Haha. If chris Powell were to be sacked I can see myself being one of those morons at Chelsea holding up Placards at the first game saying "[insert new manager here] out"
Yet in the 5th minute of 4 minutes added on Leicester had a free kick on the edge of our box.
It was blasted just past the post but if that goes in then "powell got it wrong, we sat too deep, we invited them on and gave them a chance, blah, blah, blah"
Last night the players got it right and deserved the bit of luck (another late deflected shot hit the side netting) they didn't get v Brum.
Those are the margins in this league.
Yes Powell is great but credit the players on the pitch just as they have to take the blame when we conceed late on.
Had a quick chat with Keith Peacock afterwards. Like us all very pleased and very relieved. He said how important psychologically that result would be given the recent set back but also what a great bunch of triers with fantastic spirit they are.
Of course Powell bought all but three of them and he trains and selects them but credit to the players who strong mentally and physically last night and got the result they deserved.
Beware the cult of the manager. Remember that article I wrote on here when SCP joined. Got some stick for it then but stand by every word.
Is it at all true/possible that Chrissy's job could have been on the line with the Board at any time this season this season? Surely not given the growth and strengthened position since he joined 2 years ago. And yet, these mystery men behind the scenese often work in weird and mysterious ways as we have seen with some appalling shenanigins at other clubs (e.g. Atkins @ Southampton) where amazing achievement (such as his!) has been trumped by other agendas at play by far more powerful 'players' at the club.
This thread has prompted me to imagine how I felt if our Board had such an 'agenda' and Powelly was outed and the very next day (for example) Dennis Wise was unveiled as our 'new' saviour. Even putting this reprobate's name to one side, I think I'd have to be changing a habit of a lifetime (apart from going on the pitch at the 'last game at the valley' v. Stoke in 1985) I could see me wanting to take part in the most extreme protestations possible.
Like all on here, I absolutely love our football club. It's been in my veins for more than 35 years now. I've been everywhere, seen pretty much all of the definitive matches in Charlton's ups and downs as far back as the 80's (Stamford Bridge, St Andrews, Carlisle x2, Villa (4-3), Harlow Town etc etc etc) and I firmly believe that we have a 'Charlton' man at our helm in Chrissy P. He simply IS Charlton. There should be no question of needing to 'give him time' because he is living that time now. We're on the way back. Like an earleir post, I believe we're a 'Mendonca' away from making an even bigger step back to the true Big Time.
I'm keeping the faith and will do so even if we lose a 1-0 lead again on Saturday. We have all gotta keep this in perspective, take a pause when hitting those frustrating lows and remember where we've got to in a relatively short space of time under SCP.
COYR.
The above says it all for me and you have to view the bigger picture of what SCP has done within the club since he arrived. I have been disappointed with results over the last few weeks but you have to ask where would we be if SCP hadn't taken the helm 2 years ago? He will make mistakes no doubt but for those that seriously question whether SCP is up to the job or not be very careful what you wish for.
Yet in the 5th minute of 4 minutes added on Leicester had a free kick on the edge of our box.
It was blasted just past the post but if that goes in then "powell got it wrong, we sat too deep, we invited them on and gave them a chance, blah, blah, blah"
Last night the players got it right and deserved the bit of luck (another late deflected shot hit the side netting) they didn't get v Brum.
Those are the margins in this league.
Yes Powell is great but credit the players on the pitch just as they have to take the blame when we conceed late on.
Had a quick chat with Keith Peacock afterwards. Like us all very pleased and very relieved. He said how important psychologically that result would be given the recent set back but also what a great bunch of triers with fantastic spirit they are.
Of course Powell bought all but three of them and he trains and selects them but credit to the players who strong mentally and physically last night and got the result they deserved.
Beware the cult of the manager. Remember that article I wrote on here when SCP joined. Got some stick for it then but stand by every word.
Any chance you could re-post that H, for the benefit of those of us that joined CL after then?
Most of the flak he's had has come from people who expect success now and at any cost.
He's learning his craft and there are a couple of things about him that worry me - he seems to go off some players (last season Hayes, Benson etc and this year Wagstaff/BWP) who could contribute something and appear to be good team players but don't seem to get any playing time. Then there is the issue of the substitutions and his reluctance to make them until late on in the game. Also his playing style verges on the conservative at times.
But overall I'm happy with a manager who is vastly in credit with the things he's done and the players he's brought in and trained on and unless he's drinking away the transfer budget I'm happy for him to continue. None of the matches that we've lost this year have seen us being outclassed or run off the pitch.
Mid-season finish and hopefully he'll get some money in the summer to spend on a striker to play alongside Yann K, a decent finisher and this season we could be challenging for the play-offs.
As I said on the Relegation thread at the weekend, not only are the majority of this team relatively inexperienced at this level but CP has only been doing his job for 2 years. There are plenty more managers out there with more experience, doing a worse job.
First off I am absolutely certain that SCP will go on to be a very successful manager at the highest level, hopefully with Charlton. The man oozes class. But bear this in mind. It was widely rumoured by quite a few of the credible ITK posters on here that had CP not got that victory against Cardiff then he was toast. Our last four games excluding Leicester were three defeats and a draw. Talk was of getting sucked into a relegation dog fight and tactical nievity. I wonder how far the thinking of our beloved owner would have been to pulling the trigger had the to be expected loss last night happened with Forest close on its heels given that Forest played us off the pitch earlier in the season at what would have been a very nervous Valley. It's been said by sages on other threads quite rightly that our season has been shaped by small margins. The 100% Support campaign is just as important now as it was then. The love of Sir Chris is not universal we are led to believe. We need to make our opinions very clear. COYR.
Some of the stuff on here about Powell and his 'tactics' and 'bad substitutions' have been a fecking joke, I don't bother coming on here much after a loss because of the amount of bollocks being spoken by the usual suspects.
Powell, quite clearly, is a Curbishley style manager, pragmatic, cautious and mostly risk-averse (as you'd expect from a defender).
I mean, the equaliser Brum scored the other week was pure arse, a mis-hit shot bobbles across the box for a tap-in - a pure freak goal - and yet people on here gave Powell pelters for his 'substitutions' - sheer madness.
this.
I was thinking of posting on this topic until I read your post and realized you've said it all.
And for those that said Chris Powell was too soft on his players , not tough enough for management , too loyal , he's just let his leading goalscorer go out on loan , when was the last time Charlton had a 20 goal a season striker , Andy Hunt ? not even Darren Bent got to 20 goals in a season for Charlton (19 abeit at a higher level) and i loved him too bits.
I would say though that just because Powell got his tactics spot on against Leicester doesn't mean he didn't get it wrong before, against Birmingham and Wednesday and Palace, when he played it defensive and it cost us. He's learned from his mistakes, as he has before and is one of his greatest strengths, but I am not about to say I was wrong to question some of his formation/substitution changes at the time.
Of course there is an element of luck about some of the late goals the opposition scored, but the number of chances they got, one of them was bound to go in eventually, even by a fluke. This time we get a positive change and a positive result, and I only hope that should we concede an equaliser, or god forbid go behind, on Saturday, he make the same kind of change as he did on Tuesday.
There is indeed a magic touch about Powell, he will become a good and probably even great manager, but he's not infallible. Credit where credit is due, and criticism where it's warranted.
I would also add we have no idea if Slater and co. are desperate to pull the trigger, as some keep insinuating. So far, they've put their trust in Powell, just like we have. And until they show otherwise, I still trust the board to do the sensible thing and keep hold of one of the best young managers in the business.
I would say though that just because Powell got his tactics spot on against Leicester doesn't mean he didn't get it wrong before, against Birmingham and Wednesday and Palace, when he played it defensive and it cost us. He's learned from his mistakes, as he has before and is one of his greatest strengths, but I am not about to say I was wrong to question some of his formation/substitution changes at the time.
Of course there is an element of luck about some of the late goals the opposition scored, but the number of chances they got, one of them was bound to go in eventually, even by a fluke. This time we get a positive change and a positive result, and I only hope that should we concede an equaliser, or god forbid go behind, on Saturday, he make the same kind of change as he did on Tuesday.
There is indeed a magic touch about Powell, he will become a good and probably even great manager, but he's not infallible. Credit where credit is due, and criticism where it's warranted.
I would also add we have no idea if Slater and co. are desperate to pull the trigger, as some keep insinuating. So far, they've put their trust in Powell, just like we have. And until they show otherwise, I still trust the board to do the sensible thing and keep hold of one of the best young managers in the business.
I would agree with this- it is all about the number of chances you give opponents. Desperate teams will try to play as high up the pitch as they can with as many bodies forward as they can get away with. If they get a sense that their opponents aren't to bothered about getting another goal, that is as many as they like basically. I can't recall ever being so frustrated as I was after Palace - it has been a long time since we have been so superior in a half, yet at half time I knew what would happen and it almost happened to the letter of my imagination. The bit almost immediately before they got the equlaiser, where we were fa**ing about at their corner flag with no offensive intent said it all.
To be fair to Chrissy, this isn't always the manager and players instincts can take over, but you have to send them messages sometimes, and that is eaxctly what he did yesterday, by bringing on Haynes. I'm not saying we should expect not to have to defend, but we can't allow teams to lay seige. If you are going to hold out - make in 4 or 5 minutes not 25 minutes!!!
It took a long time for us to get out on the pitch for the second half and I assume this was because Chrissy was getting a firm message accross. When Leicester equlaised, the thought process could have been - lets try to hold on for a draw but instead it was- they are going to open up - let's put another striker on and try to take advantage of that. The second option will always get you more points and getting a goal will re-inforce the meassage to everybody concerned.
We have to accept that Chrissy is a young manager and a good learner. He showed this in his second season. It would be a disaster to lose him but pointing out his errors is not the same as wanting him out. I certainly have never wanted that.
I am sure that CP never told any player 'just go out and sit on the 15 yard line, defend defend defend' because as a defender himself he knows that sometimes you have to attack to defend, keep them on the back foot, stop them creating chances. BUT when players get tired (and the pitch does have a part in that) and then they see more defensively inclined subs coming on, they would go into a more defensive mindset, that's just the nature of the game.
Like I say, I rate Powell highly, I think he could be a truly great manager, but if I think he's got it wrong, I'm going to say so. Some of the criticism does get ridiculous when emotions run high, my own just as much as anyone's I am sure. But that doesn't mean there should be no criticism whatsoever.
I am sure that CP never told any player 'just go out and sit on the 15 yard line, defend defend defend' because as a defender himself he knows that sometimes you have to attack to defend, keep them on the back foot, stop them creating chances. BUT when players get tired (and the pitch does have a part in that) and then they see more defensively inclined subs coming on, they would go into a more defensive mindset, that's just the nature of the game.
Like I say, I rate Powell highly, I think he could be a truly great manager, but if I think he's got it wrong, I'm going to say so. Some of the criticism does get ridiculous when emotions run high, my own just as much as anyone's I am sure. But that doesn't mean there should be no criticism whatsoever.
All true.
The other major factor in that the other side are trying to win the game.
If they put more bodies in the last third we have to deal with it. Players have to drop deeper to mark them.
It's not totally in the control of one team or one manager. That's what makes football so interesting.
Fair points H.I, though I think one of the major criticism Powell has faced is being too reactionary. The other team/manager DOES manage to wrest control and we end up trying to counter their plan rather than enforcing our own. But as you say, its part of what makes football such an exciting game, and there is no manager in the league I would swap Powell for.
Anyone else get the feeling we are on to something special with this man at the helm? More than a smuttering of Curbs about the fella.Shows an abundance of Grit and determination as well as intelligence just as he did when he played the game. And when things look like they are starting to slip he manages to turn it around.
Exciting times.
Not sure if this was on purpose but made me laugh.
Fair points H.I, though I think one of the major criticism Powell has faced is being too reactionary. The other team/manager DOES manage to wrest control and we end up trying to counter their plan rather than enforcing our own. But as you say, its part of what makes football such an exciting game, and there is no manager in the league I would swap Powell for.
But the criticism is often of what he doesn't do when we are winning. So if we are winning the onus is on the other manager to try and win the game.
Sometimes teams have got some luck (weds/brum), sometimes they have had very good players to bring on (Lita/Philips).
Football isn't 100% predictable but a lot of people , using 20/20 hindsight, seem to think it is.
Other than Weds at home I think Powell has tried to make positive substitutions. Last night it worked almost perfectly but if Leicester stick away that last minute free kick bringing on Taylor and Wilson would have been described as a mistake as would going 4 -4-1-1.
All true points Henry, and as you say, a lot of the time there is luck or a moment of skill from a good player that no manager could ever reasonably account for. Powell actually gets it right far more often than he gets it wrong, and rarely makes the same mistake twice.
If any of those chances you pointed out had gone in, the rabid critics would be digging out Powell right now. And if Hamer hadn't literally slipped against Palace, we could be hailing Powell's tactical genius. All ifs and maybes, all part of the game.
If we made some of the changes I, you, or any other fan on here advocated a lot of the time, I think we'd have a lot more to worry about regarding relegation! CP is of course a pro and a very smart chap, he's forgotten more about football at the high level than I will ever know. There is a difference between playing Football Manager and actually being a Football Manager after all.
Think your right about the margins being so tight Henry ,if that free kick had of gone in these posts would have been so different. And people would not have appreciated what a decent performance that was even if we all would have taken a point before the game.
Harold Wilson once said a week is a long time in politics well 3 days is a long time in football we have gone from despair to triumph keep up the good work Chris if it was not for a couple of deflections we would have a few more points to add to our total--roll on Forest on Saturday.
Think your right about the margins being so tight Henry ,if that free kick had of gone in these posts would have been so different. And people would not have appreciated what a decent performance that was even if we all would have taken a point before the game.
So true and if we'd taken our early chances v Wendies and Palace their late goals would have been meaningless. It's football.
How many really doubt him though - beyond a few well known loons who nay-sayed his appointment and are desperate to be proved right. Think it's OK to voice frustration or concerns ( I haven't personally but I don't take offence to those that do in a balanced way)......
Anyway I am 100% pro-CP always have been & always will be....
Comments
It was blasted just past the post but if that goes in then "powell got it wrong, we sat too deep, we invited them on and gave them a chance, blah, blah, blah"
Last night the players got it right and deserved the bit of luck (another late deflected shot hit the side netting) they didn't get v Brum.
Those are the margins in this league.
Yes Powell is great but credit the players on the pitch just as they have to take the blame when we conceed late on.
Had a quick chat with Keith Peacock afterwards. Like us all very pleased and very relieved. He said how important psychologically that result would be given the recent set back but also what a great bunch of triers with fantastic spirit they are.
Of course Powell bought all but three of them and he trains and selects them but credit to the players who strong mentally and physically last night and got the result they deserved.
Beware the cult of the manager. Remember that article I wrote on here when SCP joined. Got some stick for it then but stand by every word.
He's learning his craft and there are a couple of things about him that worry me - he seems to go off some players (last season Hayes, Benson etc and this year Wagstaff/BWP) who could contribute something and appear to be good team players but don't seem to get any playing time. Then there is the issue of the substitutions and his reluctance to make them until late on in the game. Also his playing style verges on the conservative at times.
But overall I'm happy with a manager who is vastly in credit with the things he's done and the players he's brought in and trained on and unless he's drinking away the transfer budget I'm happy for him to continue. None of the matches that we've lost this year have seen us being outclassed or run off the pitch.
Mid-season finish and hopefully he'll get some money in the summer to spend on a striker to play alongside Yann K, a decent finisher and this season we could be challenging for the play-offs.
There are plenty more managers out there with more experience, doing a worse job.
Simply the best !
I was thinking of posting on this topic until I read your post and realized you've said it all.
" Lest we forget".....It's up to us to keep reminding those who pay the wages when the going gets tough on the pitch.
Of course there is an element of luck about some of the late goals the opposition scored, but the number of chances they got, one of them was bound to go in eventually, even by a fluke. This time we get a positive change and a positive result, and I only hope that should we concede an equaliser, or god forbid go behind, on Saturday, he make the same kind of change as he did on Tuesday.
There is indeed a magic touch about Powell, he will become a good and probably even great manager, but he's not infallible. Credit where credit is due, and criticism where it's warranted.
I would also add we have no idea if Slater and co. are desperate to pull the trigger, as some keep insinuating. So far, they've put their trust in Powell, just like we have. And until they show otherwise, I still trust the board to do the sensible thing and keep hold of one of the best young managers in the business.
To be fair to Chrissy, this isn't always the manager and players instincts can take over, but you have to send them messages sometimes, and that is eaxctly what he did yesterday, by bringing on Haynes. I'm not saying we should expect not to have to defend, but we can't allow teams to lay seige. If you are going to hold out - make in 4 or 5 minutes not 25 minutes!!!
It took a long time for us to get out on the pitch for the second half and I assume this was because Chrissy was getting a firm message accross. When Leicester equlaised, the thought process could have been - lets try to hold on for a draw but instead it was- they are going to open up - let's put another striker on and try to take advantage of that. The second option will always get you more points and getting a goal will re-inforce the meassage to everybody concerned.
We have to accept that Chrissy is a young manager and a good learner. He showed this in his second season. It would be a disaster to lose him but pointing out his errors is not the same as wanting him out. I certainly have never wanted that.
Like I say, I rate Powell highly, I think he could be a truly great manager, but if I think he's got it wrong, I'm going to say so. Some of the criticism does get ridiculous when emotions run high, my own just as much as anyone's I am sure. But that doesn't mean there should be no criticism whatsoever.
The other major factor in that the other side are trying to win the game.
If they put more bodies in the last third we have to deal with it. Players have to drop deeper to mark them.
It's not totally in the control of one team or one manager. That's what makes football so interesting.
Sometimes teams have got some luck (weds/brum), sometimes they have had very good players to bring on (Lita/Philips).
Football isn't 100% predictable but a lot of people , using 20/20 hindsight, seem to think it is.
Other than Weds at home I think Powell has tried to make positive substitutions. Last night it worked almost perfectly but if Leicester stick away that last minute free kick bringing on Taylor and Wilson would have been described as a mistake as would going 4 -4-1-1.
If any of those chances you pointed out had gone in, the rabid critics would be digging out Powell right now. And if Hamer hadn't literally slipped against Palace, we could be hailing Powell's tactical genius. All ifs and maybes, all part of the game.
If we made some of the changes I, you, or any other fan on here advocated a lot of the time, I think we'd have a lot more to worry about regarding relegation! CP is of course a pro and a very smart chap, he's forgotten more about football at the high level than I will ever know. There is a difference between playing Football Manager and actually being a Football Manager after all.
So true and if we'd taken our early chances v Wendies and Palace their late goals would have been meaningless. It's football.
Sorry just thought some of the sentiments in here could be extended a little more, as it was only last Tuesday/Wednesday afterall......