100% behind bows , hes trying to make a silk purse out of pigs sow. Ok so he went defensive when we were winning away against Brenfrod and again today, but the fact he can us into winning positions with this squad is a miracle in itself if I was him I'd do the same.
Rather than launch full tilt into LB, lets first think about the shitshow that’s been going on off the pitch and put some context on our current situation.
If we had stable ownership we would have had resources for a way better squad through decent money to spend in both transfer windows. We’ve basically played a League One squad in the Championship - and in all fairness that’s been far from easy. It’s been a lean squad for a few years but this season it’s been as thin as that awful bog paper you end up putting your finger through - and about as pleasant.
I suspect we lost Conor Gallagher in the January window because Chelsea knew what was going on behind the scenes. He’d had great games under Bowyer and he shaped the team a lot - his loss was massive to us and easily worth enough points to be certain of remaining.
All of that will have an effect on the players, management and staff. We began the re-start brightly but the shine soon came off - about the same time as the latest ownership bollocks kicked off.
To be honest, given everything going on with ownership, relegation or indeed who the manager is, will be the least of our worries.
We could quite seriously be facing administration, and we just have to hope that a buyer who is utterly serious about the game of football and isn’t in it for quick riches is found.
But to my mind blaming Bowyer for the mess is like kicking the cat when you’re pissed off. And just as cruel.
Bowyer has my full support because whoever we get instead will be significantly worse.
100%
Not sure he’ll stick around if we drop and I dread to think who we’ll get instead. Hopefully give it to Jacko
As i have said before we will all moan when he has gone.
Bowyer has love for OUR club what else would bring him back to charlton. I am sure he could just sit beside his lake in France and fish the rest of his life away.
what ever happens next season i expect with the correct owners in place Bowyer will be with charlton and leading from the front.
Pride in charlton is what he has and his job is not done so lead us on Lee Bowyer ,player, manager and man of Charlton.
IF we stay up, without any investment, we risk being the whipping boys of the league. Is it really worth it!?
Based on what facts though? Both Rotherham and Wycombe are worse than this squad and will have a lower budget. We need to focus on on here and now, which is staying in Div 2. I am very very frustrated that we could not hold on as I am convinced that 49 would have been enough to stay up, but we go again on Sat.
IF we stay up, without any investment, we risk being the whipping boys of the league. Is it really worth it!?
Of course it is. If we stay up, we a better chance of attracting investment and not being the whipping boys of the league. If we go down we can't assume we're going to come straight back up - look at Sunderland.
Sit back??? We hit the post and had a goal saved on the line.
Yes, around the 70th min mark. Please remind me how many chances we had after 3 attacking players were taken off for 3 more defensive ones.
I'll help you out.......NONE.
Who were the three defensive players we brought on for more attacking ones?
I make it;
- Aneke replaced Hemed. Straight swap up front. - Pratley replaced Field. Two defensive midfielders so a like for like change. - Morgan replaced Williams. Neither exactly known for their defensive qualities so a fairly similar switch. As we know Williams can never seem to last 90 mins and was tiring so someone needed to come on, so who else, Oshilaja?! - Purrington replaced Doughty. A left back for a left back. Certainly Doughty is a more attacking left back than Purrington, but the young lad had put in a shift and was tiring, so replacing him with another more experienced left back doesn't seem to be such a bizarre plan. - Sarr replaced McGeady. Definitely a defensive change, but one made with six minutes of normal time to to go and at a time when Brum were resorting to flinging long balls into the box, so not exactly a crazy move given that McGeady was blowing out of his arse by then.
So, one outright attacking for defensive change. Maybe one and a half if you count Doughty/Purrington.
I’m with Off it. Given the chance to moan at a manager I normally would. But the inability to score a second (Bonne) although I don’t agree with Bowyer laying into him again, and the poor defending (when although Birmingham may have been slightly on top they didn’t look too dangerous) has let us down tonight.
I love Bows, i think he’s done so well for us and we’d be so much worse without him. Is he immune from criticism? No, the subs today and particularly from Brentford deserve a lot of stick. If we go down its not his fault and i’d love him to stay... but 7 goals conceded in injury time? Absolutely not good enough. Whether thats Bowyers fault, our weak squad or bad luck, i have no idea. I suspect a combination of all three which is impossible to quantify. Its pretty simple, if we go down we deserve to and if we stay up we deserve to.
IF we stay up, without any investment, we risk being the whipping boys of the league. Is it really worth it!?
Of course it is. If we stay up, we a better chance of attracting investment and not being the whipping boys of the league. If we go down we can't assume we're going to come straight back up - look at Sunderland.
Definitely can't assume we'd come straight back up.
Sunderland, Portsmouth, Peterborough, Ipswich, Oxford, plus probably Barnsley and Hull. League one will be fairly strong next season.
Saturday is this season's Wembley. Wigan are beatable. They have lost since the break and they stuffed Hull who are a busted flush. They are also a very tough game and it feels to me that we have to get a two goal lead to beat them. Goals do not come easily to us, but there are players that ought to be on the pitch starting on Saturday. Doughty, Aneke, Williams, McGeady and Sarr. And Oztumer needs to be on the bench. We need to set out to beat them 2 or 3 nil and see where that gets us.
Too many balls lumped up to Hemed, who doesn’t win headers or score goals, doughty was getting a pasting early days, he’s much better going forwards than defending (what a cross for the goal).
Lee doesn’t seem to know what his best team is, I know he’s trying to rotate players and not get them injured, I thought it was actually a good sub bringing Naby on for tiring legs, but with Mcgeady , Williams and doughty off the pitch there was nothing going on to keep the ball up the other end of the pitch.
I’m pleased Bonne scored again, just need to keep creating chances for him.
Dillon earnt us that point, penalty save and unbelievable save, don’t give up hope lads!
some of the comments I've read about Bowyer both on here and on Twitter since last night are beyond embarrassing, fella has worked absolutely miracles for us to be 1 win away with 2 chances to do it from staying in this division.
Will serve us right if he just jacks it in at the end of the season....then see who we'll be left with.
What he's had to put up with, it's incredible we are still in with a shout.
Lee is still massively in credit (even if we do go down)
Vitrol should be saved for Taylor, I'm pretty convinced we'd now be safe if he was still playing.
Does anyone on CL work for no wages, other than some charity work ?
As we got 7 points from 3 games in June when he was still under contract then that is a different matter but since Bosman, players have the power and some footballers will be selfish.
There should've been rules put into place so Taylor, Solly, and Fraser at Bournemouth plus others couldn't go on strike while still under contract.
I can't bring myself to hate Lyle as he was on a low wage for his amazing stats for cafc.
Lyle Taylor is a serial mover and this one will be lucrative. I can't hate him because his contract should've been sorted.
Good luck to Lee, next season at Birmingham or Bristol City or a similar size Championship club. His 100 games in charge, will stand him in good stead.
Chris Powell struggled big time after being messed about by Duchatelet and maybe Lee can have a squad where he won't have to park the bus in the last quarter of a match when winning.
My bigger criticism of a Bowyer probably isn’t the resorting to defensive tactics thing but rather his digging out of players in public - the same players that we’re then relying on to save us. At the start of the season it was “Bonne’s not ready for this level” and now it’s “he has to be taking those chances”.
There was nothing wrong with any of the substitutions, it was, unfortunately, the quality of the substitutions. Bowyer took of five third division players and replaced them with another five third division players who weren’t as tired as the five third division players he took off.
As this was happening, Birmingham substituted five second division players for another five second division players including a teenager who is valued at ten times the value of our entire squad. If the transfer rumours are to be believed he is worth more than our squad, the Valley and Sparrows Lane.
If the game had finished 1-0 people would have argued what a fantastic decision it was to bring Sarr on.
If the game had finished 1-1 and McGeady had played the 98 minutes people would be arguing why didn’t Bowyer Replace him with Sarr.
Edit: a little unfair on Doughty here, he’s probably second division standard.
My bigger criticism of a Bowyer probably isn’t the resorting to defensive tactics thing but rather his digging out of players in public - the same players that we’re then relying on to save us. At the start of the season it was “Bonne’s not ready for this level” and now it’s “he has to be taking those chances”.
Yet each time Bowyer has mentioned Bonne in public he's gone on to score in the next game...
Dropped too many points this season, let alone during the 9 cup finals Due to sitting back and trying to soak up pressure!
To be 4 minutes away from a vital win, and go back allowing so much play in your own third is criminal
Do you think we have the quality to not sit back and soak up the pressure? Our team is poor, our attacking threats are barely existent, and we have a midfield that is more or less all coming back from injuries. Pratley at 35 has been our mainstay. I just think its the personnel that hampers us.
Bowyer like all the players will be out the door when he gets offered something that suits him (he has a youngish family and them being settled around Sevenoaks, I think, is what gives us an edge )
He’s done an outstanding job with some decent players but now he has too many shit players the results inevitably are shit .
How good is he time will tell but he’s done a brilliant job for 2 seasons at Charlton and then he’s had an impossible job this last half season .
the current squad is very limited, especially from an attacking perspective - Lee sees the players every day and will know fitness levels etc.
I'm sure he'd love a couple of quality attacking players to be able to throw on with 20 mins left (even if just a Leko or even a Green - bit of pace) simple fact is we don't have it and have to make do with what we've got.
If we can somehow get past Wigan and stay up then 'someone/anyone' with a bit of cash (AB/PV) has a fantastic opportunity with this club and a decent nucleus of players to build on
The opinion of Charlton critics can be taken with a pinch of salt in some cases, after Simon Francis had a mare against Preston in a League cup game I heard fans saying he was shite and he should be playing in the Conference ( he was shite that night and was hooked after 45 minutes because he had totally lost his confidence) I said if he was used as a wing back he would play higher than Cafc. I was told I was clueless.
Simon Francis went on to captain a premier team as a Wing back and as a CB ( that did surprise me as I thought defending was the weakest part of his game !)
Were our players "third division players' when putting Derby county to the sword and not giving Forest a kick in the first half at the Valley plus the victory at Reading ? Or was that just down to Taylor and Gallagher ? Rhetorical question as it wasn't just down to them but they along with Dillon and Josh Cullen were our main men.
Its turned into the season from hell, off the pitch and on the pitch with the myriad of injuries and the Gallagher and Taylor debacle which resulted in our demise from a competitive champ side to one that does not have the legs to play 100 minutes without trying to park a bus. Not so clever when your losing !
Nothing wrong with criticising his managerial decisions at all. Yes he's worked wonders, yes he hasn't had much support from owners, yes ES-LIES fucked us with the transfer embargo... But that doesn't excuse questionable subs and defending a goal lead for 3/4 of a match.
I think there's a lack of faith and belief from him in some of the players and the players themselves in seeing out a game. We all groan and give it the inevitable "just wait for it" as soon as we take a lead and you can bet the players get that feeling too.
The opinion of Charlton critics can be taken with a pinch of salt in some cases, after Simon Francis had a mare against Preston in a League cup game I heard fans saying he was shite and he should be playing in the Conference ( he was shite that night and was hooked after 45 minutes because he had totally lost his confidence) I said if he was used as a wing back he would play higher than Cafc. I was told I was clueless.
Simon Francis went on to captain a premier team as a Wing back and as a CB ( that did surprise me as I thought defending was the weakest part of his game !)
Were our players "third division players' when putting Derby county to the sword and not giving Forest a kick in the first half at the Valley plus the victory at Reading ? Or was that just down to Taylor and Gallagher ? Rhetorical question as it wasn't just down to them but they along with Dillon and Josh Cullen were our main men.
Its turned into the season from hell, off the pitch and on the pitch with the myriad of injuries and the Gallagher and Taylor debacle which resulted in our demise from a competitive champ side to one that does not have the legs to play 100 minutes without trying to park a bus. Not so clever when your losing !
I was only referring to players substituted on/off as being “third division”, not Cullen and Philips, I also think Lockyer and Mathews are good enough for the second division. Maybe Pearce if he doesn’t have to play every game.
I might also have been a little unfiar on Pratley and Field, who if playing half a season each, make a second division player or if they have a very good midfield around them may be up to it. Pratley has been my favourite player this year.
When I look at our current squad, I’m amazed we’re not bottom by a long stretch, take a look where most of the team were playing last year. The majority are third division players, earning third division wages playing against teams that were assembled for millions of pounds. Compare us with other teams at the bottom, Stoke and Huddersfield and even how much Luton have spent. The only other team I think you can compare us to for spending, are a far more stable, Barnsley and look where they are.
I think Bowyer and the squad have been fantastic this year and should be proud of there achievements, even if they fail to win another game this season and are relegated.
It wasn’t a knee jerk reaction to drawing away at Birmingham, drawing away at Birmingham is a fantastic result. Not as fantastic as beating Derby or Forrest - That was super fantastic.
Comments
Bowyer has love for OUR club what else would bring him back to charlton. I am sure he could just sit beside his lake in France and fish the rest of his life away.
what ever happens next season i expect with the correct owners in place Bowyer will be with charlton and leading from the front.
Pride in charlton is what he has and his job is not done so lead us on Lee Bowyer ,player, manager and man of Charlton.
I'll help you out.......NONE.
I make it;
- Aneke replaced Hemed. Straight swap up front.
- Pratley replaced Field. Two defensive midfielders so a like for like change.
- Morgan replaced Williams. Neither exactly known for their defensive qualities so a fairly similar switch. As we know Williams can never seem to last 90 mins and was tiring so someone needed to come on, so who else, Oshilaja?!
- Purrington replaced Doughty. A left back for a left back. Certainly Doughty is a more attacking left back than Purrington, but the young lad had put in a shift and was tiring, so replacing him with another more experienced left back doesn't seem to be such a bizarre plan.
- Sarr replaced McGeady. Definitely a defensive change, but one made with six minutes of normal time to to go and at a time when Brum were resorting to flinging long balls into the box, so not exactly a crazy move given that McGeady was blowing out of his arse by then.
So, one outright attacking for defensive change. Maybe one and a half if you count Doughty/Purrington.
But the inability to score a second (Bonne) although I don’t agree with Bowyer laying into him again, and the poor defending (when although Birmingham may have been slightly on top they didn’t look too dangerous) has let us down tonight.
i do feel some Powell-esquire tendencies though.
Sunderland, Portsmouth, Peterborough, Ipswich, Oxford, plus probably Barnsley and Hull. League one will be fairly strong next season.
Let's hope it doesn't come to that.
Lee must be as frustrated as us, I just hope he can get it right in the next 2 games and get us out of this mess.
Lee doesn’t seem to know what his best team is, I know he’s trying to rotate players and not get them injured, I thought it was actually a good sub bringing Naby on for tiring legs, but with Mcgeady , Williams and doughty off the pitch there was nothing going on to keep the ball up the other end of the pitch.
I’m pleased Bonne scored again, just need to keep creating chances for him.
Dillon earnt us that point, penalty save and unbelievable save, don’t give up hope lads!
What irks me is that with all those defensive players on the pitch the Brum player still got to the cross first and relatively unchallenged.
Will serve us right if he just jacks it in at the end of the season....then see who we'll be left with.
What he's had to put up with, it's incredible we are still in with a shout.
Lee is still massively in credit (even if we do go down)
Vitrol should be saved for Taylor, I'm pretty convinced we'd now be safe if he was still playing.
Does anyone on CL work for no wages, other than some charity work ?
As we got 7 points from 3 games in June when he was still under contract then that is a different matter but since Bosman, players have the power and some footballers will be selfish.
There should've been rules put into place so Taylor, Solly, and Fraser at Bournemouth plus others couldn't go on strike while still under contract.
I can't bring myself to hate Lyle as he was on a low wage for his amazing stats for cafc.
Lyle Taylor is a serial mover and this one will be lucrative. I can't hate him because his contract should've been sorted.
Good luck to Lee, next season at Birmingham or Bristol City or a similar size Championship club. His 100 games in charge, will stand him in good stead.
Chris Powell struggled big time after being messed about by Duchatelet and maybe Lee can have a squad where he won't have to park the bus in the last quarter of a match when winning.
As this was happening, Birmingham substituted five second division players for another five second division players including a teenager who is valued at ten times the value of our entire squad. If the transfer rumours are to be believed he is worth more than our squad, the Valley and Sparrows Lane.
If the game had finished 1-0 people would have argued what a fantastic decision it was to bring Sarr on.
If the game had finished 1-1 and McGeady had played the 98 minutes people would be arguing why didn’t Bowyer Replace him with Sarr.
Edit: a little unfair on Doughty here, he’s probably second division standard.
He’s done an outstanding job with some decent players but now he has too many shit players the results inevitably are shit .
How good is he time will tell but he’s done a brilliant job for 2 seasons at Charlton and then he’s had an impossible job this last half season .
I'm sure he'd love a couple of quality attacking players to be able to throw on with 20 mins left (even if just a Leko or even a Green - bit of pace) simple fact is we don't have it and have to make do with what we've got.
If we can somehow get past Wigan and stay up then 'someone/anyone' with a bit of cash (AB/PV) has a fantastic opportunity with this club and a decent nucleus of players to build on
Simon Francis went on to captain a premier team as a Wing back and as a CB ( that did surprise me as I thought defending was the weakest part of his game !)
Were our players "third division players' when putting Derby county to the sword and not giving Forest a kick in the first half at the Valley plus the victory at Reading ?
Or was that just down to Taylor and Gallagher ? Rhetorical question as it wasn't just down to them but they along with Dillon and Josh Cullen were our main men.
Its turned into the season from hell, off the pitch and on the pitch with the myriad of injuries and the Gallagher and Taylor debacle which resulted in our demise from a competitive champ side to one that does not have the legs to play 100 minutes without trying to park a bus. Not so clever when your losing !
I think there's a lack of faith and belief from him in some of the players and the players themselves in seeing out a game. We all groan and give it the inevitable "just wait for it" as soon as we take a lead and you can bet the players get that feeling too.
I was only referring to players substituted on/off as being “third division”, not Cullen and Philips, I also think Lockyer and Mathews are good enough for the second division. Maybe Pearce if he doesn’t have to play every game.
I might also have been a little unfiar on Pratley and Field, who if playing half a season each, make a second division player or if they have a very good midfield around them may be up to it. Pratley has been my favourite player this year.
When I look at our current squad, I’m amazed we’re not bottom by a long stretch, take a look where most of the team were playing last year. The majority are third division players, earning third division wages playing against teams that were assembled for millions of pounds. Compare us with other teams at the bottom, Stoke and Huddersfield and even how much Luton have spent. The only other team I think you can compare us to for spending, are a far more stable, Barnsley and look where they are.
I think Bowyer and the squad have been fantastic this year and should be proud of there achievements, even if they fail to win another game this season and are relegated.
It wasn’t a knee jerk reaction to drawing away at Birmingham, drawing away at Birmingham is a fantastic result. Not as fantastic as beating Derby or Forrest - That was super fantastic.