society like that.
My concern is that if we have to wear facemasks in the open, then after the pandemic is over this will a) slowly creep into our culture and b) be required all the time to reduce other diseases, so the government can spend less on the NHS.
I do not want my children growing up in a society like that.
Somewhat unlikely in the UK. Some people aren't even wearing masks now, so I can't see them continuing after Covid. But who knows.
Comments
I believe we are not far off the wearing of face masks at all times outside your household.
Here we are though 6 months on and the government are telling us they cant pinpoint the outbreaks better?
All the time through this pandemic the supermarkets have remained opened.
Even in the height over 50% of people didnt wear masks probably higher.
Off the back of this i dont remember hardly any supermarkets having to shut because of an outbreak in the supermarket.
I could be wrong though and supermarkets could of been the superspreader.
I do think though 6 months on we should have a better idea how the cases are spreading.
Im being told its the youngsters , does the 6 rule make much difference to them though.
They could meet with one set of friends in the morning and another set of friends in the afternoon.
Of course some will say if we can cut the virus by 1% by wearing a mask all the time its worth doing.
It is a truly shit place in which to live.
It's an enclosed space, no one was wearing masks and often 100 people were in a shop at the same time - this was one of the few places people came across each other.
Although good rules were put in place, such as one way systems etc, they were rarely enforced.
Very very few people in Hull, Harrogate and Knaresborough were wearing face coverings, but the worst was York, where hundreds of tourists and locals were crowded in the main shopping centres and Shambles market. The sheer volume of people made social distancing impossible.
Found it very intimidating as I get out so rarely nowadays because of shielding and my own difficulties wearing mouth/nose coverings.
I know it's part of their culture but you'd like to hope people could make it part of ours to save lives, sadly not
My partner spent the last 6 months in HK and things have managed to go on there and hospitals are not stretched at all - in fact they only ever had a handful of hospital cases at a time.
It's also worth noting that Hong Kong is a lot more transparent with its cases than the UK - going as far as stating the specific flat blocks that cases are in. It's ignorant to write off their successful corona virus model of wearing masks everywhere, social distancing and being hygenic.
As for China, whether initial figures are under reported or not, they have coronavirus under control now - I guess that's what can be achieved when the government has the control to physcially stop people leaving their houses during a lockdown
Little chance of Uighur Muslims catching it as they've been under permanent lockdown for years.
Indeed, even with the current 'spike', the number of cases and related deaths are probably less than for influenza over the same period.
Although the former is still low, when compared to influenza, the worry is the exponential rise that can come when numbers start increasing like they are now.
Insurance is to protect against something that MIGHT happen not something that HAS happened.
We were told back in March or whenever that the Nightingale hospitals would be used as COVID centres whilst the existing ordinary hospitals would continue in the normal way for everything else. The whole rationale of the original 'lockdown' was to attempt to minimise the number of COVID cases to reduce the pressure on Nightingale hospitals so we were told. We weren't told they wouldn't be used at all or barely.
What has happened instead is that COVID cases were admitted into ordinary hospitals or care homes whilst the Nightingale Hospitals remained virtually empty and the National Health Service became the National COVID Service with non COVID ailments being ignored sometimes with fatalities as a result.
The justification for oppressing the populus with 'masks, face coverings, muzzles,' whichever description you prefer, and allowing only six members of families to meet is allegedly to try to avoid a 'second wave' of COVID. If that really is /was the case then why have the Nightingale hospitals been dismantled already? It doesn't make clinical sense.
Hence why I say it is a political pandemic. Jenny Harries used to pontificate with Boris at one time but she got put back in her box because she had the temerity to say that 'masks' weren't effective and could even be counter productive.
Compulsory gagging of the populus is all about making it look as if the politicians are doing something and arse covering.
I imagine that person wasn't British as clearly the correct way to respond is tut and mutter something under your breath mask.
I seem to remember the Nightingales being for extra capacity.
In fact from the NHS.
NHS Nightingale London was established in less than a fortnight on the site of the Excel centre in London’s Docklands, as part of extra back-up capacity for the NHS to treat coronavirus patients if it is needed.
https://www.england.nhs.uk/2020/04/nightingale-ldn-discharges-first/
Sounds like insurance to me.
EDIT: Sorry it's only the Evening Standard but the Chief Executive of the London Nightingale, Professor Charles Knight, is quoted, in April, as saying it should be used to make other London hospitals 'COVID free.' https://www.standard.co.uk/news/health/nightingale-should-become-covid-centre-to-free-up-nhs-a4426966.html
Something changed politically subsequently to scupper that idea it would seem, just as it did with the attitude to masks.
Put it this way, if there was a second wave, I think that a lot of the infrastructure of the Nightingales is still there, and it would be even quicker to recommission.
I also believe that the Nightingale Hospitals have been largely mothballed so that they can be brought back into use if necessary.
The following is a video that shows the correct way to put on and take off a mask from a very reputable organisation:
https://www.facebook.com/airambulancekss
I do not want my children growing up in a society like that.
Some people aren't even wearing masks now, so I can't see them continuing after Covid.
But who knows.