Attention: Please take a moment to consider our terms and conditions before posting.

An example of waste in the NHS

13»

Comments

  • You should put some clothes on before you go there next Len.
  • The NHS has its problems - a lot of which can be blamed on the 'managerialism' that was brought in the 1990's by both sides of politics, although Labour probably accelerated it, largely because they did - to give them credit - pump lots of money in that the Tories did not.

    However, under Labour (and I am on the left) especially in the 2000's spending totally spiralled out of control, the fraud within the system and mis-management was unbelievable, I know this because my close relative got to see all the case details.

    In one case at a major hospital the canteen management 'team' siphoned off THREE YEARS of revenue from the canteen BEFORE ANYONE NOTICED!!!!

    By the time they did notice three of them had left the country for Nigeria, au naturellement, and they had two UK people left when they finally alerted Plod.

    As the NHS did not want a court case because of the embarrassment they - wait for it - paid the remaining two management people off with massive redundancy payments which as they were long serving staff meant big payouts for both.

    One of the people who got the payout - which enabled them to retire at 53 - has sat in my lounge room and told me this themselves, she denied ever knowing the cash was siphoned off and blames the Nigerians - which even if true might not make her a criminal but it does make her criminally incompetent - and she still got the massive payout.

    Having said that, anyone arguing for the US 'system' - if you can call it that - is out of their fucking mind.

    Every President since Nixon has been trying to change the current US healthcare model - they spend twice as much on healthcare as a % of GDP than anyone else on the planet - and until Obama arrived they had all failed.

    Indeed, the only way Obama succeeded was by striking a deal with health insurance companies - who are fucking minted like you would not believe - that he would mandate everyone to have private health insurance, thereby giving the insurance companies tens of millions of new customers, and in return they would stop denying coverage for pre-existing conditions and allow kids to stay on their parents insurance till the age of 26.

    My friend used to manage a big hotel in DC, he said that after the defence contractors and the banking industry that the medical industry were the biggest spenders on corporate largesse - ie, bribing politicians with 'study trips' and 'research trips' to 5-Star hotels that he had ever seen.
  • edited February 2013

    "A friend of mine has a theory". Don't suppose he's a member of the loony left is he! Hope we do get rid of the NHS as it's been totally abused, leaving the poor doctors & nurses overworked & underpaid.

    Surely that is more or less what my mate said? Only difference is you appear to want it to close ( would be interested in your opinion on the alternative ), he wants to bring it back to what it used to be.

    In Portugal we have a similar system to the UK, but you pay a small amount to see the doctor (€5 at the moment), and for any tests etc. Seems to work quite well, keeps the hypochondriacs away.

    Don't forget that being Britain, your national insurance payments would remain the same, they would not drop to compensate for paying out for your health insurance.
    This can be debated till the cows come home but to answer your question, I favour the for-profit and Medicare alternatives. I.e the American system. The NHS is like a wounded animal. You still love it but it needs to be put down. It has been abused by both governments and we need an alternative.

    Fair enough. Just hope that should it come to fruition none of your family are the ones who cannot afford cover should an expensive to treat condition inflict them.
  • LenGlover said:

    I am currently on the waiting list for a knee replacement operation with Maidstone & Tunbridge Wells NHS Trust. Last week I attended a pre-assessment clinic to determine my fitness for surgery and was told I'm okay. I was told the blood tests, MRSA swabs etc. are valid for 8 weeks and if I don't have my op within that time, I will have to have them again.

    As I hadn't heard anything about a date for my operation, I just telephoned Maidstone hospital and was advised that my op will probably be in April or May. That means I will have to undergo the tests again. What a waste of my time and the staff at the hospital and more importantly tax payer's money. No wonder the NHS is in such a mess financially.

    Your operation is almost certainly classed as non emergency and you'll be pushed back in the queue as and when more urgent operations are necessary. As for the tests etc that you mention, your metabolism will change during a wait for treatment & medical staff like to have the most up to date data on your condition before they operate. All in all your time spent taking more tests etc is not wasted, more tests are a necessary precaution to prevent the possibility of your kicking the bucket on the operating table.
    Yes the NHS is wasteful in many cases, it is a huge and unwieldy organisation run by human beings and human beings are very wasteful animals. For my part, any waste although reprehensible, is waste in a good cause.
    But why not call me in for the tests as soon as they know when I'm going to have my op. They sent the letter to me in January asking me to go for my pre-op assessment. They must have known then that I wouldn't actually have the operation until April or May.
    They probably had a waiting time target.

    By sending the letter they could tick the appropiate box. Your clinical needs are almost totally irrelevant unless they match the particular target that needs to be met.

    I have family members, as I've posted before, who have died through euthanasia without consent (starved and dehydrated to death. The staff, when questioned, lied that the person was being prepared for an operation. For 4 days prior to death?) and neglect (left for hours on the floor with a fractured hip having fallen out of bed in a ward) courtesy of the NHS so I am not quoting the Daily Mail before some arsehole posts that or similar.

    Another family member used to work as an administrator and admitted that they used to post letters giving appointments, followed immediately by cancellation letters, as such action (somehow!) fulfilled the target criteria!

    As for waste what about the billions spent on a computer system that is unfit for purpose!



    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/health-news/nhs-pulls-the-plug-on-its-11bn-it-system-2330906.html

    Agree 100% and sympathise with you Len. I've had similar horror experiences involving my sister and Mum that are far too involved to discuss here. My sister was only 42 but they couldn't even be bothered with her in her final weeks and left her in a side room on her own without water in reach for a whole day. I will never forget her calling me from her mobile crying her eyes out.
    The problem boils down to too much bureaucracy and too many levels of management all trying to justify their positions by creating unnecessary paperwork for others. Basic nursing care, changing drips, turning patients to prevent bed sores, washing patients, feeding patients, even just talking to patients has become a thing of the past, with nurses now concentrating instead on writing up their "care plans" and studying for their next degree so that they too can join the managerial gravy train in the future. Many nurses now do not want to get their hands dirty and why should they when they are so highly educated with their nursing degrees and years of study behind them.
    I can fully understand your fear of being hospitalised in the Uk, I would too if I lived there. For any non urgent treatment I would not hesitate in flying to India, Malaysia or Thailand and pay for treatment rather than risking the NHS (where my wife and I spent 12 years of our working lives) my wife is working at the Chelsea & Westminster atm.
  • edited February 2013

    @len

    I think we have done this before but the people that treated if that's what it can be called your family is such appalling fashion are nothing less than negligent health care profesionals at best and at worst criminals. They should be called to account and punished accordingly. What I can assure you of is that there is 100% definitely not any kind of conspiracy or strategy to euthanase anyone. Do you really believe that ? I have a very strict code of conduct for my profession as a radiographer of which I can say that I and all my colleagues to a man/woman adhere and are very proud to do so. Certainly where I work any form of ill treatment, negligence or neglect of patients would generate an outcry from the staff and the management. It simply wouldn't be tolerated. To condemn all parts of the NHS because of the actions of a few appalling ward staff is simply wrong.

    SHG, I have no doubt that your radiology department works in a highly efficient and ethical manner, as did the theatre where I worked. Unfortunately in my mind it doesn't matter how well those particular departments work, if patients go to the ward and are not then nursed properly. The ward is the most important link in the chain. There is absolutely no point in spending hours working on a patient in theatre, only for them to die a few days later on the ward from infection, choking on food, falling out of bed etc due to nursing negligence, which I personally have witnessed on numerous occasions.

  • Bournmouth Addick said:

    Ignoring the issue of this particular persons sickness, which can be just as much a problem in the private sector tbh, what is the alternative to having someone employed to fulfill an administative roll in the health service?

    My mother had an admin job in a hospital and worked her socks off at it doing many hours of unpaid overtime every week, much to the detriment of her health in the end and she wasn't alone.

    The alternative to your point of view is what? Would you prefer consultants do their own filing, appointments, record keeping? Would you prefer it if the doctor didn't have time for you becuase he was dealing with a building contractor about a project or the surgeon couldn't do your operation because they were too busy filling in the latest return to central government about waiting time or the endless other requests they are obliged to fulfill.

    I'm not syaing there's not waste work done in the NHS, it's a large massive organisation after all, but I do think it's a bit lazy and simplistic to to blame it on the administrators that work there

    Not saying that all who work for the NHS are feckless and lazy, your mother being a good example of the other end of the spectrum, but if only a tiny minority are like the woman we know then the cost is one that should be dealt with and no I don't want doctors etc to do their own admin but would like those who are paid to do it to be there so that it can be done. The real point is that the doctors practice functions perfectly well without this person when she has her "away days" so that begs the question as to whether there is a real job there at all.

    Not sure what your experience of the private sector is but as said it would not be allowed to happen in my company.
  • An update on my original post - I now have a date for my op and it is within the 8 weeks from the pre-op assessment!
  • Had the op last weekend and am now on the long road to recovery!

    I was at Pembury Hospital and must say that if you need to be in hospital, it is a great place to be. Staff all excellent and the facilities are superb. Having your own room is so much better than being in a communal ward. The only problem is that it is 25 miles from where I live,so was a long way for my husband to travel each time he visited me. Glad that I am at home this weekend and he hasn't had to travel in the poor weather!
  • Had the op last weekend and am now on the long road to recovery!

    I was at Pembury Hospital and must say that if you need to be in hospital, it is a great place to be. Staff all excellent and the facilities are superb. Having your own room is so much better than being in a communal ward. The only problem is that it is 25 miles from where I live,so was a long way for my husband to travel each time he visited me. Glad that I am at home this weekend and he hasn't had to travel in the poor weather!

    I'm pleased all appears to have gone well.

    Best wishes for a smooth recovery.
  • Thanks Len!
  • Sponsored links:


  • Glad all went well ME14addick. The Tunbridge Wells Hospital is part of the Trust for which I work. I work at The Maidstone Hospital. The Pembury site is a flagship NHS hospital and blueprint for all that follow. Built with no wards but single rooms it is the future of state hospitals in this country. It is sadly already crippled with the debt burden of PFI which hangs around its neck like an albatross.
  • I'm not sure how to change to title of this post as it reflects my initial moans which didn't come to fruition, but I have certainly had excellent care from both Maidstone and Tunbridge Wells Hospital so far. The Tun Wells hospital at Pembury is certainly a very impressive place. The single rooms certainly make it much more pleasant to stay in hospital.

    It is a shame that so much debt was created, perhaps future PFI contracts will be better negotiated in favour of the NHS.

  • Not saying that all who work for the NHS are feckless and lazy, your mother being a good example of the other end of the spectrum, but if only a tiny minority are like the woman we know then the cost is one that should be dealt with and no I don't want doctors etc to do their own admin but would like those who are paid to do it to be there so that it can be done. The real point is that the doctors practice functions perfectly well without this person when she has her "away days" so that begs the question as to whether there is a real job there at all.

    Not sure what your experience of the private sector is but as said it would not be allowed to happen in my company.

    Nearly all doctors' practices are private companies/partnerships that contract to the NHS. This woman you know may well be working for a private company anyway.

Sign In or Register to comment.

Roland Out Forever!