Jack Payne - July 2024 signed for Colchester (p14)

paulfox said:

Cafc43v3r said:

paulfox said:

Airman Brown said:

mattinfinland said:

Airman Brown said:

Nug said:

Vincenzo said:

IAgree said:

So a divisive manager, with very patchy experience and success, hired by a narcissist who knows sod all about football, has essentially plundered his old club for a bunch of players who were so great that they were in league two in what should be the high point of their career and we have signed a half dozen academy players? Fabulous!

You must have been furious when we signed Nick Pope and Joe Aribo from non-league clubs. I mean, how good could they be if they're playing for Bury Town and Staines, ffs? 

Not the same though is it? Pope and Aribo were about 19 when they were signed for their potential. I have no idea if this guy or any of the Swindon lads are any good but he’s a 27 year old player from League 2. It’ll be interesting to see how it goes but I do think it’s strange with all the Swindon connections and I believe it’s a concern. However the squad needed an overhaul and this is the level we’re looking at, hopefully it’s enough to push for promotion but I’m not sure it will be.

Absolutely this. Another big question is whether Garner is any good as a manager. I have no idea and I don’t think last season is enough evidence to be confident he is. I’m open minded.

What is clear is that a lot of recruitment / staffing decisions at the club are being financially driven, often around relatively small sums. Of course that is always true to some extent but you can’t argue we’re getting the best of L2 if that is compromised by what we’re willing to pay - the four may not be “L2 players” but that’s no different from saying we’re not a L1 club. 

The five permanent signings will respectively be 28, 27, 26, 25 and 27 in the next few months - they are all mid-career rather than promising youngsters who are typical players moving up (and moving from Lincoln to Charlton is surely moving up). A great deal hangs on the manager’s ability to build a team.
 

Could it also be possible that another reason why TS hasn't thrown money at the squad is because he wants to see the impact Garner has as a manager? Playing it safe so to speak? If we are in a good position in January he may be more willing to use he's checkbook to help us get over the line. 

Not that I have any complaints with our strategy this window. I feel in terms of squad numbers we are in a much better place than last season. 

At this point there is a fair amount of evidence TS regularly overestimates what is achievable on and off the pitch - results, commercial revenue, attendances, international support - even disregarding his more outlandish rhetoric.

The problem with “playing it safe” is that the bill for being in L1 keeps on coming.

You do make TS sound quite a dimwit!!😂, I’d like to be a pound behind him and be so naive and stupid.

He wouldn't be the first highly intelligent, highly successful business man to lose a fortune on a football club and achieve sod all, would he? 

Absolutely not, but he would have known and been advised as to the pitfalls, and it’s his money to do as he likes, none of ours.

paulfox said:

Cafc43v3r said:

paulfox said:

Airman Brown said:

mattinfinland said:

Airman Brown said:

Nug said:

Vincenzo said:

IAgree said:

So a divisive manager, with very patchy experience and success, hired by a narcissist who knows sod all about football, has essentially plundered his old club for a bunch of players who were so great that they were in league two in what should be the high point of their career and we have signed a half dozen academy players? Fabulous!

You must have been furious when we signed Nick Pope and Joe Aribo from non-league clubs. I mean, how good could they be if they're playing for Bury Town and Staines, ffs? 

Not the same though is it? Pope and Aribo were about 19 when they were signed for their potential. I have no idea if this guy or any of the Swindon lads are any good but he’s a 27 year old player from League 2. It’ll be interesting to see how it goes but I do think it’s strange with all the Swindon connections and I believe it’s a concern. However the squad needed an overhaul and this is the level we’re looking at, hopefully it’s enough to push for promotion but I’m not sure it will be.

Absolutely this. Another big question is whether Garner is any good as a manager. I have no idea and I don’t think last season is enough evidence to be confident he is. I’m open minded.

What is clear is that a lot of recruitment / staffing decisions at the club are being financially driven, often around relatively small sums. Of course that is always true to some extent but you can’t argue we’re getting the best of L2 if that is compromised by what we’re willing to pay - the four may not be “L2 players” but that’s no different from saying we’re not a L1 club. 

The five permanent signings will respectively be 28, 27, 26, 25 and 27 in the next few months - they are all mid-career rather than promising youngsters who are typical players moving up (and moving from Lincoln to Charlton is surely moving up). A great deal hangs on the manager’s ability to build a team.
 

Could it also be possible that another reason why TS hasn't thrown money at the squad is because he wants to see the impact Garner has as a manager? Playing it safe so to speak? If we are in a good position in January he may be more willing to use he's checkbook to help us get over the line. 

Not that I have any complaints with our strategy this window. I feel in terms of squad numbers we are in a much better place than last season. 

At this point there is a fair amount of evidence TS regularly overestimates what is achievable on and off the pitch - results, commercial revenue, attendances, international support - even disregarding his more outlandish rhetoric.

The problem with “playing it safe” is that the bill for being in L1 keeps on coming.

You do make TS sound quite a dimwit!!😂, I’d like to be a pound behind him and be so naive and stupid.

He wouldn't be the first highly intelligent, highly successful business man to lose a fortune on a football club and achieve sod all, would he? 

Absolutely not, but he would have known and been advised as to the pitfalls, and it’s his money to do as he likes, none of ours.

Airman Brown said:

paulfox said:

Airman Brown said:

mattinfinland said:

Airman Brown said:

Nug said:

Vincenzo said:

IAgree said:

So a divisive manager, with very patchy experience and success, hired by a narcissist who knows sod all about football, has essentially plundered his old club for a bunch of players who were so great that they were in league two in what should be the high point of their career and we have signed a half dozen academy players? Fabulous!

You must have been furious when we signed Nick Pope and Joe Aribo from non-league clubs. I mean, how good could they be if they're playing for Bury Town and Staines, ffs? 

Not the same though is it? Pope and Aribo were about 19 when they were signed for their potential. I have no idea if this guy or any of the Swindon lads are any good but he’s a 27 year old player from League 2. It’ll be interesting to see how it goes but I do think it’s strange with all the Swindon connections and I believe it’s a concern. However the squad needed an overhaul and this is the level we’re looking at, hopefully it’s enough to push for promotion but I’m not sure it will be.

Absolutely this. Another big question is whether Garner is any good as a manager. I have no idea and I don’t think last season is enough evidence to be confident he is. I’m open minded.

What is clear is that a lot of recruitment / staffing decisions at the club are being financially driven, often around relatively small sums. Of course that is always true to some extent but you can’t argue we’re getting the best of L2 if that is compromised by what we’re willing to pay - the four may not be “L2 players” but that’s no different from saying we’re not a L1 club. 

The five permanent signings will respectively be 28, 27, 26, 25 and 27 in the next few months - they are all mid-career rather than promising youngsters who are typical players moving up (and moving from Lincoln to Charlton is surely moving up). A great deal hangs on the manager’s ability to build a team.
 

Could it also be possible that another reason why TS hasn't thrown money at the squad is because he wants to see the impact Garner has as a manager? Playing it safe so to speak? If we are in a good position in January he may be more willing to use he's checkbook to help us get over the line. 

Not that I have any complaints with our strategy this window. I feel in terms of squad numbers we are in a much better place than last season. 

At this point there is a fair amount of evidence TS regularly overestimates what is achievable on and off the pitch - results, commercial revenue, attendances, international support - even disregarding his more outlandish rhetoric.

The problem with “playing it safe” is that the bill for being in L1 keeps on coming.

You do make TS sound quite a dimwit!!😂, I’d like to be a pound behind him and be so naive and stupid.

You’re nothing if not predictable, but what is your actual point beyond cheerleading? If it’s that TS is at this point a capable and successful leader of our football club I suggest you’re delusional.

You of all people give someone stick for being predictable, pot and kettle I’m afraid. Airman you would find a problem in yourself if you was in charge of the club. I’m far from a cheerleader, just someone willing to let the past go and give people the benefit of doubt. Sorry if that upsets you and you’re little group of followers on here.as I always say provide definitive proof of wrong doing and I have no problem listening.

paulfox said:

swordfish said:

Looks like this is the thread to come to today for a heated debate instead of the weather one.

For my part, I'm neither supreme optimist nor gloomster. More let's wait and see with a hint of new season ahead optimism thrown in for good measure, but only half expecting TS to shell out fees again now (in addition to the compo payments made already that is)

I am the same, but get painted as a cheerleader, just because I’m happy to see how things pan out. If proof is given that things aren’t right I’d happily jump on board if it is for the best of the club.

wmcf123 said:

paulfox said:

cafcfan1990 said:

paulfox said:

cafcfan1990 said:

paulfox said:

Cafc43v3r said:

paulfox said:

Airman Brown said:

mattinfinland said:

Airman Brown said:

Nug said:

Vincenzo said:

IAgree said:

So a divisive manager, with very patchy experience and success, hired by a narcissist who knows sod all about football, has essentially plundered his old club for a bunch of players who were so great that they were in league two in what should be the high point of their career and we have signed a half dozen academy players? Fabulous!

You must have been furious when we signed Nick Pope and Joe Aribo from non-league clubs. I mean, how good could they be if they're playing for Bury Town and Staines, ffs? 

Not the same though is it? Pope and Aribo were about 19 when they were signed for their potential. I have no idea if this guy or any of the Swindon lads are any good but he’s a 27 year old player from League 2. It’ll be interesting to see how it goes but I do think it’s strange with all the Swindon connections and I believe it’s a concern. However the squad needed an overhaul and this is the level we’re looking at, hopefully it’s enough to push for promotion but I’m not sure it will be.

Absolutely this. Another big question is whether Garner is any good as a manager. I have no idea and I don’t think last season is enough evidence to be confident he is. I’m open minded.

What is clear is that a lot of recruitment / staffing decisions at the club are being financially driven, often around relatively small sums. Of course that is always true to some extent but you can’t argue we’re getting the best of L2 if that is compromised by what we’re willing to pay - the four may not be “L2 players” but that’s no different from saying we’re not a L1 club. 

The five permanent signings will respectively be 28, 27, 26, 25 and 27 in the next few months - they are all mid-career rather than promising youngsters who are typical players moving up (and moving from Lincoln to Charlton is surely moving up). A great deal hangs on the manager’s ability to build a team.
 

Could it also be possible that another reason why TS hasn't thrown money at the squad is because he wants to see the impact Garner has as a manager? Playing it safe so to speak? If we are in a good position in January he may be more willing to use he's checkbook to help us get over the line. 

Not that I have any complaints with our strategy this window. I feel in terms of squad numbers we are in a much better place than last season. 

At this point there is a fair amount of evidence TS regularly overestimates what is achievable on and off the pitch - results, commercial revenue, attendances, international support - even disregarding his more outlandish rhetoric.

The problem with “playing it safe” is that the bill for being in L1 keeps on coming.

You do make TS sound quite a dimwit!!😂, I’d like to be a pound behind him and be so naive and stupid.

He wouldn't be the first highly intelligent, highly successful business man to lose a fortune on a football club and achieve sod all, would he? 

Absolutely not, but he would have known and been advised as to the pitfalls, and it’s his money to do as he likes, none of ours.

Except that's not an accurate reflection is it. Because it's quite clear he expected revenue to be greater than it is and he is now talking about running it like other businesses, even "breaking even". He was either advised poorly, ignored the advice or what I believe to be the truth, a bit of both. 

Ok, we are going over old ground now so I’ll leave it.  People know my views, I’m not going to justify them to people as I don’t have to. If people are that unhappy don’t go and dodgy old Thomas won’t take you’re money.

nobody is saying you have to justfy them. But whenever somebody else gives their opinion you dig them out and then when people disagree with you, you just say you don't have to explain yourself. You said "I just try and do my bit go on a Saturday/ Tuesday, and support the team, and leave the politics to people that think they know best". But when you're defending Sandgaard on everything and calling anyone else who doesn't a pessimist, that's not exactly true is it? You seem to think you either have to love everything Sandgaard does or boycott and hate them. You're missing the bit in the middle where I think most of the fans currently sit. 

That’s complete bollox, I have never dug anyone out for being pessimistic, I question why they are absolutely, as most of these people seem to know more than I do, my defence of sandgaard is based upon the fact nobody is giving us a good reason to be against him. I have on many occasions said I’m pretty much in the middle until he  does something disastrously wrong, so please don’t paint a picture of me that’s incorrect. I have a bigger issue with the constant negativity.

Poor appointments , poor recruitment , dubious ticketing policies , putting his son into a key position with no experience, poor managerial selections (I’m not including Garner in this ).  Scepticism is justified surely . 

paulfox said:

Cafc43v3r said:

paulfox said:

Cafc43v3r said:

paulfox said:

Airman Brown said:

mattinfinland said:

Airman Brown said:

Nug said:

Vincenzo said:

IAgree said:

So a divisive manager, with very patchy experience and success, hired by a narcissist who knows sod all about football, has essentially plundered his old club for a bunch of players who were so great that they were in league two in what should be the high point of their career and we have signed a half dozen academy players? Fabulous!

You must have been furious when we signed Nick Pope and Joe Aribo from non-league clubs. I mean, how good could they be if they're playing for Bury Town and Staines, ffs? 

Not the same though is it? Pope and Aribo were about 19 when they were signed for their potential. I have no idea if this guy or any of the Swindon lads are any good but he’s a 27 year old player from League 2. It’ll be interesting to see how it goes but I do think it’s strange with all the Swindon connections and I believe it’s a concern. However the squad needed an overhaul and this is the level we’re looking at, hopefully it’s enough to push for promotion but I’m not sure it will be.

Absolutely this. Another big question is whether Garner is any good as a manager. I have no idea and I don’t think last season is enough evidence to be confident he is. I’m open minded.

What is clear is that a lot of recruitment / staffing decisions at the club are being financially driven, often around relatively small sums. Of course that is always true to some extent but you can’t argue we’re getting the best of L2 if that is compromised by what we’re willing to pay - the four may not be “L2 players” but that’s no different from saying we’re not a L1 club. 

The five permanent signings will respectively be 28, 27, 26, 25 and 27 in the next few months - they are all mid-career rather than promising youngsters who are typical players moving up (and moving from Lincoln to Charlton is surely moving up). A great deal hangs on the manager’s ability to build a team.
 

Could it also be possible that another reason why TS hasn't thrown money at the squad is because he wants to see the impact Garner has as a manager? Playing it safe so to speak? If we are in a good position in January he may be more willing to use he's checkbook to help us get over the line. 

Not that I have any complaints with our strategy this window. I feel in terms of squad numbers we are in a much better place than last season. 

At this point there is a fair amount of evidence TS regularly overestimates what is achievable on and off the pitch - results, commercial revenue, attendances, international support - even disregarding his more outlandish rhetoric.

The problem with “playing it safe” is that the bill for being in L1 keeps on coming.

You do make TS sound quite a dimwit!!😂, I’d like to be a pound behind him and be so naive and stupid.

He wouldn't be the first highly intelligent, highly successful business man to lose a fortune on a football club and achieve sod all, would he? 

Absolutely not, but he would have known and been advised as to the pitfalls, and it’s his money to do as he likes, none of ours.

Of course its his money but do you think the Alan Sugar's of this world were taking their advice from Dave down the pub when they were losing fortunes?

Is that what he has done?, you are far more ITK than me. I just try and do my bit go on a Saturday/ Tuesday, and support the team, and leave the politics to people that think they know best. If TS goes and someone else comes in I will go and do the same. There is a certain element of our fan base that will never be happy.

cafcfan1990 said:

wmcf123 said:

paulfox said:

cafcfan1990 said:

paulfox said:

cafcfan1990 said:

paulfox said:

Cafc43v3r said:

paulfox said:

Airman Brown said:

mattinfinland said:

Airman Brown said:

Nug said:

Vincenzo said:

IAgree said:

So a divisive manager, with very patchy experience and success, hired by a narcissist who knows sod all about football, has essentially plundered his old club for a bunch of players who were so great that they were in league two in what should be the high point of their career and we have signed a half dozen academy players? Fabulous!

You must have been furious when we signed Nick Pope and Joe Aribo from non-league clubs. I mean, how good could they be if they're playing for Bury Town and Staines, ffs? 

Not the same though is it? Pope and Aribo were about 19 when they were signed for their potential. I have no idea if this guy or any of the Swindon lads are any good but he’s a 27 year old player from League 2. It’ll be interesting to see how it goes but I do think it’s strange with all the Swindon connections and I believe it’s a concern. However the squad needed an overhaul and this is the level we’re looking at, hopefully it’s enough to push for promotion but I’m not sure it will be.

Absolutely this. Another big question is whether Garner is any good as a manager. I have no idea and I don’t think last season is enough evidence to be confident he is. I’m open minded.

What is clear is that a lot of recruitment / staffing decisions at the club are being financially driven, often around relatively small sums. Of course that is always true to some extent but you can’t argue we’re getting the best of L2 if that is compromised by what we’re willing to pay - the four may not be “L2 players” but that’s no different from saying we’re not a L1 club. 

The five permanent signings will respectively be 28, 27, 26, 25 and 27 in the next few months - they are all mid-career rather than promising youngsters who are typical players moving up (and moving from Lincoln to Charlton is surely moving up). A great deal hangs on the manager’s ability to build a team.
 

Could it also be possible that another reason why TS hasn't thrown money at the squad is because he wants to see the impact Garner has as a manager? Playing it safe so to speak? If we are in a good position in January he may be more willing to use he's checkbook to help us get over the line. 

Not that I have any complaints with our strategy this window. I feel in terms of squad numbers we are in a much better place than last season. 

At this point there is a fair amount of evidence TS regularly overestimates what is achievable on and off the pitch - results, commercial revenue, attendances, international support - even disregarding his more outlandish rhetoric.

The problem with “playing it safe” is that the bill for being in L1 keeps on coming.

You do make TS sound quite a dimwit!!😂, I’d like to be a pound behind him and be so naive and stupid.

He wouldn't be the first highly intelligent, highly successful business man to lose a fortune on a football club and achieve sod all, would he? 

Absolutely not, but he would have known and been advised as to the pitfalls, and it’s his money to do as he likes, none of ours.

Except that's not an accurate reflection is it. Because it's quite clear he expected revenue to be greater than it is and he is now talking about running it like other businesses, even "breaking even". He was either advised poorly, ignored the advice or what I believe to be the truth, a bit of both. 

Ok, we are going over old ground now so I’ll leave it.  People know my views, I’m not going to justify them to people as I don’t have to. If people are that unhappy don’t go and dodgy old Thomas won’t take you’re money.

nobody is saying you have to justfy them. But whenever somebody else gives their opinion you dig them out and then when people disagree with you, you just say you don't have to explain yourself. You said "I just try and do my bit go on a Saturday/ Tuesday, and support the team, and leave the politics to people that think they know best". But when you're defending Sandgaard on everything and calling anyone else who doesn't a pessimist, that's not exactly true is it? You seem to think you either have to love everything Sandgaard does or boycott and hate them. You're missing the bit in the middle where I think most of the fans currently sit. 

That’s complete bollox, I have never dug anyone out for being pessimistic, I question why they are absolutely, as most of these people seem to know more than I do, my defence of sandgaard is based upon the fact nobody is giving us a good reason to be against him. I have on many occasions said I’m pretty much in the middle until he  does something disastrously wrong, so please don’t paint a picture of me that’s incorrect. I have a bigger issue with the constant negativity.

Poor appointments , poor recruitment , dubious ticketing policies , putting his son into a key position with no experience, poor managerial selections (I’m not including Garner in this ).  Scepticism is justified surely . 

Yeah but apart from that?



I do think that the majority of fans sit in the middle and are willing to let things roll out before making a decision on TS and that is a good thing. Then you have to two opposite sides of the spectrum which keep going over the same stuff but with no outcome. The positive folk ( like me ) support TS and what he is trying to do, yes errors have been made but nowhere near the amount of errors claimed i.e. his son is in charge of recruitment ? no he isnt !!! My point is that we should all be appreciative of the bloke and give him time to either learn on move on. Without him we wouldnt have a club to support now, we wouldnt be signing players. We wouldnt be rowing about where we are going to finish this season. So for that reason alone Im willing to give the guy time personally. Others it seems are not and are forever planting seeds of doubt in cryptic messages but wont actually state any facts if they are known. Others just post total bollox and then say nothing when it is shown to be incorrect.

The day (as some seem to be dreaming of) Barclay rocks up with PV in tow throwing millions around will be a fantastic day ( it aint happening folks) in the meantime we have got what we have got and the bills are being paid, the club isnt being raided financially and hopefully the guy is learning some hard lessons and will get progression. In the meantime as supporters we should be getting behind the club for the start of the season and not bitching all the time. You can be 100% certain that if TS decided to sell up there would be more chance of Bassini buying us than a billionaire so careful what you wish for is all I say