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Leicester City deducted 6 points with immediate effect - upheld on appeal (p9)
Comments
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Leicester would still be below us if the appeal had been successful. They are in deep trouble because of how bad they've been.
I wonder if they should have cashed in Fatawu in January, and used the money to get some Championship battlers, players who will fight on the pitch. I'm sure Rowett would have done that if he had been in charge then. Get the defence sorted, so that they're less of a soft touch7 -
They were never turning that around, it would have really kicked off with everyone else if it had been.3
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True, but it would have changed the relegation picture significantly. Now 22nd place is 8 points behind us, having played Sheff W twice and with us still to play Sheff W. If they got their points back then it'd be a 7 point gap to Pompey, but with them having a game in hand, albeit they've also played Sheff W twice. We'd still be "safe" but we'd suddenly look far more vulnerable to dropping into the bottom three as our run-in isn't the easiest on paper (neither, is Pompey's to be fair).killerandflash said:Leicester would still be below us if the appeal had been successful. They are in deep trouble because of how bad they've been.
Thankfully for us the appeal came to the correct decision and we remain on the fringe of the relegation battle, but it shows why today's outcome was important for us.5 -
Southendaddick said:Really hope Leicester go down, it should be 12 points and they would be gone
Why should it have been 12 points?1 -
No, you're right, they're stupid. They seem to think that increasing the number of play off places, without increasing the number of teams who actually get promoted, increases their chances of promotion. I can't believe that every club without exception voted for that. Are the owners mentally retarded?Stu_of_Kunming said:
Because the clubs wouldn't agree to it.jimmymelrose said:
Why can’t the EFL have a system where clubs hand in their accounts for the previous year by 31st July and points deductions are made with immediate effect before the start of the season, with for example a 1 point deduction for each 1/5/10 million in debt?
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….and how lenient the ‘punishment’ was in the first place.blackpool72 said:
Correct decision.bolloxbolder said:Just announced on sky that 6 points appeal has been lost. So 6 points deduction remains.
Still a joke it took so long to announce it.
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Remaining fixtures- After Swansea on Saturday they have a key game against Portsmouth, then 2 tough ones at home but finish with Blackburn away. Still in their hands to get out of it i think but the next defeat could break any spirit they have left.
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2nd May will be the exact 10-year anniversary of them sealing the Premier League title in 2016 and almost (but not quite) the 5-year anniversary of them winning the FA Cup in 2021.swords_alive said:Remaining fixtures- After Swansea on Saturday they have a key game against Portsmouth, then 2 tough ones at home but finish with Blackburn away. Still in their hands to get out of it i think but the next defeat could break any spirit they have left.
Now, it could well be the day they seal their relegation to League One.
When you consider they also played Champions League football in 16/17, were in the semi-final of a European competition as recently as 2022, and the last (and only time) they were in League One was just 2009, it's been a bonkers decade-and-three-quarters for them.9 -
Because of how badly they broke the financial rules they didn’t just go over the threshold they obliterated itAthletico Charlton said:Southendaddick said:Really hope Leicester go down, it should be 12 points and they would be gone
Why should it have been 12 points?1 -
But it’s like Leeds, that success came from overspending and ultimately isn’t sustainable (like most clubs granted) but it’s this overspending which has ultimately been their downfall too.Exiled_Addick said:
2nd May will be the exact 10-year anniversary of them sealing the Premier League title in 2016 and almost (but not quite) the 5-year anniversary of them winning the FA Cup in 2021.swords_alive said:Remaining fixtures- After Swansea on Saturday they have a key game against Portsmouth, then 2 tough ones at home but finish with Blackburn away. Still in their hands to get out of it i think but the next defeat could break any spirit they have left.
Now, it could well be the day they seal their relegation to League One.
When you consider they also played Champions League football in 16/17, were in the semi-final of a European competition as recently as 2022, and the last (and only time) they were in League One was just 2009, it's been a bonkers decade-and-three-quarters for them.The success and fall are linked by the same factor.It isn’t shocking when it happens really, like it will happen with Wrexham when eventually the circus ends.3 -
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Appreciate this is so off subject but why is the Manchester City investigation taking so much time.....?1
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Numerous reasons, the fact their charges date back years and years far more reports to go through, the number of charges each one will need to be carefully reviewed and there’s 115 of them. The fact city will have the best lawyers in the world trying to find any sort of loophole to give them the edge delaying everything as much as possible and the nature of the outcomes. We’re not talking about a 5/6 point deduction with the number of charges, City can be anything from relegation to title strips, to getting kicked out of the EFL completely. The result of which can have an impact to the extent City may go bust or never recover or if they’re not harsh enough mean that ffp rules in the premier league may never apply properly to clubs again and we will go down the rabbit hole of clubs never following financial rules again. It’s a really complex situation it would be great if it was as straightforward as you broke the rules here’s a set punishment this result could completely change the outlook of English football as we know itMiserableoldgit said:Appreciate this is so off subject but why is the Manchester City investigation taking so much time.....?
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Agree with the overall sentiment but could we maybe try and hold ourselves to a higher standard than the phrase in bold please? It's not really been okay to say that for at least a decade. It's even bleeped out on TV and starred out on TV subtitles.jimmymelrose said:
No, you're right, they're stupid. They seem to think that increasing the number of play off places, without increasing the number of teams who actually get promoted, increases their chances of promotion. I can't believe that every club without exception voted for that. Are the owners mentally retarded?Stu_of_Kunming said:
Because the clubs wouldn't agree to it.jimmymelrose said:
Why can’t the EFL have a system where clubs hand in their accounts for the previous year by 31st July and points deductions are made with immediate effect before the start of the season, with for example a 1 point deduction for each 1/5/10 million in debt?19 -
Even if that is the case, it's still bonkers to go from League One to League One via a League Championship and FA Cup win in 17 years.CAFC_boi said:
But it’s like Leeds, that success came from overspending and ultimately isn’t sustainable (like most clubs granted) but it’s this overspending which has ultimately been their downfall too.Exiled_Addick said:
2nd May will be the exact 10-year anniversary of them sealing the Premier League title in 2016 and almost (but not quite) the 5-year anniversary of them winning the FA Cup in 2021.swords_alive said:Remaining fixtures- After Swansea on Saturday they have a key game against Portsmouth, then 2 tough ones at home but finish with Blackburn away. Still in their hands to get out of it i think but the next defeat could break any spirit they have left.
Now, it could well be the day they seal their relegation to League One.
When you consider they also played Champions League football in 16/17, were in the semi-final of a European competition as recently as 2022, and the last (and only time) they were in League One was just 2009, it's been a bonkers decade-and-three-quarters for them.The success and fall are linked by the same factor.It isn’t shocking when it happens really, like it will happen with Wrexham when eventually the circus ends.
Although, I'm not totally sure your point totally holds water. Yes, bad financial management and overspending has got them where they are now, but I'm not sure it's what got them their success as they weren't particularly excessive spenders in the lead up to winning the title. That season was as much as anything just a 1 in a million event where everything fell into place - they got on a really hot streak, some cheapish transfer punts like Mahrez and Kante turned into world beaters, and the normal big boys all had weirdly off seasons at the same time. I'm happy to be corrected if my memory has let me down, but this graphic of the fees paid for their first XI that season would suggest I'm right. If anything, it's probably the raised profile and expectation that came with the Premier League win that pushed them to start spending more:
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Interesting that Leicester and Sheffield Wednesday are (or were) both under Thai ownership. In Thailand, the elite business owners are protected by government officials in return for "support", they break rules to maintain their monopolies and get away with unfair practices.
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Weak argument whatever you have to say when you feel the need to say something like this!! Unacceptable thing to write.jimmymelrose said:
No, you're right, they're stupid. They seem to think that increasing the number of play off places, without increasing the number of teams who actually get promoted, increases their chances of promotion. I can't believe that every club without exception voted for that. Are the owners mentally retarded?Stu_of_Kunming said:
Because the clubs wouldn't agree to it.jimmymelrose said:
Why can’t the EFL have a system where clubs hand in their accounts for the previous year by 31st July and points deductions are made with immediate effect before the start of the season, with for example a 1 point deduction for each 1/5/10 million in debt?15 -
Their hearing apparently finished in December 2024. Since then the panel have to go through thousands of pieces of evidence going back many years and then write their report which you'd expect will be hundreds of pages given the number of charges.Miserableoldgit said:Appreciate this is so off subject but why is the Manchester City investigation taking so much time.....?
Stuff like that will naturally take a long time, so when people compare it to the likes of Everton and Forest, which was ONE charge and they pleaded guilty, it's not really a comparison at all.
What also delays it is that the members of the independent panel are apparently not even working on the City case full-time. They have other cases to work on as well, so we don't even know how much time they dedicate to it or how often they align schedules to meet on it.3 -
Seen a few Leicester fans link their issues to wider issues within the whole King Power conglomerate and that the owner is more bothered about that than running Leicester.Bangkokaddick said:Interesting that Leicester and Sheffield Wednesday are (or were) both under Thai ownership. In Thailand, the elite business owners are protected by government officials in return for "support", they break rules to maintain their monopolies and get away with unfair practices.0 -
Crispywood said:
Because of how badly they broke the financial rules they didn’t just go over the threshold they obliterated itAthletico Charlton said:Southendaddick said:Really hope Leicester go down, it should be 12 points and they would be gone
Why should it have been 12 points?
I don't really know anything about this rule but is there a guide to points deductions based on whether you break it or obliterate it, or is a broken rule the same no matter the level of overspending?0 -
There’s no set deduction for example if we were to break FFP rules by 5M and then say Leicester break it by 50M despite being the same rule break Leciester should and usually would get a bigger points deduction because of the severity.Athletico Charlton said:Crispywood said:
Because of how badly they broke the financial rules they didn’t just go over the threshold they obliterated itAthletico Charlton said:Southendaddick said:Really hope Leicester go down, it should be 12 points and they would be gone
Why should it have been 12 points?
I don't really know anything about this rule but is there a guide to points deductions based on whether you break it or obliterate it, or is a broken rule the same no matter the level of overspending?For this specific FFP related rule points deduction it usually ranges from 6-12, I’m guessing it’s slightly more complex based on the reasoning for the rule break such as a transfer sale falling through or a mistake with paperwork getting submitted after accounts are due or issues with accounting errors or just plain negligence etc etc which all get taken into account and may influence it.
It’s not as simple you start at 6 points and for every 10M we deduct an extra point for example0 -
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That would be far too sensibleAthletico Charlton said:Crispywood said:
Because of how badly they broke the financial rules they didn’t just go over the threshold they obliterated itAthletico Charlton said:Southendaddick said:Really hope Leicester go down, it should be 12 points and they would be gone
Why should it have been 12 points?
I don't really know anything about this rule but is there a guide to points deductions based on whether you break it or obliterate it, or is a broken rule the same no matter the level of overspending?2 -
Looking at that team, hats off to whoever found Kante and Mahrez. Absolutely brilliant finds and value for money. Each were sold for a decent amount too. Just goes to show you how bonkers football is, because I expect they then squandered the fees and the CL revenue on some absolute faffExiled_Addick said:
Even if that is the case, it's still bonkers to go from League One to League One via a League Championship and FA Cup win in 17 years.CAFC_boi said:
But it’s like Leeds, that success came from overspending and ultimately isn’t sustainable (like most clubs granted) but it’s this overspending which has ultimately been their downfall too.Exiled_Addick said:
2nd May will be the exact 10-year anniversary of them sealing the Premier League title in 2016 and almost (but not quite) the 5-year anniversary of them winning the FA Cup in 2021.swords_alive said:Remaining fixtures- After Swansea on Saturday they have a key game against Portsmouth, then 2 tough ones at home but finish with Blackburn away. Still in their hands to get out of it i think but the next defeat could break any spirit they have left.
Now, it could well be the day they seal their relegation to League One.
When you consider they also played Champions League football in 16/17, were in the semi-final of a European competition as recently as 2022, and the last (and only time) they were in League One was just 2009, it's been a bonkers decade-and-three-quarters for them.The success and fall are linked by the same factor.It isn’t shocking when it happens really, like it will happen with Wrexham when eventually the circus ends.
Although, I'm not totally sure your point totally holds water. Yes, bad financial management and overspending has got them where they are now, but I'm not sure it's what got them their success as they weren't particularly excessive spenders in the lead up to winning the title. That season was as much as anything just a 1 in a million event where everything fell into place - they got on a really hot streak, some cheapish transfer punts like Mahrez and Kante turned into world beaters, and the normal big boys all had weirdly off seasons at the same time. I'm happy to be corrected if my memory has let me down, but this graphic of the fees paid for their first XI that season would suggest I'm right. If anything, it's probably the raised profile and expectation that came with the Premier League win that pushed them to start spending more:3 -
These issues with inconsistent deductions and appeals could be so easily avoided if there was a firm set deduction for each rule break and severity of it i.e overspend up to 5m = 3 points, 5m-10m = 6pts etc4
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Thank you.Crispywood said:
Numerous reasons, the fact their charges date back years and years far more reports to go through, the number of charges each one will need to be carefully reviewed and there’s 115 of them. The fact city will have the best lawyers in the world trying to find any sort of loophole to give them the edge delaying everything as much as possible and the nature of the outcomes. We’re not talking about a 5/6 point deduction with the number of charges, City can be anything from relegation to title strips, to getting kicked out of the EFL completely. The result of which can have an impact to the extent City may go bust or never recover or if they’re not harsh enough mean that ffp rules in the premier league may never apply properly to clubs again and we will go down the rabbit hole of clubs never following financial rules again. It’s a really complex situation it would be great if it was as straightforward as you broke the rules here’s a set punishment this result could completely change the outlook of English football as we know itMiserableoldgit said:Appreciate this is so off subject but why is the Manchester City investigation taking so much time.....?0 -
Given that they just announced a loss of 71m in their last accounts, it can't be long before they are charged again.0
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Much looser financial rules in L1 might help on that frontChris_from_Sidcup said:Given that they just announced a loss of 71m in their last accounts, it can't be long before they are charged again.1 -
The only fit punishment for Man City is for them to be relegated into the Championship with immediate effect, before being deducted 100 points for being extra naughty, putting them below Sheff Wednesday and meaning there's only one relegation slot left.7
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Bought Mahrez for £450k in 2013 and sold him in 2018 for £60m, or 133 times the amount they paid. Probably goes down as one of the top value-for-money transfer fees of all time.cabbles said:
Looking at that team, hats off to whoever found Kante and Mahrez. Absolutely brilliant finds and value for money. Each were sold for a decent amount too. Just goes to show you how bonkers football is, because I expect they then squandered the fees and the CL revenue on some absolute faffExiled_Addick said:
Even if that is the case, it's still bonkers to go from League One to League One via a League Championship and FA Cup win in 17 years.CAFC_boi said:
But it’s like Leeds, that success came from overspending and ultimately isn’t sustainable (like most clubs granted) but it’s this overspending which has ultimately been their downfall too.Exiled_Addick said:
2nd May will be the exact 10-year anniversary of them sealing the Premier League title in 2016 and almost (but not quite) the 5-year anniversary of them winning the FA Cup in 2021.swords_alive said:Remaining fixtures- After Swansea on Saturday they have a key game against Portsmouth, then 2 tough ones at home but finish with Blackburn away. Still in their hands to get out of it i think but the next defeat could break any spirit they have left.
Now, it could well be the day they seal their relegation to League One.
When you consider they also played Champions League football in 16/17, were in the semi-final of a European competition as recently as 2022, and the last (and only time) they were in League One was just 2009, it's been a bonkers decade-and-three-quarters for them.The success and fall are linked by the same factor.It isn’t shocking when it happens really, like it will happen with Wrexham when eventually the circus ends.
Although, I'm not totally sure your point totally holds water. Yes, bad financial management and overspending has got them where they are now, but I'm not sure it's what got them their success as they weren't particularly excessive spenders in the lead up to winning the title. That season was as much as anything just a 1 in a million event where everything fell into place - they got on a really hot streak, some cheapish transfer punts like Mahrez and Kante turned into world beaters, and the normal big boys all had weirdly off seasons at the same time. I'm happy to be corrected if my memory has let me down, but this graphic of the fees paid for their first XI that season would suggest I'm right. If anything, it's probably the raised profile and expectation that came with the Premier League win that pushed them to start spending more:
Steve Walsh was supposedly the scout behind it all. He was seen as a bit of a flop after he left Leicester and went to Everton, but his Wikipedia entry makes interesting and, if true, highlights that it's not enough to just employ talented people to key positions, but as an ownership or board you also need to trust and act upon their advice and judgement."In 2006, he left for the chief scout role at Newcastle United, where he met Nigel Pearson. He followed Pearson to Leicester City in 2008 and Hull City two years later, and then accompanied him on his return to Leicester, whereby he was made assistant manager. After Pearson was sacked in 2015, the club's board retained all of his staff, including Walsh.
Walsh scouted obscure players such as Riyad Mahrez, Jamie Vardy and N'Golo Kanté for Leicester, and their contribution to the club's success in the 2015–16 season ostensibly led Arsenal to express an interest for his services. He had a £1 million release clause written into his contract.[5] On 8 May 2016, a few days after the club secured their maiden Premier League title, both Walsh and assistant manager Craig Shakespeare agreed to extend their contracts with Leicester City.
On 21 July 2016, he returned to his native North West England, joining Everton as Director of Football, signed by their new majority shareholder Farhad Moshiri.
In November 2017, Walsh's job was reported as under pressure. Everton had spent £150 million on new players over the summer but found themselves in danger of relegation and were eliminated from the UEFA Europa League. In addition to the expensive players that Everton signed, Walsh also recommended Hull duo Andy Robertson and Harry Maguire for a combined £20 million and teenage Norwegian striker Erling Haaland for €4 million; Everton rejected the trio, whose values soared years later. On 16 May 2018, Walsh was relieved of his duties, being replaced by Marcel Brands.
In March 2020, Walsh was named Special Advisor at Major League Soccer club Charlotte FC."
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