How can we blame managers for selecting a weak team when they have a gun pointed at their head? Sport can flourish with the input of funds (our olympians) but you have to control greed, not an easily controlled human emotion.
Can name the teams and scores from the Cup finals from about 1970 (when born) to about 1999. Can anyone really remember all the games from the last 10 years?
Cup Final day used to be a shortened version of Swap Shop, followed by Cup Final Grandstand which included tv cameras with the teams at breakfast, a Question of Sport Cup Final Special, TV cameras on the coaches showing the teams leaving their hotels and a full pre match build up.
I appreciate there used to be very few live games back in the day and probably made it a bit more special, but there is none of that frisson of excitement anymore.
Last year it was played when there were also league games being played.
But I think that extensive TV coverage and excitement has dwindled simply because it doesn't hold the prestige anymore. Even as recently as 2000 or so, the FA Cup final was something that every fan and player dreamed about - just as much as the Premier League or the European Cup. The FA Cup Final was the big one that everyone wanted to win, and nobody wanted to lose. We really have lost a giant of English football now that the magic from that has gone.
FA Cup Winner should get a Champions League place. Crying shame that the greatest Cup competition in the world has been allowed to die.
In the last 20 years there has only been a couple of winners that hadn't already qualified for the Champions League so I'm not sure what difference it would make, to be honest.
Don't think the Champions League thing would make a great deal of difference. Just take the semi-finals away from Wembley - that would go such a long way.
Nowadays if you win the FA Cup you get THREE outings at Wembley in the space of three months if you include the Community Shield. Massive overkill on what was once a great thing.
FA Cup Winner should get a Champions League place. Crying shame that the greatest Cup competition in the world has been allowed to die.
In the last 20 years there has only been a couple of winners that hadn't already qualified for the Champions League so I'm not sure what difference it would make, to be honest.
In which case the CL place could go to the losing team, added incentive as you either get a proper go at winning the cup or you lose in most cases to one of the big boys in the final and still get european football at the highest level.
FA Cup Winner should get a Champions League place. Crying shame that the greatest Cup competition in the world has been allowed to die.
In the last 20 years there has only been a couple of winners that hadn't already qualified for the Champions League so I'm not sure what difference it would make, to be honest.
In which case the CL place could go to the losing team, added incentive as you either get a proper go at winning the cup or you lose in most cases to one of the big boys in the final and still get european football at the highest level.
That could be a disaster. We get four teams in the CL due to our performance in it year on year. Give a second rate team two games in the CL qualifiers and within no time we'd only have three teams in it. What would be the point of that?
It's bad enough that the the CL has teams finishing forth in the best/strongest leagues in Europe in it, putting runners up from a knock out cup competition would be insane, in my view.
FA Cup Winner should get a Champions League place. Crying shame that the greatest Cup competition in the world has been allowed to die.
In the last 20 years there has only been a couple of winners that hadn't already qualified for the Champions League so I'm not sure what difference it would make, to be honest.
In which case the CL place could go to the losing team, added incentive as you either get a proper go at winning the cup or you lose in most cases to one of the big boys in the final and still get european football at the highest level.
That could be a disaster. We get four teams in the CL due to our performance in it year on year. Give a second rate team two games in the CL qualifiers and within no time we'd only have three teams in it. What would be the point of that?
It's bad enough that the the CL has teams finishing forth in the best/strongest leagues in Europe in it, putting runners up from a knock out cup competition would be insane, in my view.
Tto be honest, I havent watched a Champions League game in about a decade, have about as much interest in it as I do the NHL/NFL etc - couldn't give a monkeys about Cheslea, Man Utd or Arsenal etc, but if a place in this competition is the be all & end all in football right now, it would be great to revive the best competition (The FA Cup) with such a lucrative prize & they could play off for the place right down to the losing quarter finalists - I mean if the winners of the Welsh League have a chance at entering the CL via play-offs, so should the winner of the FA Cup....
If the 4th place is at the expense of an Arsenal or Chelsea - even better!!!
FA Cup Winner should get a Champions League place. Crying shame that the greatest Cup competition in the world has been allowed to die.
In the last 20 years there has only been a couple of winners that hadn't already qualified for the Champions League so I'm not sure what difference it would make, to be honest.
In which case the CL place could go to the losing team, added incentive as you either get a proper go at winning the cup or you lose in most cases to one of the big boys in the final and still get european football at the highest level.
That could be a disaster. We get four teams in the CL due to our performance in it year on year. Give a second rate team two games in the CL qualifiers and within no time we'd only have three teams in it. What would be the point of that?
It's bad enough that the the CL has teams finishing forth in the best/strongest leagues in Europe in it, putting runners up from a knock out cup competition would be insane, in my view.
Semi agree with you but then if i was in control of Uefa i would make it that every european country gets one spot that goes to the team who wins there highest division.
Never really agreed that the richer a league so that it attracts the better players gets them more spaces in the tournament as lets be honest none of our clubs just like most of the big european clubs do well in it due to home grown players.
FA Cup Winner should get a Champions League place. Crying shame that the greatest Cup competition in the world has been allowed to die.
In the last 20 years there has only been a couple of winners that hadn't already qualified for the Champions League so I'm not sure what difference it would make, to be honest.
In which case the CL place could go to the losing team, added incentive as you either get a proper go at winning the cup or you lose in most cases to one of the big boys in the final and still get european football at the highest level.
That could be a disaster. We get four teams in the CL due to our performance in it year on year. Give a second rate team two games in the CL qualifiers and within no time we'd only have three teams in it. What would be the point of that?
It's bad enough that the the CL has teams finishing forth in the best/strongest leagues in Europe in it, putting runners up from a knock out cup competition would be insane, in my view.
Agree, winner of Cup should get the place but not the runner up.
Nowadays if you win the FA Cup you get THREE outings at Wembley in the space of three months if you include the Community Shield. Massive overkill on what was once a great thing.
Very good point, semi's need to return to neutral league grounds.
Magic is as magic does .. Everton tonight at mighty Cheltenham have put out a nigh on full strength team .. it seems that Moyes still believes in the stardust inherent in a good cup run, not to mention the cash.
Magic is as magic does .. Everton tonight at mighty Cheltenham have put out a nigh on full strength team .. it seems that Moyes still believes in the stardust inherent in a good cup run, not to mention the cash.
There was an article in the papers yesterday showing most of the Premiership sides made changes but not as many as you think.
Cardiff's selection summed it all up though to an extent - money from being promoted/staying up is more important that cup glory.
Its why the top teams have pretty much dominated and the likes of Arsenal/Liverpool will be under pressure to win a trophy.
There are quite a few factors that have led to the demise of the cup - but from the day that big clubs started playing weakened teams, the writing was on the wall. The final used to be an occasion with it's a cup final knockout etc... on the telly but now it's just another match and sometimes other matches are played on the same day.
The biggest factor of all is that the money in the game has simply made the league more important. It is quite sad as there is no way back - when the magic has gone it has gone. Having said that a place in the Champions League for the winner could possibly fix it, but that is never going to happen.
...now it's just another match and sometimes other matches are played on the same day...
That, I think, is an absolute disgrace. I remember the day that Man City won the cup then Man Utd went and won the Prem that evening. Blimey, couldn't they allow the cup winners one day of glory before overshadowing it again?
...now it's just another match and sometimes other matches are played on the same day...
That, I think, is an absolute disgrace. I remember the day that Man City won the cup then Man Utd went and won the Prem that evening. Blimey, couldn't they allow the cup winners one day of glory before overshadowing it again?
never really thought about that...now my stomachs turning over.
I think City did manage to make themselves the focus of attention in the end though. Those scenes of the Man Utd players, cautiously, celebrating the title at (I think) Sunderland for a few seconds before Agero scored the late, late goal at Eastlands trumped the events of the year before.
Incidentally I thought United won the title before the Cup Final. I thought that was when the City fans joined arms and turned their backs on the screen?
We are critical of the club paying weakened teams but if somebody you offered victory against Huddersfiled in the cup or victory against Blackpool on Saturday - very few- if any of us would pick the former!
We are critical of the club paying weakened teams but if somebody you offered victory against Huddersfiled in the cup or victory against Blackpool on Saturday - very few- if any of us would pick the former!
True but I'd rather win them both and there is no guarantee that we'll win this Saturday.
I just don't subscribe to this whole notion of "Well it's the same old clubs that win cups so what's the point in taking it seriously"
When Bradford kicked off their League Cup campaign on 11th August this year away at Notts County in front of 3,460 fans I'm sure Wembley was far from their minds.....5 months later now look at them.
That is where it gets a bit harder to understand- say we beat Huddersfiled and won the next game- all of a sudden, we'd start to take it more seriously and play stronger teams. If you are willing to play stronger teams when you make progress- why are you not willing to play stronger teams to get you in that position.
Another side of things from Chrissy's perspective is that without a reserve side- the cup might be a good chance to have a look at fringe players in a competetive game and keep their eye in. It is a balancing act and I was predicting on here that it would become a matter of how seriously Huddersfield took it. I suspected that after a big defeat, Grayson would have seen the game as an opportunity to regain confidence - which I think he did. We probably would have been better off getting Cardiff or Leicester who would have had firm eye on the league.
The cup still holds it's magic at grass roots level. Supporters of clubs that enter in the third round don't realise the 100's of games which have already been played and are obsessed with league position and money.
The cup still holds it's magic at grass roots level.
Supporters of clubs that enter in the third round don't realise the 100's of games which have already been played and are obsessed with league position and money.
Very good point.
The FA Cup has never begun at the 3rd Round.
To give the BBC credit, they've always featured a path through the early qualifying rounds on the road to Wembley.
Isn't it like a self fulfilling prophecy? As more and more people say it's losing 'it's magic' then so more and more believe it is. Of course, there is no real magic in the first place, just a good feeling and a sense of excitement.
Is it because the big clubs care less? If so I say good - sod them all - it gives us more of a chance and I do bloody well want to win it. It's one of the things on my shortlist of things I want to see or do before I die.
I personally say there is magic in the FA Cup. What's more we can win it but I can't see us winning the league. I personally would go for the cup and if necessary field a weakened team in the league. You may think this crazy but I find the lack of respect for the grandest oldest football competion in the word pure idiocy.
Think about it and you too may conclude that the FA Cup is the most important thing for Charlton Athletic. Why have a club if you don't want to win anything which is essentially what a lot of you are saying (without realising it). If we as supporters made this clear to the club then I'm sure we'd get a lot closer to winning it.
Comments
Can anyone really remember all the games from the last 10 years?
Cup Final day used to be a shortened version of Swap Shop, followed by Cup Final Grandstand which included tv cameras with the teams at breakfast, a Question of Sport Cup Final Special, TV cameras on the coaches showing the teams leaving their hotels and a full pre match build up.
I appreciate there used to be very few live games back in the day and probably made it a bit more special, but there is none of that frisson of excitement anymore.
Last year it was played when there were also league games being played.
Nowadays if you win the FA Cup you get THREE outings at Wembley in the space of three months if you include the Community Shield. Massive overkill on what was once a great thing.
It's bad enough that the the CL has teams finishing forth in the best/strongest leagues in Europe in it, putting runners up from a knock out cup competition would be insane, in my view.
If the 4th place is at the expense of an Arsenal or Chelsea - even better!!!
Never really agreed that the richer a league so that it attracts the better players gets them more spaces in the tournament as lets be honest none of our clubs just like most of the big european clubs do well in it due to home grown players.
Cardiff's selection summed it all up though to an extent - money from being promoted/staying up is more important that cup glory.
Its why the top teams have pretty much dominated and the likes of Arsenal/Liverpool will be under pressure to win a trophy.
The biggest factor of all is that the money in the game has simply made the league more important. It is quite sad as there is no way back - when the magic has gone it has gone. Having said that a place in the Champions League for the winner could possibly fix it, but that is never going to happen.
Incidentally I thought United won the title before the Cup Final. I thought that was when the City fans joined arms and turned their backs on the screen?
When Bradford kicked off their League Cup campaign on 11th August this year away at Notts County in front of 3,460 fans I'm sure Wembley was far from their minds.....5 months later now look at them.
Another side of things from Chrissy's perspective is that without a reserve side- the cup might be a good chance to have a look at fringe players in a competetive game and keep their eye in. It is a balancing act and I was predicting on here that it would become a matter of how seriously Huddersfield took it. I suspected that after a big defeat, Grayson would have seen the game as an opportunity to regain confidence - which I think he did. We probably would have been better off getting Cardiff or Leicester who would have had firm eye on the league.
Supporters of clubs that enter in the third round don't realise the 100's of games which have already been played and are obsessed with league position and money.
The FA Cup has never begun at the 3rd Round.
To give the BBC credit, they've always featured a path through the early qualifying rounds on the road to Wembley.
Is it because the big clubs care less? If so I say good - sod them all - it gives us more of a chance and I do bloody well want to win it. It's one of the things on my shortlist of things I want to see or do before I die.
I personally say there is magic in the FA Cup. What's more we can win it but I can't see us winning the league. I personally would go for the cup and if necessary field a weakened team in the league. You may think this crazy but I find the lack of respect for the grandest oldest football competion in the word pure idiocy.
Think about it and you too may conclude that the FA Cup is the most important thing for Charlton Athletic. Why have a club if you don't want to win anything which is essentially what a lot of you are saying (without realising it). If we as supporters made this clear to the club then I'm sure we'd get a lot closer to winning it.