Try getting Kent police or fire service to respond if your London bus catches fire in Welling high street. Mind you, you can always complain to your Greater London Assembly member or the London mayor.
Try getting Kent police or fire service to respond if your London bus catches fire in Welling high street. Mind you, you can always complain to your Greater London Assembly member or the London mayor.
Better off waiting for Kent Fire Service to turn up mate
Surrey play cricket at The Oval but that doesn't mean that anyone would seriously suggest that modern day Kennington isn't part of London!
It's mad to think that Kennington was once in Surrey
Southwark and Deptford too.
Looking at a map, the Isle of Dogs were once Middlesex!
Southwark was in Surrey, as was Bermondsey (hence Surrey Docks). Deptford was in Kent. Most of Lewisham borough was historically in Kent; Tower Hamlets and Hackney were in Middlesex; Newham was mainly Essex until 1965, despite having E postcodes and was not part of London administratively for most things, even though it is closer to the City than most places west, because the local boroughs of West and East Ham resisted becoming part of London so they could pay lower rates. So Charlton were a London team before West Ham.
And for all of you saying postcodes decide whether you're in London, what if you're from Sewardstone, E4 and live in the Essex district of Epping Forest? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sewardstone
Surrey play cricket at The Oval but that doesn't mean that anyone would seriously suggest that modern day Kennington isn't part of London!
It's mad to think that Kennington was once in Surrey
Southwark and Deptford too.
Looking at a map, the Isle of Dogs were once Middlesex!
Southwark was in Surrey, as was Bermondsey (hence Surrey Docks). Deptford was in Kent. Most of Lewisham borough was historically in Kent; Tower Hamlets and Hackney were in Middlesex; Newham was mainly Essex until 1965, despite having E postcodes and was not part of London administratively for most things, even though it is closer to the City than most places west, because the local boroughs of West and East Ham resisted becoming part of London so they could pay lower rates. So Charlton were a London team before West Ham.
And for all of you saying postcodes decide whether you're in London, what if you're from Sewardstone, E4 and live in the Essex district of Epping Forest? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sewardstone
Not all of Southwark was in Surrey. The border between Kent and Surrey ran through Southwark at certain parts. Part of the border was actually Surrey docks itself, with Kent one side and Surrey on the other.
Surrey play cricket at The Oval but that doesn't mean that anyone would seriously suggest that modern day Kennington isn't part of London!
It's mad to think that Kennington was once in Surrey
Southwark and Deptford too.
Looking at a map, the Isle of Dogs were once Middlesex!
Southwark was in Surrey, as was Bermondsey (hence Surrey Docks). Deptford was in Kent. Most of Lewisham borough was historically in Kent; Tower Hamlets and Hackney were in Middlesex; Newham was mainly Essex until 1965, despite having E postcodes and was not part of London administratively for most things, even though it is closer to the City than most places west, because the local boroughs of West and East Ham resisted becoming part of London so they could pay lower rates. So Charlton were a London team before West Ham.
And for all of you saying postcodes decide whether you're in London, what if you're from Sewardstone, E4 and live in the Essex district of Epping Forest? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sewardstone
Not all of Southwark was in Surrey. The border between Kent and Surrey ran through Southwark at certain parts. Part of the border was actually Surrey docks itself, with Kent one side and Surrey on the other.
So are Millwall (as in the location of the old and new Den) Surrey or Kent
Surrey play cricket at The Oval but that doesn't mean that anyone would seriously suggest that modern day Kennington isn't part of London!
It's mad to think that Kennington was once in Surrey
Southwark and Deptford too.
Looking at a map, the Isle of Dogs were once Middlesex!
Southwark was in Surrey, as was Bermondsey (hence Surrey Docks). Deptford was in Kent. Most of Lewisham borough was historically in Kent; Tower Hamlets and Hackney were in Middlesex; Newham was mainly Essex until 1965, despite having E postcodes and was not part of London administratively for most things, even though it is closer to the City than most places west, because the local boroughs of West and East Ham resisted becoming part of London so they could pay lower rates. So Charlton were a London team before West Ham.
And for all of you saying postcodes decide whether you're in London, what if you're from Sewardstone, E4 and live in the Essex district of Epping Forest? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sewardstone
Not all of Southwark was in Surrey. The border between Kent and Surrey ran through Southwark at certain parts. Part of the border was actually Surrey docks itself, with Kent one side and Surrey on the other.
So are Millwall (as in the location of the old and new Den) Surrey or Kent
Surrey. New Den is on Surrey Canal Road and is the Lewisham bit of the Rotherhithe postcode (SE16) so no argument there. Old Den it's a bit less clearcut but the old manor of Hatcham was originally under the Hundred of Brixton (Surrey) but the parish of St Pauls's Deptford (Kent). There are marker stones in Vesta Rd Telegraph Hill that put the west side in Surrey and the east in Kent so I'm going to say Millwall started off in Middlesex and ended up in Surrey though by the time they arrived there it was London.
Surrey play cricket at The Oval but that doesn't mean that anyone would seriously suggest that modern day Kennington isn't part of London!
It's mad to think that Kennington was once in Surrey
Southwark and Deptford too.
Looking at a map, the Isle of Dogs were once Middlesex!
Southwark was in Surrey, as was Bermondsey (hence Surrey Docks). Deptford was in Kent. Most of Lewisham borough was historically in Kent; Tower Hamlets and Hackney were in Middlesex; Newham was mainly Essex until 1965, despite having E postcodes and was not part of London administratively for most things, even though it is closer to the City than most places west, because the local boroughs of West and East Ham resisted becoming part of London so they could pay lower rates. So Charlton were a London team before West Ham.
And for all of you saying postcodes decide whether you're in London, what if you're from Sewardstone, E4 and live in the Essex district of Epping Forest? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sewardstone
Not all of Southwark was in Surrey. The border between Kent and Surrey ran through Southwark at certain parts. Part of the border was actually Surrey docks itself, with Kent one side and Surrey on the other.
So are Millwall (as in the location of the old and new Den) Surrey or Kent
Surrey. New Den is on Surrey Canal Road and is the Lewisham bit of the Rotherhithe postcode (SE16) so no argument there. Old Den it's a bit less clearcut but the old manor of Hatcham was originally under the Hundred of Brixton (Surrey) but the parish of St Pauls's Deptford (Kent). There are marker stones in Vesta Rd Telegraph Hill that put the west side in Surrey and the east in Kent so I'm going to say Millwall started off in Middlesex and ended up in Surrey though by the time they arrived there it was London.
Thanks. Millwall should stick to hating Palace then, the Surrey derby
The other thing to note is this - Council bounderies break up towns and villages**, but post codes don't, which again suggest the postcode dictates where you are as, as far as I'm aware, county boundaries never go through a town or village, they go round it.
** Example. Depending on where you stand in Mottingham, you could be in either the London Borough of Greenwich, the London Borough of Lewisham or Bromley Borough (Kent), but it's all SE9
The other thing to note is this - Council bounderies break up towns and villages**, but post codes don't, which again suggest the postcode dictates where you are as, as far as I'm aware, county boundaries never go through a town or village, they go round it.
** Example. Depending on where you stand in Mottingham, you could be in either the London Borough of Greenwich, the London Borough of Lewisham or Bromley Borough (Kent), but it's all SE9
Postcodes divide places as well. You could be anywhere in Bexleyheath and your council will be the London Borough of Bexley but your postcode could be DA6 or DA7. Brixton is SW2, but central parts of it are also SW9 and SE24. All the same council though.
The other thing to note is this - Council bounderies break up towns and villages**, but post codes don't, which again suggest the postcode dictates where you are as, as far as I'm aware, county boundaries never go through a town or village, they go round it.
** Example. Depending on where you stand in Mottingham, you could be in either the London Borough of Greenwich, the London Borough of Lewisham or Bromley Borough (Kent), but it's all SE9
Postcodes divide places as well. You could be anywhere in Bexleyheath and your council will be the London Borough of Bexley but your postcode could be DA6 or DA7. Brixton is SW2, but central parts of it are also SW9 and SE24. All the same council though.
But its still DA (Dartford) or SW (South West London)
London's growth was based on its global trade which was built on the docks and associated industries on the Thames to the east of London. Charlton's decline mirrored the decline of these docks and industries from the 50's onwards. Unfortunately all the money has always ended up in north and west London. With most football clubs now owned by foreigners its probably not so linked but you would think that the regeneration of the 'east thames corridor' can only be a good thing for Charlton in terms of support and in attracting wealthy owners. With Canary Wharf and the O2/peninsula development it could be argued that the centre of London has started to shift eastwards. Regardless, proximity to the Thames makes us far more of a London club than say a palace or a Watford in my book and its hard to pin down the true identity of clubs like millwall and arsenal who started off in one part of London and are now in another. The conclusion is therefore that Charlton is actually The London club - not that it matters really but i've spent a few minutes typing that so might as well post it!!!!!
People do realise that London has got bigger over the years, right?
The old Roman walls used to mark the boundary back in the day, so anything outside of them obviously isn't London. Or so some on here might have you believe!
Not many would agree that post codes are a significant marker of identity.
in Norfolk, for example, you can find Peterborough post codes. In Suffolk you can find Norwich post codes. Post codes are somewhat modern arbitrary lines of division, whereas counties are very very old.
There have been a few reorganizations of local government that have muddied the waters with counties - introduction of local authorities (taking Liverpool out of Lancashire), practical dissolution of some historical counties (Middlesex!) merging of others (Cumberland and Westmorland into Cumbria)
but the historical counties continue to exist.... county cricket being an example of how... local newspaper titles being another
in any case, London is a bit of an anomaly in that it has grown into these historical counties, hence causing discussions like the one in this thread
places like Charlton were historically in Kent, but are now part of London. Same with Palace and Surrey. I can see the temptation to use post codes as the new marker, but it doesn’t work if you look beyond London.
As a a side note, I set out to play cribbage in all 39 historical counties in a year when I moved back to the uk from China. I get into this discussion a bit I’m my write up. You can read about the whole shebang here:
Comments
Airports? You can't beat London Ashford - Lydd, which like Manston is on the Kent coast.
So Charlton were a London team before West Ham.
And for all of you saying postcodes decide whether you're in London, what if you're from Sewardstone, E4 and live in the Essex district of Epping Forest?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sewardstone
South Londons England,
North Londons Britain
and then theres the rest of the world
Where does London stop?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAusbJmRB0c&t=468s
The other thing to note is this - Council bounderies break up towns and villages**, but post codes don't, which again suggest the postcode dictates where you are as, as far as I'm aware, county boundaries never go through a town or village, they go round it.
** Example. Depending on where you stand in Mottingham, you could be in either the London Borough of Greenwich, the London Borough of Lewisham or Bromley Borough (Kent), but it's all SE9
The old Roman walls used to mark the boundary back in the day, so anything outside of them obviously isn't London. Or so some on here might have you believe!
Full of spanners and palice.
in Norfolk, for example, you can find Peterborough post codes. In Suffolk you can find Norwich post codes. Post codes are somewhat modern arbitrary lines of division, whereas counties are very very old.
There have been a few reorganizations of local government that have muddied the waters with counties - introduction of local authorities (taking Liverpool out of Lancashire), practical dissolution of some historical counties (Middlesex!) merging of others (Cumberland and Westmorland into Cumbria)
but the historical counties continue to exist.... county cricket being an example of how... local newspaper titles being another
in any case, London is a bit of an anomaly in that it has grown into these historical counties, hence causing discussions like the one in this thread
places like Charlton were historically in Kent, but are now part of London. Same with Palace and Surrey. I can see the temptation to use post codes as the new marker, but it doesn’t work if you look beyond London.
As a a side note, I set out to play cribbage in all 39 historical counties in a year when I moved back to the uk from China. I get into this discussion a bit I’m my write up. You can read about the whole shebang here:
https://cribbageinthecounties.wordpress.com/