How do the Tories need to change?
Comments
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I have a feeling that her star will become a black hole sucking in light and stretching time when she is exposed to the national media/tough decisions. I was reading something, somewhere about her already falling popularity in Scotland and that there is a website keeping count of her lies (a bit like Trump).MuttleyCAFC said:
It is all relative - The only rising star they seem to have is Ruth Davison and she is too pro-remain. So only natural they set their standards a bit low.kentaddick said:
I can’t think of anyone more bland than gavin Williamson. He has the charisma of an average sized pebble. I have no idea why people seem to think he’s a “rising star” in the Tory party.Red_in_SE8 said:Gavin Williamson must surely have the lowest IQ of anyone who has ever attained a cabinet position. And yet, apparently, he has serious ambitions of becoming the leader of the Tory Party!
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2018/may/29/richard-madeley-gavin-williamson-dodges-question-on-russia-video0 -
That was always going to happen in Scotland - she is a Tory. But she is a very capable politician who comes across as reasonable. If she was running things, I'd feel a lot better about the country than I do with the current clowns in charge.Cordoban Addick said:
I have a feeling that her star will become a black hole sucking in light and stretching time when she is exposed to the national media/tough decisions. I was reading something, somewhere about her already falling popularity in Scotland and that there is a website keeping count of her lies (a bit like Trump).MuttleyCAFC said:
It is all relative - The only rising star they seem to have is Ruth Davison and she is too pro-remain. So only natural they set their standards a bit low.kentaddick said:
I can’t think of anyone more bland than gavin Williamson. He has the charisma of an average sized pebble. I have no idea why people seem to think he’s a “rising star” in the Tory party.Red_in_SE8 said:Gavin Williamson must surely have the lowest IQ of anyone who has ever attained a cabinet position. And yet, apparently, he has serious ambitions of becoming the leader of the Tory Party!
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2018/may/29/richard-madeley-gavin-williamson-dodges-question-on-russia-video0 -
Her capabilities are about increasing the Tory vote in Scotland, a lot to do with a home for anti nationalism, and she doesn't want brexit which is a good thing in my book. However she hasn't been in charge of anything yet.MuttleyCAFC said:
That was always going to happen in Scotland - she is a Tory. But she is a very capable politician who comes across as reasonable. If she was running things, I'd feel a lot better about the country than I do with the current clowns in charge.Cordoban Addick said:
I have a feeling that her star will become a black hole sucking in light and stretching time when she is exposed to the national media/tough decisions. I was reading something, somewhere about her already falling popularity in Scotland and that there is a website keeping count of her lies (a bit like Trump).MuttleyCAFC said:
It is all relative - The only rising star they seem to have is Ruth Davison and she is too pro-remain. So only natural they set their standards a bit low.kentaddick said:
I can’t think of anyone more bland than gavin Williamson. He has the charisma of an average sized pebble. I have no idea why people seem to think he’s a “rising star” in the Tory party.Red_in_SE8 said:Gavin Williamson must surely have the lowest IQ of anyone who has ever attained a cabinet position. And yet, apparently, he has serious ambitions of becoming the leader of the Tory Party!
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2018/may/29/richard-madeley-gavin-williamson-dodges-question-on-russia-video
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Being accused of failing to take the issue of Islamophobia seriously by the Muslim Council of Britain (MCB), which is calling for an independent inquiry into a problem it said had “poisoned” sections of the party.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/31/muslim-council-calls-for-inquiry-into-conservative-party-islamophobia0 -
A report from the New York times on the changing face/fabric of Britain due to austerity.
https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/05/28/world/europe/uk-austerity-poverty.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=photo-spot-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news0 -
Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?2 -
Just shows what a shambles the Labour party are that they still can't get a majority.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
The sooner we see a new centrist party the better. Could we kidnap Macron perhaps? Although looking at his recent approval ratings, maybe not.0 -
Not really that keen on the centrists either but (almost) anybody but the Tories.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Just shows what a shambles the Labour party are that they still can't get a majority.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
The sooner we see a new centrist party the better. Could we kidnap Macron perhaps? Although looking at his recent approval ratings, maybe not.
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Unless something happens to Corbyn, the Tories are all you're gonna get.Cordoban Addick said:
Not really that keen on the centrists either but (almost) anybody but the Tories.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Just shows what a shambles the Labour party are that they still can't get a majority.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
The sooner we see a new centrist party the better. Could we kidnap Macron perhaps? Although looking at his recent approval ratings, maybe not.0 -
From a left of centre view I think Labour will be the largest single party at the next election and will form a coalition with the SNP, Greens and PC which will suit me down to the ground.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Unless something happens to Corbyn, the Tories are all you're gonna get.Cordoban Addick said:
Not really that keen on the centrists either but (almost) anybody but the Tories.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Just shows what a shambles the Labour party are that they still can't get a majority.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
The sooner we see a new centrist party the better. Could we kidnap Macron perhaps? Although looking at his recent approval ratings, maybe not.3 -
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That's pretty much how I see it, there will be a coalition fronted by Labour this time.Cordoban Addick said:
From a left of centre view I think Labour will be the largest single party at the next election and will form a coalition with the SNP, Greens and PC which will suit me down to the ground.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Unless something happens to Corbyn, the Tories are all you're gonna get.Cordoban Addick said:
Not really that keen on the centrists either but (almost) anybody but the Tories.Stu_of_Kunming said:
Just shows what a shambles the Labour party are that they still can't get a majority.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
The sooner we see a new centrist party the better. Could we kidnap Macron perhaps? Although looking at his recent approval ratings, maybe not.
Anything is better than the Coalition of Chaos we currently have.3 -
They don't even need to be the largest single party to do it. I'd like to see a coalition of anti Tories too.1
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I’m shocked, are you suggesting Tories put the tea in before the milk..... what are they doing.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
Not a bad list, like @Stu_of_Kunming I’m not convinced the opposition currently have enough even in a coalition to take power, but we’re still a way away from finding out.
The polls don’t seem to show a positive shift to Labour though despite the last 8 years. http://ukpollingreport.co.uk
Unless labour up their game just don’t see it happening. Thought it was a real shame that Caroline Lucas has stepped down as leader of the Greens.0 -
Rob7Lee said:
I’m shocked, are you suggesting Tories put the tea in before the milk..... what are they doing.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
Not a bad list, like @Stu_of_Kunming I’m not convinced the opposition currently have enough even in a coalition to take power, but we’re still a way away from finding out.
The polls don’t seem to show a positive shift to Labour though despite the last 8 years. http://ukpollingreport.co.uk
Unless labour up their game just don’t see it happening. Thought it was a real shame that Caroline Lucas has stepped down as leader of the Greens.
Can't argue about the polls but last year when people saw and heard Labour/Corbyn during a campaign the polls changed.
But even if their is little movement in the polls for Labour all it will take is for the Lib Dems to take back a few seats, Scotland to reject a few Tories and the DUP to lose a couple and it is game on for a coalition (of caring).1 -
Any Chief Whip worth his salt would sack off the transparent and odious Chris Grayling in a heartbeat. Laying all the blame for the current railways debacle on to the overworked underfunded unelected bureaucrats at NR is right up there with pissing on our faces and saying it’s raining. The TOC’s see an opportunity to cut their overheads and know full well they’ll get away with it and have the Tory reptiles happily repeat the lies. Yes NR was late with parts of the timetable but the ‘insufficient route trained drivers ‘ line is childish bullshit. TOC’s have known for months what the routes would be and when they were due to commence. Very very few are new. Cunt Grayling is either a moron or coining it big time from the TOC’s. It’s a sad bad day when ASLEF can sit comfortably on the moral high ground. When even shitrags the daily fail and torygraph aren’t shoulder to shoulder with Tory front bench we know it’s beyond the pale.4
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Agreed, but having laid out his stall I don’t think you’d see that ‘momentum’ again in another general, I believe that may well have been his peak and it’ll only go south. Just depends on what the Tories lose to others and then it could be a coalition as you mention.Cordoban Addick said:Rob7Lee said:
I’m shocked, are you suggesting Tories put the tea in before the milk..... what are they doing.Cordoban Addick said:Brexit (and the lack of a white paper)
Railways
Productivity
Schools
NHS
Grenfell
Milk in cup before tea
Weak leadership
Johnson, Gove & Mogg being the most likely successors
Social care
Heathrow and third runway
Islamaphobia
Police funding
Knife crime
et al
edit How did I forget Windrush and hostile environment
May be we need a thread about what the Tories need to keep?
Not a bad list, like @Stu_of_Kunming I’m not convinced the opposition currently have enough even in a coalition to take power, but we’re still a way away from finding out.
The polls don’t seem to show a positive shift to Labour though despite the last 8 years. http://ukpollingreport.co.uk
Unless labour up their game just don’t see it happening. Thought it was a real shame that Caroline Lucas has stepped down as leader of the Greens.
Can't argue about the polls but last year when people saw and heard Labour/Corbyn during a campaign the polls changed.
But even if their is little movement in the polls for Labour all it will take is for the Lib Dems to take back a few seats, Scotland to reject a few Tories and the DUP to lose a couple and it is game on for a coalition (of caring).0 -
David Davis rumoured to be threatening to resign today.
His entire political career has been bullshitting his way into being in a position of great influence and then, through sheer incompetence, screwing it up. He was the heavy favourite to be Tory leader and completely screwed it up and Cameron became leader, now he’s completely screwed up being responsible for one of the biggest changes in British political history.
I can’t see this government lasting a lot longer if davis does resign.0 -
To be fair to him, he never had the support he needed to go into the negotiations. At a time when the country needs leadership, we have a government that is at each others throats with no real position on anything related to Brexit. On one side it upsets the Brexiters and on another it upsets the Remainers. How do you enter into hard nosed serious negotiations when you are trying to appease two opposites?
What you get is a miracle situation where progress was somehow made on the Irish border and then the DUP scupperd it. We have no chance as we are! Whatever side of the Brexit fence you sit, surely you have to see that we are making a pigs ear of this! We do need to find some clarity and maybe an election is needed.
If it results in clear support for a Hard Brexit - simple we leave there and then! If not, we are going to need a lot more time to work it all out! This point was always going to happen - May has been walking a tightrope since the election and it is getting narrower and narrower!1 -
Think we just need to be a little careful in what we say about David Davis #justsaying
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Presumably in the Mr. Pastry battalion.TelMc32 said:Think we just need to be a little careful in what we say about David Davis #justsaying
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SAS as in scandinavian trolley dolly "coffee, tea or me?"ShootersHillGuru said:
Presumably in the Mr. Pastry battalion.TelMc32 said:Think we just need to be a little careful in what we say about David Davis #justsaying
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How the tories need to change is quite different from how we need them to change.
With Corbyn at the helm, there is no credible opposition and little to no chance of the tory party finding itself in a weaker parliamentary position than now. A year ago the nation spurned the best opportunity in a lifetime to dish out a severe spanking. Despite the tories lowering their strides and bending forward, volunteering their cheeks for a furious reddening, no, they got away with it, voters demonstrated for the 2nd time in quick succession that they have no idea what's good for themselves and voted the despicable, mendacious, half-witted, self-serving, scumsuckers back in for another 5 years.
Given the electorate's insatiable appetite for misery and hardship, the tories are safe as houses until there is a collective moment of clarity in the Labour Party and any kind of parliamentary pragmatism breaks out. Even then they are so far removed and insulated from 'the real world' they're not really gonna care until they are individually voted out.
The changes we need from the tory party reptiles simply ain't gonna materialise before they feel opposed and maybe not even then - I'm not sure they have retained the collective intellect to recognise anything that matters anymore.
The Northern Ireland situation, perversely perhaps, offers a chink of light: Life goes on in the province unencumbered by interference from career politicians. Most people are rightly furious that the MLA's continue to trouser their £48k p.a. plus expenses for doing fuck all but at least that's all they are getting wrong. Anybody been to Belfast lately? It's a terrific place to visit. Perhaps if the Westminster party animals can be corralled into spending all their time and energy just arguing among themselves, they can leave we citizens to get on with getting on with life without their malign interference.1 -
The Tories are on a path towards self destruction. Brexit has put them on that path and it isn't going to be pretty!0
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I understand that Belfast had a £1 billion cash injection recently.StigThundercock said:How the tories need to change is quite different from how we need them to change.
With Corbyn at the helm, there is no credible opposition and little to no chance of the tory party finding itself in a weaker parliamentary position than now. A year ago the nation spurned the best opportunity in a lifetime to dish out a severe spanking. Despite the tories lowering their strides and bending forward, volunteering their cheeks for a furious reddening, no, they got away with it, voters demonstrated for the 2nd time in quick succession that they have no idea what's good for themselves and voted the despicable, mendacious, half-witted, self-serving, scumsuckers back in for another 5 years.
Given the electorate's insatiable appetite for misery and hardship, the tories are safe as houses until there is a collective moment of clarity in the Labour Party and any kind of parliamentary pragmatism breaks out. Even then they are so far removed and insulated from 'the real world' they're not really gonna care until they are individually voted out.
The changes we need from the tory party reptiles simply ain't gonna materialise before they feel opposed and maybe not even then - I'm not sure they have retained the collective intellect to recognise anything that matters anymore.
The Northern Ireland situation, perversely perhaps, offers a chink of light: Life goes on in the province unencumbered by interference from career politicians. Most people are rightly furious that the MLA's continue to trouser their £48k p.a. plus expenses for doing fuck all but at least that's all they are getting wrong. Anybody been to Belfast lately? It's a terrific place to visit. Perhaps if the Westminster party animals can be corralled into spending all their time and energy just arguing among themselves, they can leave we citizens to get on with getting on with life without their malign interference.2 -
To be fair, I thought it meant "Strong & Stable"...until I realised that was even more unlikely than the lads from Hereford!!!StigThundercock said:
SAS as in scandinavian trolley dolly "coffee, tea or me?"ShootersHillGuru said:
Presumably in the Mr. Pastry battalion.TelMc32 said:Think we just need to be a little careful in what we say about David Davis #justsaying
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Taking over from Paddy McGuinness.TelMc32 said:Think we just need to be a little careful in what we say about David Davis #justsaying
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StigThundercock said:
How the tories need to change is quite different from how we need them to change.
With Corbyn at the helm, there is no credible opposition and little to no chance of the tory party finding itself in a weaker parliamentary position than now. A year ago the nation spurned the best opportunity in a lifetime to dish out a severe spanking. Despite the tories lowering their strides and bending forward, volunteering their cheeks for a furious reddening, no, they got away with it, voters demonstrated for the 2nd time in quick succession that they have no idea what's good for themselves and voted the despicable, mendacious, half-witted, self-serving, scumsuckers back in for another 5 years.
Given the electorate's insatiable appetite for misery and hardship, the tories are safe as houses until there is a collective moment of clarity in the Labour Party and any kind of parliamentary pragmatism breaks out. Even then they are so far removed and insulated from 'the real world' they're not really gonna care until they are individually voted out.
The changes we need from the tory party reptiles simply ain't gonna materialise before they feel opposed and maybe not even then - I'm not sure they have retained the collective intellect to recognise anything that matters anymore.
The Northern Ireland situation, perversely perhaps, offers a chink of light: Life goes on in the province unencumbered by interference from career politicians. Most people are rightly furious that the MLA's continue to trouser their £48k p.a. plus expenses for doing fuck all but at least that's all they are getting wrong. Anybody been to Belfast lately? It's a terrific place to visit. Perhaps if the Westminster party animals can be corralled into spending all their time and energy just arguing among themselves, they can leave we citizens to get on with getting on with life without their malign interference.
I don’t quite have the same full on dislike for the Tories, but hard to argue with most of that, I fully share the view that there’s no credible opposition, I think that’s also true for a large part of the electorate who voted Tory. It’s not nice but better than the alternative.
I just don’t see or hear of many/any people who voted Tory suddenly seeing the light when it comes to corbyn and his current Labour machine, but I do know of some Corbyn voters who won’t vote for him again next time and the polls are starting to show that.
Brexit is a mess, but Labour have hardly set their stall out, so again I don’t see swathes of people who voted Tory jumping into the Red Sea over it.
We’ve probably got 4 more years of the same and then at best a watered down version of it or at worst Corbyn, Abbot and McDonnel in a coalition with the SNP et all..... if the latter happens hopefully by then I’ll only be a year or two from packing up the city and can join the many and not the few
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Regardless of what your political persuasion is, that is seriously cringe.TelMc32 said:Think we just need to be a little careful in what we say about David Davis #justsaying
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Exactly as I see it. I'm naturally left leaning, at least according to what the political compass site says. I don't tend to vote labour, but I'm in the anyone but Tory camp. Can't say I particularly hate them though. Inline a lot of what Corbyn says and stands for but he fills me with no confidence. Not helped by the likes of McDonnell (I actually quite like Abbott, but mainly based on previous rather than recent form) and their screechy preachy supporters and momentum.Rob7Lee said:StigThundercock said:How the tories need to change is quite different from how we need them to change.
With Corbyn at the helm, there is no credible opposition and little to no chance of the tory party finding itself in a weaker parliamentary position than now. A year ago the nation spurned the best opportunity in a lifetime to dish out a severe spanking. Despite the tories lowering their strides and bending forward, volunteering their cheeks for a furious reddening, no, they got away with it, voters demonstrated for the 2nd time in quick succession that they have no idea what's good for themselves and voted the despicable, mendacious, half-witted, self-serving, scumsuckers back in for another 5 years.
Given the electorate's insatiable appetite for misery and hardship, the tories are safe as houses until there is a collective moment of clarity in the Labour Party and any kind of parliamentary pragmatism breaks out. Even then they are so far removed and insulated from 'the real world' they're not really gonna care until they are individually voted out.
The changes we need from the tory party reptiles simply ain't gonna materialise before they feel opposed and maybe not even then - I'm not sure they have retained the collective intellect to recognise anything that matters anymore.
The Northern Ireland situation, perversely perhaps, offers a chink of light: Life goes on in the province unencumbered by interference from career politicians. Most people are rightly furious that the MLA's continue to trouser their £48k p.a. plus expenses for doing fuck all but at least that's all they are getting wrong. Anybody been to Belfast lately? It's a terrific place to visit. Perhaps if the Westminster party animals can be corralled into spending all their time and energy just arguing among themselves, they can leave we citizens to get on with getting on with life without their malign interference.
I don’t quite have the same full on dislike for the Tories, but hard to argue with most of that, I fully share the view that there’s no credible opposition, I think that’s also true for a large part of the electorate who voted Tory. It’s not nice but better than the alternative.
I just don’t see or hear of many/any people who voted Tory suddenly seeing the light when it comes to corbyn and his current Labour machine, but I do know of some Corbyn voters who won’t vote for him again next time and the polls are starting to show that.
Brexit is a mess, but Labour have hardly set their stall out, so again I don’t see swathes of people who voted Tory jumping into the Red Sea over it.
We’ve probably got 4 more years of the same and then at best a watered down version of it or at worst Corbyn, Abbot and McDonnel in a coalition with the SNP et all..... if the latter happens hopefully by then I’ll only be a year or two from packing up the city and can join the many and not the few
Thing is, I should be nailed on to vote for them based on the current government's record, but I'm not. If there's a chance in my constituency I'd sooner vote lib Dems. If there's proportional representation, I'd vote green. If I can't believe in the labour party, there's no chance that genuine swing voters will. And he is going to get even more pelters from the right, there's no grudging respect Blair got. Bad times for democracy.2 -
My god, even I am starting to feel a little bit sorry for Theresa May. There is absolutely know chance of her reconciling the two sides of her party.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/14/tory-rebellion-back-on-after-mps-reject-mays-brexit-amendment0
