January 2024 Transfer Rumours (D/day starts pg.263)

cantersaddick said:

I have just remembered that at the end of the summer window I said "we might lack quality but we do have depth in most positions" turns out I know nothing about football. No quality and no depth. 

Braziliance said:

None of the links so far have impressed me bar JCH who I suspect we won't shell out for and Docherty could be a coup but again I don't see it. JCH could be formidable with May and Docherty is your very box-to-box type. Would make a great partner with Dobbo assuming the captain stays. 

Coventry I really am not sure about, don't know enough/haven't watched him enough. I've seen a lot of people mention his MK Dons performance, but we are pants and I've seen loads of players do well against us and not light the pitch up in other games. Especially towards the end of Jackos tenure where we genuinely looked useless.

One signing I definitely don't like the sound of is Gillesphey which is probably the one who is a goer out of the lot. We have made the mistake too many times of taking other clubs bit part players who are struggling with injuries in particular. This screams of that. I've seen Plymouth fans annoyed when he allegedly failed the medical and saying 'more bad luck' and seen some pretty in-depth reports on him. 

Basically sounds like he has no pace (which we struggle with as is) isn't particularly strong or an aerial threat but his main strength is he can ping a ball and in a back 3 he is dependable. We don't play a back 3 and as much as I give him grief, we already have Hector who can ping a ball to all of our non-physical forwards. 

Just sounds like an on the cheap window again, especially if we can't get JCH who is proven and does what he says on the tin and we now know is realistic. 

There are quality players in this league and below, why are we going for the ones who are out of favour at their current clubs or coming back from injuries? Same old Charlton for me 

KingKinsella said:

Braziliance said:

fenaddick said:

Braziliance said:

fenaddick said:

Braziliance said:

Henry Irving said:

Any proposed solution to any complex problem which begins "it's simple..." is automatically wrong.

Just spending money isn't enough.

Duchatelet spent so much he lost £13m in a season and we got relegated.

Sandgaard spent a lot of money but a lot of it was wasted on the  likes of Schwarzt and Kirk.

Spending in itself isn't enough, this is the real world not football manager.

Of course, having a bigger budget is a huge advantage but you need to spend it well.

You need a good manager to coach the players you've brought in (radical idea but you could even let the manager pick those players).

You need a balanced squad, you need experience, leadership and flexibility.

You need good  recruitment so you get the right personalities.

You need good scouting to see what opposition are doing.

You need the right sports science people and facilities to get and keep the players fit.

You need good facilities and infrastructure to back up all of that.

You need time and management to build a collection of individuals into a team that is greater than the sum of its parts.

No, it's not "simple". That's what Sandgaard and Duchatelet thought.

We've yet to see if GFP are any better.

Right, back to some rumours now.

Everything you just said is solved by money though and I am saying money gets you out of league 1, I understand the championship is a more complex beast (you spend even more money) 

A good manager, is secured by money or having knowledge of managers on the up, which you need to buy out from their club. 

A balanced squad you gain by spending money, good scouts are on good money, the right sports science, again money.

Everything you said just involves us spending more than the other teams to secure the top staff at this level? 

Sandgaards arrogance, was his downfall, not the size of his wallet. Had he had the right people in his ear, we wouldn't be in this league still. Unfortunately he's his own man and refused to have the humility to let people give him the advice he needed. 

Roland is old news and a lot more complex, he also had us in the championship whereas I am talking about league 1 here. Roland didn't spend the required cash to be competitive in the championship but that's a whole other argument.

Any ownership that comes in and talks about 'building projects' 'plans in place' is talking sh*t to save money. This league is tripe and it's no coincidence all the bigger spenders are in the top 8 (we'd probably be with a decent, non-journeyman manager)

You buy your way out of here, you aim to survive the following season in the championship and then you build there where players are more likely to stay and if they don't they go for reasonable fees. There is no long sustainability in this league or time for 'projects' as seen by our dwindling numbers and loss of interest in Charlton.

It's not just money though, it's money and good decision making. The decision making is where we've been lacking for so so long

You can have all the decision making in the world but cash trumps all. 

I understand where you are coming from though and I have sort of covered that by mentioning Sandgaard. 

Unfortunately based on our recent transfer history and the fact that Appleton is still in post, we evidently have neither currently until proven otherwise.

Think Plymouth are a good example of decision making being more important. Not denying that they've spent money but they're a relatively small club for the Championship and location makes them a hard sell. But they have a good philosophy and set up which has led to 2 coaches in a row being poached. Neither were big name expensive hires. 

Plymouth are a good example but also a bit of an anomaly with the points tally they gained, especially after losing their manager.

Plymouth aren't some fairytale story though, they were the 8th highest spenders in the league in terms of wages and squad value (we were 9th) and the only teams ranked above them were, in order: Peterborough, Derby, Bolton, Barnsley, Ipswich, Portsmouth, Sheffield Wednesday. All of those sides made up the top8 for that season, we were the only side in the top9 spend to not get top 9. 

They utilised the loan market extremely well securing Azaz, Whittaker and Mumba who were all a huge success and pivotal in gaining promotion. 

So although Plymouth are a team who beat the odds slightly, it wasn't a long term project, they heavily relied on outstanding loans and had to spend very competitive wages to gain promotion. 

This season we currently sit in 10th in wages and squad value and are underperforming again. Out of the top 8 current biggest spenders in this league, all 6 of the teams in the play offs currently occupy those slots in the top8 spend. 

It really is just about spending money in one way or another. It's so unlikely you'll ever see a team get promoted from this league doing it any other way. All the best coaches, scouts, players require decent cash, you can't do it on the cheap. Only a few have. 

We shouldn't have to be one of those clubs like Burton who did or Shrewsbury who nearly did as we have more at our disposal every season in this poxy league.

Interested to know your sources on finances? Just enquiring

Braziliance said:

None of the links so far have impressed me bar JCH who I suspect we won't shell out for and Docherty could be a coup but again I don't see it. JCH could be formidable with May and Docherty is your very box-to-box type. Would make a great partner with Dobbo assuming the captain stays. 

Coventry I really am not sure about, don't know enough/haven't watched him enough. I've seen a lot of people mention his MK Dons performance, but we are pants and I've seen loads of players do well against us and not light the pitch up in other games. Especially towards the end of Jackos tenure where we genuinely looked useless.

One signing I definitely don't like the sound of is Gillesphey which is probably the one who is a goer out of the lot. We have made the mistake too many times of taking other clubs bit part players who are struggling with injuries in particular. This screams of that. I've seen Plymouth fans annoyed when he allegedly failed the medical and saying 'more bad luck' and seen some pretty in-depth reports on him. 

Basically sounds like he has no pace (which we struggle with as is) isn't particularly strong or an aerial threat but his main strength is he can ping a ball and in a back 3 he is dependable. We don't play a back 3 and as much as I give him grief, we already have Hector who can ping a ball to all of our non-physical forwards. 

Just sounds like an on the cheap window again, especially if we can't get JCH who is proven and does what he says on the tin and we now know is realistic. 

There are quality players in this league and below, why are we going for the ones who are out of favour at their current clubs or coming back from injuries? Same old Charlton for me 

Callumcafc said:

Braziliance said:

None of the links so far have impressed me bar JCH who I suspect we won't shell out for and Docherty could be a coup but again I don't see it. JCH could be formidable with May and Docherty is your very box-to-box type. Would make a great partner with Dobbo assuming the captain stays. 

Coventry I really am not sure about, don't know enough/haven't watched him enough. I've seen a lot of people mention his MK Dons performance, but we are pants and I've seen loads of players do well against us and not light the pitch up in other games. Especially towards the end of Jackos tenure where we genuinely looked useless.

One signing I definitely don't like the sound of is Gillesphey which is probably the one who is a goer out of the lot. We have made the mistake too many times of taking other clubs bit part players who are struggling with injuries in particular. This screams of that. I've seen Plymouth fans annoyed when he allegedly failed the medical and saying 'more bad luck' and seen some pretty in-depth reports on him. 

Basically sounds like he has no pace (which we struggle with as is) isn't particularly strong or an aerial threat but his main strength is he can ping a ball and in a back 3 he is dependable. We don't play a back 3 and as much as I give him grief, we already have Hector who can ping a ball to all of our non-physical forwards. 

Just sounds like an on the cheap window again, especially if we can't get JCH who is proven and does what he says on the tin and we now know is realistic. 

There are quality players in this league and below, why are we going for the ones who are out of favour at their current clubs or coming back from injuries? Same old Charlton for me 

If we want to replace Hector in the backline, it surely wouldn’t hurt to replace him with what could turn out to be a better version of him.

These Plymouth fans don’t seem too upset at the failed medical rumour: https://pasoti.co.uk/threads/gillesphey.126368/

Braziliance said:

KingKinsella said:

Braziliance said:

fenaddick said:

Braziliance said:

fenaddick said:

Braziliance said:

Henry Irving said:

Any proposed solution to any complex problem which begins "it's simple..." is automatically wrong.

Just spending money isn't enough.

Duchatelet spent so much he lost £13m in a season and we got relegated.

Sandgaard spent a lot of money but a lot of it was wasted on the  likes of Schwarzt and Kirk.

Spending in itself isn't enough, this is the real world not football manager.

Of course, having a bigger budget is a huge advantage but you need to spend it well.

You need a good manager to coach the players you've brought in (radical idea but you could even let the manager pick those players).

You need a balanced squad, you need experience, leadership and flexibility.

You need good  recruitment so you get the right personalities.

You need good scouting to see what opposition are doing.

You need the right sports science people and facilities to get and keep the players fit.

You need good facilities and infrastructure to back up all of that.

You need time and management to build a collection of individuals into a team that is greater than the sum of its parts.

No, it's not "simple". That's what Sandgaard and Duchatelet thought.

We've yet to see if GFP are any better.

Right, back to some rumours now.

Everything you just said is solved by money though and I am saying money gets you out of league 1, I understand the championship is a more complex beast (you spend even more money) 

A good manager, is secured by money or having knowledge of managers on the up, which you need to buy out from their club. 

A balanced squad you gain by spending money, good scouts are on good money, the right sports science, again money.

Everything you said just involves us spending more than the other teams to secure the top staff at this level? 

Sandgaards arrogance, was his downfall, not the size of his wallet. Had he had the right people in his ear, we wouldn't be in this league still. Unfortunately he's his own man and refused to have the humility to let people give him the advice he needed. 

Roland is old news and a lot more complex, he also had us in the championship whereas I am talking about league 1 here. Roland didn't spend the required cash to be competitive in the championship but that's a whole other argument.

Any ownership that comes in and talks about 'building projects' 'plans in place' is talking sh*t to save money. This league is tripe and it's no coincidence all the bigger spenders are in the top 8 (we'd probably be with a decent, non-journeyman manager)

You buy your way out of here, you aim to survive the following season in the championship and then you build there where players are more likely to stay and if they don't they go for reasonable fees. There is no long sustainability in this league or time for 'projects' as seen by our dwindling numbers and loss of interest in Charlton.

It's not just money though, it's money and good decision making. The decision making is where we've been lacking for so so long

You can have all the decision making in the world but cash trumps all. 

I understand where you are coming from though and I have sort of covered that by mentioning Sandgaard. 

Unfortunately based on our recent transfer history and the fact that Appleton is still in post, we evidently have neither currently until proven otherwise.

Think Plymouth are a good example of decision making being more important. Not denying that they've spent money but they're a relatively small club for the Championship and location makes them a hard sell. But they have a good philosophy and set up which has led to 2 coaches in a row being poached. Neither were big name expensive hires. 

Plymouth are a good example but also a bit of an anomaly with the points tally they gained, especially after losing their manager.

Plymouth aren't some fairytale story though, they were the 8th highest spenders in the league in terms of wages and squad value (we were 9th) and the only teams ranked above them were, in order: Peterborough, Derby, Bolton, Barnsley, Ipswich, Portsmouth, Sheffield Wednesday. All of those sides made up the top8 for that season, we were the only side in the top9 spend to not get top 9. 

They utilised the loan market extremely well securing Azaz, Whittaker and Mumba who were all a huge success and pivotal in gaining promotion. 

So although Plymouth are a team who beat the odds slightly, it wasn't a long term project, they heavily relied on outstanding loans and had to spend very competitive wages to gain promotion. 

This season we currently sit in 10th in wages and squad value and are underperforming again. Out of the top 8 current biggest spenders in this league, all 6 of the teams in the play offs currently occupy those slots in the top8 spend. 

It really is just about spending money in one way or another. It's so unlikely you'll ever see a team get promoted from this league doing it any other way. All the best coaches, scouts, players require decent cash, you can't do it on the cheap. Only a few have. 

We shouldn't have to be one of those clubs like Burton who did or Shrewsbury who nearly did as we have more at our disposal every season in this poxy league.

Interested to know your sources on finances? Just enquiring

I don't have a source tbf. I am just basing our wages from what you can find online and what we hear from journos. In the past we have been made aware that we weren't willing to pay the going rates in the championship and then when we came down we wasn't spending big wages then either. It was only Thomas who then upped the wages and by the sounds of things, was a mistake as he was ill advised. We are now suffering from that and new investors who you can probably assume couldn't give a bollock about the future of us are trying to cut costs. 

As for our players wages, I just go by transfermarkt for squad value and then articles about player wages, as an example: 

https://www.peterboroughtoday.co.uk/sport/football/peterborough-united/the-staggering-weekly-wages-of-league-ones-highest-paid-players-and-the-sheffield-wednesday-ipswich-town-derby-county-plymouth-argyle-bolton-wanderers-and-wycombe-wanderers-players-who-make-the-list-3991003

https://salarysport.com/football/league-one/highest-paid/

These two articles align with each other and make sense. 

This site shows us we sit 10th currently: 
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/league-one/marktwerteverein/wettbewerb/GB3

Transfermarkt isn't too far off usually and a pretty credible site.

So all in all based on the calibre of player we sign (injured wantaways usually) the fact we never seem to be able to tie down good players (at risk of losing two currently), that a few journos have said we don't pay good wages and our recent transfer activity. Everything suggests to me that our finances aren't up to much. When they were and we had an ambitious owner (Sandgaard) he was ill  advised, it was all passed away and now we are suffering as he didn't want to see out the project of a failing club

Braziliance said:

None of the links so far have impressed me bar JCH who I suspect we won't shell out for and Docherty could be a coup but again I don't see it. JCH could be formidable with May and Docherty is your very box-to-box type. Would make a great partner with Dobbo assuming the captain stays. 

Coventry I really am not sure about, don't know enough/haven't watched him enough. I've seen a lot of people mention his MK Dons performance, but we are pants and I've seen loads of players do well against us and not light the pitch up in other games. Especially towards the end of Jackos tenure where we genuinely looked useless.

One signing I definitely don't like the sound of is Gillesphey which is probably the one who is a goer out of the lot. We have made the mistake too many times of taking other clubs bit part players who are struggling with injuries in particular. This screams of that. I've seen Plymouth fans annoyed when he allegedly failed the medical and saying 'more bad luck' and seen some pretty in-depth reports on him. 

Basically sounds like he has no pace (which we struggle with as is) isn't particularly strong or an aerial threat but his main strength is he can ping a ball and in a back 3 he is dependable. We don't play a back 3 and as much as I give him grief, we already have Hector who can ping a ball to all of our non-physical forwards. 

Just sounds like an on the cheap window again, especially if we can't get JCH who is proven and does what he says on the tin and we now know is realistic. 

There are quality players in this league and below, why are we going for the ones who are out of favour at their current clubs or coming back from injuries? Same old Charlton for me 

NabySarr said:

Braziliance said:

None of the links so far have impressed me bar JCH who I suspect we won't shell out for and Docherty could be a coup but again I don't see it. JCH could be formidable with May and Docherty is your very box-to-box type. Would make a great partner with Dobbo assuming the captain stays. 

Coventry I really am not sure about, don't know enough/haven't watched him enough. I've seen a lot of people mention his MK Dons performance, but we are pants and I've seen loads of players do well against us and not light the pitch up in other games. Especially towards the end of Jackos tenure where we genuinely looked useless.

One signing I definitely don't like the sound of is Gillesphey which is probably the one who is a goer out of the lot. We have made the mistake too many times of taking other clubs bit part players who are struggling with injuries in particular. This screams of that. I've seen Plymouth fans annoyed when he allegedly failed the medical and saying 'more bad luck' and seen some pretty in-depth reports on him. 

Basically sounds like he has no pace (which we struggle with as is) isn't particularly strong or an aerial threat but his main strength is he can ping a ball and in a back 3 he is dependable. We don't play a back 3 and as much as I give him grief, we already have Hector who can ping a ball to all of our non-physical forwards. 

Just sounds like an on the cheap window again, especially if we can't get JCH who is proven and does what he says on the tin and we now know is realistic. 

There are quality players in this league and below, why are we going for the ones who are out of favour at their current clubs or coming back from injuries? Same old Charlton for me 

We haven’t signed any of them yet so it means nothing, but I think all 4 look like they’d be good signings. Personally Coventry and Docherty would be the standouts so I hope we get at least 1 of them done 

There is nothing wrong with signing players from leagues above, in fact it should be encouraged surely? Better than the likes of Jaiyesimi, Payne, Egbo, Kirk, Lavelle etc that we’ve signed from Leagues 1 & 2. The best L1/L2 players cost millions nowadays, we can’t afford that. Better players for better value exist in championship squads 

AFKABartram said:

Charlton Life are delighted to announce the permanent signing of the letter ‘s’. It’s fit and available for immediate selection, and goes straight into the title of the popular thread ‘January 2024 Transfer Rumour’.

Charlton Life’s owners were keen to pounce early in the window following growing criticism that thread titles were not properly resourced. We’re delighted to secure the popular additional letter and fought off Championship interest from nearby rivals Millwall Online, for their thread ‘Wotz you favourite bicuit’

Chunes said:

Ah right. I wondered where it came from. But I guess 22 of those games are this season which I presume he's missed because he's not first choice anymore, so if you remove that, he's played 79 of 99. 

If there is anything wrong with his groin at all then I hope we pass. 

Callumcafc said:

NabySarr said:

Braziliance said:

None of the links so far have impressed me bar JCH who I suspect we won't shell out for and Docherty could be a coup but again I don't see it. JCH could be formidable with May and Docherty is your very box-to-box type. Would make a great partner with Dobbo assuming the captain stays. 

Coventry I really am not sure about, don't know enough/haven't watched him enough. I've seen a lot of people mention his MK Dons performance, but we are pants and I've seen loads of players do well against us and not light the pitch up in other games. Especially towards the end of Jackos tenure where we genuinely looked useless.

One signing I definitely don't like the sound of is Gillesphey which is probably the one who is a goer out of the lot. We have made the mistake too many times of taking other clubs bit part players who are struggling with injuries in particular. This screams of that. I've seen Plymouth fans annoyed when he allegedly failed the medical and saying 'more bad luck' and seen some pretty in-depth reports on him. 

Basically sounds like he has no pace (which we struggle with as is) isn't particularly strong or an aerial threat but his main strength is he can ping a ball and in a back 3 he is dependable. We don't play a back 3 and as much as I give him grief, we already have Hector who can ping a ball to all of our non-physical forwards. 

Just sounds like an on the cheap window again, especially if we can't get JCH who is proven and does what he says on the tin and we now know is realistic. 

There are quality players in this league and below, why are we going for the ones who are out of favour at their current clubs or coming back from injuries? Same old Charlton for me 

We haven’t signed any of them yet so it means nothing, but I think all 4 look like they’d be good signings. Personally Coventry and Docherty would be the standouts so I hope we get at least 1 of them done 

There is nothing wrong with signing players from leagues above, in fact it should be encouraged surely? Better than the likes of Jaiyesimi, Payne, Egbo, Kirk, Lavelle etc that we’ve signed from Leagues 1 & 2. The best L1/L2 players cost millions nowadays, we can’t afford that. Better players for better value exist in championship squads 

Signing from league above = castoffs or injury prone, not willing to pay the going rate for a good one

Signings from this league = just because he played well against us doesn’t mean anything, probably wants more than we’re willing to pay

Signings from league below = never going to make the step up, won’t want a big wage

These are the conclusions you can draw when you have a pre-determined outcome in your head.

Bubble said:

https://www.thestar.co.uk/sport/football/sheffield-wednesday/sheffield-wednesday-charlton-athletic-tyreeq-bakinson-4466932