I’ve finally put my hand in my pocket to listen to my brother again. I was boycotting & if I’m honest I get quite emotional listening to him when it’s been nearly a year since I’ve seen him (through no fault of our own).
But I only listen to the comms. I’m really not interested in watching a stream, especially at those prices. When the world gets back to normal I’ll be coming over to games now & then & that’s how I’d rather spend my money.
A bit deep those pockets aren’t they? At £10 they are a bargain and the price is set by the EFL so there will not be any cheap offers unless the Club subs it.
Being abroad you don’t even pay £10!
There have been a few blips, but overall the picture, sound quality and the commentary has been excellent. Far better quality picture than BT can muster!
It’s your money and your choice, but I don’t think you and others are being fair criticising the price, I think it is good value and my spending is way less than I spend following Charlton - even if I exclude going to away games. It costs a tenner to get the coach to a home game FFS.
Yep, it’s my money.
I have always preferred live sport.
I can watch football on the telebox mostly as it’s not my team. I’ve always hated watching Charlton on the the tv. So, if it’s all the same to you, I’ll save the money until I can go & watch a few games live with my friends & family. Listening to my brother through an earpiece actually makes me feel like I’m there, sat next to him, like I used to.
“If we could fill two thirds of the stadium we could break even or better.”
This is intresting, is the wage bill really that much smaller than 2 seasons ago?
We could break even on an average gate of 18k in league 1? Or does he mean this season after the sales of Bonne, Phillips and the KAG windfall?
I think this is unlikely to be true in operating terms in L1. If you work off £15 per match per seat net of VAT, which is quite a reach as it equates to a season ticket price of £400 for everyone, including U11s etc, two thirds full would raise about £6m over the season. The club's operating expenses have been close to £20m a year for some time.
The gap is much smaller in the Championship, because of the higher solidarity and TV money, but of course you get relegated unless you increase the playing budget, as has just been demonstrated.
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I'm loving the Sandgaard era so far and long may it continue. But I do have a bit of a worry about his view that Keohane and Parkes have their finger on the pulse. And that worry is that TS doesn't yet know what he doesn't know about running football club. I suspect there are a huge number of good management practices which have been abandoned at Charlton in recent years and they may well be alien also to the likes of Keohane and Parkes (no disrespect intended to the latter, huge disrespect intended to the former). I have no problem with Thomas being his own CEO and really getting to grips with the detail of the club but he would be very well advised to ask an experienced and respected football CEO, like Peter Varney but not necessarily him, to cast a critical eye over the running of the club and make some recommendations for improvement.
I'm loving the Sandgaard era so far and long may it continue. But I do have a bit of a worry about his view that Keohane and Parkes have their finger on the pulse. And that worry is that TS doesn't yet know what he doesn't know about running football club. I suspect there are a huge number of good management practices which have been abandoned at Charlton in recent years and they may well be alien also to the likes of Keohane and Parkes (no disrespect intended to the latter, huge disrespect intended to the former). I have no problem with Thomas being his own CEO and really getting to grips with the detail of the club but he would be very well advised to ask an experienced and respected football CEO, like Peter Varney but not necessarily him, to cast a critical eye over the running of the club and make some recommendations for improvement.
Dave Baldwin was in CAST's EFL meeting and was very impressive - a straight-talking Yorkshireman who was finding it very hard not to be more candid with us, given CAFC were in the midst of legal proceedings.
I'd be pretty pleased if he did come in, though understand that his EFL resignation was because of the Covid circumstances and he is quite firmly Northern-based. But you never know.
Sandgaard's comments re TK / CP were specifically in relation to the safe return of fans, though overall he did feel that a lot was running OK behind the scenes.
"Part of Ged Roddy’s role is to look at 'streamlining the way Charlton play' so that young players 'fit into the system' when they come through."
Any more details on how this will work exactly? I take that to mean Ged will be getting the youth teams to play similar football to the first team, rather than changing the way Bowyer approaches games
I had said this when Roddy was hired is will all the teams play the same way and is that Roddy or Bowyers way?
Dave Baldwin was in CAST's EFL meeting and was very impressive - a straight-talking Yorkshireman who was finding it very hard not to be more candid with us, given CAFC were in the midst of legal proceedings.
I'd be pretty pleased if he did come in, though understand that his EFL resignation was because of the Covid circumstances and he is quite firmly Northern-based. But you never know.
Sandgaard's comments re TK / CP were specifically in relation to the safe return of fans, though overall he did feel that a lot was running OK behind the scenes.
Time will tell.
The only person I would trust with the safe return of fans is Mick E. He is the only one with decades of experience of fan safety in the ground.
“If we could fill two thirds of the stadium we could break even or better.”
This is intresting, is the wage bill really that much smaller than 2 seasons ago?
We could break even on an average gate of 18k in league 1? Or does he mean this season after the sales of Bonne, Phillips and the KAG windfall?
I think this is unlikely to be true in operating terms in L1. If you work off £15 per match per seat net of VAT, which is quite a reach as it equates to a season ticket price of £400 for everyone, including U11s etc, two thirds full would raise about £6m over the season. The club's operating expenses have been close to £20m a year for some time.
The gap is much smaller in the Championship, because of the higher solidarity and TV money, but of course you get relegated unless you increase the playing budget, as has just been demonstrated.
Yes fair point that, so strange comment from TS there. I did see that our salary bill was 9.5m in our last League One season though, and given the new player wage restrictions, I'd guess that the bill for all staff would come in significantly below 5m?
Looking at the financials again it has reminded me what a fool's errand running a football club is.
Edit: 5m+ reduction in salary bill, almost 2m from Bonne sale, 2m or so from KAG sell on. I can see how we would be approaching break even this year.
Dave Baldwin was in CAST's EFL meeting and was very impressive - a straight-talking Yorkshireman who was finding it very hard not to be more candid with us, given CAFC were in the midst of legal proceedings.
I'd be pretty pleased if he did come in, though understand that his EFL resignation was because of the Covid circumstances and he is quite firmly Northern-based. But you never know.
Sandgaard's comments re TK / CP were specifically in relation to the safe return of fans, though overall he did feel that a lot was running OK behind the scenes.
Time will tell.
I don’t see in what way CP is involved with the safe return of fans.
“If we could fill two thirds of the stadium we could break even or better.”
This is intresting, is the wage bill really that much smaller than 2 seasons ago?
We could break even on an average gate of 18k in league 1? Or does he mean this season after the sales of Bonne, Phillips and the KAG windfall?
I think this is unlikely to be true in operating terms in L1. If you work off £15 per match per seat net of VAT, which is quite a reach as it equates to a season ticket price of £400 for everyone, including U11s etc, two thirds full would raise about £6m over the season. The club's operating expenses have been close to £20m a year for some time.
The gap is much smaller in the Championship, because of the higher solidarity and TV money, but of course you get relegated unless you increase the playing budget, as has just been demonstrated.
Yes fair point that, so strange comment from TS there. I did see that our salary bill was 9.5m in our last League One season though, and given the new player wage restrictions, I'd guess that the bill for all staff would come in significantly below 5m?
Looking at the financials again it has reminded me what a fool's errand running a football club is.
Edit: 5m+ reduction in salary bill, almost 2m from Bonne sale, 2m or so from KAG sell on. I can see how we would be approaching break even this year.
I can't see the wage bill has halved. Nabby, BFG, Igor, possibly Ajose and Taylor were probably our biggest earners and have all gone. But Williams, Amos and Chuks are still on thier "championship" contracts.
Aribo, Phillips, Grant and Dijksteel were on peanuts.
"Part of Ged Roddy’s role is to look at 'streamlining the way Charlton play' so that young players 'fit into the system' when they come through."
Any more details on how this will work exactly? I take that to mean Ged will be getting the youth teams to play similar football to the first team, rather than changing the way Bowyer approaches games
I had said this when Roddy was hired is will all the teams play the same way and is that Roddy or Bowyers way?
Surely the 'way' will be dependent upon the players available? If not - why don't we just play the Bayern Munich way or the Barca way?
I would think that they would at first need to agree a style that fits the players and abilities across all squads in scope and over time start to bring players in that fit into the desired style?!?
Dave Baldwin was in CAST's EFL meeting and was very impressive - a straight-talking Yorkshireman who was finding it very hard not to be more candid with us, given CAFC were in the midst of legal proceedings.
I'd be pretty pleased if he did come in, though understand that his EFL resignation was because of the Covid circumstances and he is quite firmly Northern-based. But you never know.
Sandgaard's comments re TK / CP were specifically in relation to the safe return of fans, though overall he did feel that a lot was running OK behind the scenes.
Time will tell.
Baldwin was an educated guess based on him having dealings with Sandgaard during the takeover. He fits the same profile as Roddy and Mumford in being an over qualified but ambitious appointment.
TS had said previously about getting a CEO in at the end of the season which fits with Baldwin's notice period.
Him being previously northern based is the biggest negative to this happening but just my speculation, not ITK info
Dave Baldwin was in CAST's EFL meeting and was very impressive - a straight-talking Yorkshireman who was finding it very hard not to be more candid with us, given CAFC were in the midst of legal proceedings.
I'd be pretty pleased if he did come in, though understand that his EFL resignation was because of the Covid circumstances and he is quite firmly Northern-based. But you never know.
Sandgaard's comments re TK / CP were specifically in relation to the safe return of fans, though overall he did feel that a lot was running OK behind the scenes.
Time will tell.
Baldwin was an educated guess based on him having dealings with Sandgaard during the takeover. He fits the same profile as Roddy and Mumford in being an over qualified but ambitious appointment.
TS had said previously about getting a CEO in at the end of the season which fits with Baldwin's notice period.
Him being previously northern based is the biggest negative to this happening but just my speculation, not ITK info
I'd had the same thought but also pure speculation.
I’ve finally put my hand in my pocket to listen to my brother again. I was boycotting & if I’m honest I get quite emotional listening to him when it’s been nearly a year since I’ve seen him (through no fault of our own).
But I only listen to the comms. I’m really not interested in watching a stream, especially at those prices. When the world gets back to normal I’ll be coming over to games now & then & that’s how I’d rather spend my money.
A bit deep those pockets aren’t they? At £10 they are a bargain and the price is set by the EFL so there will not be any cheap offers unless the Club subs it.
Being abroad you don’t even pay £10!
There have been a few blips, but overall the picture, sound quality and the commentary has been excellent. Far better quality picture than BT can muster!
It’s your money and your choice, but I don’t think you and others are being fair criticising the price, I think it is good value and my spending is way less than I spend following Charlton - even if I exclude going to away games. It costs a tenner to get the coach to a home game FFS.
Yep, it’s my money.
I have always preferred live sport.
I can watch football on the telebox mostly as it’s not my team. I’ve always hated watching Charlton on the the tv. So, if it’s all the same to you, I’ll save the money until I can go & watch a few games live with my friends & family. Listening to my brother through an earpiece actually makes me feel like I’m there, sat next to him, like I used to.
Yep, as I said it’s your money and I understand everything else that you say, BUT your complaint about the pricing.
Be honest, the few quid it costs has bugger all to do with your decision so why not stop slagging off a service that you have no intention of using. I am so grateful I can follow our team by watching the games, and so is a friend of mine who is deaf.
Think the stream is good value,and easy to access,up to now i have had season ticket holding relations join me so 4 of us every game ,would suspect many others the same equating to 12-15000 watching.Figures might now go up with gatherings now illegal.One annoyance,the replays consistently being shown while play is in progress.
Very very pleasing to read TS's thoughts and about his ambitions. The only negative for me is his willingness to possibly sacrifice The Valley for his European dream. I know which of these is the most important to me.
I know that he says that he wouldn't do it without fan consultation but once we get the new 'Premier League' and 'happy clappy' fans on board, we know which way this vote would go. By then fans like me will just be labelled as grumpy old bastards who can't 'move with the times.'
Very very pleasing to read TS's thoughts and about his ambitions. The only negative for me is his willingness to possibly sacrifice The Valley for his European dream. I know which of these is the most important to me.
I know that he says that he wouldn't do it without fan consultation but once we get the new 'Premier League' and 'happy clappy' fans on board, we know which way this vote would go. By then fans like me will just be labelled as grumpy old bastards who can't 'move with the times.'
It would be pretty sad but I think if it's with fan consultation and the logic is well reasoned, which I'm sure it would be - then I'll have to open myself up to the idea.
And to be fair, if he gets us European Football as soon as he's hoping then he can rename it the Sandgaard Stadium of Success and walk about the place with his ballbag hanging out for all I care.
Very very pleasing to read TS's thoughts and about his ambitions. The only negative for me is his willingness to possibly sacrifice The Valley for his European dream. I know which of these is the most important to me.
I know that he says that he wouldn't do it without fan consultation but once we get the new 'Premier League' and 'happy clappy' fans on board, we know which way this vote would go. By then fans like me will just be labelled as grumpy old bastards who can't 'move with the times.'
I suspect (hope) that he's just putting up a marker to Rolly that he won't be held over a barrel regarding the stadium. Fair play to him.
Anyway, we're still in League One, even in fantasyland we've got a couple of years before we worry about European football - unless he fulfils the FA Cup dream
“If we could fill two thirds of the stadium we could break even or better.”
This is intresting, is the wage bill really that much smaller than 2 seasons ago?
We could break even on an average gate of 18k in league 1? Or does he mean this season after the sales of Bonne, Phillips and the KAG windfall?
I think this is unlikely to be true in operating terms in L1. If you work off £15 per match per seat net of VAT, which is quite a reach as it equates to a season ticket price of £400 for everyone, including U11s etc, two thirds full would raise about £6m over the season. The club's operating expenses have been close to £20m a year for some time.
The gap is much smaller in the Championship, because of the higher solidarity and TV money, but of course you get relegated unless you increase the playing budget, as has just been demonstrated.
With the upmost respect for your knowledge of Chartlon, Sandgaard's comment here does not specify if he means in isolation or including the following: - Increase in commercial revenues - Hospitality - Average player sales
I am sure he has done the sums and would not pluck that figure out of the air.
What we can all agree on, is that with no fans, we will (and all other clubs in league one no doubt) make a loss.
There's still a fair few years until The Valley isn't suitable, I don't really see the need for expansion until you have thousands locked out on a regular basis, and its always seems expensive to expand, 27k seems alright, if you can get to 32k it puts you on par with Leicester, Southampton, Sheffield United and Brighton, and sees about right for a club of our size.
Very very pleasing to read TS's thoughts and about his ambitions. The only negative for me is his willingness to possibly sacrifice The Valley for his European dream. I know which of these is the most important to me.
I know that he says that he wouldn't do it without fan consultation but once we get the new 'Premier League' and 'happy clappy' fans on board, we know which way this vote would go. By then fans like me will just be labelled as grumpy old bastards who can't 'move with the times.'
If anyone came out and said:
"for" reasons" we will no longer play at the Valley, we will go and play at the den for an unspecified amount of time. Then when as yet unknown circumstances change we might do something else"
There would be, rightly, a lot of anger, resistance etc
However if someone said
"this is the site, we will start building on x date, complete on y date. This is how we will pay for it, these are the benifits. We will play at the Valley until its ready."
I believe there would be a totally different response, even if there isn't 100% agreement.
I’ve finally put my hand in my pocket to listen to my brother again. I was boycotting & if I’m honest I get quite emotional listening to him when it’s been nearly a year since I’ve seen him (through no fault of our own).
But I only listen to the comms. I’m really not interested in watching a stream, especially at those prices. When the world gets back to normal I’ll be coming over to games now & then & that’s how I’d rather spend my money.
A bit deep those pockets aren’t they? At £10 they are a bargain and the price is set by the EFL so there will not be any cheap offers unless the Club subs it.
Being abroad you don’t even pay £10!
There have been a few blips, but overall the picture, sound quality and the commentary has been excellent. Far better quality picture than BT can muster!
It’s your money and your choice, but I don’t think you and others are being fair criticising the price, I think it is good value and my spending is way less than I spend following Charlton - even if I exclude going to away games. It costs a tenner to get the coach to a home game FFS.
Yep, it’s my money.
I have always preferred live sport.
I can watch football on the telebox mostly as it’s not my team. I’ve always hated watching Charlton on the the tv. So, if it’s all the same to you, I’ll save the money until I can go & watch a few games live with my friends & family. Listening to my brother through an earpiece actually makes me feel like I’m there, sat next to him, like I used to.
Yep, as I said it’s your money and I understand everything else that you say, BUT your complaint about the pricing.
Be honest, the few quid it costs has bugger all to do with your decision so why not stop slagging off a service that you have no intention of using. I am so grateful I can follow our team by watching the games, and so is a friend of mine who is deaf.
Alright sweet pea!
I do still think it costs too much for what it’s worth. That’s not ‘slagging it off’, it’s my opinion on the price. If it were cheaper then maybe I would consider it more.
The point being ‘I’.
Over the moon & completely delighted for you & your friend.
While I would be loathe to leave the Valley, if there were good reasons that it would make sense, then I'd have to be up for that whether I liked it or not.
Other clubs have made that decision and fans have by and large excepted the need.
There's still a fair few years until The Valley isn't suitable, I don't really see the need for expansion until you have thousands locked out on a regular basis, and its always seems expensive to expand, 27k seems alright, if you can get to 32k it puts you on par with Leicester, Southampton, Sheffield United and Brighton, and sees about right for a club of our size.
With the tv money in the top flight these days, there's less emphasis on crowd size anyway.
An extra 5k through the gate on a matchday paying 30 quid is only 2.85 million over an entire season. Peanuts when compared to the sky money.
There are problems with the Valley, like the hospitality set up is pretty meh, but you can make space in the west stand by moving the offices somewhere else, getting access to the Casino school space, and probably improve the boxes in the east. If there was an issue it would be the ability to sell expensive tickets to the London prawn sandwich types. But then TV money covers that in the Premier League.
There are problems with the Valley, like the hospitality set up is pretty meh, but you can make space in the west stand by moving the offices somewhere else, getting access to the Casino school space, and probably improve the boxes in the east. If there was an issue it would be the ability to sell expensive tickets to the London prawn sandwich types. But then TV money covers that in the Premier League.
I think the TV money, currently, makes "bums on seats" somewhat irrelevant but the corporate set up is more important than ever.
10k seats at £20 profit isn't as important as 2k seats at £200 profit. That's before you look at the non match day revenue of the 2. A seat in the Covered End would only generate income on a match day, what ever league you are in.
Getting into the streams via valley pass is still a clunky affair and a bit of a pain in the arse for me. Might put some off.
I think making all the pre interviews and reaction free to everyone and then really pushing the streams once you've got people in might be something to look at. If you could quickly buy and watch a stream at the touch of a few buttons that would help. Drop the price to £5-7 due to the free content.
I would consider myself fairly average in terms of computer literacy and it certainly put me off. I tend to only buy a ticket last minute, and on several occasions I have simply forgotten what I need to do.
Comments
I have always preferred live sport.
I’ve always hated watching Charlton on the the tv.
So, if it’s all the same to you, I’ll save the money until I can go & watch a few games live with my friends & family.
Listening to my brother through an earpiece actually makes me feel like I’m there, sat next to him, like I used to.
The gap is much smaller in the Championship, because of the higher solidarity and TV money, but of course you get relegated unless you increase the playing budget, as has just been demonstrated.
Happy to help.
I still expect to see a CEO in place by the summer and still think it might be Dave Baldwin
I'd be pretty pleased if he did come in, though understand that his EFL resignation was because of the Covid circumstances and he is quite firmly Northern-based. But you never know.
Sandgaard's comments re TK / CP were specifically in relation to the safe return of fans, though overall he did feel that a lot was running OK behind the scenes.
Time will tell.
I did see that our salary bill was 9.5m in our last League One season though, and given the new player wage restrictions, I'd guess that the bill for all staff would come in significantly below 5m?
Looking at the financials again it has reminded me what a fool's errand running a football club is.
Edit: 5m+ reduction in salary bill, almost 2m from Bonne sale, 2m or so from KAG sell on. I can see how we would be approaching break even this year.
Aribo, Phillips, Grant and Dijksteel were on peanuts.
I would imagine its less, but no where near half.
I would think that they would at first need to agree a style that fits the players and abilities across all squads in scope and over time start to bring players in that fit into the desired style?!?
TS had said previously about getting a CEO in at the end of the season which fits with Baldwin's notice period.
Him being previously northern based is the biggest negative to this happening but just my speculation, not ITK info
I am so grateful I can follow our team by watching the games, and so is a friend of mine who is deaf.
I know that he says that he wouldn't do it without fan consultation but once we get the new 'Premier League' and 'happy clappy' fans on board, we know which way this vote would go. By then fans like me will just be labelled as grumpy old bastards who can't 'move with the times.'
And to be fair, if he gets us European Football as soon as he's hoping then he can rename it the Sandgaard Stadium of Success and walk about the place with his ballbag hanging out for all I care.
Anyway, we're still in League One, even in fantasyland we've got a couple of years before we worry about European football - unless he fulfils the FA Cup dream
- Increase in commercial revenues
- Hospitality
- Average player sales
I am sure he has done the sums and would not pluck that figure out of the air.
What we can all agree on, is that with no fans, we will (and all other clubs in league one no doubt) make a loss.
"for" reasons" we will no longer play at the Valley, we will go and play at the den for an unspecified amount of time. Then when as yet unknown circumstances change we might do something else"
There would be, rightly, a lot of anger, resistance etc
However if someone said
"this is the site, we will start building on x date, complete on y date. This is how we will pay for it, these are the benifits. We will play at the Valley until its ready."
I believe there would be a totally different response, even if there isn't 100% agreement.
I do still think it costs too much for what it’s worth. That’s not ‘slagging it off’, it’s my opinion on the price. If it were cheaper then maybe I would consider it more.
Over the moon & completely delighted for you & your friend.
You, me, completely different.
But carry on if it makes you feel better 😊
Other clubs have made that decision and fans have by and large excepted the need.
An extra 5k through the gate on a matchday paying 30 quid is only 2.85 million over an entire season. Peanuts when compared to the sky money.
10k seats at £20 profit isn't as important as 2k seats at £200 profit. That's before you look at the non match day revenue of the 2. A seat in the Covered End would only generate income on a match day, what ever league you are in.