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Post-match Thread: Charlton v Portsmouth | Tues 2nd Feb 2021
Comments
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Lockdown defeats definitely feel so much worse than normality defeats. Once I’ve had a few beers after a game at the Valley or elsewhere, I generally move on but all these awful performances watching at home are really turning me into a moody prick.AFKABartram said:Everyone else just feel massively deflated?My poor family must absolutely dread Tuesdays and Saturdays at the moment.11 -
Bowyer was still talking about top 2 in his post match interview.
Fucking hell!!!!!!!!1 -
Yet we have people saying he should be given the next two transfer window!!!!LouisMend said:
I'd 100% give him to the end of the season. But if we don't get top 6, then he has to go.
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I would guess that TS has told him he will go if he doesn't get top six. That comment was a message to the owner I suspect.0
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Just about sums it up for me!Covered End said:I support Bowyer and yet this season he seems to set the team up wrong in most games.
It was quite apparent after 20 mins, that they were in control and a goal was looking likely.
The diamond formation does not work well this season.
Whether that's down to the manager or the players I'm not sure.
But what I am certain, is if the players can't play the formation, stop playing it.
We are wide open at the back most games shipping in 2 or more regularly.
Matthews was nowhere to be seen near right back at times.
Maatsen also pushing high and giving away the ball too often.
Oshilaja did well enough considering he has little defensive protection and Gunter was ok on the same basis.
Morgan got involved but generally made the wrong decisions.
JFC got involved but was poor all night.
Shinnie was ok, as was Pratley.
Schwarz was anonymous once again and Stockley was our best player by a country mile.
Watson is past it, he gave away a goal because he's too slow, although Matthews clearance to him was awful.
Millar did well after Bowyer decided it might be a good idea to change the formation (as he has to nearly every game).
Why the hell wasn't Millar starting?
If we go behind we generally lose.
If we go in front we generally win.
Why do we never start with our strongest 11 to try and take the lead?
If we're not going to defend as a team with bodies behind the ball blocking the runs and shots we haven't got a prayer and if Bowyer hasn't worked it out by now I don't think he will.
Perhaps Famewo and Inniss can come back and organise the defence without any managerial assistance but it's looking less and less likely.2 -
HandG said:AFKABartram said:Everyone else just feel massively deflated?My poor family must absolutely dread Tuesdays and Saturdays at the moment.
I know, I do.
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I think you can probably afford one, maybe two, part-timers in a squad. We have about half a dozen.CheshireAddick said:
Not being funny, but if we can't rely on Chucks to play regularly play 90 minutes then he should have gone too. It's ridiculous.Ormiston_Addick said:That was poor, really, really poor.
Looks to me like Bowyer has really got himself tied up in knots and there have just been way too many team and personnel changes - we look nothing like a team at all.
You really can't play a diamond midfield with the personnel we had out there tonight, it's never going to work.
Stockley is an old fashioned number 9, he needs service from wide areas and we never gave him that at all, if you play a narrow midfield you need at least one channel runner to get in behind and that's not his game.
The same goes for Schwartz too, he is not a Grant type running striker, he needs service from wide areas to make space in the middle and again we never gave that too him - how many times did we get midfield runners in behind?
The midfield was all over the place, nobody really seemed to know the structure and with a left footer in JFC on the right of the diamond and a right footer in Shinnie on the left we were just so narrow and the full backs didn't offer any width at all.
Defensively we were shocking. Matthews gave away the first and third goals with sloppy passes and Maatsen the second with a crazy foul in a dangerous area. Gunter looks like a right back playing centre half and Oshi tries his heart out but always has a mistake in him and the distribution of Amos is a major worry even when under no pressure.
To my mind Lee has to pick his best XI and stick with it we have no cohesion or combinations at all, we just look like we are making it up as we go along.
If Chuks can't play every game for the 90 then we need to stop pissing about and just bring him off the bench and go with the two that started tonight but with the proper set-up around them - we HAVE to stop the constant shuffling of the deck with personnel and formations.
For Saturday I really think we need to go back to basics with a 4-4-2 and play to our strengths.
Amos
Gunter - Oshilaja - Famewo - Maatsen
Jaiyesimi - Shinnie - JFC - Millar
Schwartz - Stockley
We need the two wide players getting up to support the front two and creating overloads that create chances for Schwartz - unless we get players around him then he is not going to score goals - you can take that to the bank.
All is not lost yet and the return of Famewo and Inniss is crucial because unless we tighten the back four then we are going nowhere, we are leaking goals for fun and you can't win games like that.0 -
The Old boys we have hold no affiliation with our club and crikey it is showing.
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When a team lacks confidence it is always harder to play football. You need to go back to basics, get the spine of the team right (that is why we needed a centre half on 1st January) and go a bit more direct. Then as confidence returns you open up a bit more.2
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Yeah, Albiemid_life_crisis said:Look, I haven't got time to go through all this, but could someone just tell me if a new scapegoat has been identified now JW, MM and Bogle are gone.0 -
How very dare you doubt the great gods Inniss an Famewo. They are only not able to play as they are saving the world from the Pandemic. I am sick to bloody death of hearing how it’s all going to be ok, when they return. Unless the can cover midfield and get 25 goals each, then that isn’t going to happen.golfaddick said:
This. They have only played together half a dozen times. They aren't Gomez & Van Dyke or Bould & Adams who have played a few seasons together.CAFCOlly said:Really, really not convinced as some that Famewo and Innis will transform our season once they're back. We've got big issues across the pitch.7 -
Like I said, I think it’s a multifaceted issue. I think the teams built on foundations made of sand, due to ownership shenanigans and the wage cap, we’ve crammed together a squad that the management team doesn’t really know how to get the best out of when matched with their own methodology.thenewbie said:
Okay. Fair point. So: why ARE so many experienced and competent players making so many mistakes? Because it's been happening for an extended period now.ElliotCAFC said:
Yes your right, I’m not saying it’s a simple problem and answer - it’s a multifaceted issue that’s compounded by what we’re watching on the pitch.CAFCOlly said:
Individual errors almost every game suggests a bigger problem. Bowyer might not be the one on the pitch making the mistakes but he needs to take responsibility, too.ElliotCAFC said:That was hard to watch. The most braindead set of players I’ve ever seen. So many individual errors that led to that loss.Without the stupid errors from defenders and midfield it would have been a fairly even game. Pompey were the better side no doubt about it, it’s just a shame we gifted them the victory.Predictably, people will hound Bowyer out like a mob, but it’s the players that are making the errors on the pitch.It’s just frustrating to see the fickleness from fans begging for Bowyer to be sacked. There’s no rational discourse about what’s causing the individual errors and subsequent poor form, it’s just blanket statements of “Bowyers an idiot” “he’s lost the dressing room” “if [insert unemployed manager name] was in charge we’d be smashing the league”.
We’re still more than capable of getting in the play-offs, and we’ll be much improved with DJ and Famewo starting on Saturday and there’s plenty of time to go on a long run of wins.We’d all be a lot happier if we just remained calm, wait to see how the season unfolds and then take reasonable action in the Summer.
Because at some point you have to at least ask what the manager is doing about it, if anything. Players who make mistakes get swapped out get replaced, by other players who also make mistakes. More importantly, players who actually play well ALSO get replaced.
You want to talk about rational discourse then fair play. But I don't think that questioning the manager is all that irrational given how long this has been happening.
I personally think the biggest issue is we lack an identity, if a rival fan asked me what sort of football we play I honestly wouldn’t have an answer. People will say that’s all Bowyers fault, but I believe this is a symptom of us having a mismatched squad. Of course Bowyer has to take some of the blame, as does Jackson - but to simply pin it all on one man is nonsensical. This is been somewhat addressed in January already, you can see Bowyer wants to play with wide players (we picked the diamond tonight because the diamond had beaten Pompey 4 times out of 4). Moving forward, I think we’ll stick with a flat 4-4-2 and keep it big man little man up top.You could get more granular into why certain partnerships aren’t working I.e two right backs next to each other and a right footer in the left side of defence - but to be honest I’m too tired tonight.No matter what happens, we’re going to need a major rebuild in the Summer, whether or not that rebuild includes a new manager is up to the board - who I fully back to make the right decision.Absolutely no problem criticising the manager, that’s a given in football and the day we can’t criticise the manager is the day I stop watching - but my problem is I don’t really see criticism, I see tribalism and people getting into camps.10 -
First off Portsmouth were better than us, they were revved up and the tenacity their midfield had won them the game, we had chances and on another day we go in at half time 2 1 up.
Stockley and Schwartz like all of our strikers were forced to eat out of the bin in terms of service.
Biggest problem is our insistence on giving away soft, stupid avoidable goals like a handicap. I cant stress enough how crucial having 2 proper centre halves is, we don't carry enough goals in us to win shootouts with teams like Keegans flawed but wonderful Newcastle side, we are a bit more attritional but so so easy to bully and outfox in the most important area of the pitch
It will take an amazing an herculean effort to string a run of results together now and rely on Inniss and Famewo staying fit but weirder things have happened.
Result was fair, Portsmouth the better team15 -
JFC not to start anymore for me. Whenever he gets the ball slows the game down and will look to play a 30 yard wonder ball.....sideways. Takes all the free kicks when a right footed player should be taking from left side of field. Can't shoot for shit either. Should have come off instead of Albie who had our only 2 shots of first half.4
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What has been wrong with Innis?0
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We are jank0
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DeludedGravesend_Addick said:Bowyer was still talking about top 2 in his post match interview.
Fucking hell!!!!!!!!0 - Sponsored links:
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He is yet another injury prone player we brought in when we had no money. We should have bought somebody in on Jan 1 when we had the chance. Schwarz who came in then, is never going to score enough goals to make up for our truly terrible defence.robroy said:What has been wrong with Innis?1 -
CheshireAddick said:
Not being funny, but if we can't rely on Chucks to play regularly play 90 minutes then he should have gone too. It's ridiculous.Ormiston_Addick said:That was poor, really, really poor.
Looks to me like Bowyer has really got himself tied up in knots and there have just been way too many team and personnel changes - we look nothing like a team at all.
You really can't play a diamond midfield with the personnel we had out there tonight, it's never going to work.
Stockley is an old fashioned number 9, he needs service from wide areas and we never gave him that at all, if you play a narrow midfield you need at least one channel runner to get in behind and that's not his game.
The same goes for Schwartz too, he is not a Grant type running striker, he needs service from wide areas to make space in the middle and again we never gave that too him - how many times did we get midfield runners in behind?
The midfield was all over the place, nobody really seemed to know the structure and with a left footer in JFC on the right of the diamond and a right footer in Shinnie on the left we were just so narrow and the full backs didn't offer any width at all.
Defensively we were shocking. Matthews gave away the first and third goals with sloppy passes and Maatsen the second with a crazy foul in a dangerous area. Gunter looks like a right back playing centre half and Oshi tries his heart out but always has a mistake in him and the distribution of Amos is a major worry even when under no pressure.
To my mind Lee has to pick his best XI and stick with it we have no cohesion or combinations at all, we just look like we are making it up as we go along.
If Chuks can't play every game for the 90 then we need to stop pissing about and just bring him off the bench and go with the two that started tonight but with the proper set-up around them - we HAVE to stop the constant shuffling of the deck with personnel and formations.
For Saturday I really think we need to go back to basics with a 4-4-2 and play to our strengths.
Amos
Gunter - Oshilaja - Famewo - Maatsen
Jaiyesimi - Shinnie - JFC - Millar
Schwartz - Stockley
We need the two wide players getting up to support the front two and creating overloads that create chances for Schwartz - unless we get players around him then he is not going to score goals - you can take that to the bank.
All is not lost yet and the return of Famewo and Inniss is crucial because unless we tighten the back four then we are going nowhere, we are leaking goals for fun and you can't win games like that.
I like Chuks but we cannot keep up this habit of switching out strikers every game to accommodate him and - yes - I know he is our top goal scorer.
We need to build proper combinations and let a front two find their feet, it's hardly an accident that our most recent promotion winning teams have all had a regular front-two that started every game when fit...or until we sold one of them!
97/98 - Bright & Mendonca
99/00 - Mendonca & Hunt
11/12 - BWP & Kermorgant
18/19 - Taylor & Grant
This constant switching means that we can't establish a regular pattern of play at all.3 -
Several things show that there needs change. Sounds obvious but with LB in charge progress is actually regress.
Wont apologize but a Morgan fan and his treatment by LB has been diabolical. Getting hooked at half time when he had the only two shots in the first half. Shuts down and the best passer in the team.
Maartson 2 wayward passes in first half putting us in trouble.
Matthews cant cross a ball let alone defend.
Pratley all over the place.
JFC not his finest
Shinnie one game wonder and completely anonymous tonight and exactly the same against MK Don's.
Oshilaja not commanding.
Tactics poor and whilst some goals are preventable confidence is lost by some fans it must be by some players also.
Time for change.0 -
I think we switched because it wasn't working. If Bogle was on the bench rather than Chuks he would have come on!0
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I agree with this. My reading of Thomas Sandgaard is that he will remove Lee Bowyer if needed. There are a lot of factors in that judgement, though, timing and successor availability being among them.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Rich, successful business men often have a nice exterior. But they haven't made all their money by being nice. When push comes to shove, and they see their money going down the drain, they have a ruthless streak running right through them.Dave Rudd said:
Bring on the pitchforks, Leuth.Leuth said:Okay okay I said I was sorry, jesus! Talking myself into the path of the pitchforks here lol
Your point (if I may be so presumptuous) is that Bowyer lacks intelligence. And the days of unintelligent football managers are over.
Sandgaard will give him until the Summer. Sandgaard is too nice.
I'm hoping that Ged Roddy is a competitive, winning bastard because I'm finding it difficult to warm to this inept team and its limited manager ... and I want my Club to be successful.
I've seen it many times and I suspect TS is no different.
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Us being all cocky about taking Swindon's best 2 players. Guess what happened today...we lost and they won.8
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We are lightyears behind the Wembley winning squad.6
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Sounds like something I would say.......its telepathic 😄jimmymelrose said:Curbishley praises Stockley's performance but then bemoans that Schwartz is feeding off of knock downs when he needs through balls. This is why I don't like the tactic of a target man laying it off for other players as a constant tactic. I didn't like it with Leaburn and I don't think I've ever liked it. If this is how we plan to play then I will probably stop watching when the weather improves.
Bowyer said that they are good at what they do but failed to add that we are bad at what we do.
I don't believe that this transfer window will have helped us. The new players are not what we needed. We are laughable in defence and even if the other two get back fit, there's no guarantee that they will stay fit.
I know it sounds like I'm over-reacting to a defeat but we can't keep saying 'get over it, there's another game on Saturday.' This match was the real test and we failed it.1
