Impressive ride from Roglic, and good ride from Thomas. Didn't catch Tao's ride, even if he was saving for the mountains I'd still expect him to be top 50. Something's not good there. Cav did one of his good ITTs. When he does that, the next day he usually......
French police say they have arrested a woman suspected of causing a huge crash during the Tour de France by waving a sign in the riders' path on Saturday. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-57668657
Impressive ride from Roglic, and good ride from Thomas. Didn't catch Tao's ride, even if he was saving for the mountains I'd still expect him to be top 50. Something's not good there. Cav did one of his good ITTs. When he does that, the next day he usually......
Pogacar ain't even remotely legit. Roglic is on the gear too. Slovenia's drug testing regime is non-existent.
Sadly I completely agree and it is as if almost everyone in cycling knows it and it is whispered about and I don’t just think that is sour grapes. A cursory look at Pogacar’s junior results do not suggest he would achieve anywhere near what he is producing now.
Pogacar ain't even remotely legit. Roglic is on the gear too. Slovenia's drug testing regime is non-existent.
But then why arent they throwing up positive tests @ the Tour?
In short, you have a team that’s tests you as you go and adjust your intake so that it does not throw up a positive. Pogacar produces big race results then has some awful performances in small less significant events, that is basically similar to a come down and strongly points to pharmaceutical assistance.
Wouldn’t it be refreshing if when watching the race you heard conversations like this. Ned: David you are a former doper. What do you make of the current top riders now. Do you think their performances indicate they are riding clean? Millar: .........
Pogacar ain't even remotely legit. Roglic is on the gear too. Slovenia's drug testing regime is non-existent.
But then why arent they throwing up positive tests @ the Tour?
In short, you have a team that’s tests you as you go and adjust your intake so that it does not throw up a positive. Pogacar produces big race results then has some awful performances in small less significant events, that is basically similar to a come down and strongly points to pharmaceutical assistance.
Has the testing methods really changed that much then since the Armstrong days
Its almost like Cycling hasnt completely learnt its lessons. - e.g. Its unfair in a way as its already probably the most tested Sport out there, unfortunately it'll never shed its past, and certainly wont if we continue to get new cases
I think it is like a lot of things in life in that things continue to evolve on both sides. Personally I don’t think things are anywhere near as bad as they were when Armstrong was riding. Back then so many people were doing it, that many felt they had to just to keep their place in the peloton. I think now there are a few that do, a few that manipulate TUE’s and push the line to the limit. I think cycling is a sport that attracts it more because it is so physically demanding, so a small increase in performance or reduction in fatigue can add up to a lot over three weeks. Marginal gains if you like.
I think the very fact that Pogacar is so obvious speaks volumes about the rest of the peloton. It still happens - but its nothing like the nuclear era of blood bags and then Edgar.
Why don't those that are clean start shouting from the rooftops?
Knowing it, suspecting it and proving it are all different things. I did wonder today when G said after his ITT ‘I just didn’t have the power’ whether he was alluding to something.
Why don't those that are clean start shouting from the rooftops?
Honestly because no one is. If they aren't breaking the rules they are bending them. At the very least pushing the envelope.
The same reason more football club owners don't shout from the roof tops at dodgy owners.
Bullshit. The sport is nothing like the shambles it was in the 90s and 00s. If you can't see the difference between that era and now, then you could write what you know about cycling on the back of a postage stamp with a magic marker.
Why don't those that are clean start shouting from the rooftops?
Honestly because no one is. If they aren't breaking the rules they are bending them. At the very least pushing the envelope.
The same reason more football club owners don't shout from the roof tops at dodgy owners.
Bullshit. The sport is nothing like the shambles it was in the 90s and 00s. If you can't see the difference between that era and now, then you could write what you know about cycling on the back of a postage stamp with a magic marker.
No its not the same, and that's not what I said.
I don't believe there is "industrial doping" like there was. I also don't believe the peleton is "clean" in the true sense of the word either.
I am not having a dig at cycling either, as you have accused me of before. I honestly don't think any elite sport is "clean".
Why don't those that are clean start shouting from the rooftops?
Honestly because no one is. If they aren't breaking the rules they are bending them. At the very least pushing the envelope.
The same reason more football club owners don't shout from the roof tops at dodgy owners.
Bullshit. The sport is nothing like the shambles it was in the 90s and 00s. If you can't see the difference between that era and now, then you could write what you know about cycling on the back of a postage stamp with a magic marker.
No its not the same, and that's not what I said.
I don't believe there is "industrial doping" like there was. I also don't believe the peleton is "clean" in the true sense of the word either.
I am not having a dig at cycling either, as you have accused me of before. I honestly don't think any elite sport is "clean".
What do you define as 'clean'? Because no athlete, in any sport, has ever been 'paniagua' - but there's a huge difference between endemic, team-sponsored doping like we saw with Festina, T-Mobile, USPS etc etc
What exactly do you think they (cyclists), or any other sportsmen are doing? Setting aside all the lunatic fringe theories like ketones or magnets/motors - because obviously you mean pharmaceutical enhancements here - there are no wonder drugs available that can't be tested for now (unlike with EPO back in the day, or blood bags now that the haematocrit is monitored by biological passport).
There's a unique set of circumstances here - Pogacar really arrived on the scene at a time when there was much less drug testing being done due to covid - it's entirely plausible that he could be doping under the supervision of someone like the doctor involved in the Aderlass bust who would be able to monitor his glow time during a period he was unlikely to face an OOC test, get his haematocrit elevated so that it didn't look quite so obvious on the bio passport around the time of the Tour last year (and be put down to peaking through training) and then carry on smashing himself to bits over last winter with a well-maintained and monitored doping regime - dropping off at the start of the year as testing became more frequent again. The other riders don't have that advantage - because any serious contender will already have had years of bio passport information available, so suspicious peaks or trends would make it more obvious they were up to no good.
A couple of other riders 'ping' as likely cheats as well - Marc Hirschi and Mark Padun - for similar reasons. I maintain though, that the very fact these three pop out as 'obvious' candidates for suspicion indicates that the vast majority of cyclists as clean. In an arms race like we saw in the 90s and 00s, where everyone was juiced up to the eyeballs, it was much harder to spot dopers... because everyone was doing it
He won the Tour De l'Avenir when he was 18. Never really rode U23. Came fifth in the Tour of Slovenia when he was 17. He's won a lot this year and never been off form.
Slovenia's decentish but smallish pool of pro cyclists, also has a good record for dopers. A UAE team manager was team manager for Saunier Duval - Mauro Gianetti???? David Millar knows exactly how indifferent Saunier's management was to doping. UAE were Lampre who were deep in the Mantova doping investigation.
So do I believe there's something afoot? I'd be foolish not to and it seems Slovenia's a perfect country to pursue a specific training programme.
Swart is seen as vigorously anti-doping? I do find it interesting that altitude training is seen to be the perfect mask for doping. With the understanding of how to stimulate HIF-1 with prolyl hydroxylaxes, HIF-1 modulates EPO production, it is said to be hugely difficult to tell the difference between exogenus and endogenus HIF-1 origin/stimulation. You don't have to microdose anymore, but your risk of cancer looks to be higher than taking synthetic EPO. Anyways if the Slovenians are up to something so will be many other teams, along with all the top football teams.
Shame!! - Its not fair to single out one person when others do it (e.g. the Mountain Stages get a bit ridiculous) but at the same time and example needs to be made at some point
Shame!! - Its not fair to single out one person when others do it (e.g. the Mountain Stages get a bit ridiculous) but at the same time and example needs to be made at some point
Comments
Here's hoping for number 32.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-57668657
Ned: David you are a former doper. What do you make of the current top riders now. Do you think their performances indicate they are riding clean?
Millar: .........
Its almost like Cycling hasnt completely learnt its lessons. - e.g. Its unfair in a way as its already probably the most tested Sport out there, unfortunately it'll never shed its past, and certainly wont if we continue to get new cases
Why don't those that are clean start shouting from the rooftops?
The same reason more football club owners don't shout from the roof tops at dodgy owners.
I don't believe there is "industrial doping" like there was. I also don't believe the peleton is "clean" in the true sense of the word either.
I am not having a dig at cycling either, as you have accused me of before. I honestly don't think any elite sport is "clean".
What exactly do you think they (cyclists), or any other sportsmen are doing? Setting aside all the lunatic fringe theories like ketones or magnets/motors - because obviously you mean pharmaceutical enhancements here - there are no wonder drugs available that can't be tested for now (unlike with EPO back in the day, or blood bags now that the haematocrit is monitored by biological passport).
There's a unique set of circumstances here - Pogacar really arrived on the scene at a time when there was much less drug testing being done due to covid - it's entirely plausible that he could be doping under the supervision of someone like the doctor involved in the Aderlass bust who would be able to monitor his glow time during a period he was unlikely to face an OOC test, get his haematocrit elevated so that it didn't look quite so obvious on the bio passport around the time of the Tour last year (and be put down to peaking through training) and then carry on smashing himself to bits over last winter with a well-maintained and monitored doping regime - dropping off at the start of the year as testing became more frequent again. The other riders don't have that advantage - because any serious contender will already have had years of bio passport information available, so suspicious peaks or trends would make it more obvious they were up to no good.
A couple of other riders 'ping' as likely cheats as well - Marc Hirschi and Mark Padun - for similar reasons. I maintain though, that the very fact these three pop out as 'obvious' candidates for suspicion indicates that the vast majority of cyclists as clean. In an arms race like we saw in the 90s and 00s, where everyone was juiced up to the eyeballs, it was much harder to spot dopers... because everyone was doing it
Slovenia's decentish but smallish pool of pro cyclists, also has a good record for dopers. A UAE team manager was team manager for Saunier Duval - Mauro Gianetti???? David Millar knows exactly how indifferent Saunier's management was to doping. UAE were Lampre who were deep in the Mantova doping investigation.
So do I believe there's something afoot? I'd be foolish not to and it seems Slovenia's a perfect country to pursue a specific training programme.
Swart is seen as vigorously anti-doping? I do find it interesting that altitude training is seen to be the perfect mask for doping. With the understanding of how to stimulate HIF-1 with prolyl hydroxylaxes, HIF-1 modulates EPO production, it is said to be hugely difficult to tell the difference between exogenus and endogenus HIF-1 origin/stimulation. You don't have to microdose anymore, but your risk of cancer looks to be higher than taking synthetic EPO. Anyways if the Slovenians are up to something so will be many other teams, along with all the top football teams.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jul/01/tour-de-france-withdraws-lawsuit-against-spectator-who-caused-pile-up-cycling
Did anyone else just see that filthy image on the Tour?
DQS have enough to bring him to the business end of the sprint, and he has more than enough nous to make the most of the opportunity.