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Jones' press conference
Comments
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You don't explain yourself, so I will leave you to your imagination.Leroy Ambrose said:
You know exactly what I mean, you disingenuous caricatureseth plum said:
If you can explain what you mean by 'well' I might be able to answer your question.Leroy Ambrose said:
You're not a well man, are you?seth plum said:Not as bad as ‘obviously’.
Personally I despise the use of ‘obviously’ which is a way of saying ‘I am totally right about this’.
Oh yeah?
Like saying ‘obviously immigration is a problem’, when it can easily be argued that immigration is a blessing.
A person saying ‘obviously’ is chasing the high ground of rightness, and so if it isn’t obvious to you, then you’re a lesser person compared to them.
I position ‘obviously’ in the same category as people who wear cravats and ties when it is not for work, in my mind they are very dubious pricks.4 -
Totally agree with your last sentence. But would prefer to have May upfront than any of the others bar Godden.Scoham said:
As good as May is, I think the goals drying up is more about how poor we are in possession and at creating chances, rather than having a better player to take the few chances we create.golfaddick said:
It was the pressing thing & the defensive aspect that got me. Yes, we might have kept more clean sheets than last season but the goals have dried up. And why is that ?? Because we lost the season's top goalscorer. In fact, a goalscorer who score 20+ goals in his last 3 seasons.Braziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
We can press as much as we like but when we do get the ball we have no idea how to score.
Between the various strikers we have and players like Berry and TC we have players who could score a decent if not great number of goals.
But how can they do that when the ball is hoofed long for them to chase, we don't have much of a threat from out wide and so little creativity in the middle of midfield?
May would have scored goals despite the limited service, just as Godden has. He wouldn't thrive in this team though, he'd suffer just like our strikers currently are. They're made to look worse than they are because Jones puts so little focus on ball retention, chance creation, and signing players who have those abilities.
I'd rather sign a 2/3 wingers/creative midfielders in January over 2/3 better strikers.1 -
Absolute mugseth plum said:
You don't explain yourself, so I will leave you to your imagination.Leroy Ambrose said:
You know exactly what I mean, you disingenuous caricatureseth plum said:
If you can explain what you mean by 'well' I might be able to answer your question.Leroy Ambrose said:
You're not a well man, are you?seth plum said:Not as bad as ‘obviously’.
Personally I despise the use of ‘obviously’ which is a way of saying ‘I am totally right about this’.
Oh yeah?
Like saying ‘obviously immigration is a problem’, when it can easily be argued that immigration is a blessing.
A person saying ‘obviously’ is chasing the high ground of rightness, and so if it isn’t obvious to you, then you’re a lesser person compared to them.
I position ‘obviously’ in the same category as people who wear cravats and ties when it is not for work, in my mind they are very dubious pricks.2 -
The annoying thing is not only the results it's the style. We have arguably the worst football style in the whole division. Going out on a limb, if we actually have better players than the REALLY bad teams at the bottom, then why do we make our football so bloody awful on the eye. I know it's a results based business, but to get people in the ground, we also need attractive football. I've watched probably 17 games this season and immediately after almost all, regretted the time spent watching. Win, lose or draw, I'm left feeling it was all a bit crap.
Jones MUST change the style, or if the players can only play that way (which is what he is saying), then sell them (that's a laugh) and bring in players that can actually play something that resembles football. FFS, watching us against Crawley looked like we had entered Europe and we were up against Real Madrid!!9 -
We aren’t as good as he says we are, but without the ball we are one of the best teams in the leagueBraziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
In terms of pressing, if you look as PPDA (passes per defensive action) and high recoveries. Which are two measures commonly used to measure how well a team presses, we are up there on both. As well as xG conceded. If you look at the stats we are a very good team without the ball, maybe not the best but probably 2nd or 3rd best behind Birmingham and maybe Stevenage, who both perform well across those measures
We are absolutely terrible with the ball of course
Jones is a bullshitter but for him this isn’t that bad of a claim5 -
Zero evidence to suggest TC could score a decent number of goals imoScoham said:
As good as May is, I think the goals drying up is more about how poor we are in possession and at creating chances, rather than having a better player to take the few chances we create.golfaddick said:
It was the pressing thing & the defensive aspect that got me. Yes, we might have kept more clean sheets than last season but the goals have dried up. And why is that ?? Because we lost the season's top goalscorer. In fact, a goalscorer who score 20+ goals in his last 3 seasons.Braziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
We can press as much as we like but when we do get the ball we have no idea how to score.
Between the various strikers we have and players like Berry and TC we have players who could score a decent if not great number of goals.
But how can they do that when the ball is hoofed long for them to chase, we don't have much of a threat from out wide and so little creativity in the middle of midfield?
May would have scored goals despite the limited service, just as Godden has. He wouldn't thrive in this team though, he'd suffer just like our strikers currently are. They're made to look worse than they are because Jones puts so little focus on ball retention, chance creation, and signing players who have those abilities.
I'd rather sign a 2/3 wingers/creative midfielders in January over 2/3 better strikers.9 -
Good questions and good answers in that one.
I've come to realise that I always have hope when it comes to Charlton. When Jones says we could be in the top 6 at the turn of the year, I know the evidence of how bad we've been suggests it is beyond unlikely. However... I know I'll be watching and willing us to win believing it is possible.
COYR!3 -
So we aren't the best then?NabySarr said:
We aren’t as good as he says we are, but without the ball we are one of the best teams in the leagueBraziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
In terms of pressing, if you look as PPDA (passes per defensive action) and high recoveries. Which are two measures commonly used to measure how well a team presses, we are up there on both. As well as xG conceded. If you look at the stats we are a very good team without the ball, maybe not the best but probably 2nd or 3rd best behind Birmingham and maybe Stevenage, who both perform well across those measures
We are absolutely terrible with the ball of course
Jones is a bullshitter but for him this isn’t that bad of a claim
"Look there isn't a better pressing team in the division than us, like, statistically, or, or otherwise"
"We pride ourselves on being outstanding out of possession"
"There were occasions, I think 1 or 2 occasions in the 90 minutes where they played through us and got a cross, half an opportunity, that never happens to us"
The best pressing team, but the stats don't prove it, and Wigan, Huddersfield, Stevenage, Birmingham and Wrexham have all conceded less than us.
If our manager says no one is better than us, I want that to be the truth. The stats don't show it is, our defensive record doesn't suggest we press the best, and when I watch the games, I don't see it either, as there's multiple occasions per game where a player isn't closed down, and the other team get a chance for it.
It may come across as though I'm being extra, but when a manager speaks, it shouldn't be bollocks. If he said "I believe we are one of the best pressers in the league, we are right up there in that department" that's completely different. To dismiss the teams that are better than us at it, while also being shit at football, is a delusional and arrogant take.
He's up against it, and he's talking waffle to cover his arse. We can all see we aren't anything special off the ball, as its been noted multiple times how we lack aggression and drive, so why make out like things are all dandy when they aren't.15 -
Conceding less goals isn’t the best way to measure a good pressing side. Using the stats that analysts would use, we are one of the best teams without the ball in the league, that’s a fact. He should have said that insstead, you are right and I don’t like it either. I try and avoid his interviews and press conferences tbh, he’s not learned from his Southampton experienceBraziliance said:
So we aren't the best then?NabySarr said:
We aren’t as good as he says we are, but without the ball we are one of the best teams in the leagueBraziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
In terms of pressing, if you look as PPDA (passes per defensive action) and high recoveries. Which are two measures commonly used to measure how well a team presses, we are up there on both. As well as xG conceded. If you look at the stats we are a very good team without the ball, maybe not the best but probably 2nd or 3rd best behind Birmingham and maybe Stevenage, who both perform well across those measures
We are absolutely terrible with the ball of course
Jones is a bullshitter but for him this isn’t that bad of a claim
"Look there isn't a better pressing team in the division than us, like, statistically, or, or otherwise"
"We pride ourselves on being outstanding out of possession"
"There were occasions, I think 1 or 2 occasions in the 90 minutes where they played through us and got a cross, half an opportunity, that never happens to us"
The best pressing team, but the stats don't prove it, and Wigan, Huddersfield, Stevenage, Birmingham and Wrexham have all conceded less than us.
If our manager says no one is better than us, I want that to be the truth. The stats don't show it is, our defensive record doesn't suggest we press the best, and when I watch the games, I don't see it either, as there's multiple occasions per game where a player isn't closed down, and the other team get a chance for it.
It may come across as though I'm being extra, but when a manager speaks, it shouldn't be bollocks. If he said "I believe we are one of the best pressers in the league, we are right up there in that department" that's completely different. To dismiss the teams that are better than us at it, while also being shit at football, is a delusional and arrogant take.
He's up against it, and he's talking waffle to cover his arse. We can all see we aren't anything special off the ball, as it’s been noted multiple times how we lack aggression and drive, so why make out like things are all dandy when they aren't.2 -
I meant he’d contribute in that group over a season, even if only 4/5 it’s more than we’re getting from him now. He’d stand a much better chance if he was on the left wing in a team that actually played football.Croydon said:
Zero evidence to suggest TC could score a decent number of goals imoScoham said:
As good as May is, I think the goals drying up is more about how poor we are in possession and at creating chances, rather than having a better player to take the few chances we create.golfaddick said:
It was the pressing thing & the defensive aspect that got me. Yes, we might have kept more clean sheets than last season but the goals have dried up. And why is that ?? Because we lost the season's top goalscorer. In fact, a goalscorer who score 20+ goals in his last 3 seasons.Braziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
We can press as much as we like but when we do get the ball we have no idea how to score.
Between the various strikers we have and players like Berry and TC we have players who could score a decent if not great number of goals.
But how can they do that when the ball is hoofed long for them to chase, we don't have much of a threat from out wide and so little creativity in the middle of midfield?
May would have scored goals despite the limited service, just as Godden has. He wouldn't thrive in this team though, he'd suffer just like our strikers currently are. They're made to look worse than they are because Jones puts so little focus on ball retention, chance creation, and signing players who have those abilities.
I'd rather sign a 2/3 wingers/creative midfielders in January over 2/3 better strikers.
I agree he won’t in this squad and style under Jones.5 - Sponsored links:
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Bringing up a friendly v Pompey for one of 3 good games at The Valley is desperation.
Saying we are bold for aiming for top 6 (when we have a top 4 budget and he raved about our summer transfer dealing) is contradictory.
Saying he wanted to move on Taylor in the summer whom he never gave any sort of chance last season even when we were safe, but is then surprised at the quality of makes me question judgement.
Saying there is a golden thread through the club with a lot of things right, including recruitment is nuts.
Saying league form is inconsistent when we have 1 win in 8 and 2 in 11 is demonstrably wrong.
.
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When he talks about our teams pressing being the best, could he be referring to us doing a bit of laundry on the side to earn a bit of bunce, and keep all the crocked players from hanging around the training ground cluttering up the place?1
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One of the things that might make me believe he can turn things around is if I was convinced he had a pin sharp grasp of what was wrong and what was needed to rectify it.
Nothing he says ever convinces me, in fact I find his interviews painful.
Meanwhile our whole attacking strategy is a triumph of hope over expectation.
Every game I sit there in a state of frustration and anxiety, desperate that something will fall for us and that something will change and give me the adrenaline rush of expectation and belief.
The joylessness continues.
4 -
The best pressing teams have lively and super persistent forwards and midfielders, who hunt defenders in packs, closing them down to prevent them passing it out, winning the ball up the pitch and creating chances that way.
I thought we started the season in that mode. In August we looked super sharp and fit, and swamped opponents. We weren't very creative, but at the time we pressed so well and looked so solid that the lack of attacking flair didn't matter. Unfortunately, we still don't have attacking flair, and that solidity and press have dissipated.
3 of the 7 clean sheets were the first 3 games of the season, 4 in the next 15 doesn't sound so impressive.
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Agreed, it's odd the way he treated Taylor. I don't believe that he left him out at the end of last season to protect him after his injury, as if he was that important and valued he would have been straight in the team in pre season and the start of the season, not left out of the 18 completely until mid October.Athletico Charlton said:Bringing up a friendly v Pompey for one of 3 good games at The Valley is desperation.
Saying we are bold for aiming for top 6 (when we have a top 4 budget and he raved about our summer transfer dealing) is contradictory.
Saying he wanted to move on Taylor in the summer whom he never gave any sort of chance last season even when we were safe, but is then surprised at the quality of makes me question judgement.
Saying there is a golden thread through the club with a lot of things right, including recruitment is nuts.
Saying league form is inconsistent when we have 1 win in 8 and 2 in 11 is demonstrably wrong.
.
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I think it’s more cynical than that. I think he was kept out to protect against injury but only because if he was injured there was no chance at all another team would come in for himkillerandflash said:
Agreed, it's odd the way he treated Taylor. I don't believe that he left him out at the end of last season to protect him after his injury, as if he was that important and valued he would have been straight in the team in pre season and the start of the season, not left out of the 18 completely until mid October.Athletico Charlton said:Bringing up a friendly v Pompey for one of 3 good games at The Valley is desperation.
Saying we are bold for aiming for top 6 (when we have a top 4 budget and he raved about our summer transfer dealing) is contradictory.
Saying he wanted to move on Taylor in the summer whom he never gave any sort of chance last season even when we were safe, but is then surprised at the quality of makes me question judgement.
Saying there is a golden thread through the club with a lot of things right, including recruitment is nuts.
Saying league form is inconsistent when we have 1 win in 8 and 2 in 11 is demonstrably wrong.
.3 -
Yeah that's true, I do see your point. I suppose I'm just pissed off with him. If we were winning and he said it, I probably wouldn't care. Because we have been so abysmal, it irritates me that's he's glossing over it all.NabySarr said:
Conceding less goals isn’t the best way to measure a good pressing side. Using the stats that analysts would use, we are one of the best teams without the ball in the league, that’s a fact. He should have said that insstead, you are right and I don’t like it either. I try and avoid his interviews and press conferences tbh, he’s not learned from his Southampton experienceBraziliance said:
So we aren't the best then?NabySarr said:
We aren’t as good as he says we are, but without the ball we are one of the best teams in the leagueBraziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
In terms of pressing, if you look as PPDA (passes per defensive action) and high recoveries. Which are two measures commonly used to measure how well a team presses, we are up there on both. As well as xG conceded. If you look at the stats we are a very good team without the ball, maybe not the best but probably 2nd or 3rd best behind Birmingham and maybe Stevenage, who both perform well across those measures
We are absolutely terrible with the ball of course
Jones is a bullshitter but for him this isn’t that bad of a claim
"Look there isn't a better pressing team in the division than us, like, statistically, or, or otherwise"
"We pride ourselves on being outstanding out of possession"
"There were occasions, I think 1 or 2 occasions in the 90 minutes where they played through us and got a cross, half an opportunity, that never happens to us"
The best pressing team, but the stats don't prove it, and Wigan, Huddersfield, Stevenage, Birmingham and Wrexham have all conceded less than us.
If our manager says no one is better than us, I want that to be the truth. The stats don't show it is, our defensive record doesn't suggest we press the best, and when I watch the games, I don't see it either, as there's multiple occasions per game where a player isn't closed down, and the other team get a chance for it.
It may come across as though I'm being extra, but when a manager speaks, it shouldn't be bollocks. If he said "I believe we are one of the best pressers in the league, we are right up there in that department" that's completely different. To dismiss the teams that are better than us at it, while also being shit at football, is a delusional and arrogant take.
He's up against it, and he's talking waffle to cover his arse. We can all see we aren't anything special off the ball, as it’s been noted multiple times how we lack aggression and drive, so why make out like things are all dandy when they aren't.
You'd have thought he'd have learned from Stoke and Southampton, but here we are.1 -
It seems he has a personality that if things are going well, he's fantastic. But when pear shaped he can upset people easily.
I imagine it is not a happy ship at Sparrows Lane.8 -
He's a fucking moron8
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That is the biggest load of waffle I've read on here in a long time. Just word salad.NabySarr said:
We aren’t as good as he says we are, but without the ball we are one of the best teams in the leagueBraziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
In terms of pressing, if you look as PPDA (passes per defensive action) and high recoveries. Which are two measures commonly used to measure how well a team presses, we are up there on both. As well as xG conceded. If you look at the stats we are a very good team without the ball, maybe not the best but probably 2nd or 3rd best behind Birmingham and maybe Stevenage, who both perform well across those measures
We are absolutely terrible with the ball of course
Jones is a bullshitter but for him this isn’t that bad of a claim
Can you imagine Brian Cough coming out with bollox like that ? Football is such a simple game. No need for PPDA (wtf !) or XG. When you have the ball go forwards with it & make sure when you are near the box you give it to the 2 or 3 "forwards" to shoot at the big netty thing. And when you dont have the ball make sure when it comes towards your goal you kick or head it away.
Score more goals than your opponent and you win the game. End of.
No coaching badges or excel spreadsheets necessary.
9 - Sponsored links:
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Which bits ?bertpalmer said:I still like him0 -
ElfsborgAddick said:It seems he has a personality that if things are going well, he's fantastic. But when pear shaped he can upset people easily.
I imagine it is not a happy ship at Sparrows Lane.
I think this is it exactly. I also think he's probably someone that when things are going badly players see straight through and especially the touchline antics.
I don't if he's got it in him to turn this around because it would require him to admit he's got it wrong this season in the main.3 -
It definitely didn't help losing Lloyd Jones for 6 weeks either though I think he lifts the whole defense. It's not a coincidence IMO I think that a lot of the reason for only 4 in 15 is down to that.killerandflash said:The best pressing teams have lively and super persistent forwards and midfielders, who hunt defenders in packs, closing them down to prevent them passing it out, winning the ball up the pitch and creating chances that way.
I thought we started the season in that mode. In August we looked super sharp and fit, and swamped opponents. We weren't very creative, but at the time we pressed so well and looked so solid that the lack of attacking flair didn't matter. Unfortunately, we still don't have attacking flair, and that solidity and press have dissipated.
3 of the 7 clean sheets were the first 3 games of the season, 4 in the next 15 doesn't sound so impressive.2 -
Absolutely. TC is a real threat when he's wide left. Trying to play him as a striker or a right wing back isn’t doing the lad any good.Scoham said:
I meant he’d contribute in that group over a season, even if only 4/5 it’s more than we’re getting from him now. He’d stand a much better chance if he was on the left wing in a team that actually played football.Croydon said:
Zero evidence to suggest TC could score a decent number of goals imoScoham said:
As good as May is, I think the goals drying up is more about how poor we are in possession and at creating chances, rather than having a better player to take the few chances we create.golfaddick said:
It was the pressing thing & the defensive aspect that got me. Yes, we might have kept more clean sheets than last season but the goals have dried up. And why is that ?? Because we lost the season's top goalscorer. In fact, a goalscorer who score 20+ goals in his last 3 seasons.Braziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
We can press as much as we like but when we do get the ball we have no idea how to score.
Between the various strikers we have and players like Berry and TC we have players who could score a decent if not great number of goals.
But how can they do that when the ball is hoofed long for them to chase, we don't have much of a threat from out wide and so little creativity in the middle of midfield?
May would have scored goals despite the limited service, just as Godden has. He wouldn't thrive in this team though, he'd suffer just like our strikers currently are. They're made to look worse than they are because Jones puts so little focus on ball retention, chance creation, and signing players who have those abilities.
I'd rather sign a 2/3 wingers/creative midfielders in January over 2/3 better strikers.
I agree he won’t in this squad and style under Jones.2 -
Orpingtony said:
Absolutely. TC is a real threat when he's wide left. Trying to play him as a striker or a right wing back isn’t doing the lad any good.Scoham said:
I meant he’d contribute in that group over a season, even if only 4/5 it’s more than we’re getting from him now. He’d stand a much better chance if he was on the left wing in a team that actually played football.Croydon said:
Zero evidence to suggest TC could score a decent number of goals imoScoham said:
As good as May is, I think the goals drying up is more about how poor we are in possession and at creating chances, rather than having a better player to take the few chances we create.golfaddick said:
It was the pressing thing & the defensive aspect that got me. Yes, we might have kept more clean sheets than last season but the goals have dried up. And why is that ?? Because we lost the season's top goalscorer. In fact, a goalscorer who score 20+ goals in his last 3 seasons.Braziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
We can press as much as we like but when we do get the ball we have no idea how to score.
Between the various strikers we have and players like Berry and TC we have players who could score a decent if not great number of goals.
But how can they do that when the ball is hoofed long for them to chase, we don't have much of a threat from out wide and so little creativity in the middle of midfield?
May would have scored goals despite the limited service, just as Godden has. He wouldn't thrive in this team though, he'd suffer just like our strikers currently are. They're made to look worse than they are because Jones puts so little focus on ball retention, chance creation, and signing players who have those abilities.
I'd rather sign a 2/3 wingers/creative midfielders in January over 2/3 better strikers.
I agree he won’t in this squad and style under Jones.
This is where we miss CBT who despite being erratic could go past a RB on the inside or outside because he was two footed. The inverse winger/wide forwards will cut back on to his strong foot which a decent full back should read at the mediocre 3rd tier level.
In the Premier most of the wide forwards play on their 'wrong side' but because of their skill levels it works fine.
Tyreece on the right gives shape and width and the crying shame is the disappearance of Ramsey who may or not have a long term injury since the secrecy act I/we don't know.
T. Campbell is a wide right forward and like Corey Blackett-Taylor doesn't have the defensive ability to be a wing back from what we have seen. If the opposition have a thick RB then TC can be effective on the left cutting inside but personally I would rather have Small or Edwards crossing with their left foot in advanced positions.
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No need for it yet pretty much every team in football uses it. I’m sure you know better than everyone involved in football though so fair enoughgolfaddick said:
That is the biggest load of waffle I've read on here in a long time. Just word salad.NabySarr said:
We aren’t as good as he says we are, but without the ball we are one of the best teams in the leagueBraziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
In terms of pressing, if you look as PPDA (passes per defensive action) and high recoveries. Which are two measures commonly used to measure how well a team presses, we are up there on both. As well as xG conceded. If you look at the stats we are a very good team without the ball, maybe not the best but probably 2nd or 3rd best behind Birmingham and maybe Stevenage, who both perform well across those measures
We are absolutely terrible with the ball of course
Jones is a bullshitter but for him this isn’t that bad of a claim
Can you imagine Brian Cough coming out with bollox like that ? Football is such a simple game. No need for PPDA (wtf !) or XG. When you have the ball go forwards with it & make sure when you are near the box you give it to the 2 or 3 "forwards" to shoot at the big netty thing. And when you dont have the ball make sure when it comes towards your goal you kick or head it away.
Score more goals than your opponent and you win the game. End of.
No coaching badges or excel spreadsheets necessary.
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Yeah so do I, I thought he was quiet candid, and I thought he was pretty honest with Rich Cawley, nothing defensive about itbertpalmer said:I still like him0 -
Say no more
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I just want to watch my team and feel some excitement. We desperately need some wingers and a creative midfielder the type we thought Berry would be. I can't believe the way he's got us playing it's almost like he respects the teams in this league too much we never "have a go" it's so so poor I honestly can't wait for him to leave. I'd honestly rather have Jacko here as manager and Pearce as his number two
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Where are the stats that you refer to so we can make our own judgement on this ?NabySarr said:
Conceding less goals isn’t the best way to measure a good pressing side. Using the stats that analysts would use, we are one of the best teams without the ball in the league, that’s a fact. He should have said that insstead, you are right and I don’t like it either. I try and avoid his interviews and press conferences tbh, he’s not learned from his Southampton experienceBraziliance said:
So we aren't the best then?NabySarr said:
We aren’t as good as he says we are, but without the ball we are one of the best teams in the leagueBraziliance said:He's actually full of shit.
Says we are the best pressing team, there is no evidence of this. The table doesn't say so, the stats don't say so, our goals conceded don't say so. It's pretty much just a lie.
He also said at the end we aren't as bad as last season. Well, I've got some news Jones mate, we are. Actually, we are worse off.
Even if he meant from when he took over, that would be incomparable due to the games played, and if anything, makes his argument worse as he had preparation time to improve on this.
We are worse off in literally every aspect of the table.
In 23/24 by this stage we had scored 30 and conceded 25, and had a 5 goal difference.
This season we have scored 18 and conceded 19 and have a -1 G/D. 12 less goals scored, huge amount, and 6 goals less conceded.
Absolute waffler.
In terms of pressing, if you look as PPDA (passes per defensive action) and high recoveries. Which are two measures commonly used to measure how well a team presses, we are up there on both. As well as xG conceded. If you look at the stats we are a very good team without the ball, maybe not the best but probably 2nd or 3rd best behind Birmingham and maybe Stevenage, who both perform well across those measures
We are absolutely terrible with the ball of course
Jones is a bullshitter but for him this isn’t that bad of a claim
"Look there isn't a better pressing team in the division than us, like, statistically, or, or otherwise"
"We pride ourselves on being outstanding out of possession"
"There were occasions, I think 1 or 2 occasions in the 90 minutes where they played through us and got a cross, half an opportunity, that never happens to us"
The best pressing team, but the stats don't prove it, and Wigan, Huddersfield, Stevenage, Birmingham and Wrexham have all conceded less than us.
If our manager says no one is better than us, I want that to be the truth. The stats don't show it is, our defensive record doesn't suggest we press the best, and when I watch the games, I don't see it either, as there's multiple occasions per game where a player isn't closed down, and the other team get a chance for it.
It may come across as though I'm being extra, but when a manager speaks, it shouldn't be bollocks. If he said "I believe we are one of the best pressers in the league, we are right up there in that department" that's completely different. To dismiss the teams that are better than us at it, while also being shit at football, is a delusional and arrogant take.
He's up against it, and he's talking waffle to cover his arse. We can all see we aren't anything special off the ball, as it’s been noted multiple times how we lack aggression and drive, so why make out like things are all dandy when they aren't.
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