Energy Bills
Comments
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They seem to be falling over themselves where he lives, trying to keep the locals happy.ShootersHillGuru said:
Good to hear. I know energy companies have some obligations to install energy saving equipment. Thing is, it’s such a small percentage of the housing stock that qualifies for these schemes.guinnessaddick said:
My BIL lives up in Scotland, near a wind farm, he lives in an old stone house. The local energy company installed insulation, solar panels and an air pump.ShootersHillGuru said:Not meant as a criticism because I realise the constraints but until the government at national level come up with money and schemes to provide grants for massively upgrading insulation, windows, doors and solar panels and heat pumps then the transition to what Arthur has managed to achieve is going to never happen. I know there are grants available that come and go but it’s pissing in the wind. Millions and millions of homes have zero chance of financing the required upgrades. About a year ago I had a couple of quotes for something that sounds like Arthur’s set up and with all the work required including to pipes and rads I was looking at £15k plus for a four bedroom house that has cavity insulation and recommended levels of loft insulation. It’s just not viable.0 -
I have a bit of experience installing boilers and heat pumps.
Was working on a commercial heat pump installation in Cambridge only a few weeks ago.
We ripped out some boilers that were still working perfectly fine, to be replaced by heat pumps.
I would imagine that a huge government grant would have influenced the decision to replace the boilers.
Could see the cost being in the high hundreds of thousands, if not into a million or two.
I am a bit sceptical on heat pumps being pushed on everyone, as they are not always the best solution currently.
As others have mentioned, in older houses with poor insulation heat pumps cannot provide the required temperatures to heat the buildings, giving around 50 degrees centigrade as opposed to around 80 with a boiler.
I'm not a total dinosaur and realise that gas is not an infinite energy source and heat pumps do have situations where they may be the better solution for more modern buildings.
As with petrol / diesel vs. EVs, we don't currently have the infrastructure for everyone to go all electric yet.
It wasn't that long ago that Gordon Brown wanted everyone to be driving diesel cars, was it?
I've added a few pictures of my recent work if anyone is interested.
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No chance we ever get given free energy in the UK when shareholders and CEO's massive wages have to be paid.cantersaddick said:
I think its much more likely we follow the model that is becoming common across Europe (and elsewhere in the world - 28 countries now doing it) where electricity is given away free or very cheap at times where generation is high in order to flatten out the evening peak in demand. Tech can then be used to auto charge batteries and cars at the times when energy is cheapest.fenlandaddick said:What I would say about the cheap overnight rates is don't bank on these long term. Octopus is already messing around with their Intelligent Octopus Go tariff. My crystal ball tells me about another 5 years of cheap regular overnight electricity. After that I think they will adjust these so fewer slots and more dynamic pricing like the flux tariff1 -
Thanks for the background, I'm unlikely to go to a heat pump (boilers only a few years old). My house is pretty efficient, I pay £360 a month for gas and electric (slightly more than half is gas) but they've just refunded me £700 and I'm still £180 in credit, so in reality I think my electric is around £1k a year and on that I don;t see the value yet in solar.arthur said:I was asked on another (now closed) thread about my Solar panels. There was interest in my personal experience, @CaptainRobbo @Rob7Lee @valleynick66 so I thought I would follow up here. To clarify a couple of things; £3k saving I said was slightly ambitious and slightly tongue in cheek due to possible price rises! £2.5k would have been more accurate but maybe not really the correct answer either! This is because my actual electricity saving is high but it’s a bit of a false figure due to the massively increased electricity use due to a heat pump and the difference between gas and even cheap rate electricity.
System cost:
14 Solar panels (5kwh) & 2 batteries (6.5kwh usable) in 2022 cost: £10.5k (we factored this in as a moving house cost)
Heat pump 2025: a little over £1k with the government grant (our house needed very little upgrading as it is modern and has wet underfloor heating)
Extra battery for additional heat pump requirement: £1k
Total: £12.5k
Our house was built in 2017 and has lots of “smart home” things going on when we bought it! Speakers everywhere, a 6ft tall server rack stuffed full of media things and air con which we only use on the hottest days. When I’ve compared it to my parents, small 4 bedroom house built c.1990, my modern, large 4 bed room house uses twice as much electricity as theirs does just sitting there during the day with no one home!
Prior to the heat pump my yearly savings on just solar were around £1100 in 2022 (only 9 months but high prices), 2023: £1200, 2024: £900. (no battery charging included) So around 9 to 10 years to “pay off” if only using solar generation, 10 years is the figure normally given so I can say that was originally accurate for me. However, there are other ways to save money with the solar that are less obvious (see below!) Also, next to no other home improvements pay you anything back, so to have something that actually can is fantastic!
Solar is great in the summer especially but not so much in the winter. It could produce as little as 56kwh in December but 730kwh is the record for a month in summer. (we did have really tall trees in a neighbour’s garden which shaded the solar panels in any December sunlight, these have now been taken down but I don’t expect a huge improvement!)
What wasn’t particularly explained to me by the solar install company was how useful cheap rate charging is so I didn’t have this set up for the first few years. This is where you can save quite a lot of money in those winter months which negates the argument of a solar install being only a summer thing. I have 3 batteries that total around 11kwh capacity. Currently for electricity I pay 26p regular rate but 11p for cheap Octopus Flux rate. This tariff, which you can only access if you have a heat pump, gives me 3 cheap rate charging times spread out during the day. Because of this I don’t need a huge battery capacity to be able to run the whole house mostly on cheap rate electricity. 80% of the electricity I import is 11p instead of 25p.
If I try and ignore the heat pump, and just look at savings for solar panels and cheap rate charging of batteries only. So far in 2026, its £400 for solar that I use directly, £65 in exports and £330 in cheap rate charging (mostly over winter). That would mean £1900 saving in 12 months at which rate the “payback” for the system for me is 5.5 years. A big difference from 9 to 10 for just using the solar generation alone.
Regarding the heat pump, it is more expensive to run than gas UNLESS you can power it mostly on cheap rate electricity, which I can. So it’s very important that you have a plan for this if you are going to switch. I’ve not had it for long but I think it will save about £350 per year when compared to gas (would be more but I still have a gas hob so can’t ditch gas completely) For me this means “paying back” the heat pump in 5.5 years for the heat pump and extra battery. Day-to-day for my house, if the temperature is close to zero all day, the heat pump is more expensive to use than gas, even on cheap rate electricity. But anything over 5 degree’s and the heat pump is always cheaper. It's very different with the house being heated with a heat pump and underfloor heating. You dont ever really notice the heating being on, its just the temperature that you want it to be. Never too warm and never too cold! I'm pretty happy with it!
That said I am considering Air Con........0 -
Those pictures posted by CaptainRobbo are seriously impressive 👍0
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Thanks, can't take credit for it all, but did a fair bit of the pump and pipe installation.ShootersHillGuru said:Those pictures posted by CaptainRobbo are seriously impressive 👍1 -
Seriously considering solar on our house given we are not planning on moving and electricity seems to be going up constantly.
We have had a quote for the following at a cost of 6k:- 6 x Longi 485W HiMo X10 All-Black Panels
- 1 x Hanchu 3.68kW Hybrid Inverter
- 1 x Hanchu 9.4kWh Heated Batteries – 95% depth of discharge, 8.93kWh usable,
They are advising we are likely to knock about £800 a year off our bill in the first year alone, gradually increasing year on year. Electricity doesn't seem to be coming down anytime soon so we are tempted.
Any reason not to do it?2 -
I heard someone complaining the other day that their solar panels apparently need "servicing" every few years and the cost of a service was £2,000.
I'll let you/others investigate.0 -
Not heard this before and got 4 close family with big solar arrays...Covered End said:I heard someone complaining the other day that their solar panels apparently need "servicing" every few years and the cost of a service was £2,000.
I'll let you/others investigate.0 -
Had ours for over 10 years and never had them serviced at all. Saving us a fortune plus we get a good feed in tariff. Having air con fitted next week which will be mainly powered by panels/ battery and will save on gas usage during the winter. Win win as far as I am concerned.Covered End said:I heard someone complaining the other day that their solar panels apparently need "servicing" every few years and the cost of a service was £2,000.
I'll let you/others investigate.3 -
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Dont know if you are on Reddit but the R/solar subreddit is great for this kind of thing. Loads of people posting exactly like you and others giving their experiences and reccommendations - Ive been considering solar so going through them for info. Would say on your quote above 6 panels isnt huge - the panels themselves are cheap its the inverter/battery and labour that are expensive. If you have space on your roof I'd see if I could squeeze in a few more panels.Notts_Addick said:Seriously considering solar on our house given we are not planning on moving and electricity seems to be going up constantly.
We have had a quote for the following at a cost of 6k:- 6 x Longi 485W HiMo X10 All-Black Panels
- 1 x Hanchu 3.68kW Hybrid Inverter
- 1 x Hanchu 9.4kWh Heated Batteries – 95% depth of discharge, 8.93kWh usable,
They are advising we are likely to knock about £800 a year off our bill in the first year alone, gradually increasing year on year. Electricity doesn't seem to be coming down anytime soon so we are tempted.
Any reason not to do it?1 -
I made the decision today to exit the octopus tracker for the first time since 2022.In fact, I have left octopus all together due to
1. Free Nero coffee saved me £5 a week on my trip to work and they removed it.2. Customer service is increasingly slow and AI led.3. They are not competitive, but the ‘same’ as all the other energy companies now who have caught up to octopus.Moved to EON on a fixed deal. Gas is going to be 10p and electricity over 30p through the winter based on best estimates so if you can fix for lower than that, I would seriously consider it.It’s going to be a long old winter for electricity prices.1 -
BalladMan, we’ve been like minded and I’ve been considering jumping ship since July and should have.
Anyway with the cap going up something like 3.6% in October & 25% on January 1st, now’s the time to jump so I have to an 18 month fix with Fuse.
I used Uswitch & seemed the cheapest fix.
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Try and get on a tariff where you get cheap rate electricity and can charge your batteries during those times.Notts_Addick said:Seriously considering solar on our house given we are not planning on moving and electricity seems to be going up constantly.
We have had a quote for the following at a cost of 6k:- 6 x Longi 485W HiMo X10 All-Black Panels
- 1 x Hanchu 3.68kW Hybrid Inverter
- 1 x Hanchu 9.4kWh Heated Batteries – 95% depth of discharge, 8.93kWh usable,
They are advising we are likely to knock about £800 a year off our bill in the first year alone, gradually increasing year on year. Electricity doesn't seem to be coming down anytime soon so we are tempted.
Any reason not to do it?1 -
Sadly the massive profits are being made by the producers, who operate on global markets and not the suppliers. The war in Iran with no credible end plan is the cause. We need this war to end fast. The long term solution is to have a greater reliance in renewables. There isn't really a short term one.3
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I would think the week leading up to the midterm elections.MuttleyCAFC said:Sadly the massive profits are being made by the producers, who operate on global markets and not the suppliers. The war in Iran with no credible end plan in the cause. We need this war to end fast,0 -
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Hey! I switched to Fuse for my energy - it’s way cheaper, and their support team are actual humans. Sign up directly on the app or website and use my code STEPHEN28595 before 18 Sep and we can earn £100 each!0
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Fuse are also a non-profit and all money made goes back into renewables. Another great way to support the environment in a small purchasing decision.2
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From what I can see Fuse daily standing charge is cheaper than Octopus but the unit rates are higher. As always it’s very difficult for people to assess what’s going to be better.1
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Agreed, but even if the war ended today the 25% January 1st price cap rises are baked in and will still happen.MuttleyCAFC said:Sadly the massive profits are being made by the producers, who operate on global markets and not the suppliers. The war in Iran with no credible end plan is the cause. We need this war to end fast. The long term solution is to have a greater reliance in renewables. There isn't really a short term one.0 -
Yes they are, which is usually preferable for low energy users.ShootersHillGuru said:From what I can see Fuse daily standing charge is cheaper than Octopus but the unit rates are higher. As always it’s very difficult for people to assess what’s going to be better.
The issue is the cap going up 25% on January 1st.
If you’ve got a good fix that lasts through this winter you’re likely ok.
If your fix runs out in the next few months your offer in a few months will very likely be much higher than fixed offerings today.
The fixed deals are increasing/being removed daily.
Fixed deals are already 10% higher than in July & I should have fixed then in hindsight.0 -
I can't read that without hearing Rory Stewart's voice.cantersaddick said:Fuse are also a non-profit and all money made goes back into renewables. Another great way to support the environment in a small purchasing decision.2 -
I’m fixed until April 2027 so I think I’m about as well fixed as is possible right now. I’m an above average user with an estimated electricity yearly cost of £1200 and gas of £900Covered End said:
Yes they are, which is usually preferable for low energy users.ShootersHillGuru said:From what I can see Fuse daily standing charge is cheaper than Octopus but the unit rates are higher. As always it’s very difficult for people to assess what’s going to be better.
The issue is the cap going up 25% on January 1st.
If you’ve got a good fix that lasts through this winter you’re likely ok.
If your fix runs out in the next few months your offer in a few months will very likely be much higher than fixed offerings today.
The fixed deals are increasing/being removed daily.
Fixed deals are already 10% higher than in July & I should have fixed then in hindsight.1 -
Just switched today to Ecotricity (currently with Scottish Power) - USwitch were doing a special deal.Standing Charge 75p per day (currently paying 70p)22.9p per Kw (currently paying 27.7p)Two year fix so October and January price cap rises factored in - the Scottish Power 12 month fix is at 32p.We are all electric and we use a shed load of it so the unit cost is much more important to us than the SC - the new deal will likely save me £800-£1,000 per year.Edit: Just checked and the above Ecotricity deal on USwitch ends in one day.1
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Our existing fix with EDF ends 1st October. When we got the new offer last month, we opted to fix for 2 years at a slightly higher rate. Fixes have always worked out well for us, so keeping my fingers crossed that it will do so again.1
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I was paying £135pm overall.ShootersHillGuru said:
I’m fixed until April 2027 so I think I’m about as well fixed as is possible right now. I’m an above average user with an estimated electricity yearly cost of £1200 and gas of £900Covered End said:
Yes they are, which is usually preferable for low energy users.ShootersHillGuru said:From what I can see Fuse daily standing charge is cheaper than Octopus but the unit rates are higher. As always it’s very difficult for people to assess what’s going to be better.
The issue is the cap going up 25% on January 1st.
If you’ve got a good fix that lasts through this winter you’re likely ok.
If your fix runs out in the next few months your offer in a few months will very likely be much higher than fixed offerings today.
The fixed deals are increasing/being removed daily.
Fixed deals are already 10% higher than in July & I should have fixed then in hindsight.0 -
Just fixed with Octopus for 18 months, less then the caps likely jump later this year, and should stay below the cap for most of next year. We use very little gas for 6/7 months a year, so the lower Standing charge will help as well.1
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How do you only pay £135ppm?!Covered End said:
I was paying £135pm overall.ShootersHillGuru said:
I’m fixed until April 2027 so I think I’m about as well fixed as is possible right now. I’m an above average user with an estimated electricity yearly cost of £1200 and gas of £900Covered End said:
Yes they are, which is usually preferable for low energy users.ShootersHillGuru said:From what I can see Fuse daily standing charge is cheaper than Octopus but the unit rates are higher. As always it’s very difficult for people to assess what’s going to be better.
The issue is the cap going up 25% on January 1st.
If you’ve got a good fix that lasts through this winter you’re likely ok.
If your fix runs out in the next few months your offer in a few months will very likely be much higher than fixed offerings today.
The fixed deals are increasing/being removed daily.
Fixed deals are already 10% higher than in July & I should have fixed then in hindsight.
I've been looking at whether to stay with Octopus, might be time to change.0 -
We currently use a lot of Gas and pay Octopus £132 pm for Gas/Electric. Deal coming to an end 31st October, so grateful for any good deals posted here! Been quoted £177 fixed by Octopus for new 12/18 month deal.0
