Attention: Please take a moment to consider our terms and conditions before posting.
POST-MATCH THREAD: Crewe Alexandra v Charlton Athletic | January 12, 2022
Comments
-
The ref was appalling all night for both sides,they had two good penalty shouts(one didnt matter anyway) But I do think it was right to chalk off the goal.Leko was blatantly standing offside,he could not have possibly contributed anything from where he was,yet when the shot came in ,he moved towards the keeper,thereby giving the officials a decision to make,he should have just got away from where he was a quickly as possible,and the goal would have stood.PragueAddick said:
The person to blame is the referee. He had a good view from the right angle. He would have noted (or should have done) that the keeper didn't complain ( @LargeAddick, you never heard Browney lecturing you that player reactions are a great giveaway? - something that Browney himself forgot last night with his initial reaction, before Scotty gently helped him engage his brain). If (and I didn't realise that until this morning,) the shot took a Crewe deflection then Leko may not have been offside anyway.thickandthin63 said:There is only one person to blame for the disallowed goall,Leko,he was offside by miles,he could not have contributed to a goal,he should have just got away from the area quickley,but no when the shot comes in he moves towards the ball,brainless.
Then he sees the linesman has decided to Assert Himself. A linesman whom Terry Smith had been calling out from about the first minute. A linesman who was much further away and more or less level with Leko and the keeper. So, completely unable to judge the flight of the ball and the relevance of Leko's position. And they talked and talked and talked. And the 4th official, who had apparently persuaded the ref earlier to book one of ours, I think Gilbey, goaded by Crewe touchline bullying? Nothing to say, apparently. So the ref bottled it.
We should always be ready to forgive officials for missing incidents, in play. It's an impossible job to get 100% right. But when they make decisions after giving themselves time, (in this case about 2 minutes) and then make such a bad decision., then they have failed to do their job. Just as most of our players failed to do so last night, and for which they are rightly getting pelters. So let's not let that ref off the hook.3 -
How strange……I was categorically told that he hadn’t by someone who most certainly would know.matt88 said:
Yes he did, he's in this videoSoundAsa£ said:Incidentally, Kirk did not travel with the squad to Crewe. 🤔
I suppose it’s just possible that he had traveled up earlier as he wasn’t going to be in the squad, so as to stay with family for a day or two.
I just don’t know now, I’m rather puzzled?2 -
PWR. Absolutely spineless performance. So many players need to have a good hard look at themselves. It wasn’t too long ago that these very same players were running through brick walls for Jackson, now they are doing the complete opposite. The only players that came out of last night with any real credibility were Clare, Burstow and Dobson. As for the goalkeeper - dreadful, what he did for the 2nd goal was inexcusable. And he hardly covered himself in glory for the first. If Mcg is unavailable, just give Harness the gloves.Clearly the season is over (I believe we will pick up enough points to not get relegated). We just need to build for next season. It’s very much in the mould of the shit show that Powell inherited.I’m actually sick and tired of loan players. Leko last night and of late has been an absolute waste of space. Famewo has been a liability of recently and is an accident waiting to happen. Lee flatters to deceive.
Our set plays are embarrassing and utterly predictable.I have no idea what players we are looking at to come in during this window. Personally I’d like to see some of the younger players get game time - I’d much rather that then some two bob loan.6 -
I'm not keen on any of em except prolly Stockley , the rest are a bit nothingy , a few can run around a bit , there's fuck all creativity and no one has a shot on em worth a wank ...
crap4 -
Confidence is a factor as is the fact Plymouth underestimated us and went toe toe.Cafc43v3r said:
Last season we won six in a row, then won 6 in 5 months. I don't understand how the same players can be so good, then so awful.ValleyGary said:That was pretty much the same side that beat Plymouth 2-0 just a month ago. Absolutely amazing how much we've regressed since then. No excuse at all.
I don't think the players are as bad as they showed last night, nor as good as they were in some other games. They seem to be either brilliant or shit.
One thing that does stick out to me is in the last season and a half, which is quite a big sample size, I can't think of a single game where we didn't get exactly what we deserved. No games stand out as how the hell did we win that or how the hell did we lose that. Another thing in the same time frame I can only thing of one game, Peterborough at home, when we played quite well and got beat because the other team had better players.
It's almost like the players decide when they want to turn up.0 -
Watson always looks lost in those clips...0
-
Surely if your contact is that good, they can clarify?SoundAsa£ said:
How strange……I was categorically told that he hadn’t by someone who most certainly would know.matt88 said:
Yes he did, he's in this videoSoundAsa£ said:Incidentally, Kirk did not travel with the squad to Crewe. 🤔
I suppose it’s just possible that he had traveled up earlier as he wasn’t going to be in the squad, so as to stay with family for a day or two.
I just don’t know now, I’m rather puzzled?1 -
People keep saying we will not be in the relegation battle, but where will they pick up these poimts if they cannot beat the team second bottom in the league. are players looked tired and without imagination or even any idea where each other were on the pitch.ricky_otto said:PWR. Absolutely spineless performance. So many players need to have a good hard look at themselves. It wasn’t too long ago that these very same players were running through brick walls for Jackson, now they are doing the complete opposite. The only players that came out of last night with any real credibility were Clare, Burstow and Dobson. As for the goalkeeper - dreadful, what he did for the 2nd goal was inexcusable. And he hardly covered himself in glory for the first. If Mcg is unavailable, just give Harness the gloves.Clearly the season is over (I believe we will pick up enough points to not get relegated). We just need to build for next season. It’s very much in the mould of the shit show that Powell inherited.I’m actually sick and tired of loan players. Leko last night and of late has been an absolute waste of space. Famewo has been a liability of recently and is an accident waiting to happen. Lee flatters to deceive.
Our set plays are embarrassing and utterly predictable.I have no idea what players we are looking at to come in during this window. Personally I’d like to see some of the younger players get game time - I’d much rather that then some two bob loan.
it looks like are usual post winter break form collapse of previous seasons.0 -
For the time being we haveISawLeaburnScore said:We play a system in which the most important players on the pitch are the two wing backs. We do not have a wing back of sufficient quality or consistency in the entire squad on either side, yet we have 4 senior full backs and at least 3 partly-converted wingers.
To date this is something we haven't been able to help - JJ has introduced the formation without any transfer window to recruit for it. The squad and tactics are not aligned. However, if this is the long term formation we need to recruit a starting pair of wing backs. If there is nothing out there for a permanent we need to look into the loan market. Otherwise, this formation needs a rethink. It is always going to be critically limited by playing players in the key positions who are either not capable defensively or offensively.
We clearly need a centre forward as well but in my opinion the wing backs are just as important given the influence that position has on the entire tactical set up.
2 left backs - Purrington and Souare
2 right backs - Gunter and Matthews
4 wingers - DJ, CBT, Kirk, Leko
Not even counting any youngsters in the U23s
That's what we have to play with this season. We can't ship 4 of them out in January, so maybe Jacko needs to change the system to utilise the players we DO have.1 -
I don’t know them well enough to contact them directly.Dazzler21 said:
Surely if your contact is that good, they can clarify?SoundAsa£ said:
How strange……I was categorically told that he hadn’t by someone who most certainly would know.matt88 said:
Yes he did, he's in this videoSoundAsa£ said:Incidentally, Kirk did not travel with the squad to Crewe. 🤔
I suppose it’s just possible that he had traveled up earlier as he wasn’t going to be in the squad, so as to stay with family for a day or two.
I just don’t know now, I’m rather puzzled?0 - Sponsored links:
-
At the game.
I actually think we deserved a draw……first 20-25 minutes we played very well and were clearly the better side.
Then, quite inexplicably, we seemed to lose our way…..have to say Crewe would have been astounded to have gone in two up, but not to have gone in two down.
Second half was very even until the last 15 minutes when we proceeded to throw the kitchen sink at them and were very very unlucky not to have equalised.
Their keeper was man of the match IMHO.
Having said all that, overall yes…… it was a poor performance there’s no escaping that.0 -
Ah fair enough in that case.SoundAsa£ said:
I don’t know them well enough to contact them directly.Dazzler21 said:
Surely if your contact is that good, they can clarify?SoundAsa£ said:
How strange……I was categorically told that he hadn’t by someone who most certainly would know.matt88 said:
Yes he did, he's in this videoSoundAsa£ said:Incidentally, Kirk did not travel with the squad to Crewe. 🤔
I suppose it’s just possible that he had traveled up earlier as he wasn’t going to be in the squad, so as to stay with family for a day or two.
I just don’t know now, I’m rather puzzled?0 -
Was at the game, and am a season ticket holder, the issue over the last half dozen games with me is the quality of delivery into the box. Corner kicks, free kicks and threaded passes are all either over hit, under hit or off direction. So we blame the forwards for not scoring, but the quality of delivery into the box is poor. Every team seems to have a player that can deliver a decent corner/free kick, but we don't.
An aside on the referee, who was shit by the way, someone from the Charlton crowd shouted out," are you watching the same game as me ref", and he shouted back NO"!16 -
Clare and Dobson have been excellent, even the last few games. Washington is good at this level when he’s playing with a decent forward next to him, he cannot lead the line. The rest are all a bit meh.oohaahmortimer said:I'm not keen on any of em except prolly Stockley , the rest are a bit nothingy , a few can run around a bit , there's fuck all creativity and no one has a shot on em worth a wank ...
crap5 -
Right, and would you be able to list those responsibilities, or even better just post up the link so I can inform myself. I’m interested among other things in whether no 4 is the primary bod for calculating time to be added on.PeterGage said:
I must admit that I had to look up this one to be sure, knowing that the 4th official's responsibilities have changed/increased since my days of 4th official at football league games.PragueAddick said:
Ah then you need to. The thing is, the deflection aspect was not at all key to my point. I didnt even notice it when I was looking back at it last night. I’d seen enough already. Leko was standing to the right of the keeper whereas the shot passed directly over the keeper’s head. In no way did Leko stop or attempt to stop the keeper from making the save. There was no way he could have saved it. I’m afraid that decision was not derived from anything technical/legal but from the respective personal attributes of the ref and linesman, sorry to say.PeterGage said:
Agreed. However my interpretation of Prague's wording (and my interpretation may be wrong) ie "deflection" is that the defender was not attempting to play the ball.Briston_Addick said:
I would suggest that a defender making a desperate lunge in the final seconds of stoppage time to attempt to block a shot to preserve a lead might just qualify his actions as "deliberate" when determining the nature of the deflection for an offside adjudication.PeterGage said:
A "deflection" does not play an "offside" player onside. The action of a defender has to be deliberate (even if the ball doesnt go where he intended it to go), for the otherwise offside player to be judged onside (second phase).PragueAddick said:
The person to blame is the referee. He had a good view from the right angle. He would have noted (or should have done) that the keeper didn't complain ( @LargeAddick, you never heard Browney lecturing you that player reactions are a great giveaway? - something that Browney himself forgot last night with his initial reaction, before Scotty gently helped him engage his brain). If (and I didn't realise that until this morning,) the shot took a Crewe deflection then Leko may not have been offside anyway.thickandthin63 said:There is only one person to blame for the disallowed goall,Leko,he was offside by miles,he could not have contributed to a goal,he should have just got away from the area quickley,but no when the shot comes in he moves towards the ball,brainless.
Then he sees the linesman has decided to Assert Himself. A linesman whom Terry Smith had been calling out from about the first minute. A linesman who was much further away and more or less level with Leko and the keeper. So, completely unable to judge the flight of the ball and the relevance of Leko's position. And they talked and talked and talked. And the 4th official, who had apparently persuaded the ref earlier to book one of ours, I think Gilbey, goaded by Crewe touchline bullying? Nothing to say, apparently. So the ref bottled it.
We should always be ready to forgive officials for missing incidents, in play. It's an impossible job to get 100% right. But when they make decisions after giving themselves time, (in this case about 2 minutes) and then make such a bad decision., then they have failed to do their job. Just as most of our players failed to do so last night, and for which they are rightly getting pelters. So let's not let that ref off the hook.
Always happy to be proved wrong - I haven't seen the replay.In connection with this, maybe you can clear something up. Are there clear rules/guidelines defining the role of the 4th official in in-game decision-making. When and how might they interact with the ref? I think most of us, including @KillersBeard on commentary, are unsure about this.
The law states that the linesmen are there to assist the referees with onfield decisions, but doesnt include the 4th official in that sentence. The law does go on to state their responsibilities.0 -
And we play a formation that suits none of them.killerandflash said:
For the time being we haveISawLeaburnScore said:We play a system in which the most important players on the pitch are the two wing backs. We do not have a wing back of sufficient quality or consistency in the entire squad on either side, yet we have 4 senior full backs and at least 3 partly-converted wingers.
To date this is something we haven't been able to help - JJ has introduced the formation without any transfer window to recruit for it. The squad and tactics are not aligned. However, if this is the long term formation we need to recruit a starting pair of wing backs. If there is nothing out there for a permanent we need to look into the loan market. Otherwise, this formation needs a rethink. It is always going to be critically limited by playing players in the key positions who are either not capable defensively or offensively.
We clearly need a centre forward as well but in my opinion the wing backs are just as important given the influence that position has on the entire tactical set up.
2 left backs - Purrington and Souare
2 right backs - Gunter and Matthews
4 wingers - DJ, CBT, Kirk, Leko
Not even counting any youngsters in the U23s
That's what we have to play with this season. We can't ship 4 of them out in January, so maybe Jacko needs to change the system to utilise the players we DO have.0 -
you know what? .. this reminds me of some terrible times during the mid to late 1960s (yes ancient history) .. if a player (no names) taking a corner actually got the ball in play from a corner he got a big cheeraltrinchamaddick said:Was at the game, and am a season ticket holder, the issue over the last half dozen games with me is the quality of delivery into the box. Corner kicks, free kicks and threaded passes are all either over hit, under hit or off direction. So we blame the forwards for not scoring, but the quality of delivery into the box is poor. Every team seems to have a player that can deliver a decent corner/free kick, but we don't.
An aside on the referee, who was shit by the way, someone from the Charlton crowd shouted out," are you watching the same game as me ref", and he shouted back NO"!0 -
Who did you have in mind Lincs Harry Gregory or Mike Kenning?😉Lincsaddick said:
you know what? .. this reminds me of some terrible times during the mid to late 1960s (yes ancient history) .. if a player (no names) taking a corner actually got the ball in play from a corner he got a big cheeraltrinchamaddick said:Was at the game, and am a season ticket holder, the issue over the last half dozen games with me is the quality of delivery into the box. Corner kicks, free kicks and threaded passes are all either over hit, under hit or off direction. So we blame the forwards for not scoring, but the quality of delivery into the box is poor. Every team seems to have a player that can deliver a decent corner/free kick, but we don't.
An aside on the referee, who was shit by the way, someone from the Charlton crowd shouted out," are you watching the same game as me ref", and he shouted back NO"!0 -
I think Clare and Dobson are workhorses and are decent athletes but they're missing that bit of quality passing wise that will help push us to promotion .ValleyGary said:
Clare and Dobson have been excellent, even the last few games. Washington is good at this level when he’s playing with a decent forward next to him, he cannot lead the line. The rest are all a bit meh.oohaahmortimer said:I'm not keen on any of em except prolly Stockley , the rest are a bit nothingy , a few can run around a bit , there's fuck all creativity and no one has a shot on em worth a wank ...
crap
Squad members and back up yes , regulars maybe but they'd need some real quality with them to give us a promotion feel0 -
Prague, may I suggest that you go on line and look at the Laws of the Game. The Law number 6, details the responsibilities of the Assistant Referees and the 4th Official.PragueAddick said:
Right, and would you be able to list those responsibilities, or even better just post up the link so I can inform myself. I’m interested among other things in whether no 4 is the primary bod for calculating time to be added on.PeterGage said:
I must admit that I had to look up this one to be sure, knowing that the 4th official's responsibilities have changed/increased since my days of 4th official at football league games.PragueAddick said:
Ah then you need to. The thing is, the deflection aspect was not at all key to my point. I didnt even notice it when I was looking back at it last night. I’d seen enough already. Leko was standing to the right of the keeper whereas the shot passed directly over the keeper’s head. In no way did Leko stop or attempt to stop the keeper from making the save. There was no way he could have saved it. I’m afraid that decision was not derived from anything technical/legal but from the respective personal attributes of the ref and linesman, sorry to say.PeterGage said:
Agreed. However my interpretation of Prague's wording (and my interpretation may be wrong) ie "deflection" is that the defender was not attempting to play the ball.Briston_Addick said:
I would suggest that a defender making a desperate lunge in the final seconds of stoppage time to attempt to block a shot to preserve a lead might just qualify his actions as "deliberate" when determining the nature of the deflection for an offside adjudication.PeterGage said:
A "deflection" does not play an "offside" player onside. The action of a defender has to be deliberate (even if the ball doesnt go where he intended it to go), for the otherwise offside player to be judged onside (second phase).PragueAddick said:
The person to blame is the referee. He had a good view from the right angle. He would have noted (or should have done) that the keeper didn't complain ( @LargeAddick, you never heard Browney lecturing you that player reactions are a great giveaway? - something that Browney himself forgot last night with his initial reaction, before Scotty gently helped him engage his brain). If (and I didn't realise that until this morning,) the shot took a Crewe deflection then Leko may not have been offside anyway.thickandthin63 said:There is only one person to blame for the disallowed goall,Leko,he was offside by miles,he could not have contributed to a goal,he should have just got away from the area quickley,but no when the shot comes in he moves towards the ball,brainless.
Then he sees the linesman has decided to Assert Himself. A linesman whom Terry Smith had been calling out from about the first minute. A linesman who was much further away and more or less level with Leko and the keeper. So, completely unable to judge the flight of the ball and the relevance of Leko's position. And they talked and talked and talked. And the 4th official, who had apparently persuaded the ref earlier to book one of ours, I think Gilbey, goaded by Crewe touchline bullying? Nothing to say, apparently. So the ref bottled it.
We should always be ready to forgive officials for missing incidents, in play. It's an impossible job to get 100% right. But when they make decisions after giving themselves time, (in this case about 2 minutes) and then make such a bad decision., then they have failed to do their job. Just as most of our players failed to do so last night, and for which they are rightly getting pelters. So let's not let that ref off the hook.
Always happy to be proved wrong - I haven't seen the replay.In connection with this, maybe you can clear something up. Are there clear rules/guidelines defining the role of the 4th official in in-game decision-making. When and how might they interact with the ref? I think most of us, including @KillersBeard on commentary, are unsure about this.
The law states that the linesmen are there to assist the referees with onfield decisions, but doesnt include the 4th official in that sentence. The law does go on to state their responsibilities.1 - Sponsored links:
-
Didn’t the 4th official effectively give a penalty against us. Gillingham away, I think last season.0
-
We’ve seen some brainless moments these last two games. That ridiculous free kick late in the first half against Norwich and then Leko standing next to the keeper for that equaliser. Jeez Louise.0
-
Agreed, though harsh to blame Mendez for it though1StevieG said:We’ve seen some brainless moments these last two games. That ridiculous free kick late in the first half against Norwich and then Leko standing next to the keeper for that equaliser. Jeez Louise.7 -
I have absolutely no idea what match you were at, but it wasn't ours.SoundAsa£ said:At the game.
I actually think we deserved a draw……first 20-25 minutes we played very well and were clearly the better side.
Then, quite inexplicably, we seemed to lose our way…..have to say Crewe would have been astounded to have gone in two up, but not to have gone in two down.
Second half was very even until the last 15 minutes when we proceeded to throw the kitchen sink at them and were very very unlucky not to have equalised.
Their keeper was man of the match IMHO.
Having said all that, overall yes…… it was a poor performance there’s no escaping that.3 -
Some of the home games under Luzon were horrendous, as was most of Fraeye’s tenure. Cheltenham at home horrific .RedPanda said:twiggyaddick said:I thought Dagenham 2011 was the nadir of being a Charlton fan, but this feels on a par. When will things actually get better for us and we have more than 1 fleeting season of success surrounded by years of shite
Having been at both, Dagenham was worse. Lincoln was a bit worse than last night as well.
Still registered very highly on the s--- scale though. Shocking performance, I don't understand the disallowed goal but we didn't deserve it anyway0 -
Based on League One. Initially I was unsure about our keeper, but have changed my mind over the season so far. Clare has found a position that warrants a place in the team and I think he is growing in that position. I don't fancy him as a midfielder but he can improve. Dobson is going to be a massive asset for us. I think Lee is more effective with a sharper tip and he is a bit off his game, probably due to confidence but I like him. I think Gilbey has a dynamic game. The goals have dried up but I think he has goals in his game.
DJ needs to improve the consistency of his delivery, but lately he hasn't had anything to deliver to. Leko looked good as a wing back but is not a striker. CBT looked a lot more dangerous before he got injured. Purrington knows where the goal is and is a great option. Also gives us a bit of extra height. Innis looks really good but seems to be made of glass. Pearce has done well but is at the back end of his career. Famewo is very up and down but could turn into a decent player although he isn't there yet. Elerewe looks a great prospect but needs a season or two. Gunter and Matthews are ok players but strangely for their experience are not reliable. Soare just doesn't convince.
Washington is an effective hard working striker. He can lack composure but is effective with multiple threats around him. Davison works very hard and shows the odd flash that he might have something but he looks like he is playing a Division too high at the moment. Stockley is a great option at this level but some big defenders can keep him quiet. Can't argue with his goal ratio though. Burstow looks a prospect but we shouldn't put too much on him too soon.
What we are missing:
I recall Ricky Holmes reliably getting us of a poor performance with his directness and shooting from outside the box. Finding a player like him would change everything.
I look at what we are missing and then look at a player that I think has a lot of what we are missing. It isn't he is the best player in the league but Cole Stockton has a lot of what we are missing. I think we are at a point where a small addition or two could make a massive difference.1 -
Croydon said:
I have absolutely no idea what match you were at, but it wasn't ours.SoundAsa£ said:At the game.
I actually think we deserved a draw……first 20-25 minutes we played very well and were clearly the better side.
Then, quite inexplicably, we seemed to lose our way…..have to say Crewe would have been astounded to have gone in two up, but not to have gone in two down.
Second half was very even until the last 15 minutes when we proceeded to throw the kitchen sink at them and were very very unlucky not to have equalised.
Their keeper was man of the match IMHO.
Having said all that, overall yes…… it was a poor performance there’s no escaping that.
Doesn't ring any bells with me either.
2 -
Lucky our game against Norwich didn't go to extra time, so we could get a big fat zero points three days later.
Funny how football works hey? Applying too much theory and hypothesis does not usually work.0 -
This season I have missed a number of games due to having an operation. I saw the Accrington game and then missed the subsequent matches until Wycombe a couple of weeks ago and sat there wondering what the hell had been going on. The team that had been winning matches was not anywhere to be seen and what I saw was the same toothless performance that I sat through two months before. We have nothing up front without Stockley and this, IMO, is due to the complete imbalance of the squad. We seem to have enough midfield players to put out two teams but no proficient back up strikers. We also have injury prone players like , Innes, who I like by the way, but doesn't seem to be able to complete 90 minutes. The squad is also burdened with expensive passengers like Gunter, whose only apparent contribution to the cause is to siphon much needed money away from the squad which would enable us to recruit fresh blood
I question the recruitment policy completely, this team is actually worse than last year, instead of the improvement we were promised, we have actually gone backwards. mid-table mediocracy is the best we can now hope for. TS seems a decent enough bloke but I wonder if he has the wherewithal to actually fund the building of a new squad? Even in League 1 this isn't cheap, I fear that he hasn't. I hope I'm wrong.1
