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ELON MUSK - Worlds first Trillionaire
Comments
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I appear to have logged on to The Guardian by mistake...2
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There is no way he is going to get manned flights to Mars. It is too problematic. If you get there, which is just about feasible, you can't come back. It is better to send robots there who don't care if they come back. If somebody is mad enough to volunteer, they should be sectioned.cafcnick1992 said:
Trying to offer balance to the discussion isn't bootlicking. I'm not asking you to like or respect the man, but to claim he isn't a visionary takes some serious going when he has revolutionised the electric car industry, and currently oversees a company making re-usable rockets as a means of going to mars.cantersaddick said:
Again no one has said that but nice try with the slippery slope fallacy. He clearly has some strengths including leveraging influence, rasing finance from governments and investors for projects that would never get funding without him fronting them and for a while he was very effective at garnering public support. He also effectively uses his propaganda machine. I'm sure he has other skills too. But engineer, visonary or genius he is not.cafcnick1992 said:
So just to clarify; the world's first trillionaire has no positive attributes when it comes to business, and is an absolute dufus who causes mass disruption in all the companies he works for?cantersaddick said:
https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-engineer-quit-slam-elon-musk-leadership-linkedin-post-2025-9cafcnick1992 said:
Right and Steve Jobs was just sat in the Apple cafeteria when an engineer walked in and presented him with the new iPhone.cantersaddick said:
Ignoring the idiotic culture war langauge. Thats not what he said though. Clearly Musk using his influence to extract massive subsidies from governments is obviously part of the success "story". But did he "revolutionise the EV industry" as was claimed. Well he didnt found Tesla, he didnt fund the development (that was a few investors and large government sibsidies) nor was he involved in any engineering decisions. Musk used his profile to gain attention and popularity for Tesla and ultimately that will have helped success of Tesla. But did he personally revolutionise the EV industry? Its at best questionable.cafcnick1992 said:
I do think it takes a serious dosage of Musk Derangement Syndrome to pretend that Musk had nothing to do with the success of Tesla.Leroy Ambrose said:
Musk did absolutely nothing related to that except con the US government of the day into giving Tesla massive subsidies in order to make it economically viable. The US taxpayer made Tesla a success, not Musk.cafcnick1992 said:
He did revolutionise the electric car industry. Electric cars would not be as good as they are today without Tesla having set the standard.The Red Robin said:Yet he chooses to be a c*nt and not do anything of any social value with it. I hope he fucks off to Mars and takes his helmet off.
To claim that Elon Musk was not involved in any of the engineering decisions is just silly
https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsman/2025/11/10/teslas-engineering-exodus-comes-amid-shift-from-core-ev-mission/
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-engineer-accuses-elon-musk-004000611.html
https://futurism.com/tesla-engineer-roasts-elon-musk
https://insideevs.com/news/658439/elon-musk-overruled-tesla-autopilot-engineers-radar-removal/
https://medium.com/predict/musk-overruled-tesla-engineers-and-now-they-are-in-serious-trouble-2e37269e387a
There are literally thousands of accounts like these that say engineers spent the whole time trying to find ways around musks "decisions" or "developments" or directly ignored his ideas when he meddled in engineering. He's certainly used his whole propaganda machine and influence in government and the media to give the impression of his engineering "genius". The reality is a long long way away from that.
Both tesla and spaceX are famously structured internally specifically to handle Musk and his ideas, they have a team dedicated to listening to him then basically doing the minimum viable thing to make him think his ideas have been implemented. When management has such an adversarial relationship with the CEO, it's hard to see what contributions Ellen could have made to the products directly. As I said above he has was for a while a valuable viral marketing tool - that that time has long since passed.
The bootlicking obsession some people have with this fantasy version of the man was weird 10 years ago. Its just creepy as fuck now.
I think we all understand he isn't on the ground with a pencil and ruler designing the Falcon rockets, but he clearly does have a vision of how he thinks space travel / cars should work, and to date has been effective in delivering changes in those industries.1 -
I think Musk is an interesting story in the non-transformative power of wealth when it comes to personal happiness. The bloke is valued as the richest man in the world but he's clearly still so incredibly insecure about the fact he's a huge fucking dweeb. I like to think that if I was a trillionaire I'd have a little sit down, maybe buy a bigger TV and just enjoy not having to worry about anything ever again but instead he's terminally online, constantly trying to impress people and convince them that he's a cool guy when every single thing he posts just makes him seem more and more embarrassing. It makes me feel better knowing that if Musk is anything to go by money isn't something that would make me substantially happier; if anything I reckon he'd be much more chipper if he was just some guy living a normal, if slightly geeky, life.5
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The richest people on earth are those who have what they need and don't seek more. I just can't see how somebody who feels they have to make more and more money, to a point where they can't spend it can ever be happy. You can always make more money after all.Garrymanilow said:I think Musk is an interesting story in the non-transformative power of wealth when it comes to personal happiness. The bloke is valued as the richest man in the world but he's clearly still so incredibly insecure about the fact he's a huge fucking dweeb. I like to think that if I was a trillionaire I'd have a little sit down, maybe buy a bigger TV and just enjoy not having to worry about anything ever again but instead he's terminally online, constantly trying to impress people and convince them that he's a cool guy when every single thing he posts just makes him seem more and more embarrassing. It makes me feel better knowing that if Musk is anything to go by money isn't something that would make me substantially happier; if anything I reckon he'd be much more chipper if he was just some guy living a normal, if slightly geeky, life.3 -
Narcissism with a side order of psychopathy.MuttleyCAFC said:
The richest people on earth are those who have what they need and don't seek more. I just can't see how somebody who feels they have to make more and more money, to a point where they can't spend it can ever be happy. You can always make more money after all.Garrymanilow said:I think Musk is an interesting story in the non-transformative power of wealth when it comes to personal happiness. The bloke is valued as the richest man in the world but he's clearly still so incredibly insecure about the fact he's a huge fucking dweeb. I like to think that if I was a trillionaire I'd have a little sit down, maybe buy a bigger TV and just enjoy not having to worry about anything ever again but instead he's terminally online, constantly trying to impress people and convince them that he's a cool guy when every single thing he posts just makes him seem more and more embarrassing. It makes me feel better knowing that if Musk is anything to go by money isn't something that would make me substantially happier; if anything I reckon he'd be much more chipper if he was just some guy living a normal, if slightly geeky, life.1 -
Mars has a very thin atmosphere, much of it carbon dioxide and not suitable for humans to breathe and little protection from solar radiation. It's not suitable for humans to live. The costs involved in getting there enormous, as would be the cost of taking all the infrastructure to enable humans to live. Even if it were possible, who
would want to live there. Musk perhaps, that's the best place for him.
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I've just googled "is elon musk actually a engineer", and someone has actually compiled a massive list of evidence that he plays a direct role in the engineering process at SpaceX.cantersaddick said:
Nothing to do with my views on him. I've said repeatedly that he deserves credit for getting in place the finance for projects that would not be funded in other circumstances. But those proposals and ideas existed long before he got involved. To give him any form of credit for the ideas themselves (which was the original point) is laughably naive.cafcnick1992 said:
His influence on the electric car industry isn't "questionable at best". He took over Tesla in 2004, at which point there was no factory and no prototypes. By 2012 he was shipping electric cars with 17" touchscreens that were at least 5 years ahead of anything else out there. If Elon Musk had views similar to your own, you would accept that this was a success and that he deserves credit.cantersaddick said:
Don't try and pretend you point is just playing devils advocate (literally in this case). You havent presented any evidence that he played any part in those things othere than the incredibly naieve "he owns it so he did it". Its like claiming that as I own shares in Santander I personally introduced the 123 acount or signed off someones mortgage.cafcnick1992 said:
Trying to offer balance to the discussion isn't bootlicking. I'm not asking you to like or respect the man, but to claim he isn't a visionary takes some serious going when he has revolutionised the electric car industry, and currently oversees a company making re-usable rockets as a means of going to mars.cantersaddick said:
Again no one has said that but nice try with the slippery slope fallacy. He clearly has some strengths including leveraging influence, rasing finance from governments and investors for projects that would never get funding without him fronting them and for a while he was very effective at garnering public support. He also effectively uses his propaganda machine. I'm sure he has other skills too. But engineer, visonary or genius he is not.cafcnick1992 said:
So just to clarify; the world's first trillionaire has no positive attributes when it comes to business, and is an absolute dufus who causes mass disruption in all the companies he works for?cantersaddick said:
https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-engineer-quit-slam-elon-musk-leadership-linkedin-post-2025-9cafcnick1992 said:
Right and Steve Jobs was just sat in the Apple cafeteria when an engineer walked in and presented him with the new iPhone.cantersaddick said:
Ignoring the idiotic culture war langauge. Thats not what he said though. Clearly Musk using his influence to extract massive subsidies from governments is obviously part of the success "story". But did he "revolutionise the EV industry" as was claimed. Well he didnt found Tesla, he didnt fund the development (that was a few investors and large government sibsidies) nor was he involved in any engineering decisions. Musk used his profile to gain attention and popularity for Tesla and ultimately that will have helped success of Tesla. But did he personally revolutionise the EV industry? Its at best questionable.cafcnick1992 said:
I do think it takes a serious dosage of Musk Derangement Syndrome to pretend that Musk had nothing to do with the success of Tesla.Leroy Ambrose said:
Musk did absolutely nothing related to that except con the US government of the day into giving Tesla massive subsidies in order to make it economically viable. The US taxpayer made Tesla a success, not Musk.cafcnick1992 said:
He did revolutionise the electric car industry. Electric cars would not be as good as they are today without Tesla having set the standard.The Red Robin said:Yet he chooses to be a c*nt and not do anything of any social value with it. I hope he fucks off to Mars and takes his helmet off.
To claim that Elon Musk was not involved in any of the engineering decisions is just silly
https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsman/2025/11/10/teslas-engineering-exodus-comes-amid-shift-from-core-ev-mission/
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-engineer-accuses-elon-musk-004000611.html
https://futurism.com/tesla-engineer-roasts-elon-musk
https://insideevs.com/news/658439/elon-musk-overruled-tesla-autopilot-engineers-radar-removal/
https://medium.com/predict/musk-overruled-tesla-engineers-and-now-they-are-in-serious-trouble-2e37269e387a
There are literally thousands of accounts like these that say engineers spent the whole time trying to find ways around musks "decisions" or "developments" or directly ignored his ideas when he meddled in engineering. He's certainly used his whole propaganda machine and influence in government and the media to give the impression of his engineering "genius". The reality is a long long way away from that.
Both tesla and spaceX are famously structured internally specifically to handle Musk and his ideas, they have a team dedicated to listening to him then basically doing the minimum viable thing to make him think his ideas have been implemented. When management has such an adversarial relationship with the CEO, it's hard to see what contributions Ellen could have made to the products directly. As I said above he has was for a while a valuable viral marketing tool - that that time has long since passed.
The bootlicking obsession some people have with this fantasy version of the man was weird 10 years ago. Its just creepy as fuck now.
I think we all understand he isn't on the ground with a pencil and ruler designing the Falcon rockets, but he clearly does have a vision of how he thinks space travel / cars should work, and to date has been effective in delivering changes in those industries.
As presented above the claim that he personally revolutionised the electric car industry is quentionable at best. Its the same with SpaceX. Its not like he came up with the idea of reusable rockets, they've been discussed, studied, designed and planned for 40 odd years before he had anything to do with a space company. What he did that was different to others was that he is the only one who managed to persuade governments and a small number of investors to put the money into it to try and turn the concept into reality. Even that is a failure given they are a decade behind his own "space travel" timeline and hence the need for this IPO scam to raise the cash to carry on trying as it got to the point where SpaceX was struggling to access any further borrowing.
So again, not an engineer, visionary or genius. The one way you could argue he was something close to genius was how for a while he had the ability to leverage his influence to raise capital to fund projects others couldnt get off the ground. Whether from governments, investors or financial institutions. Very successful as a financier. For a while. but this IPO prooves he has milked that as far as he can too.
Again with the slippery slope fallacy - no one ever said he was on the ground with a pencil and a ruler.
I cannot provide you with the obviously unobtainable evidence that he personally came up with the silver bullet that made it all possible, in the same way that i cannot give you evidence that Steve Jobs knows anything about the iPod, or that Jeff Bezos knows anything about shipping parcels.
He has been in charge during Tesla's incredible rise and therefore deserves credit, in the same way that you would rightfully criticise him if Tesla went under.
You say you cant possibly provide evidence that he did the things you claim but I have provided evidence and there are literally thousands of first hand accounts in the public of people who worked for him saying he didn't. And there is the evidence that those concepts existed long before his companies started. What is it they say about people who refuse to change their minds in the face of the evidence?
https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/evidence_that_musk_is_the_chief_engineer_of_spacex/
This does rather suggest he does more than just hand over money0 -
If he wants to travel to an unpleasant place, why not go to Burnley or Blackburn. Much cheaper although I appreciate, money isn't an issue.2
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On a practical level he was obscenely rich / wealthy already. The IPO doesnt practically change that as it’s all paper money to a large degree.
He doesn't have a trillion in cash to do good with more than he did last week. He cant really sell the Space X shares to raise that cash as the market would plummet and their value fall. Assuming anyone / enough want to own them.
What I'm saying is the concerns on him pre date the IPO. His influence was already too great but I dont see how you change that unless Twitter gets banned or similar.
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As many scientists have said if we have the geo-eningeering capability to make Mars liveable we have the Geo-enfineering capability to make earth liveable no matter how bad it gets (climate breakdown, nuclear fallout etc.). Of course currently we have neither.ME14addick said:Mars has a very thin atmosphere, much of it carbon dioxide and not suitable for humans to breathe and little protection from solar radiation. It's not suitable for humans to live. The costs involved in getting there enormous, as would be the cost of taking all the infrastructure to enable humans to live. Even if it were possible, who
would want to live there. Musk perhaps, that's the best place for him.
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Sponsored links:
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Well yes that must be true, but I guess Mars might be an insurance policy incase someone on earth goes mad with a nuclear weaponcantersaddick said:
As many scientists have said if we have the geo-eningeering capability to make Mars liveable we have the Geo-enfineering capability to make earth liveable no matter how bad it gets (climate breakdown, nuclear fallout etc.). Of course currently we have neither.ME14addick said:Mars has a very thin atmosphere, much of it carbon dioxide and not suitable for humans to breathe and little protection from solar radiation. It's not suitable for humans to live. The costs involved in getting there enormous, as would be the cost of taking all the infrastructure to enable humans to live. Even if it were possible, who
would want to live there. Musk perhaps, that's the best place for him.
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Does he carry a bit of change for the buskers?0
