I can't see anything other than a hung parliament. Lots of people will be pissed off at the Tories and May. But at he same time Corbyn won't get enough to turn it around. Lib Dems will rpobably get a few seats back. UKIP may get one or two. SNP wll serge north of the boarder.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
So for the first time in my adult life, I won't be voting Labour, I'll be voting Lib Dem, won't make much difference in Dartford, and we'll end up with that clown Gareth Johnson back again, but I just can't vote Labour with its stance on leaving the EU, and the Lib Dems are the only party providing the opposition required.
I can't see anything other than a hung parliament. Lots of people will be pissed off at the Tories and May. But at he same time Corbyn won't get enough to turn it around. Lib Dems will rpobably get a few seats back. UKIP may get one or two. SNP wll serge north of the boarder.
Unless Murdoch (or the Russians) decide otherwise, I can't see anything other than a stronger Tory majority after the election.
I've never voted anything other than Labour but couldn't vote for them at the moment - it doesn't mean that I'll vote Tory of course but I'm pretty sure that I'm not alone being in this position and that will split the old labour vote. The Lib-Dems would be the main beneficiaries would be my guess but not in a significant enough way for it to be meaningful.
I'm stunned by this, how can they call it so soon. Some of the candidates need time to get their costumes dry-cleaned, some their names changed (either for novelty purposes or to avoid any salacious stories on Google) and some need to fabricate friendships and conjure up stories about the various disasters they believe they might have attended. None of this shit just happens by itself overnight. Theresa is just inconsiderate. There I've said it.
A considerable number will have to find new homes (at least to rent) in the constituency they hope to represent too.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Maybe if the centre of the party offered a credible candidate it might be different. When you have someone like @Fiiish missing Ed Milliband, you know you are in trouble.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Lib Dems only credible English party who are opposing Brexit...
Conservatives and Labour are both pro Remain (unless they have both done u-turns from the referendum campaign) but are both pro respecting the will of the people. Big difference.
They were pro remain, they are now, based on the will of the people, pro Brexit.
Let me put it this way then, the Lib Dems are the only big party in England that don't care about democracy.
I don't get this.
Part of democracy is being able to air opposing views. It's not just a silent acceptance of the will of the (marginal) majority.
IF the Lib Dems fight a general election on a Remain ticket, and win (big if) - will they still be anti-democratic?
Elections are held every few years because 'the will of the people' changes in response to internal and external events. Why is it that some people think that a referendum result can never again be questioned (or the question put again)?
Because of the nature of the referendum. Changing a political party every few years isn't much of an issue, negotiating your way in and out of the EU every few years is. Hence whey the last time we had one on it was over 40 years ago. To draw parallels with something as simple as an election is a bit simplistic...
I take your point, but for me this reinforces the vital importance of ensuring that such key decisions are well informed.
Since the referendum, many of the key promises set out by the Leave campaign have been shown to be misleading at best (think bus). The £350m a week extra for the NHS was dropped pretty much the following day.
There's another thread for the Brexit debate and I don't want to reopen it here, but this really does destroy any perceived mandate for Brexit in my opinion.
Many? Well you've listed one, why don't you continue to list the others? Also, whilst your at it, explain how you expect them to have been achieved in less than a year.
Hi @Bow_Addick - you have asked @Jodaius to produce some more lies - apart from the £350m a week to be spent on the NHS whopper - that we were sold during the Brexit referendum. But I hope you don't mind me jumping in to remind everyone of some of the lies the official leave campaigns told during the campaign. This - as @Jodaius has said - is not meant to re-open that debate, but to reinforce the point @Jodaius made, which is that this time, we should make sure we are properly, accurately and accountably informed. Democracy works best when the electorate isn't lied to.
Can I add a few?
- £111.8bn of new spending commitments. These were lies
- A fall in net migration as a result of "taking back control of our borders". Brexit has had no effect on our ability to control migration from outside the EU. And since Brexit we still do not have a solution as to how we can control our land border with the EU. These were lies.
- Staying in the single market ("Absolutely nobody is talking about threatening our place in the single market" Daniel Hannan. "Only a madman woud leave the market", Owen Paterson. "Increasingly the Norwegian option looks the best for the UK" Arron Banks). All lies.
- We were told we couldn't prevent Turkey joining the EU - that was a lie.
- Likewise we were told we could not prevent a European Army - another lie.
- We are liable for eurzone bailouts. A lie.
- EU law is adopted by unlected buraucrats. Thankfully (although too late) everyone now understands this was a lie.
- EU "health tourism" costs the NHS billions. It doesn't; it's a lie.
- The EU prevents the UK from deporting EU criminals. This is a lie.
- 70% of our laws come from the EU. This is yet another lie.
- The EU budget ceiling can rise without our input. Not true - this is a lie.
- "We were told we were only joining a free-trade area. "No-one told us that it was more than that". This is a lie.
What are the odds Labour will try to make the election about the NHS and not Brexit?
This is not a second referendum by proxy, it is a General Election, and we should treat it as such. I felt that a Leave win in last years referendum would distract the general public from many of the big issues we face as a country for the next 5 years, and I fear that may be the case.
Britain's exit from the EU will obviously be a big talking point, and rightly so, however we ought to remember that there are many other issues in our country right now of which chronic under-funding of the NHS is one.
What's more I feel confident when I say that a failing NHS will have a much bigger impact on the lives of most of us as opposed to whether it is Brussels's bureaucrats or our bureaucrats who govern us.
What are the odds Labour will try to make the election about the NHS and not Brexit?
This is not a second referendum by proxy, it is a General Election, and we should treat it as such. I felt that a Leave win in last years referendum would distract the general public from many of the big issues we face as a country for the next 5 years, and I fear that may be the case.
Britain's exit from the EU will obviously be a big talking point, and rightly so, however we ought to remember that there are many other issues in our country right now of which chronic under-funding of the NHS is one.
What's more I feel confident when I say that a failing NHS will have a much bigger impact on the lives of most of us as opposed to whether it is Brussels's bureaucrats or our bureaucrats who govern us.
It will but people are more interested in waving flags.
Lib Dems only credible English party who are opposing Brexit...
Conservatives and Labour are both pro Remain (unless they have both done u-turns from the referendum campaign) but are both pro respecting the will of the people. Big difference.
They were pro remain, they are now, based on the will of the people, pro Brexit.
Let me put it this way then, the Lib Dems are the only big party in England that don't care about democracy.
I don't get this.
Part of democracy is being able to air opposing views. It's not just a silent acceptance of the will of the (marginal) majority.
IF the Lib Dems fight a general election on a Remain ticket, and win (big if) - will they still be anti-democratic?
Elections are held every few years because 'the will of the people' changes in response to internal and external events. Why is it that some people think that a referendum result can never again be questioned (or the question put again)?
Because of the nature of the referendum. Changing a political party every few years isn't much of an issue, negotiating your way in and out of the EU every few years is. Hence whey the last time we had one on it was over 40 years ago. To draw parallels with something as simple as an election is a bit simplistic...
I take your point, but for me this reinforces the vital importance of ensuring that such key decisions are well informed.
Since the referendum, many of the key promises set out by the Leave campaign have been shown to be misleading at best (think bus). The £350m a week extra for the NHS was dropped pretty much the following day.
There's another thread for the Brexit debate and I don't want to reopen it here, but this really does destroy any perceived mandate for Brexit in my opinion.
Many? Well you've listed one, why don't you continue to list the others? Also, whilst your at it, explain how you expect them to have been achieved in less than a year.
Hi @Bow_Addick - you have asked @Jodaius to produce some more lies - apart from the £350m a week to be spent on the NHS whopper - that we were sold during the Brexit referendum. But I hope you don't mind me jumping in to remind everyone of some of the lies the official leave campaigns told during the campaign. This - as @Jodaius has said - is not meant to re-open that debate, but to reinforce the point @Jodaius made, which is that this time, we should make sure we are properly, accurately and accountably informed. Democracy works best when the electorate isn't lied to.
Can I add a few?
- £111.8bn of new spending commitments. These were lies
- A fall in net migration as a result of "taking back control of our borders". Brexit has had no effect on our ability to control migration from outside the EU. And since Brexit we still do not have a solution as to how we can control our land border with the EU. These were lies.
- Staying in the single market ("Absolutely nobody is talking about threatening our place in the single market" Daniel Hannan. "Only a madman woud leave the market", Owen Paterson. "Increasingly the Norwegian option looks the best for the UK" Arron Banks). All lies.
- We were told we couldn't prevent Turkey joining the EU - that was a lie.
- Likewise we were told we could not prevent a European Army - another lie.
- We are liable for eurzone bailouts. A lie.
- EU law is adopted by unlected buraucrats. Thankfully (although too late) everyone now understands this was a lie.
- EU "health tourism" costs the NHS billions. It doesn't; it's a lie.
- The EU prevents the UK from deporting EU criminals. This is a lie.
- 70% of our laws come from the EU. This is yet another lie.
- The EU budget ceiling can rise without our input. Not true - this is a lie.
- "We were told we were only joining a free-trade area. "No-one told us that it was more than that". This is a lie.
This is why we need a 2nd referendum on what is eventually negotiated by May and co. Let the people decide not the Tory Party - May is only calling this election because Corbyn has presented her with the opportunity to keep the decision within the Tory Party.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Maybe if the centre of the party offered a credible candidate it might be different. When you have someone like Fiiish missing Ed Milliband, you know you are in trouble.
By someone like me, I assume someone who wants a credible opposition?
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
A shameless U turn Mrs May and those who tell her what to do, think & say, believe: 1) that Corbyn's mob is an unelectable mess from whom a good few marginal seats can be taken and 2) the current slim tory majority is slim enough to be worrisome as the Conservative corsair drifts rudderless into the dark, uncharted waters of Brexit to face the hitherto unseen fleet of the united states of Europe. On 1) there can be no argument. With 2) only time will tell whether there are sufficient tory remainer zealots with big enough balls to defy the whips and to outnumber the brexiteers in all parties who will refuse to disrupt the process regardless of their instructions. This morning's announcement is nothing more than self-interested election opportunism, I'm not buying the "we're only doing this so we can get brexit done without interference from all the silly people". I'd laugh my cock right off if tomorrow's vote didn't produce the 2/3's majority required to curtail this parliament. If the LibDems, Scots nationalists and tory remainers really want to stick one in Teresa's eye they need to be going all out to scupper the move at the first opportunity. Many who know lots more about Westminster politicking suggest this is unlikely. Come the election: Corbyn's rabble will lose a few marginals but probably not that many, they're already pretty much pared back to their traditional heartlands where tories never prosper and both leading English parties are out of the picture in Scotland. The LibDems are sadly invisible in every real sense and their chances of gaining more than a couple of seats are nil. Sturgeon's crowd are rock solid in Scotland and not bothered about England at all. Indeed the scots nationalists would probably take more seats off Labour in England than the Tories if they chose to stand, Sturgeon herself has more integrity than 90% of English MP's added together. Wales & Ulster always do their own thing in GE's and none of the other parties are worth airtime. Are the same witless turds advising May now as scuppered Cameron with their woefully misplaced fears that Dave might not win the last election? If tomorrow's parliamentary vote goes as expected and an early election is called, ladies and gentlemen we will be presented with a grand early opportunity to cut this vicious, dogmatic tory abomination off at the knees. Winning an early election isn't about smoothing the Brexit business. It's about speeding up the dismantling of the welfare state, the health service, employees rights, lower and lower taxes for the richest. I've never voted Labour in my life, I've voted tory more often than anything else, where I grew up nobody else was ever visible. But this 21st century incarnation of Conservatism is abhorrent, wicked even. Don't get sick or old people cos this cadre of superannuated gravy train guzzlers will just get their chauffeur to drive over your ailing carcass and send your kids a bill for the damage to the Bentley. Brexit is in Downing Street's shaky hands (and their paymasters) and will be what it will be, this election won't change a thing there, we'll just have to cope with the shitty hand we're dealt when it happens. Tories running GB with a more workable majority will be awful, painful and heartless. On June 8, in the interests of all those who might need any sort of looking after post 2018, we have to vote for the candidate most likely to beat the tory. Voting tory will swiftly and directly be to the detriment of those you hold dear who may require the state's help in any way in the months and years to come. For the hard of reading: if you vote conservative you're voting for your granny to die in the street when she and you can't afford the carehome bills anymore; you're voting for legions of homeless begging in doorways the length and breadth of our once proud land; you're voting for closing your local hospital, you're voting for state schools with ever larger class sizes and ever deteriorating classrooms and ever fewer teachers; you're voting away your own old age pension. Don't vote tory and obviously don't vote for any of the racist nutjob gangs either.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Extreme left?
Yes Baldric, the extreme left.
Quite the hyperbole there, he's left wing but far from extreme left.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Extreme left?
Yes Baldric, the extreme left.
Quite the hyperbole there, he's left wing but far from extreme left.
The party has been hijacked. The system for electing the leader means that all the extreme left nut jobs including Momentum have found a home and a way of having a left wing leader with extreme left wing policies or he's /She's out. Corbyn himself is extreme left by modern political standards. His policies not moved on since the seventies. Anyone that thinks the Labour Party will elect post Corbyn anyone other than another left winger who is seen by the public as unelectable is I'm afraid mistaken. That's why labour is moribund.
Well, this is going to bring forward the end of Simon Burns in Chelmsford. Good MP though his voting record was of a man utterly opposed to the progress of humanity. What worries me is that Chelmsford is such a safe Tory seat they will use it to bring in some fresh faced hopeful formal political advisor. Or Katie Hopkins.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Extreme left?
Yes Baldric, the extreme left.
Quite the hyperbole there, he's left wing but far from extreme left.
The party has been hijacked. The system for electing the leader means that all the extreme left nut jobs including Momentum have found a home and a way of having a left wing leader with extreme left wing policies or he's /She's out. Corbyn himself is extreme left by modern political standards. His policies not moved on since the seventies. Anyone that thinks the Labour Party will elect post Corbyn anyone other than another left winger who is seen by the public as unelectable is I'm afraid mistaken. That's why labour is moribund.
Corbyn won the 2nd of his leadership elections by ~120,000 votes. If any non-extreme left nut jobs want someone else then just get 121,000 people to join up and vote for that candidate. That's what Corbyn did!
I suppose there is a desire from some to vote Nationalist, either for the SNP or UKIP (which purport to be very different...hmmn) and I can only assume that those of a nationalist persuasion are happy to do so for some reason, and others will vote nationalist because they can't bring themselves to vote for one of the others. I find it really hard to understand though, this global movement towards some idealised view of the world. Great Britain, making America great again, Le Pen inviting people to vote for the Frenchness of the French, Sinn Fein, the Scots, the idea of UK independence and sovereignty and so on. To me nationalists seem to want ti stick a pin into a moment from history when they felt their country was great. For the Scots it would be when Mel Gibson took them to the world cup in Argentina sporting Kilts and sporrens, for the English maybe Victorian Britain, or the world wars, maybe for Americans or Australians it would be when white settlers were practicing genocide on an industrial scale against native peoples, maybe for the French it would be the age of the Guillotine or Napoleon. My overall point is that what one person thinks of as their 'nation', good old British values and all that, will differ from what another person thinks of as their nation. Indeed in Fascist Germany they took the notion of being a proper German to a whole new level. I get the romantic yearning for a notion that has never really existed in terms of ones perceived 'nation'. However I really don't see how nationalism of any sort can speak to the reality of our present interconnected Global Village, sharing the same air and water in this part of the galaxy, where indeed there certainly ought to be more things that unite us than divide us.
I'm not going to make too much comment but Great Britain is not exactly a new concept and you may struggle to find anyone that yearns for a return to world wars!
Yes, but it is just a bit of rhetoric. Great in this sense means big - and it comes from a translation of the French - Grande Bretagne as opposed to Bretagne, which is Brittany. We're Big Britain and Brittany is effectively Little Britain.
So all this "make Britain great again" is about making it bigger rather than greater in the modern sense. I suppose we could reclaim a few coastal marshes.
Beat me to it. It's geography, not rhetoric.
The UK (United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland) – a sovereign state that includes England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Great Britain (Grand Bretagne - To distinguish between it and Little Britain - Bretagne)– an island situated off the north west coast of Europe. British Isles – a collection of over 6,000 islands, of which Great Britain is the largest. England – a country within the UK which is not a sovereign state Scotland - a country within the UK that is not a sovereign state but wants to be.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Extreme left?
Yes Baldric, the extreme left.
Quite the hyperbole there, he's left wing but far from extreme left.
The party has been hijacked. The system for electing the leader means that all the extreme left nut jobs including Momentum have found a home and a way of having a left wing leader with extreme left wing policies or he's /She's out. Corbyn himself is extreme left by modern political standards. His policies not moved on since the seventies. Anyone that thinks the Labour Party will elect post Corbyn anyone other than another left winger who is seen by the public as unelectable is I'm afraid mistaken. That's why labour is moribund.
Corbyn won the 2nd of his leadership elections by ~120,000 votes. If any non-extreme left nut jobs want someone else then just get 121,000 people to join up and vote for that candidate. That's what Corbyn did!
But it won't happen. The majority of traditional moderate centre left labour voters are not and never have been Labour Party members. They turn up and vote labour at the polls but have no wish to join a political party. Yes it's to a certain extent apathy but that's exactly why the system of electing the Labour Party leader was tailor made for a left wing coup.
All it means in reality is that people like me that have never voted anything other than labour in 43 years of voting are now politically homeless.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Extreme left?
Yes Baldric, the extreme left.
Quite the hyperbole there, he's left wing but far from extreme left.
The party has been hijacked. The system for electing the leader means that all the extreme left nut jobs including Momentum have found a home and a way of having a left wing leader with extreme left wing policies or he's /She's out. Corbyn himself is extreme left by modern political standards. His policies not moved on since the seventies. Anyone that thinks the Labour Party will elect post Corbyn anyone other than another left winger who is seen by the public as unelectable is I'm afraid mistaken. That's why labour is moribund.
Disagree on your first part but agree on the second. It was a fair way of electing a leader, it was just exploited better by Corbyn. Anyone could have signed up if they cared enough about who leads the party. And on your point about him being extreme left by modern standards is quite a sad indictment of how right wing politics has become in the modern day. I still wouldn't say he is extreme left but yes he is much further left than the general political landscape at the moment.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Extreme left?
Yes Baldric, the extreme left.
Quite the hyperbole there, he's left wing but far from extreme left.
The party has been hijacked. The system for electing the leader means that all the extreme left nut jobs including Momentum have found a home and a way of having a left wing leader with extreme left wing policies or he's /She's out. Corbyn himself is extreme left by modern political standards. His policies not moved on since the seventies. Anyone that thinks the Labour Party will elect post Corbyn anyone other than another left winger who is seen by the public as unelectable is I'm afraid mistaken. That's why labour is moribund.
Disagree on your first part but agree on the second. It was a fair way of electing a leader, it was just exploited better by Corbyn. Anyone could have signed up if they cared enough about who leads the party. And on your point about him being extreme left by modern standards is quite a sad indictment of how right wing politics has become in the modern day. I still wouldn't say he is extreme left but yes he is much further left than the general political landscape at the moment.
So it's fair that Len McClusky of Unite has the say on who leads the Labour Party.
Not for me it isn't. Apart from being a Labour Party voter and sometime party member I have also been a trade unionist all my working life and up until November of last year was Chair of the South East region of a trade union. My labour credentials are credible.
Maybe an essay question in this year's Government and Politics A-level could go something like: 'Compare and contrast how Jeremy Corbyn and Theresa May became leaders of their respective parties'.
This is a cynical exercise by May and this is in the interests of the party and not the country. The fixed term parliament legislation is utterly pointless if it's so easy to bypass.
We are in danger of becoming a one party state with no effective opposition - there will be no proper debate over the terms of Brexit.
Corbyn's response will be useless and I'm sure the turnout will be pitiful.
At least it gives Labour a chance to get rid of Corbyn in 2017 instead of waiting until after he would have lost in 2020.
Yeah. John McDonnell will have Labour voters flooding back and the Tories bricking it.
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
Extreme left?
Yes Baldric, the extreme left.
Quite the hyperbole there, he's left wing but far from extreme left.
The party has been hijacked. The system for electing the leader means that all the extreme left nut jobs including Momentum have found a home and a way of having a left wing leader with extreme left wing policies or he's /She's out. Corbyn himself is extreme left by modern political standards. His policies not moved on since the seventies. Anyone that thinks the Labour Party will elect post Corbyn anyone other than another left winger who is seen by the public as unelectable is I'm afraid mistaken. That's why labour is moribund.
Disagree on your first part but agree on the second. It was a fair way of electing a leader, it was just exploited better by Corbyn. Anyone could have signed up if they cared enough about who leads the party. And on your point about him being extreme left by modern standards is quite a sad indictment of how right wing politics has become in the modern day. I still wouldn't say he is extreme left but yes he is much further left than the general political landscape at the moment.
Corbyn is far left by Labour party standards. Even ignoring New Labour, they're previous 2 PMs Wilson and Callaghan were centrist politicians. For every Tony Benn, there were Roy Jenkins, Dennis Healey and Shirley Williams
Comments
The Labour Party is done for. It's been hijacked by the extreme left and that isn't going to change now. They will elect loser after loser until they disappear into the Permanant talking shop Corbyn has presided over.
The only good news I see is that post this election we might see the emergence of a fledgling centre left party. Will take years to come together but by god the country needs an opposition.
I've never voted anything other than Labour but couldn't vote for them at the moment - it doesn't mean that I'll vote Tory of course but I'm pretty sure that I'm not alone being in this position and that will split the old labour vote. The Lib-Dems would be the main beneficiaries would be my guess but not in a significant enough way for it to be meaningful.
Can I add a few?
- £111.8bn of new spending commitments. These were lies
- A fall in net migration as a result of "taking back control of our borders". Brexit has had no effect on our ability to control migration from outside the EU. And since Brexit we still do not have a solution as to how we can control our land border with the EU. These were lies.
- Staying in the single market ("Absolutely nobody is talking about threatening our place in the single market" Daniel Hannan. "Only a madman woud leave the market", Owen Paterson. "Increasingly the Norwegian option looks the best for the UK" Arron Banks). All lies.
- We were told we couldn't prevent Turkey joining the EU - that was a lie.
- Likewise we were told we could not prevent a European Army - another lie.
- We are liable for eurzone bailouts. A lie.
- EU law is adopted by unlected buraucrats. Thankfully (although too late) everyone now understands this was a lie.
- EU "health tourism" costs the NHS billions. It doesn't; it's a lie.
- The EU prevents the UK from deporting EU criminals. This is a lie.
- 70% of our laws come from the EU. This is yet another lie.
- The EU budget ceiling can rise without our input. Not true - this is a lie.
- "We were told we were only joining a free-trade area. "No-one told us that it was more than that". This is a lie.
Britain's exit from the EU will obviously be a big talking point, and rightly so, however we ought to remember that there are many other issues in our country right now of which chronic under-funding of the NHS is one.
What's more I feel confident when I say that a failing NHS will have a much bigger impact on the lives of most of us as opposed to whether it is Brussels's bureaucrats or our bureaucrats who govern us.
Mrs May and those who tell her what to do, think & say, believe: 1) that Corbyn's mob is an unelectable mess from whom a good few marginal seats can be taken and 2) the current slim tory majority is slim enough to be worrisome as the Conservative corsair drifts rudderless into the dark, uncharted waters of Brexit to face the hitherto unseen fleet of the united states of Europe.
On 1) there can be no argument. With 2) only time will tell whether there are sufficient tory remainer zealots with big enough balls to defy the whips and to outnumber the brexiteers in all parties who will refuse to disrupt the process regardless of their instructions.
This morning's announcement is nothing more than self-interested election opportunism, I'm not buying the "we're only doing this so we can get brexit done without interference from all the silly people".
I'd laugh my cock right off if tomorrow's vote didn't produce the 2/3's majority required to curtail this parliament.
If the LibDems, Scots nationalists and tory remainers really want to stick one in Teresa's eye they need to be going all out to scupper the move at the first opportunity. Many who know lots more about Westminster politicking suggest this is unlikely.
Come the election: Corbyn's rabble will lose a few marginals but probably not that many, they're already pretty much pared back to their traditional heartlands where tories never prosper and both leading English parties are out of the picture in Scotland.
The LibDems are sadly invisible in every real sense and their chances of gaining more than a couple of seats are nil.
Sturgeon's crowd are rock solid in Scotland and not bothered about England at all. Indeed the scots nationalists would probably take more seats off Labour in England than the Tories if they chose to stand, Sturgeon herself has more integrity than 90% of English MP's added together.
Wales & Ulster always do their own thing in GE's and none of the other parties are worth airtime.
Are the same witless turds advising May now as scuppered Cameron with their woefully misplaced fears that Dave might not win the last election?
If tomorrow's parliamentary vote goes as expected and an early election is called, ladies and gentlemen we will be presented with a grand early opportunity to cut this vicious, dogmatic tory abomination off at the knees. Winning an early election isn't about smoothing the Brexit business. It's about speeding up the dismantling of the welfare state, the health service, employees rights, lower and lower taxes for the richest.
I've never voted Labour in my life, I've voted tory more often than anything else, where I grew up nobody else was ever visible.
But this 21st century incarnation of Conservatism is abhorrent, wicked even.
Don't get sick or old people cos this cadre of superannuated gravy train guzzlers will just get their chauffeur to drive over your ailing carcass and send your kids a bill for the damage to the Bentley.
Brexit is in Downing Street's shaky hands (and their paymasters) and will be what it will be, this election won't change a thing there, we'll just have to cope with the shitty hand we're dealt when it happens.
Tories running GB with a more workable majority will be awful, painful and heartless.
On June 8, in the interests of all those who might need any sort of looking after post 2018, we have to vote for the candidate most likely to beat the tory. Voting tory will swiftly and directly be to the detriment of those you hold dear who may require the state's help in any way in the months and years to come. For the hard of reading: if you vote conservative you're voting for your granny to die in the street when she and you can't afford the carehome bills anymore; you're voting for legions of homeless begging in doorways the length and breadth of our once proud land; you're voting for closing your local hospital, you're voting for state schools with ever larger class sizes and ever deteriorating classrooms and ever fewer teachers; you're voting away your own old age pension.
Don't vote tory and obviously don't vote for any of the racist nutjob gangs either.
Corbyn himself is extreme left by modern political standards. His policies not moved on since the seventies. Anyone that thinks the Labour Party will elect post Corbyn anyone other than another left winger who is seen by the public as unelectable is I'm afraid mistaken. That's why labour is moribund.
The UK (United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland) – a sovereign state that includes England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.
Great Britain (Grand Bretagne - To distinguish between it and Little Britain - Bretagne)– an island situated off the north west coast of Europe.
British Isles – a collection of over 6,000 islands, of which Great Britain is the largest.
England – a country within the UK which is not a sovereign state
Scotland - a country within the UK that is not a sovereign state but wants to be.
All it means in reality is that people like me that have never voted anything other than labour in 43 years of voting are now politically homeless.
Not for me it isn't. Apart from being a Labour Party voter and sometime party member I have also been a trade unionist all my working life and up until November of last year was Chair of the South East region of a trade union. My labour credentials are credible.
Will I vote for Corbyn ? Will I f**k.
'Compare and contrast how Jeremy Corbyn and Theresa May became leaders of their respective parties'.
We are in danger of becoming a one party state with no effective opposition - there will be no proper debate over the terms of Brexit.
Corbyn's response will be useless and I'm sure the turnout will be pitiful.
Edit: @C_A_F_C did this a while back.