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Dean Holden - Jan 2025: joined the coaching staff at Adana Demispor in Turkey (p47)

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Comments

  • Scoham
    Scoham Posts: 37,386
    Leuth said:
    I wouldn't write Garner off in quite such a cavalier manner as some of you are. When we were good under him, we were very good. Perhaps he didn't quite tailor it to our players, but he did hit on a 4-4-2 with Leaburn, Fraser/Dobbo and Inniss/EOC as the spine, only for injuries to rob him of it 
    Garner can be successful but having a philosophy like his that he sticks to doesn’t align with a club desperate to get promoted and with a limited budget. He needs to be supported with time and the budget to bring in the right type of players. Instead we were renewing Inniss’s contract, making Stockley captain etc.
  • Scoham
    Scoham Posts: 37,386

    @ElfsborgAddick this must give you some comfort? Sounds like he’s a lot closer to Warnock, McCarthy etc than Garner. If Holden gets us to mid table he’d have done as much as any of those three you named could do in the same situation.
  • Garnerball wasn’t suited to average to poor league one players. They are basically just not good enough to have the consistency required. Too many of our players have an enormous mistake in them. I think Garners future is as a coach in the PL and perhaps not manager. 
  • sillav nitram
    sillav nitram Posts: 10,169
    edited January 2023
    PWR

    Don’t know if someone else has posted this? Holden on losing his daughter.

    https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/charlton-manager-dean-holden-daughter-28901815

    Tragic experience.
  • "Pure" coaches/managers do seem to have higher peaks and deeper troughs. I look at Liam Manning at MKD where last season with the right players his team were successful playing great passing football, whereas this year having lost and not adequately replaced many of his best players, it was a real struggle until he got sacked.

    A more pragmatic manager wouldn't have overachieved like Manning did last season, but might have done better this season, grinding out results, rather than trying to play passing football all the time.
  • bolloxbolder
    bolloxbolder Posts: 7,964
    Great interview in the Athletic. Feel comforted in the fact that he will do his very best for us. Sticking his foot through the tactics board at ht v Oxford. Good stuff.
  • Dazzler21
    Dazzler21 Posts: 51,360
    Dazzler21 said:
    If Holden continues to do well there's no doubt he'll be rewarded with a contract. 
    Like Riga you mean.
     Riga was an exception to the rule. He certainly should have been given a contract at that time. We might not be where we are now...
  • FishCostaFortune
    FishCostaFortune Posts: 10,773
    edited January 2023
    This is a really interesting article and although parts of Holdens journey are tragically unique, it does demonstrate the brutality of football for professionals.
  • RedChaser
    RedChaser Posts: 19,886
    edited January 2023
    RC_CAFC said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    thenewbie said:
    thenewbie said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    The guy was offered the job, of course he is going to take it, he'll have faith in his own ability, even Mr Fraeye did.
    My concern is with who appointed him, as long as the sale  goes through, our new owners.
    Nobody will tell me otherwise, putting it mildly, there are a lot more people more qualified and experienced.

    There aren't loads of good managers out there - we've struggled to find them.

    He deserves a chance.
    Rubbish.

    Look at his managerial history.
    What was Bowyer's managerial history? Or Powell's, or Curbs'...
    Holden will almost certainly not be here in 12 months time.

    We should have brought somebody in with experience, without a doubt.
    It's not that simple though is it. A properly proven manager with experience and a good record is never going to take a short term contract at a basket case of a club like this. They don't need to, the risk vs reward is not worth it.

    And until we know if someone, anyone, is actually going to complete a takeover, let alone who that someone is and their relative wealth and experience, no one will be offering the kind of money to tempt a proven name manager in.

    This is fair enough but there MUST be somebody out there more suited.
    Fifty games on a CV when we were 3 or four points off the bottom four is not good enough.
    There cannot be any Charlton fan who was happy when they found out Holden was coming in.
    But is anyone actually more suited? An experienced manager would know that going back to basics and getting the team spirit back... which is what he's doing anyway.

    I was not very impressed at the time and he's far from proven but I genuinely don't think that in our current situation there's any (realistic) options that would have done any better.
    I would have been very sceptical about anyone Thomas appointed on his own.  Holden wouldn't have been my choice, that's probably a good thing because I would have given it to Mick Mccarthy!

    Although some people won't ever be happy if it's not someone from the past, someone who "knows the club".


    McCarthy would have been a good appointment.
    Are you just on the wind up Elfsborg? All our best recent managers have had no experience in management whatsoever and lots of our worst have had loads.

    Holden’s only real previous managerial role saw him have a better win record than the (experienced) Nigel Pearson who took over from him.

    He wasn’t anyone’s first choice, mainly because of the apathy in the club at the time, but he’s made an excellent start and has got that team playing really well already.

    I really like how level headed he seems. Not too high for a win, not too down for a defeat. Just look for the positives and areas to work on and move on to the next.
    You haven’t had the pleasure of meeting Elfs have you ! 😉
  • RedChaser said:
    RC_CAFC said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    thenewbie said:
    thenewbie said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    The guy was offered the job, of course he is going to take it, he'll have faith in his own ability, even Mr Fraeye did.
    My concern is with who appointed him, as long as the sale  goes through, our new owners.
    Nobody will tell me otherwise, putting it mildly, there are a lot more people more qualified and experienced.

    There aren't loads of good managers out there - we've struggled to find them.

    He deserves a chance.
    Rubbish.

    Look at his managerial history.
    What was Bowyer's managerial history? Or Powell's, or Curbs'...
    Holden will almost certainly not be here in 12 months time.

    We should have brought somebody in with experience, without a doubt.
    It's not that simple though is it. A properly proven manager with experience and a good record is never going to take a short term contract at a basket case of a club like this. They don't need to, the risk vs reward is not worth it.

    And until we know if someone, anyone, is actually going to complete a takeover, let alone who that someone is and their relative wealth and experience, no one will be offering the kind of money to tempt a proven name manager in.

    This is fair enough but there MUST be somebody out there more suited.
    Fifty games on a CV when we were 3 or four points off the bottom four is not good enough.
    There cannot be any Charlton fan who was happy when they found out Holden was coming in.
    But is anyone actually more suited? An experienced manager would know that going back to basics and getting the team spirit back... which is what he's doing anyway.

    I was not very impressed at the time and he's far from proven but I genuinely don't think that in our current situation there's any (realistic) options that would have done any better.
    I would have been very sceptical about anyone Thomas appointed on his own.  Holden wouldn't have been my choice, that's probably a good thing because I would have given it to Mick Mccarthy!

    Although some people won't ever be happy if it's not someone from the past, someone who "knows the club".


    McCarthy would have been a good appointment.
    Are you just on the wind up Elfsborg? All our best recent managers have had no experience in management whatsoever and lots of our worst have had loads.

    Holden’s only real previous managerial role saw him have a better win record than the (experienced) Nigel Pearson who took over from him.

    He wasn’t anyone’s first choice, mainly because of the apathy in the club at the time, but he’s made an excellent start and has got that team playing really well already.

    I really like how level headed he seems. Not too high for a win, not too down for a defeat. Just look for the positives and areas to work on and move on to the next.
    You haven’t had the pleasure of meeting Elfs have you ! 😉
    As you are the oldest poster on this board I shall show you the respect you do not give me.

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  • Chunes
    Chunes Posts: 17,356
    edited January 2023
    I hope that ends the argument about whether these players 'always try.'
  • DA9
    DA9 Posts: 11,091
    This is a really interesting article and although parts of Holdens journey are tragically unique, it does demonstrate the brutality of football for professionals.
    Can someone pretty please copy and paste the article for us non subscribers?
  • bolloxbolder
    bolloxbolder Posts: 7,964
    DA9 said:
    This is a really interesting article and although parts of Holdens journey are tragically unique, it does demonstrate the brutality of football for professionals.
    Can someone pretty please copy and paste the article for us non subscribers?
    I'm not a subscriber but got it by saying yes to seeing it in page format?or something like that in a pop up.
  • DA9
    DA9 Posts: 11,091
    The only bit I can see is that he got an Uber from the ground to the Royal Oak…..bet the driver called it a night after that money earner 
  • DA9
    DA9 Posts: 11,091
    DA9 said:
    This is a really interesting article and although parts of Holdens journey are tragically unique, it does demonstrate the brutality of football for professionals.
    Can someone pretty please copy and paste the article for us non subscribers?
    I'm not a subscriber but got it by saying yes to seeing it in page format?or something like that in a pop up.
    not getting that pop up 
  • Great article that, thanks for posting. 
  • Chunes
    Chunes Posts: 17,356
    edited January 2023
    Removepaywall.com is a godsend. Just bookmark it and paste article links in there
  • Such a brilliant article seems a top bloke. Hope the form continues under him.

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  • sillav nitram
    sillav nitram Posts: 10,169
    Yeah, thanks for posting  @rc_cafc
  • Leuth
    Leuth Posts: 23,335
    That's about five cuts above other football writing I usually read... 
  • carly burn
    carly burn Posts: 19,472
    "Dean Holden's Barmy Army". ??
  • Cafc43v3r
    Cafc43v3r Posts: 21,600
    Leuth said:
    That's about five cuts above other football writing I usually read... 
    Try the Plymouth Herald mate, it's coverage of Charlton is second to none. 
  • Callumcafc
    Callumcafc Posts: 63,787
    edited January 2023
    Great article - would have no hesitation in signing up for the Athletic if they did regular Charlton stuff.
  • Talal
    Talal Posts: 11,493
    Have to be honest when he joined I didn't listen to his first interview or the next couple as it felt like he was just passing through and I didn't really care. Having read the Athletic and Mirror interviews I really hope things work out for him here and he sticks around. 
  • RC_CAFC
    RC_CAFC Posts: 1,758
    Feels a bit cheeky so I only do it for Charlton ones, but i find all Athletic articles open up in full on my iPhone if I just press ‘Show reader view’
  • LargeAddick
    LargeAddick Posts: 32,594
    Great article, sounds like a great bloke. Love the fact he still has a season ticket at Old Trafford, must be buzzing for Tuesday. Been through such tragedy too, makes you put all the other stuff into perspective.  If the results keep coming I hope he’s here long term.
  • Dazzler21
    Dazzler21 Posts: 51,360
    Accessible article link...
    https://archive.ph/f6Gvg
  • sholland
    sholland Posts: 485
    DA9 said:
    This is a really interesting article and although parts of Holdens journey are tragically unique, it does demonstrate the brutality of football for professionals.
    Can someone pretty please copy and paste the article for us non subscribers?
    I'm using microsoft edge browser,

    when the Athletic pop up appears right click mouse button on the article, and select 'open in immersive reader' it should then open up the article.