More Controlled Parking Restrictions for Charlton

Fortune 82nd Minute said:

Rothko said:

randy andy said:

Earlier in this thread I was picked up for intimating that parking policies were punishing car owners.

I'll defend that point now. Firstly, if the council is making car ownership both more difficult and more expensive, whislt doing nothing to improve public transport or provide viable alternative means of transport then that is punishment pure and simple.

Secondly, the situation is far worse than just alternatives not being provided, alternatives are actively being scrapped, 9% of buses and 18% of tubes. If you make it more difficult to use personal transport whilst public transport is also being cut, then how can it be anything other than a punishment?

https://metro.co.uk/2021/11/25/tube-line-could-be-closed-due-to-tfl-funding-crisis-15665178/

Those cuts are more to do with this Governments decision to go after TfL and particularly Londoners for voting the wrong way, I get the politics, not the economic damage bringing London down does  

Oh dear. 

Tfl is without a shadow of doubt one of the most (if not the worst) unreformed, wasteful public sector bodies in the country.

For example, how many organisations do you still know have a final salary pension scheme payable at 60 like tfl has?

Until Khan is prepared to tackle the waste in Tfl the government is right to play hardball. 

Rothko said:

Fortune 82nd Minute said:

Rothko said:

randy andy said:

Earlier in this thread I was picked up for intimating that parking policies were punishing car owners.

I'll defend that point now. Firstly, if the council is making car ownership both more difficult and more expensive, whislt doing nothing to improve public transport or provide viable alternative means of transport then that is punishment pure and simple.

Secondly, the situation is far worse than just alternatives not being provided, alternatives are actively being scrapped, 9% of buses and 18% of tubes. If you make it more difficult to use personal transport whilst public transport is also being cut, then how can it be anything other than a punishment?

https://metro.co.uk/2021/11/25/tube-line-could-be-closed-due-to-tfl-funding-crisis-15665178/

Those cuts are more to do with this Governments decision to go after TfL and particularly Londoners for voting the wrong way, I get the politics, not the economic damage bringing London down does  

Oh dear. 

Tfl is without a shadow of doubt one of the most (if not the worst) unreformed, wasteful public sector bodies in the country.

For example, how many organisations do you still know have a final salary pension scheme payable at 60 like tfl has?

Until Khan is prepared to tackle the waste in Tfl the government is right to play hardball. 

TfL is also one of two metropolitan transport organisation in Europe that receive no central funding, Manchester being the other, and that’s where TfL pain is coming from, as for pensions, the police do for example, it’s still common in unionised orgs where rights haven’t been taken away.

guinnessaddick said:

Fortune 82nd Minute said:

Rothko said:

Happily stand corrected on the pensions, As for the rest, the idea that you can run TfL purely on the fare box is for the birds, waste or no waste

This may shock you but I totally agree TfL needs to be grant funded - I do not know any city in the world that operates a fast, efficient and cheap light rapid transport system without some form of support.

But where we disagree is thinking that the government (ie taxpayer) should just carry on pouring money hand over fist into Tfl whilst that organisation refuses to reform itself. If TfL won't do that - and Khan shows no signs of wanting to do it or to take on the tube drivers' union - then it will have to be pushed into doing so. And the only way the government can do that is by playing hardball over the grant. 

So Boris is getting tough, why didn't he do anything when he was mayor for 8 years?

Cardinal Sin said:

Fortune 82nd Minute said:

Rothko said:

Happily stand corrected on the pensions, As for the rest, the idea that you can run TfL purely on the fare box is for the birds, waste or no waste

This may shock you but I totally agree TfL needs to be grant funded - I do not know any city in the world that operates a fast, efficient and cheap light rapid transport system without some form of support.

But where we disagree is thinking that the government (ie taxpayer) should just carry on pouring money hand over fist into Tfl whilst that organisation refuses to reform itself. If TfL won't do that - and Khan shows no signs of wanting to do it or to take on the tube drivers' union - then it will have to be pushed into doing so. And the only way the government can do that is by playing hardball over the grant. 

I also agree but Khan needs to use the revenue TfL does generate and the billions he has been given centrally on providing transport services. Bringing traffic to a standstill in central London and it's  main roads in and out with a ridiculously under-used Cycleway scheme was a colossal waste of money and simply playing politics. As for the Silvertown Tunnel.....

Redrobo said:

Cardinal Sin said:

Rothko said:

Cardinal Sin said:

Rothko said:

golfaddick said:

Leeds_Addick said:

Cardinal Sin said:

Leeds_Addick said:

Cardinal Sin said:

Rothko said:

The CPZ is being brought in as those roads are being used as car parks for Charlton Station and North Greenwich, not to spite people who think getting the train a few times on a Saturday

This isn't about Charlton Station - that's part of the justification. Parking is not really a problem on non-football Saturdays but including them until 6.30pm will give the Council a revenue bonus and catch home games. Not ok to park on a Saturday, unless you use a pay-to-park space - then it's fine.  It is about hitting motorists and opening new lines of revenue. If not, why do owners of second cars have to pay double? Why do people with working vehicles (vans etc) have to pay £428 - they are still only occupying a vehicle space? This is the Council's car-hating elite at work and in conjunction with TfL's disastrous Cycleways. The Silvertown Tunnel is a crazy decision and goes against all of the Mayor and the Council's policies and ethics on climate change and local pollution. However, it gives them the justification to toll both the Silvertown and the Blackwall Tunnels. They will tell us that these tolls will only be in place until they have recovered the cost of the tunnel build but we all know what happens once they are in place - look at Dartford (tunnel and bridge) where the cost was repaid in 2003. They rake in close to £100m a year now. That could have paid for the new Silvertown Tunnel years ago.

Motorists in south-east London will soon live with the worst traffic congestion and pollution in the country (if we don't already) and also be taxed the most for the cheek of having a car - Congestion Charge, Ultra Low Emission Zone charges, Tunnel Tolls and Resident Parking charges and restrictions. All whilst our arterial roads have been restricted to single-file, often idling, queueing traffic to accommodate a tiny number of patronising cyclists (I have two road bikes). 

Before anyone gets confused, I understand why we need to address climate change and support great public transport. Make it work really well and make it cheap, then I will consider my car usage seriously. In the meantime it's just another cynical and continuing attack on motorists. 

I don’t see how the cycleways are disastrous? It’s opened up a lot of the local area to me where otherwise I’d have felt unsafe cycling. 

I used to drive to the valley but since the cycleway along trafalgar road opened I’m now cycling. Same goes for some of my journeys to West Greenwich and Blackheath. 

I get that it’s challenging to use public transport for those coming from Kent/Bexley but for those living closer to the valley around Greenwich, driving is completely unnecessary.

This is why....

Yeah that’s a perfect example of what’s great about the cycle lanes. I wouldn’t fancy cycling along there without the segregation but now I have a speedy, safe way to get to Charlton. 

Pay £150 a year on "bike tax" and you're welcome to it. Until then, all road users should have equal rights. Crazy to have miles of empty lanes whilst cars are crammed into just 1 lane.

Is this when we have to explain to a really thick person that there is no such thing as road tax 

Another cyclist trope.

It’s also true, there’s a tax on emissions that internal combustion engines produce, and it goes in to general taxation, and not ring fenced for use on the transport infrastructure.

or is that a trope as well. Just for the record  I drive a car, and at the moment I pay for the emissions that come from it. 
 

It's still a Road Tax however much you dislike the name.

Tax payers built the roads that cyclists and drivers use and are paying for the building of cycle paths and lanes. Both inefficient methods at moving people into towns and cities.

The transport infrastructure is not joined up properly, expensive and inefficient and it needs sorting quickly

Ebbsfleet  style large car parks that are free, and fast direct trains into cities and between cities. 60 miles, 60 minutes for £6 or similar should be the aim. Buses that run from towns and villages that arrive 10 minutes before trains depart, that are required to wait for a train if delayed.

Where Tubes can’t run we should have trams. Tiny electric cars, bikes and scooters available to rent to fill in the gaps alongside busses and taxis.

In my opinion the only way to start breaking down the need for the car is to make the alternative attractive. They are trying to make it attractive by making the life of a motorist a misery, but the fact is that the alternative is not in place yet. Or even in planning.

ValleyGary said:

Sorry quick question, parking for tonight I can park closer to the ground after 6:30pm is that correct? Used to park on the big hill by the animal park.

First time driving to a midweek fixture this season.

AFKABartram said:

I had it in my head the same restrictions impacting Saturday games would impact evening ones.

Has something changed from when it was first announced? Was it originally intended to run later on matchdays than 6.30?

Airman Brown said:

AFKABartram said:

I had it in my head the same restrictions impacting Saturday games would impact evening ones.

Has something changed from when it was first announced? Was it originally intended to run later on matchdays than 6.30?

They haven’t proceeded with the second part of the scheme, which is entirely aimed at football fans. I honestly believe they only implemented the first bit because the club was asleep on the job.

Pico said:

Airman Brown said:

AFKABartram said:

I had it in my head the same restrictions impacting Saturday games would impact evening ones.

Has something changed from when it was first announced? Was it originally intended to run later on matchdays than 6.30?

They haven’t proceeded with the second part of the scheme, which is entirely aimed at football fans. I honestly believe they only implemented the first bit because the club was asleep on the job.

Do you really think that?
 
Given that it went ahead despite residents living in the CPZ being 18-1 against it, what makes you think that CAFC would have been able to stop it? 

My understanding from talking to Charlton councillor Gary Dillon last year is that the CPZ is part of a long term borough-wide plan to reduce traffic which will likely be extended in future to cover other areas (eg the roads south of Charlton Park). 

ForeverAddickted said:

Out of curiosity are the Parking Restrictions in place around Charlton on Sundays?

If not, does anyone know a good place to park, close to the station from about 8am - 12noon?