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Tyreece Campbell thread
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It’s about his lack of effort last night - well that was my point in this thread.hoof_it_up_to_benty said:The obsessive criticism of TC by some of our fans is just plain embarrassing. If he was as dreadful as some keep claiming why would NJ pick him?
Plenty of our players have limitations but they seem to escape the same level of criticism.1 -
Talent needs to be matched with effort. He lacked that in this game, for whatever reason.NabySarr said:
I reckon Nathan Jones, our other coaches, the recruitment teams of the clubs that have already bidded for him and all that likely would if he was available, probably are a slightly better judge of Tyreece Campbells potential than you or any of us on here are.EastbourneAddick said:Sorry but TC is simply not good enough for Charlton in the Championship going forward.
3 goals and 2 assists from 37 appearances this season proves this.
He is 22 now & his overall stats (most of his goals came in League One) are 146 appearance and 16 goals and 9 assists.
Clearly if after nearly 150 games his football brain / decision making isn't great I honestly think it never will be.
If someone wants to buy him I would bite their hand off.
WE NEED A SERIOUS UPGRADE if Charlton are to progress.
As an aside Leaburn's stats are pretty poor as well.It’s clear he’s got loads of ability and potential. 22 and first year at this level is ridiculously early to be writing him off1 -
He is not strong enough to be a wing back. (On two occasions he let a defender set up a goal)
Not talented enough to be a striker.
Really needs to toughen up. (Should be let out on loan)
We only score one goal a game.
When the opposition scores a goal, we are very unlikely to score 2 goals.
Honestly he is a liability (Sorry to be so blunt)
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I thought both sub attackers were disappointing. Not so much for their attacking play or workrate, but because neither kept the ball at all well.Garrymanilow said:What I find slightly odd about this criticism of TC is that after we scored absolutely every player to a man was a total disgrace on the ball. I think it was because of the stress and adrenaline of defending the position we were in but almost every first touch a player took was too heavy and opened the ball up to be taken away, every pass was too firm or too soft, behind the player or just completely wayward. The only pass I honestly remember being completed in any meaningful way was Carey to TC on the break and Carey played it far, far too late when if he'd shifted it earlier TC would have been properly away. As it was it felt like TC got caught in two minds about whether he should bomb on for goal or try and drag the play up the pitch and by the time he decided he'd lost his advantage and got dispossessed. We had so many opportunities to counter Boro last night after we scored and we wasted every single one. TC came on literally the same minute we scored so his entire game was in a team desperately trying to preserve a one goal lead. It wasn't just him, I thought Dykes was uncharacteristically slow and loose on the ball - completed 1 of his 5 attempted passes - Carey's passing radar was awful as the game wore on, every player looked like they'd rather throw themselves in front of a 400mph shot than actually have the ball at their feet after we scored. It's only TC who seems to be singled out though, it's very strange.
What we wanted was peak Tony Watt, someone to relieve the pressure on our defence by controlling the ball, and taking it away from the danger area. Instead both attackers either got tackled too easily, or in the case of TC took the wrong option. It was so frustrating when TC would receive the ball in a little bit of space, and either miscontrol it or just aimlessly flick the ball on to nobody. TC looked like someone, slightly unsure what he should be doing out there.
Of course if we'd scored just before we made the triple sub instead of just after, I suspect NJ would have made a different change.0 -
This is a fine way to talk about the player with the most appearances for us in the senior squad. Yes he has room to improve and he is young enough to do so and has shown the application in the past - just look at his upper body strength compared to someone like - oh I don’t know - Rob Apter.According to Transfermarkt he has 18 goals and 13 assists in 162 appearances. That’s not shabby for a young player breaking into the men’s game and still developing, with more than 20% of those appearances coming in the Championship this season.Basically it’s a pile on every time unless he’s perfect.Basically we don’t deserve him.12
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Very often this season he has been our only creative outlet. That doesn’t mean just scoring or assisting, it means relieving pressure in the defence.Fansince1963 said:He is not strong enough to be a wing back. (On two occasions he let a defender set up a goal)
Not talented enough to be a striker.
Really needs to toughen up. (Should be let out on loan)
We only score one goal a game.
When the opposition scores a goal, we are very unlikely to score 2 goals.
Honestly he is a liability (Sorry to be so blunt)I despair of “fans” who’d think he’s a “liability”, he’s far from it. But then I remember we have lots of hard of thinking fans.2 -
Long post, sorry. He’s not a perfect player and maybe long term he isn’t going to be good enough to get us to where we want to be. But we don’t know that. I think he’s more than good enough for where we are now and has the ability to grow with us, too.
Millwall got Azeez at 22 and didn’t rate him for about nine months. Sorba Thomas was playing non league at 21. Players develop differently and to write TC off at this age is just silly.He is developing. When TC first came into the team he only went left and let off erratic swingers with his weak foot, see his first goal. Around midway through last year he started to shift inside more. Then he improved his finishing which is why we saw benefits and good form. Now he’s going inside too often and needs to mix it up again. He has got dramatically better at using his body in the last year. Do you think Jones would talk so highly of him and play him so much if he didn’t think he was coachable? Come on.I don’t know why his heading ability is being brought into this. He’s a diminutive tricky winger. If we’re asking him to head the ball often then that’s on us for bad game planning. Did people watch the game the other night? Wingers aren’t renowned for being good in the air.
I am broadly in agreement that he was disappointing the other night. But he is not the profile of player you’d typically bring on at 1-0 in a backs to the wall game… but that’s where we are at with our squad. So I’d like to try and support the players we have rather than dismiss them. That’s before you factor in that he’s an academy graduate who’s been with the team for over 15 years which I think deserves extra support. I don’t see why that annoys some people.Lastly, forwards thrive on confidence. He’s clearly gone through periods where he lacks this. He’s been asked to play as a LWB and striker for most of the year when he’s an out and out winger. That interrupts your rhythm. Both TC and Jones have openly said it’s the mental side of the game he needs to work on. He’s 22 and a human. Let him mature.8 -
Rated too highly by Nathan Jones rated too low by the majority of the fanbase.0
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Bear with me for a second, but I kind of think Raheem Sterling is a good model for TC. Sterling, at his peak, was, obviously, a significantly higher quality player than TC is ever likely to be, but he is similar to TC in that he began, at Liverpool, as an out-and-out winger of diminutive stature and was converted into more of a wide forward, and even played as an out-and-out striker at times, by Pep at Man City.
Sterling always had a better output in terms of goals than TC has managed, so far, but he definitely attracted criticism earlier in his career for lack of end product, and being a bit lightweight and inconsistent. Not unlike TC gets.
It took a good two or three seasons at Man City, by which time he was in his mid-20s, before he really started hitting his straps in terms of goal scoring.
Not saying TC is the next Sterling, or anything like that, but Sterling is a high-profile example of a player, of similar type to TC, who many would've written off by TC's age but still went on to develop into a prolific and very successful attacking player.
It's definitely too early to give up on TC.3 -
When Antoine Semenyo was TC's age, he got 2 goals and 4 assists in 44 Championship games. Maybe Bristol fans didn't think he'd make it either.
TC was awful on Wednesday but has bags of natural ability. I'm sure he will grow as seasons go on.
I will always remember the amount of our fans saying Rak-Sakyi had 'no football brain', 'no end product', all while he was the top scoring winger in the league.
And if you were saying that about JRS and now you're saying it about TC, I hope it's not rude to suggest... It's possible you don't quite see this type of player that clearly.
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Chunes said:Guajar Faraguit
I will always remember the amount of our fans saying Rak-Sakyi had 'no football brain', 'no end product', all while he was the top scoring winger in the league.
And if you were saying that about JRS and now you're saying it about TC, I hope it's not rude to suggest... It's possible you don't quite see this type of player that clearly.
Simply not true.
About TC. Its just a difference of opinion at the end of the day.
Some people think he will develop into a better player because he is still young and others like me think he will not.
You say potatoes I say potatoes.
Time will tell.1 -
What the Azeez, Semenyo and JRS examples show is some football fans aren’t good at judging wingers and have unrealistic expectations about how quickly they should develop.
In his first few months here JRS blatantly had the ability to be too good for L1 but I remember some said they’d happily send him back in January. Instead he stayed and proved the doubters wrong when he started scoring more regularly.
Azeez according to FotMob scored twice and had 5 assists last season (league only), this season he’s scored 8 and assisted 6 (so far). I doubt he was rated so highly at Millwall last season.
These type of players have grown up having pace and skill, which stands out at lower levels and in academies, but the higher players go the more important the tactical side, their mentality, fitness etc is. They don’t need a brilliant football brain to be effective at this level, they just need to improve enough, which usually comes with game time. Those with pace, skill and that football brain play in the PL.
TC might not improve, but he’s too young to say he won’t. How well he tackles and heads won’t be what stops him doing well at Championship level either. It’s his goals and assists that are a lot more important, and the three players mentioned have all needed time before that end product started to flow.6 -
... What is 'Guajar Faraguit?'... the words you inserted when you quoted my post?EastbourneAddick said:Chunes said:Guajar Faraguit
I will always remember the amount of our fans saying Rak-Sakyi had 'no football brain', 'no end product', all while he was the top scoring winger in the league.
And if you were saying that about JRS and now you're saying it about TC, I hope it's not rude to suggest... It's possible you don't quite see this type of player that clearly.
Simply not true.
About TC. Its just a difference of opinion at the end of the day.
Some people think he will develop into a better player because he is still young and others like me think he will not.
You say potatoes I say potatoes.
Time will tell.0 -
Don’t think anyone ever questioned JRS end product. He could score and assist with ease, decision making was a bit off but I think the main problem was his fitness and strength. Typically if you combined the pair of them you have the best winger in the championship.Chunes said:When Antoine Semenyo was TC's age, he got 2 goals and 4 assists in 44 Championship games. Maybe Bristol fans didn't think he'd make it either.
TC was awful on Wednesday but has bags of natural ability. I'm sure he will grow as seasons go on.
I will always remember the amount of our fans saying Rak-Sakyi had 'no football brain', 'no end product', all while he was the top scoring winger in the league.
And if you were saying that about JRS and now you're saying it about TC, I hope it's not rude to suggest... It's possible you don't quite see this type of player that clearly.0 -
I think he is perfectly fine as a reserve at this level as a forward. He just should not be playing wing back because he is not a good defender. I don’t want him starting but having a wide forward with pace even if he is erratic is an asset late in a match. it is also ridiculous to say someone can’t develop after 220
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I didn't make it up. I have an annoying memory for things I massively disagree with. It's a curse I have to live with.Crispywood said:
Don’t think anyone ever questioned JRS end product. He could score and assist with ease, decision making was a bit off but I think the main problem was his fitness and strength. Typically if you combined the pair of them you have the best winger in the championship.Chunes said:When Antoine Semenyo was TC's age, he got 2 goals and 4 assists in 44 Championship games. Maybe Bristol fans didn't think he'd make it either.
TC was awful on Wednesday but has bags of natural ability. I'm sure he will grow as seasons go on.
I will always remember the amount of our fans saying Rak-Sakyi had 'no football brain', 'no end product', all while he was the top scoring winger in the league.
And if you were saying that about JRS and now you're saying it about TC, I hope it's not rude to suggest... It's possible you don't quite see this type of player that clearly.3 -
And?queensland_addick said:Missed the game unfortunately as it kicked off at 2.45am here.1 -
I think TC has a big future, largely playing out of position and the few times he does play left wing he creates things1
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He very rarely creates things that's the point! He does get us up the pitch but then always makes the wrong choice or fluffs his lines.BigRedEvil said:I think TC has a big future, largely playing out of position and the few times he does play left wing he creates things2 -
THISHe very rarely creates things that's the point! He does get us up the pitch but then always makes the wrong choice or fluffs his lines.0 -
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He's certainly not one-footed as claimed by a poster - probably our most two-footed player, I'd say. In the position he plays, a lot of his game is getting down the wing and crossing with his left foot and his winner vs Stoke was also with his left foot. Hardly Bernardo Silva-esque levels of using just his stronger foot.0
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CharltonManor1966 said:
He very rarely creates things that's the point! He does get us up the pitch but then always makes the wrong choice or fluffs his lines.BigRedEvil said:I think TC has a big future, largely playing out of position and the few times he does play left wing he creates things
Keep in mind Carey takes set pieces and Dykes stats include his Birmingham appearances.
No one will disagree about his poor decision making and lack of composure at times, but to say he doesn’t create is exaggerating.7 -
He rarely goes outside and crosses with his left? 80% of the time he tries to come inside on his right and ends up getting done or passing backwards. The bloke is an inverted left winger with one good foot. At this level he gets done by better defenders.crookester said:He's certainly not one-footed as claimed by a poster - probably our most two-footed player, I'd say. In the position he plays, a lot of his game is getting down the wing and crossing with his left foot and his winner vs Stoke was also with his left foot. Hardly Bernardo Silva-esque levels of using just his stronger foot.0 -
Personally, I think this is the problem and he is getting too much time to think and consequently seems to switch off. Last season it was almost like every ball was sent his way unless Small was better placed. He wasn’t given time to breathe let alone switch off. He would have two, sometimes three players around him to beat and he often seemed to leave them in his wake.This season it’s often like even the opposition defenders are starting to give him space because he has become less of a threat. I suspect his own teammates may also be choosing to subconsciously not pass the ball to him as much because, when trying to defend the Alamo against what seems like overwhelming odds, they have either witnessed the pass getting intercepted because TC seems to lean back into the defender before the ball gets to him or he too often bounces the ball straight back and we lose possession and they are immediately back under attack. It might take a huge leap of faith but maybe playing him in the middle of the park where not continuously being involved isn’t an option might get the best out of himAndyG said:I hate the constant criticism TC gets but can also see why he gets it. If I were part of the coaching team I would honestly try to concentrate on the mental side of the game with him. Flair players need a bit of swagger about them and I truly think that TC has the physical abilities but lacks the belief in those abilities. If he cannot sort that out he won’t progress beyond league one0 -
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I've never rated him which is weird for me because I usually fall in love with our academy players and back them to be the next big thing.
(I still think Albie Morgan was hard done by but that's a discussion for another day)1 -
Same and I can't quite put my finger on it. Leaburn on the other hand I love and I won't have a bad word said about him. But TC just isn't for me.ProperCharlton said:I've never rated him which is weird for me because I usually fall in love with our academy players and back them to be the next big thing.
(I still think Albie Morgan was hard done by but that's a discussion for another day)2 -
I think the problem is no-one is really creating much. Docherty 3rd on the list despite being mostly defensive. Apter and Tanto making the list despite hardly playing and being out on loan since Jan. Carey top of the list, when the biggest criticism of him is not getting his head up and passing.Scoham said:CharltonManor1966 said:
He very rarely creates things that's the point! He does get us up the pitch but then always makes the wrong choice or fluffs his lines.BigRedEvil said:I think TC has a big future, largely playing out of position and the few times he does play left wing he creates thingsKeep in mind Carey takes set pieces and Dykes stats include his Birmingham appearances.
No one will disagree about his poor decision making and lack of composure at times, but to say he doesn’t create is exaggerating.1 -
I think it heaps pressure on TC because people know he *can* create. He often gets picked out for his body language etc but that’s just shyness. It’s often the same people who call for a creative no 10, players who are well known for not doing any of the defensive work TC doesMeerKat said:
I think the problem is no-one is really creating much. Docherty 3rd on the list despite being mostly defensive. Apter and Tanto making the list despite hardly playing and being out on loan since Jan. Carey top of the list, when the biggest criticism of him is not getting his head up and passing.Scoham said:CharltonManor1966 said:
He very rarely creates things that's the point! He does get us up the pitch but then always makes the wrong choice or fluffs his lines.BigRedEvil said:I think TC has a big future, largely playing out of position and the few times he does play left wing he creates thingsKeep in mind Carey takes set pieces and Dykes stats include his Birmingham appearances.
No one will disagree about his poor decision making and lack of composure at times, but to say he doesn’t create is exaggerating.0 -
Looking at the chart above you can clearly see Rob Apter was the better player all round.
He created 1.8 chances per 90 mins compared to TC's 1.1 chances per 90 mins.
We got rid of the more creative player !5
