Poundland Enoch - Gahndi ( as he is now comparing himself to the Mahatma I hear - LOL) will be very lucky to get elected at all in Thanet South and would be pushing it to get three or four seats in a May. There isn't going to be a re-introduction of smoking in public places because no other party would touch it with a barge pole and quite rightly too.
While we are on the subject it it high time that the Club took its responsibility seriously and stopped selfish smokers inflicting thier disgusting and dangerous habit on the non- smoking majority. Fed up with smoke choked toilets and dodging smokers blatantly ignoring the ban.
I see Farage wants to bring back smoking in pubs, but on the other hand wants to invest 3bn a year into the nhs, how is making smoking public again going to help the nhs?
He also wants to scrap the human rights laws?! That's messed up!
Also why has every party mentioned building more houses but none have mentioned building more schools and hospitals in the same areas to cope with the growing population. The biggest problem round here (sittingbourne) is that they keep building big housing estates and the schools are all already full, doctors are heaving and there is only one hospital to serve the whole of Medway and swale and that is failing.
No, he wants to allow designated smoking in pubs with correct ventilation. There's a difference. Smokers will smoke, whether they are in the pub or at home.
Yes but we shouldn't have to if we don't want to. There's nothing worse than walking through a cloud of smoke. Next he'll be saying that it's ok for people to smoke in cars with children as long as it's their car.
It doesn't matter how ventilated an 'area' is in a pub or any building smoke travels and still affects other areas.
Eh?
It will need to be a separate room, with ventilation. That means the non-smokers in the next room will not be affected.
Until the door opens and you get a bit throat full of it. It will also split up social groups as the smokers will want to stay in the smoking areas, unless the poor non smokers are dragged with them to endure the poison.
but it's ventilated?!?!?! The whole point of ventilation is that there will be no clouds of smoke to get a throat full of!
And if smokers would rather spend the whole time having snouts In another room than spend time with their mates who don't smoke, I'd suggest getting better friends.
Gary we have this law in the Czech Republic, (where the tobacco companies have long had quite sinister influence) . It doesn't work. The smoke gets into the other rooms, or you have to walk through the smoking area to get to the other area. And the bar/ waiting staff may not have a choice about which bar they work on a given night.
The only way to do this is to allow a small number of designated establishments for smokers like they have in Berlin.
personally I'd rather we spent a bit more money to turn 18% into zero by 2025, which looks achievable
See, you're not looking at this as a Politician Prague.
£12.3bn taking in tobacco tax revenue in 2012/13. This will need to replaced from somewhere.
Smokers die early. Now seeing as the elderly cost the NHS £4.6m a day just from trips and falls, the early death smokers would save us an extra few bob in all those NHS costs in their dottage.
You need to look at the long term picture
We should actually be encouraging 'well ventilated' smoking rooms in pubs and clubs.
Well the tax revenue from smoking won't just suddenly disappear. I know, having lived with and loved two 60 a day girls in my earlier life how difficult it is to give up even if you want to. The figure you haven't quoted - because it is more difficult to define and is constantly undermined by dodgy tobacco lobbying - is the amount smoking costs the NHS. So a policy of gradually pushing the smoking rate down seems to me generally the right one.
as I said to Gary, the idea of separate rooms isn't as easy to make workable (for non-smokers) as Farage wants you to believe. And you haven't told me how you protect the non-smoking barmaid in zero hours contract who is asked to work the smoking bar that night.
I went in the Princess Louise in Holborn his week for the first time since around 1986. It was jam packed just like I remembered it. But I didn't have to take my clothes to the dry cleaners next day.
Why can't people look at the terms of employment being offered at the time and make their own judgement?
At last rob someone has said it,
No one forces you to take the job, no one is being forced into slave labour by people,
Sadie everything you said exactly explained how my introduction to working as a young teenager in the UK, the agency labour market offered no idea when you worked, when you were booked you could be sent home, you never got the call again for weeks, yet no one is saying ban agency labour suppliers, although they don't offer sick pay redundancy either
Afka
Bang on since conception unemployment drops to record lows there has to be a trade off
Sports direct, Asda, etc are companies that are obviously exploiting the system so deal with them not all
What's the one area of decline affected by the smoking ban more than any other,
The British pub, I wonder how many people that were working and within the framework of suppling and supporting the pubs that closed have lost their jobs since the ban, another carpet ban on something that with choice and control didn't need to happen,
When a pub closes it's doors for the last time About twenty other businesses are affected
Smoking kills it causes cancer and it's a rridiculous thing To do, no one should be forced to work where this takes place no one should be forced to drink in there, however if you choose to do so if you choose to smoke why should someone else tell you that you can't
Smoking is never coming back to indoor public places, and just because a party that won't win more than five seats, let alone runs the country chucks it into its manifesto as a filler isn't going to change that
I think it highlights just how desperate ukip are getting with their attempts to win votes, to me it highlights how young a party they are with much to learn to be taken seriously
Smoking is never coming back to indoor public places, and just because a party that won't win more than five seats, let alone runs the country chucks it into its manifesto as a filler isn't going to change that
Because it's another occasion where a politician or his party has been criticised without properly reading their manifesto.
Why can't people look at the terms of employment being offered at the time and make their own judgement?
At last rob someone has said it,
No one forces you to take the job, no one is being forced into slave labour by people,
Sadie everything you said exactly explained how my introduction to working as a young teenager in the UK, the agency labour market offered no idea when you worked, when you were booked you could be sent home, you never got the call again for weeks, yet no one is saying ban agency labour suppliers, although they don't offer sick pay redundancy either
Exactly, why weren't zero hours ever brought up when;
I was leaving at 5:30am to beat the traffic on the M25 to get to Egham and not getting home till 7 at night Working weekends coz you weren't sure how long you were gonna be in collar for that month Waiting for the 5:47am to Charing Cross at Gravesend station to be on site in Swiss Cottage for 7:45am Getting layed off the day before we broke up for Chrsitmas break
But what was that alternative? Rock n Roll or crime I spose...
Isn't Mike Ashley, billionaire owner of football clubs, the biggest zero hours employer? Or did I hear that wrong? Shocking if true.
I think you are correct on that and I'm pretty sure someone on here a while back works in one of his stores and was complaining about it
i used to work at sports direct. It's the managers that decide the hours, and they usually give you more hours the more flexible you are. I was lucky as i live very close to the town centre and it took me 5 mins to walk to work. I usually got around 30 hours a week on a casual contract.
They paid jack shit (£5 an hour for 19 year old me) and 5 hour shifts and sometimes 10 hour splits. Not a great company but i had no problem with the flexible hours.
I'm currently self employed at a small company, so i guess i'm zero hours, I haven't had any work since easter, going in on monday. It's still pretty decent for me as i'm learning a lot. I'm gonna stick it out for another 9 months or so and then look to get a more stable job if my day rate hasn't raised significantly by then. No complaints here though, if zero hours etc wouldn't be around i wouldn't have a job and would lack the amount of experience i've gained for working with huge multinational companies like BP and Swift.
Did you feel exploited, did you need someone to stop the people doing it to you mate,
I never I enjoyed doing it, when I did suspended ceilings I done the same, it was how we all got work It's just how it is now
It was work to me mate, I never hated no one for it and for the most part, the geezer paying the dough was on site grafting too.
The only time I ever got the hump was when the likes of 35-40k a year tube drivers went on strike for socialist reasons and it made it more difficult or nigh on impossible, for me to get to work to earn my 18-20k
I'm currently self employed at a small company, so i guess i'm zero hours, I haven't had any work since easter, going in on monday. It's still pretty decent for me as i'm learning a lot. I'm gonna stick it out for another 9 months or so and then look to get a more stable job if my day rate hasn't raised significantly by then. No complaints here though, if zero hours etc wouldn't be around i wouldn't have a job and would lack the amount of experience i've gained for working with huge multinational companies like BP and Swift.
Interesting exchanges on Andrew Neil's show this morning. Angela Eagle (shadow leader of H of Commons) was quite stumped by Neil putting the very complimentary IMF report on the UK economy and its current management, which he then followed up by quoting various Labour MP's. Their many and various doom-laden predictions of the Coalition policies - unemployment at 3 million, raging inflation etc etc - which have proved to be wrong. She had no answer to his assertion that Labour are clueless about the workings of the economy. Worth watching on catch up.
I saw that. Angela Eagles also correctly pointed out that the economy was in recovery and growing when the Conservatives arrived in 2010. The Conservatives created created austerity and deflation. The balance of payments deficit increased significantly. The economy was shrunk. The point of this, is that the smaller the economy and more economically inactive the population (which increases the welfare payments as well), the less of the debt that can be paid off and the higher the deficit.
The Conservatives are looking to further massively cut spending and this will further decrease the size of the economy and make it less able to pay down the deficit. Purposefully, shrinking the economy doesn't help.
Britain also has very poor productivity in relation to other developed economies and it was good Angela Eagles picked this up.
I do like Andrew Neil though, he asks some direct difficult, blunt questions and doesn't badger the person, asking the same question 15 times, if they do not give a direct answer, which is not that helpful.
from Liam Halligan in the Telegraph. Among other things it sheds light on what zero hours is really doing to the economy.
Liam Halligan is no leftie, hell no, which is all the more reason to take notice
Some great arguments in the comment section on this as well.
But I couldn't see anything about what a better alternative is and how we deal with the new issues created from its removal
I didn't pick up on it just re zero hours. It's a right wing economics commentator in a Tory newspaper telling a few home truths. Don't like the bloke, he's a Putin apologist, but for me he has nailed the big economic issues. The one thing he failed to mention is that if you want to cut the deficit and pay down the debt, the fastest and simplest way is to make citizens and especially companies pay their debts; the taxes that parliament intended them to pay before some smartass tax lawyers helped them run rings around HMRC
Love John Stayner, UKIP candidate for, as he put it on his election leaflets, ''Penrith and Boarder''. I hope the boarder isn't an illegal immigrant.
Or Tory Scott Wood in Sedgefield whose postcard to voters was that the Tories would aim for ''Defecit illumination''. Perhaps he will shine a light on their defecit elimination?
Here's a selection of items from the Ukip 2005 manifesto:
1. They claimed that leaving the EU would "save" £12bn a year. And they said that would "use this sum entirely on an increase to the state pension". So, in other words, the whole financial benefit (although utterly questionable) would be splashed on people who do not work, do not employ and do not otherwise contribute to the economy.
2. "Scrap the Qualifications and Curriculum Authority to stop interference by government and bureaucrats in setting standards for GCSE and A level examinations". Yeah, because those pesky qualifications are a real drag, aren't they?
3. "Financial support for approved young farmers to assist with start-ups".
4. "Fishing licences to stipulate acceptable practices such as mesh sizes of nets".
5. "Support our independence and our defence industries by buying British-made equipment where possible".
In 2005, Ukip fought 496 seats and lost every one.
Here's a selection of items from the Ukip 2010 manifesto:
1. "Ukip feels the [lack of success of British teams] is largely a legacy of many British teams having too few British players in the team, and teams like Arsenal have taken to the field in the recent past with none whatsoever … Ukip would place a maximum of three foreign players in the starting line-up, as this would free up places for British players in the youth academies of these teams and spur the future development of home teams".
2. "Ukip will encourage a return to proper dress for major hotels, restaurants and theatres – smarter dress is part of Britishness, although it is also a British virtue to encourage innovation in fashion".
3. "Ukip will return London's Circle line to a circle – the complete circular service recently stopped. We will build grade-separated junctions to improve the number of trains and their reliability at Edgware Road, Gloucester Road and Aldgate".
4. "Ukip will encourage a return to the glamour, grace and style of the railway companies of the past through its railway policies. Ukip seeks a return to 'Pullman' trains where justified, with appropriate branding such as 'Great Western Railway', one of the most successful British brands ever".
5. "The unseemly haste with which National Express destroyed the quality GNER brand by painting out its heraldry on service trains standing at rail stations was a disgrace. As with the iconic red bus in London, so the government should insist on a modernised form of traditional branding – chocolate and cream for Great Western, scarlet red for Midland, apple green for the east coast. These are icons of Britishness. Go-Ahead has shown the way with an excellent, tasteful branding of its Southern network".
In 2010, Ukip fought 558 seats and lost every one.
Why can't people look at the terms of employment being offered at the time and make their own judgement?
At last rob someone has said it,
No one forces you to take the job, no one is being forced into slave labour by people,
Not strictly true. The use of zero hours contracts has ballooned in such a way, and in sectors that don't actually need to use them, that in a lot of places it's a choice between a zero hours job or no job at all. It's very easy to say that any job is better than no job at all, but when you can't be certain that you're going to get the hours that you need to support your family it can seem like a massive gamble.
At the moment, I think ZHC are excluded from the sanctions on JSA claimants if they don't apply for jobs that their advisor has flagged up for them or if they turn down a job they've been offered (I remember the daughter of one of my friends being distraught because she thought that she'd finally be getting off JSA, but she had to turn the job down because it was zero hours). However, the same doesn't apply to the new Universal Credit scheme - admittedly it doesn't affect many people so far, because the implementation has been a cock-up of the highest order, but yes there are some peoplewho are being forced on to them.
NLA, you seem to be getting hung up on the word "ban" here. The Labour party aren't saying that they're banning ALL use of zero hours contracts, just where employers are using them despite the fact that they are perfectly capable of offering their staff regular hours. It won't affect small businesses like yours where the work isn't regular.
They haven't been individually named, but the The Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority revealed the figures. MPs employ 151 on these contracts, including 77 Conservative, 62 Labour, 5 Libs
Good research! That's one of the brilliant things about Charlton Life - someone can ask a massively-obscure question and, within minutes, someone else can provide a clear, sourced answer.
However, the numbers do not show that "most" Labour MPs employ zero-hours contracts. There are 256 Labour MPs. So even if they employ one each, it's something like 25%.
It's also not zero-hours contracts. Instead, IPSA have calculated numbers of staff on "casual contracts", for example, "this may include any short-term staff taken on – for example, to provide paternity, maternity or sickness cover – part-time as well as full-time staff and apprentices and interns whose employment conditions have fulfilled the conditions set out in paragraphs 7.8 and 7.9 of the MPs’ Scheme of Business Costs and Expenses (‘the Scheme’)".
So, it's not true to say "most" Labour MPs employ staff on zero-hours contracts; nor is this number calculated. It would be true to say that they employ fewer than the coalition (82) and fewer than the Conservatives (77).
Exploitative zero-hour contracts should be outlawed.
Comments
While we are on the subject it it high time that the Club took its responsibility seriously and stopped selfish smokers inflicting thier disgusting and dangerous habit on the non- smoking majority. Fed up with smoke choked toilets and dodging smokers blatantly ignoring the ban.
as I said to Gary, the idea of separate rooms isn't as easy to make workable (for non-smokers) as Farage wants you to believe. And you haven't told me how you protect the non-smoking barmaid in zero hours contract who is asked to work the smoking bar that night.
I went in the Princess Louise in Holborn his week for the first time since around 1986. It was jam packed just like I remembered it. But I didn't have to take my clothes to the dry cleaners next day.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/liamhalligan/11547132/David-Cameron-will-regret-his-spending-promises.html
from Liam Halligan in the Telegraph. Among other things it sheds light on what zero hours is really doing to the economy.
Liam Halligan is no leftie, hell no, which is all the more reason to take notice
No one forces you to take the job, no one is being forced into slave labour by people,
Sadie everything you said exactly explained how my introduction to working as a young teenager in the UK, the agency labour market offered no idea when you worked, when you were booked you could be sent home, you never got the call again for weeks, yet no one is saying ban agency labour suppliers, although they don't offer sick pay redundancy either
Afka
Bang on since conception unemployment drops to record lows there has to be a trade off
Sports direct, Asda, etc are companies that are obviously exploiting the system so deal with them not all
What's the one area of decline affected by the smoking ban more than any other,
The British pub, I wonder how many people that were working and within the framework of suppling and supporting the pubs that closed have lost their jobs since the ban, another carpet ban on something that with choice and control didn't need to happen,
When a pub closes it's doors for the last time
About twenty other businesses are affected
Smoking kills it causes cancer and it's a rridiculous thing To do, no one should be forced to work where this takes place no one should be forced to drink in there, however if you choose to do so if you choose to smoke why should someone else tell you that you can't
Smoking is never coming back to indoor public places, and just because a party that won't win more than five seats, let alone runs the country chucks it into its manifesto as a filler isn't going to change that
Some great arguments in the comment section on this as well.
I was leaving at 5:30am to beat the traffic on the M25 to get to Egham and not getting home till 7 at night
Working weekends coz you weren't sure how long you were gonna be in collar for that month
Waiting for the 5:47am to Charing Cross at Gravesend station to be on site in Swiss Cottage for 7:45am
Getting layed off the day before we broke up for Chrsitmas break
But what was that alternative? Rock n Roll or crime I spose...
And then people say the British don't wanna work
I never I enjoyed doing it, when I did suspended ceilings I done the same, it was how we all got work It's just how it is now
They paid jack shit (£5 an hour for 19 year old me) and 5 hour shifts and sometimes 10 hour splits. Not a great company but i had no problem with the flexible hours.
I'm currently self employed at a small company, so i guess i'm zero hours, I haven't had any work since easter, going in on monday. It's still pretty decent for me as i'm learning a lot. I'm gonna stick it out for another 9 months or so and then look to get a more stable job if my day rate hasn't raised significantly by then. No complaints here though, if zero hours etc wouldn't be around i wouldn't have a job and would lack the amount of experience i've gained for working with huge multinational companies like BP and Swift.
The only time I ever got the hump was when the likes of 35-40k a year tube drivers went on strike for socialist reasons and it made it more difficult or nigh on impossible, for me to get to work to earn my 18-20k
But I couldn't see anything about what a better alternative is and how we deal with the new issues created from its removal
Angela Eagle (shadow leader of H of Commons) was quite stumped by Neil putting the very complimentary IMF report on the UK economy and its current management, which he then followed up by quoting various Labour MP's.
Their many and various doom-laden predictions of the Coalition policies - unemployment at 3 million, raging inflation etc etc - which have proved to be wrong.
She had no answer to his assertion that Labour are clueless about the workings of the economy. Worth watching on catch up.
The Conservatives are looking to further massively cut spending and this will further decrease the size of the economy and make it less able to pay down the deficit. Purposefully, shrinking the economy doesn't help.
Britain also has very poor productivity in relation to other developed economies and it was good Angela Eagles picked this up.
I do like Andrew Neil though, he asks some direct difficult, blunt questions and doesn't badger the person, asking the same question 15 times, if they do not give a direct answer, which is not that helpful.
It's a right wing economics commentator in a Tory newspaper telling a few home truths. Don't like the bloke, he's a Putin apologist, but for me he has nailed the big economic issues. The one thing he failed to mention is that if you want to cut the deficit and pay down the debt, the fastest and simplest way is to make citizens and especially companies pay their debts; the taxes that parliament intended them to pay before some smartass tax lawyers helped them run rings around HMRC
I hope the boarder isn't an illegal immigrant.
Or Tory Scott Wood in Sedgefield whose postcard to voters was that the Tories would aim for ''Defecit illumination''. Perhaps he will shine a light on their defecit elimination?
Here's a selection of items from the Ukip 2005 manifesto:
1. They claimed that leaving the EU would "save" £12bn a year. And they said that would "use this sum entirely on an increase to the state pension". So, in other words, the whole financial benefit (although utterly questionable) would be splashed on people who do not work, do not employ and do not otherwise contribute to the economy.
2. "Scrap the Qualifications and Curriculum Authority to stop interference by government and bureaucrats in setting standards for GCSE and A level examinations". Yeah, because those pesky qualifications are a real drag, aren't they?
3. "Financial support for approved young farmers to assist with start-ups".
4. "Fishing licences to stipulate acceptable practices such as mesh sizes of nets".
5. "Support our independence and our defence industries by buying British-made equipment where possible".
In 2005, Ukip fought 496 seats and lost every one.
Here's a selection of items from the Ukip 2010 manifesto:
1. "Ukip feels the [lack of success of British teams] is largely a legacy of many British teams having too few British players in the team, and teams like Arsenal have taken to the field in the recent past with none whatsoever … Ukip would place a maximum of three foreign players in the starting line-up, as this would free up places for British players in the youth academies of these teams and spur the future development of home teams".
2. "Ukip will encourage a return to proper dress for major hotels, restaurants and theatres – smarter dress is part of Britishness, although it is also a British virtue to encourage innovation in fashion".
3. "Ukip will return London's Circle line to a circle – the complete circular service recently stopped. We will build grade-separated junctions to improve the number of trains and their reliability at Edgware Road, Gloucester Road and Aldgate".
4. "Ukip will encourage a return to the glamour, grace and style of the railway companies of the past through its railway policies. Ukip seeks a return to 'Pullman' trains where justified, with appropriate branding such as 'Great Western Railway', one of the most successful British brands ever".
5. "The unseemly haste with which National Express destroyed the quality GNER brand by painting out its heraldry on service trains standing at rail stations was a disgrace. As with the iconic red bus in London, so the government should insist on a modernised form of traditional branding – chocolate and cream for Great Western, scarlet red for Midland, apple green for the east coast. These are icons of Britishness. Go-Ahead has shown the way with an excellent, tasteful branding of its Southern network".
In 2010, Ukip fought 558 seats and lost every one.
At the moment, I think ZHC are excluded from the sanctions on JSA claimants if they don't apply for jobs that their advisor has flagged up for them or if they turn down a job they've been offered (I remember the daughter of one of my friends being distraught because she thought that she'd finally be getting off JSA, but she had to turn the job down because it was zero hours). However, the same doesn't apply to the new Universal Credit scheme - admittedly it doesn't affect many people so far, because the implementation has been a cock-up of the highest order, but yes there are some peoplewho are being forced on to them.
NLA, you seem to be getting hung up on the word "ban" here. The Labour party aren't saying that they're banning ALL use of zero hours contracts, just where employers are using them despite the fact that they are perfectly capable of offering their staff regular hours. It won't affect small businesses like yours where the work isn't regular.
However, the numbers do not show that "most" Labour MPs employ zero-hours contracts. There are 256 Labour MPs. So even if they employ one each, it's something like 25%.
It's also not zero-hours contracts. Instead, IPSA have calculated numbers of staff on "casual contracts", for example, "this may include any short-term staff taken on – for example, to provide paternity, maternity or sickness cover – part-time as well as full-time staff and apprentices and interns whose employment conditions have fulfilled the conditions set out in paragraphs 7.8 and 7.9 of the MPs’ Scheme of Business Costs and Expenses (‘the Scheme’)".
So, it's not true to say "most" Labour MPs employ staff on zero-hours contracts; nor is this number calculated. It would be true to say that they employ fewer than the coalition (82) and fewer than the Conservatives (77).
Exploitative zero-hour contracts should be outlawed.