If we can win tonight we'll then have the beauty of going into the Knockout Rounds as one of just three sides to win all our games - Along with Uruguay and Croatia, that should certainly be enough to make teams fear us as they'll know we wont be easy to score again
Given that both Tunisia and Panama scored against us, why would any team think that?
One of those chances being a penalty
Its not like those two were handed endless opportunities to score
Lad I know is running a fair few coaches through that route. I’m sure everyone will have factored in plenty of time.
Assume England will have a decent turnout for this one Mr Organiser?
Better than the first two games for sure, but still very low relative to previous tournaments.
Very jealous I’m not out there seeing all my mates messages and videos.
Is that down to it being in Russia, or apathy?
Russia seems an easier destination compared to recent tournaments.
I think it's numerous things.
1. I don't think our support in numbers is generally as good as the hype, even in the last 15 years. 2. There has been a huge growing apathy with the national team over the last decade or so. Around the WC in 2006 the away membership had to be capped at I think 35k. Now it's down to less than 10k and is only that high because of France 2016. Will be interesting to see how many renew after this WC for the next two year period. A lot will depend on the WC obviously. 3. We have a supporters club that makes you jump through hurdles compared to some countries. 4. Russia is a bit of a logistical nightmare to arrange, esp at short notice and is costly. 5. The unfounded fears of trouble, the police and Russia generally. 6. The unknowns over how security checks would work and black-market tickets. In previous tournaments you could pop over on the off chance knowing if you pick up a ticket, you would get in. To risky and expensive out here. 7. Having to apply for a VISA beforehand. 8. Those who have travelled for years are sick of the continued failure and Iceland was a tipping point for lots. Since 2006 - didn't qualify 08, SA was disastrous in 10, Ukraine was a non-event in 12, Brazil was uninspiring in 14, Iceland was a disgrace in 16. People spent a lot of money following the aforementioned let downs. 9. Cost of tickets - significantly higher than the last euros.
I'm sure there are many more reasons. Mine personally was cost. I've never been a big tournament man - prefer the qualifiers, but I've bought a semi and final ticket officially for £600 (!!!) and have to be mindful of the potential extra costs of getting out there should we make it. So affording group games too was a no no, just in case the unthinkable happens.
Lad I know is running a fair few coaches through that route. I’m sure everyone will have factored in plenty of time.
Assume England will have a decent turnout for this one Mr Organiser?
Better than the first two games for sure, but still very low relative to previous tournaments.
Very jealous I’m not out there seeing all my mates messages and videos.
Is that down to it being in Russia, or apathy?
Russia seems an easier destination compared to recent tournaments.
I think it's numerous things.
1. I don't think our support in numbers is generally as good as the hype, even in the last 15 years. 2. There has been a huge growing apathy with the national team over the last decade or so. Around the WC in 2006 the away membership had to be capped at I think 35k. Now it's down to less than 10k and is only that high because of France 2016. Will be interesting to see how many renew after this WC for the next two year period. A lot will depend on the WC obviously. 3. We have a supporters club that makes you jump through hurdles compared to some countries. 4. Russia is a bit of a logistical nightmare to arrange, esp at short notice and is costly. 5. The unfounded fears of trouble, the police and Russia generally. 6. The unknowns over how security checks would work and black-market tickets. In previous tournaments you could pop over on the off chance knowing if you pick up a ticket, you would get in. To risky and expensive out here. 7. Having to apply for a VISA beforehand. 8. Those who have travelled for years are sick of the continued failure and Iceland was a tipping point for lots. Since 2006 - didn't qualify 08, SA was disastrous in 10, Ukraine was a non-event in 12, Brazil was uninspiring in 14, Iceland was a disgrace in 16. People spent a lot of money following the aforementioned let downs. 9. Cost of tickets - significantly higher than the last euros.
I'm sure there are many more reasons. Mine personally was cost. I've never been a big tournament man - prefer the qualifiers, but I've bought a semi and final ticket officially for £600 (!!!) and have to be mindful of the potential extra costs of getting out there should we make it. So affording group games too was a no no, just in case the unthinkable happens.
Just a couple of points, you did not have to apply for a Visa, your FIFA ticket doubled up as one and it's as cheap as chips out there. However you are correct in that since the disgraceful scenes at Euro 2016 from the Russian thugs there was a general perception that is was going to be a bloodbath out there. An image that the British media for some reason were happy to uphold over the past couple of years.
i think i'm one of the few that want us to win tonight.
if we're going to win the World Cup, lets do it properly by beating all the big teams!
Everyone wants us to win (except probably Golfie), but if losing means we avoid Colombia i'm sure there won't be too many crying about it
If all we have to worry about is Colombia then we have nothing to fear. Bobby Moore would be turning in his grave reading comments like that. Let the Colombian players go to bed thinking "fuck, we have to face England".
For some reason this thread reminds me of the time Charlton had to win at Carlisle away to clinch promotion and a lot of people said “Ooohhh but Carlisle away is tough, they’re in the playoff spots. Don’t think I’ll go”
Let’s face it, if we end up on the ‘easier’ side of the draw then people will only downplay any progress we make by saying things like “oh we only got to the semis by playing Japan, Mexico etc”
Lad I know is running a fair few coaches through that route. I’m sure everyone will have factored in plenty of time.
Assume England will have a decent turnout for this one Mr Organiser?
Better than the first two games for sure, but still very low relative to previous tournaments.
Very jealous I’m not out there seeing all my mates messages and videos.
Is that down to it being in Russia, or apathy?
Russia seems an easier destination compared to recent tournaments.
I think it's numerous things.
1. I don't think our support in numbers is generally as good as the hype, even in the last 15 years. 2. There has been a huge growing apathy with the national team over the last decade or so. Around the WC in 2006 the away membership had to be capped at I think 35k. Now it's down to less than 10k and is only that high because of France 2016. Will be interesting to see how many renew after this WC for the next two year period. A lot will depend on the WC obviously. 3. We have a supporters club that makes you jump through hurdles compared to some countries. 4. Russia is a bit of a logistical nightmare to arrange, esp at short notice and is costly. 5. The unfounded fears of trouble, the police and Russia generally. 6. The unknowns over how security checks would work and black-market tickets. In previous tournaments you could pop over on the off chance knowing if you pick up a ticket, you would get in. To risky and expensive out here. 7. Having to apply for a VISA beforehand. 8. Those who have travelled for years are sick of the continued failure and Iceland was a tipping point for lots. Since 2006 - didn't qualify 08, SA was disastrous in 10, Ukraine was a non-event in 12, Brazil was uninspiring in 14, Iceland was a disgrace in 16. People spent a lot of money following the aforementioned let downs. 9. Cost of tickets - significantly higher than the last euros.
I'm sure there are many more reasons. Mine personally was cost. I've never been a big tournament man - prefer the qualifiers, but I've bought a semi and final ticket officially for £600 (!!!) and have to be mindful of the potential extra costs of getting out there should we make it. So affording group games too was a no no, just in case the unthinkable happens.
Just a couple of points, you did not have to apply for a Visa, your FIFA ticket doubled up as one and it's as cheap as chips out there. However you are correct in that since the disgraceful scenes at Euro 2016 from the Russian thugs there was a general perception that is was going to be a bloodbath out there. An image that the British media for some reason were happy to uphold over the past couple of years.
Sort of Riviera, to clarify as I have one myself, it's a FAN I.D (that acts as your VISA and was free) but you still needed to apply for it online beforehand and without one you ain't getting in. And you can only apply for one if you have a match ticket.
So anyone wanting to go out now for the last 16, would need to try and buy a ticket online to that or another game, to enable them to then apply for a FAN I.D. They will then have to swap that electronic FAN I.D. for a proper laminated version in the host city.
Without a FAN I.D. you are not getting in a ground.
Thankfully it appears that people have been getting in without the names on the ticket and FAN I.D. matching.
My point was really, that it's a an extra hassle that would put some people off.
For some reason this thread reminds me of the time Charlton had to win at Carlisle away to clinch promotion and a lot of people said “Ooohhh but Carlisle away is tough, they’re in the playoff spots. Don’t think I’ll go”
Let’s face it, if we end up on the ‘easier’ side of the draw then people will only downplay any progress we make by saying things like “oh we only got to the semis by playing Japan, Mexico etc”
Doubtful. Do you ever hear "oh but we only just scraped past Belgium and Cameroon" when talking about Italia 90?
Looking at that (if we win our first knock out game) we could either get a more difficult Q/F for winning the group or a more difficult S/F for finishing second. Which shows the madness of trying to pick a route.
I would go for a win to keep momentum but rest as many players as possible.
I’d be tempted to make a couple of changes, Cahill in for Walker as hes on a card I think, Rashford in for sterling to give him a run out, maybe rose in for young to give him a breather. That’s it though. Keep it roughly the same to start with, then give some of the other lads a run out after an hour, depending on whether we’re teo or three up.
Although it has a spot of ' i dont really care' tonight, we really are in win/win situation.
If we beat Belgium will continue momentum and will make others sit up and take notice (even with a 2nd string) If we lose we get the brucey bonus of a better draw (on paper)
Shame its worked out like it , would much rather both teams playing for a win but its still quite a luxury as we can rest a few players.
Personally want us to win, but will still be happy if we can get 2nd
I don't buy the point at all. For one thing, this is a completely different team to the ones who have been losing the last twelve years. If we lose in knockouts again this time, it's not because of what happened before.
If you're smart, you give yourself the best possible chance to win the tournament. Do we have a better chance of progressing against Japan, Sweden or against Colombia, Brazil? From the semi final stage, four teams are left and anything can happen.
Come off it. The best teams are set up to always look further ahead because they know they're good enough to reach the latter stages. Previous German teams have already bookies their hotels for the final ahead of the tournament because they know they're getting there.
We need a touch of the German efficiency about us and if that means losing today, I'm fine with that.
Looking forward to it tonight. The one game me and the lads have had booked in the diary for months as we all thought it would be Spurs v Spurs. Oh well. Bring on the beer.
Comments
Its not like those two were handed endless opportunities to score
1. I don't think our support in numbers is generally as good as the hype, even in the last 15 years.
2. There has been a huge growing apathy with the national team over the last decade or so. Around the WC in 2006 the away membership had to be capped at I think 35k. Now it's down to less than 10k and is only that high because of France 2016. Will be interesting to see how many renew after this WC for the next two year period. A lot will depend on the WC obviously.
3. We have a supporters club that makes you jump through hurdles compared to some countries.
4. Russia is a bit of a logistical nightmare to arrange, esp at short notice and is costly.
5. The unfounded fears of trouble, the police and Russia generally.
6. The unknowns over how security checks would work and black-market tickets. In previous tournaments you could pop over on the off chance knowing if you pick up a ticket, you would get in. To risky and expensive out here.
7. Having to apply for a VISA beforehand.
8. Those who have travelled for years are sick of the continued failure and Iceland was a tipping point for lots. Since 2006 - didn't qualify 08, SA was disastrous in 10, Ukraine was a non-event in 12, Brazil was uninspiring in 14, Iceland was a disgrace in 16. People spent a lot of money following the aforementioned let downs.
9. Cost of tickets - significantly higher than the last euros.
I'm sure there are many more reasons. Mine personally was cost. I've never been a big tournament man - prefer the qualifiers, but I've bought a semi and final ticket officially for £600 (!!!) and have to be mindful of the potential extra costs of getting out there should we make it. So affording group games too was a no no, just in case the unthinkable happens.
Let’s face it, if we end up on the ‘easier’ side of the draw then people will only downplay any progress we make by saying things like “oh we only got to the semis by playing Japan, Mexico etc”
So anyone wanting to go out now for the last 16, would need to try and buy a ticket online to that or another game, to enable them to then apply for a FAN I.D. They will then have to swap that electronic FAN I.D. for a proper laminated version in the host city.
Without a FAN I.D. you are not getting in a ground.
Thankfully it appears that people have been getting in without the names on the ticket and FAN I.D. matching.
My point was really, that it's a an extra hassle that would put some people off.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44636552
I guess ITV will get priority as guess they gave BBC the openers for the Belgium and second round
Biggest threats still France, Spain, Brazil, Croatia and even Argentina.
I would go for a win to keep momentum but rest as many players as possible.
However, ITV's mystic pig that chose apples with England flags for the first two games, has chosen apples with Belgian flags for this one.
However, however, I noted the pig always goes to the left sided apples
TAA
Stones
Cahill
Jones
Rose
RLC
Dier
Delph
Vardy
Sterling
If we beat Belgium will continue momentum and will make others sit up and take notice (even with a 2nd string)
If we lose we get the brucey bonus of a better draw (on paper)
Shame its worked out like it , would much rather both teams playing for a win but its still quite a luxury as we can rest a few players.
Personally want us to win, but will still be happy if we can get 2nd
Hopefully that happens today if we end up with Colombia in the next round
If you're smart, you give yourself the best possible chance to win the tournament. Do we have a better chance of progressing against Japan, Sweden or against Colombia, Brazil? From the semi final stage, four teams are left and anything can happen.
Come off it. The best teams are set up to always look further ahead because they know they're good enough to reach the latter stages. Previous German teams have already bookies their hotels for the final ahead of the tournament because they know they're getting there.
We need a touch of the German efficiency about us and if that means losing today, I'm fine with that.
The one game me and the lads have had booked in the diary for months as we all thought it would be Spurs v Spurs. Oh well. Bring on the beer.