I thought during the first half, when there was a break in play for injury, all the players came over for a drink and Adkins was speaking to them individually (as were the backroom team) and it was as plain as anything, that to-a-man, they were ALL blaming someone else. What was clear was that they were not a unit and Adkins eluded to this in his post match critique. It was 11 individuals being slaughtered by a coherent unit of Cheltenham players who all knew their job and how it fitted in with the next.
Whilst watching the build up for their second I started to count the passes from the halfway line. As the ball hit the back of the net it was 8 I think and remarked to my dad, how easy it looked. I said at that point I'd swap our 11 for theirs in a heartbeat. The big problem right now, we are easy to beat and the whole league knows it.
Get Stockley off he’s hopeless, we’ll play better without him in the side
Someone has lolled this, but the second point is spot on. A few of us said we didn't want to sign him again, as the brand of football with him up top is so painful to watch.
The same applies last season with Aneke. There were times when we played better without him available or on the pitch, as the players on the pitch couldn't just lump it up to him and hide themselves. Stockley isn't the problem, but he isn't the answer either. He drags defences along with him, but should be seen as a distraction more that the only target, so that other players can find room, as Leko did excellently.
We have has a bad start for sure but we have a whole new team which didnt even hve pre season to gell just look at some other big teams sheff wed ipswich pompey not exactly playing great or winning all the time
watched ipswich highlights and there fans booed louder than we even have at the end of the game yesterday after losing 5-2
i think this season we should all judge after 12/15 games and give the players and management abit more time to work if its still liek this i agree something will need to change
Wasn’t at the game yesterday thankfully, but have seen a few comments about Stockley’s role as a captain.
Whatever anyone says about his supposed limitations, he is the sort of player who will typically battle hard against any side.
For those saying he shouldn’t be our captain, can you name someone out of this mediocre, tame lot who would be more suitable?
I’ll wait.
Sadly there isn't a single leader on the pitch in a Charlton shirt. Stockley may battle (though he didn't yesterday), but he's not a leader in the true sense of the word.
Look at the personalities of our previous captains, then look at Stockley's. Miles apart.
I don’t even think the having a leader is an issue, the team just need to do as asked by the manager.
West Ham away 3-1 loss Manchester United home 0-3 loss Bolton Wanderers home 2-0 win Chelsea away 2-1 loss Portsmouth home 0-1 loss Aston Villa away 2-0 loss
League One 2021/22
Sheffield Wednesday home 0-0 draw Oxford United away 2-1 loss MK Dons away 2-1 loss Wigan Athletic home 0-2 loss Crewe Alexandra home 2-0 win Cheltenham Town home 1-2 loss Dog & Duck 2nd Xl away 2-0 loss
When that second goal went in I turned around to see TS shaking his head in disbelief, he was not happy.
I’ve not been to The Valley since jan last year, I traveled down from Yorkshire to watch it. It was horrendous at times with the crowd shouting out all sorts (I sit near the home dugout).
Nothing has changed. We are shite, onto the next one.
My next one is fleetwood away, my neighbour knows their captain and he has been kind enough to sort us a box out and a meal, players lounge after. Should he interesting as I will get to see the players after.
I saw a couple of comments a few pages back about missing Pratley. I agree in the respect that he had leadership qualities we miss, but he would’ve looked equally inept in that team yesterday.
Watson/Pratley in terms of ability, very little to choose from. Pratley gave more in terms of effort during his career with us and will be fondly remembered for the promotion season, but I think we’re in a bad place if we’re still saying we miss him. He’s gone to Orient in League 2
Adkins will have to switch to 442 and hope that Arter can play the defensive midfield role in a 4, because neither Watson nor Dobson look as if they can effectively. Lee has to play behind the front 2 and we need one of the wingers at least to be able to defend dropped Tall order.
Fixed that for you, think DJ should be on the bench with Washington out wide, not that I think he's a great winger but he will get more involved & put in the work rate to track back. You just can't play with two out & out wingers & one striker up front & a weak midfield. Recruitment has been poor, how the fuck do we not attempt to replace a 15 goal striker to give us an alternative up front. Ok maybe we did attempt to replace Chuks (I don't know) but how do we end up with no one ? Stockley won't be able to play every game given the effort he puts in, what happens then ? Ah yes Davidson
Finding myself not disagreeing with a lot of these comments, bringing players together late on and expecting them to click instantly has probably already meant top 2 has already gone, we can put a run together but we need to start picking up wins quickly to keep up with the rest, if we have aspirations of playoffs this season.
Adkins has options with the signings and with Gilbeys and Forster Caskeys eventual return will have two more. The two wide players DJ and Kirk don't seem to have an idea as to what their role is when we haven't got the ball and are not finding space when we do have it. The midfield has been poor for six games and there has been a change of personel in there, for me both of these items mean the system doesn't suit the players or they don't understand it. Adkins will need to prove he is tactically aware now and get his message over to the players and get results.
For me over the last few years, we have played our best football when we play 3-5-2 we now have the players that can play that formation. And I would get Pearce in the team, we look like we are lacking leadership at the back.
Can we please not start talking about Curbs, Powell or any other of our old favourites.
I really believe this is a failing of our club and the fanbase. We are so stuck and tied to our past successes that we can’t move forward. Hence everyone now wants 442 because it used to work..
Look at the signings we’re all delighted at Henderson, Arter, Leko & even Lee because of their links to the good old days! Regardless of whether they are any good / suited to us.
This club and fanbase needs to move with the times and appreciate football has moved on massively. Like the club Adkins is still stuck thinking it’s 2011.
That’s why clubs like Cheltenham & MK are playing us off the pitch because they are embracing modern progressive football.
433 seems to work for Liverpool and 4222 for Chelsea, 4231 for Utd - it’s the coaches and players not the formation
Whatever happens next I think we need to completely rip things up decide on a playing philosophy for the future and find a modern progressive coach to implement it for the long term. Ryan Lowe, David Artell, Russell Martin, Matt Taylor, Mark Robinson … or maybe that man is JJ or Jase.
Adkins is not the man for the job and I was always confident of this. I think the issue we will face is Sandgaard’s ego or size of wallet won’t allow him to be decisive. I’d bet NA will still be here after Christmas much like Bow was kept too long. Another season wasted, but hopefully we stay up!
For me over the last few years, we have played our best football when we play 3-5-2 we now have the players that can play that formation. And I would get Pearce in the team, we look like we are lacking leadership at the back.
We don’t have the wing backs for it. We’d end up with full backs who can’t offer the width and pace going forward or wingers who can’t defend (remember Smyth last season?). Or someone trying to do a job there like Clare.
Unhappy players mainly because of the money some new players have come in on. Also, no promotion bonus offered by TS despite negotiations. Doesn’t help.
If this isn’t a fact, with actual evidence of the statement, then it’s unnecessary and a wind up post. Why has there always got to be some conspiracy when we are playing bad. The next thing will be Adkins really isn’t a positive fella and nobody likes him. The players moaning about new players wages have no right because they were less than impressive last season. Get over it and prove they are worth more money and bonuses. however Charlton do like to be record breakers, the shortest amount of time to down tools into a season maybe? 🤣🙄
I don’t do wind up posts. I can also report that Schwarz has upset all by coming back from preseason with twice the maximum body fat allowed .The player with the huge wage is Arter who was on an unbelievable 40k at Forest. I have also heard Famweno cannot be dropped if fit. I’m hearing that the coaching staff feel a fully fit Arter and Schwarz would be massive in this league. We will see I suppose.
Unhappy players mainly because of the money some new players have come in on. Also, no promotion bonus offered by TS despite negotiations. Doesn’t help.
If this isn’t a fact, with actual evidence of the statement, then it’s unnecessary and a wind up post. Why has there always got to be some conspiracy when we are playing bad. The next thing will be Adkins really isn’t a positive fella and nobody likes him. The players moaning about new players wages have no right because they were less than impressive last season. Get over it and prove they are worth more money and bonuses. however Charlton do like to be record breakers, the shortest amount of time to down tools into a season maybe? 🤣🙄
I don’t do wind up posts. I can also report that Schwarz has upset all by coming back from preseason with twice the maximum body fat allowed .The player with the huge wage is Arter who was on an unbelievable 40k at Forest. I have also heard Famweno cannot be dropped if fit. I’m hearing that the coaching staff feel a fully fit Arter and Schwarz would be massive in this league. We will see I suppose.
Unhappy players mainly because of the money some new players have come in on. Also, no promotion bonus offered by TS despite negotiations. Doesn’t help.
If this isn’t a fact, with actual evidence of the statement, then it’s unnecessary and a wind up post. Why has there always got to be some conspiracy when we are playing bad. The next thing will be Adkins really isn’t a positive fella and nobody likes him. The players moaning about new players wages have no right because they were less than impressive last season. Get over it and prove they are worth more money and bonuses. however Charlton do like to be record breakers, the shortest amount of time to down tools into a season maybe? 🤣🙄
I don’t do wind up posts. I can also report that Schwarz has upset all by coming back from preseason with twice the maximum body fat allowed .The player with the huge wage is Arter who was on an unbelievable 40k at Forest. I have also heard Famweno cannot be dropped if fit. I’m hearing that the coaching staff feel a fully fit Arter and Schwarz would be massive in this league. We will see I suppose.
Wasn’t being personal @masicat, just a bit frustrated by the way things have started, then seeing posts like yours makes me wonder wtf!!!. If these sorts of things are already an issue this early on it doesn’t bode well.🤷🏻♂️👍
Curbishley said you have to manage what you've got. Not dream about other players. Not imposing a system but using the strengths you have. I'm sorry but 1-2 at home to Cheltenham is appalling.
Cheltenham were decent in all areas. They’re used to winning, are all quite comfortable on the ball, and work for each other. Their history is irrelevant. But I still know what you mean.
However, I’d probably swap starting elevens if we could. Which is crazy on paper.
Curbishley/Jackson anybody?
Would prefer to swap the managers than the players.
Don't actually know who their manager was but he seemed to know what he was doing!
For me over the last few years, we have played our best football when we play 3-5-2 we now have the players that can play that formation. And I would get Pearce in the team, we look like we are lacking leadership at the back.
We don’t have the wing backs for it. We’d end up with full backs who can’t offer the width and pace going forward or wingers who can’t defend (remember Smyth last season?). Or someone trying to do a job there like Clare.
I disagree, Matthew’s was outstanding when he played wing back previously. Souare is more of a wing back than a full back.
For me over the last few years, we have played our best football when we play 3-5-2 we now have the players that can play that formation. And I would get Pearce in the team, we look like we are lacking leadership at the back.
We don’t have the wing backs for it. We’d end up with full backs who can’t offer the width and pace going forward or wingers who can’t defend (remember Smyth last season?). Or someone trying to do a job there like Clare.
I disagree, Matthew’s was outstanding when he played wing back previously. Souare is more of a wing back than a full back.
Which is probably what is needed if we continue to play the way we are.
Unhappy players mainly because of the money some new players have come in on. Also, no promotion bonus offered by TS despite negotiations. Doesn’t help.
If this isn’t a fact, with actual evidence of the statement, then it’s unnecessary and a wind up post. Why has there always got to be some conspiracy when we are playing bad. The next thing will be Adkins really isn’t a positive fella and nobody likes him. The players moaning about new players wages have no right because they were less than impressive last season. Get over it and prove they are worth more money and bonuses. however Charlton do like to be record breakers, the shortest amount of time to down tools into a season maybe? 🤣🙄
I don’t do wind up posts. I can also report that Schwarz has upset all by coming back from preseason with twice the maximum body fat allowed .The player with the huge wage is Arter who was on an unbelievable 40k at Forest. I have also heard Famweno cannot be dropped if fit. I’m hearing that the coaching staff feel a fully fit Arter and Schwarz would be massive in this league. We will see I suppose.
Wasn’t being personal @masicat, just a bit frustrated by the way things have started, then seeing posts like yours makes me wonder wtf!!!. If these sorts of things are already an issue this early on it doesn’t bode well.🤷🏻♂️👍
No probs. I won’t post on these sort of subjects if I don’t know or trust the source.
Unhappy players mainly because of the money some new players have come in on. Also, no promotion bonus offered by TS despite negotiations. Doesn’t help.
If this isn’t a fact, with actual evidence of the statement, then it’s unnecessary and a wind up post. Why has there always got to be some conspiracy when we are playing bad. The next thing will be Adkins really isn’t a positive fella and nobody likes him. The players moaning about new players wages have no right because they were less than impressive last season. Get over it and prove they are worth more money and bonuses. however Charlton do like to be record breakers, the shortest amount of time to down tools into a season maybe? 🤣🙄
I don’t do wind up posts. I can also report that Schwarz has upset all by coming back from preseason with twice the maximum body fat allowed .The player with the huge wage is Arter who was on an unbelievable 40k at Forest. I have also heard Famweno cannot be dropped if fit. I’m hearing that the coaching staff feel a fully fit Arter and Schwarz would be massive in this league. We will see I suppose.
If that's the case, and i have no reason to disbelieve @masicat, then what are the coaching and medical staff doing to get them fully fit? I'm a fan of Arter, always have been since he was a youth, and I agree he could be our star man in midfield. Don't know anything really about Ronnie, but it's time we got him sorted and into the side or at least providing competition for the strikers.
Thank God for Emma Raducanu, for without her glorious distraction I'd be forced to dwell solely on that abject humiliation we had to witness at the Valley yesterday. F*ck me sideways, the amount of space and time the Cheltenham players were finding, even in our box, I was starting to think they had Dr. Who in their side. The fluid, effortless way they ran rings around us in the first half, it was as though we were playing Man City. It was all so, so easy for them. Contrast that with our pedestrian, predictable build up play and fearful resorting to hoofball to a hapless and frustrated Stockley who was sometimes double or triple marked. Christ, it's starting to look a lot more serious than "a bad day at the office". He obviously put a rocket up their arse at half-time but after our initial storm Cheltenham found a way to see out the game. I get it that they carry the momentum and confidence of promotion, and are well drilled in their system and each player knows their job. Would any of them get into our side, probably not but they are a team whereas we looked a very dishevelled rabble. I am still no nearer knowing what Nigel expects from his team. Seriously, what is the plan? Can somebody with more tactical insight explain it to my feeble brain. We made out Stockley to be our marquee signing and as others have said above, given him the captaincy makes him appear Mr. Undroppable. And yet he is such a limited player and worse than that he is so limiting to the teams options. What is the point of DJ and Kirk? Don't misunderstand me, I think they both have talent, but what is Nigel expecting from them? Somebody above described them as wingers. Now, I know I am an old fogey, but that is hilarious. I wish they were wingers - players that with a drop of the shoulder, a shimmy, or a trick could beat their man (on the outside) get towards the byeline and deliver quality into the box (you know, like in the old days when a nippy forward would make a near post run or a swashbuckling centre forward would bulldoze his way through and bury a chance. They are not wingers are they? I haven't seen Kirk beat a man once and DJ is a "blind alley" specialist. Are they even wide midfielders? They look like wide forwards. Ergo, how are they supposed to compliment Stockley? I'll say it again, what is the plan? Please somebody explain it to me in simple terms. I had assumed Lee had been brought in to be the link man, tie-ing together midfield and forwards and chipping in with a few goals. Maybe he is, but he cut a frustrated and forlorn figure yesterday. Our defence looks anything but solid. God, I am down in the dumps. It is way to early to be calling for Nigel's head, but I do share the anger and frustration and maybe in that sense the new regime is paying for the price of the neglect and mismanagement of their predecessors. That's unfair, but I am as guilty as anybody of expecting instant success and taking at face value Tommy's proud boasts upon takeover. But this is dogshit and I just want it to be over.
Comments
Whilst watching the build up for their second I started to count the passes from the halfway line. As the ball hit the back of the net it was 8 I think and remarked to my dad, how easy it looked. I said at that point I'd swap our 11 for theirs in a heartbeat. The big problem right now, we are easy to beat and the whole league knows it.
i think this season we should all judge after 12/15 games and give the players and management abit more time to work if its still liek this i agree something will need to change
Adkins will need to prove he is tactically aware now and get his message over to the players and get results.
I really believe this is a failing of our club and the fanbase. We are so stuck and tied to our past successes that we can’t move forward. Hence everyone now wants 442 because it used to work..
This club and fanbase needs to move with the times and appreciate football has moved on massively. Like the club Adkins is still stuck thinking it’s 2011.
That’s why clubs like Cheltenham & MK are playing us off the pitch because they are embracing modern progressive football.
433 seems to work for Liverpool and 4222 for Chelsea, 4231 for Utd - it’s the coaches and players not the formation
Whatever happens next I think we need to completely rip things up decide on a playing philosophy for the future and find a modern progressive coach to implement it for the long term. Ryan Lowe, David Artell, Russell Martin, Matt Taylor, Mark Robinson … or maybe that man is JJ or Jase.
Adkins is not the man for the job and I was always confident of this. I think the issue we will face is Sandgaard’s ego or size of wallet won’t allow him to be decisive. I’d bet NA will still be here after Christmas much like Bow was kept too long. Another season wasted, but hopefully we stay up!
Don't actually know who their manager was but he seemed to know what he was doing!
F*ck me sideways, the amount of space and time the Cheltenham players were finding, even in our box, I was starting to think they had Dr. Who in their side.
The fluid, effortless way they ran rings around us in the first half, it was as though we were playing Man City.
It was all so, so easy for them.
Contrast that with our pedestrian, predictable build up play and fearful resorting to hoofball to a hapless and frustrated Stockley who was sometimes double or triple marked.
Christ, it's starting to look a lot more serious than "a bad day at the office".
He obviously put a rocket up their arse at half-time but after our initial storm Cheltenham found a way to see out the game.
I get it that they carry the momentum and confidence of promotion, and are well drilled in their system and each player knows their job.
Would any of them get into our side, probably not but they are a team whereas we looked a very dishevelled rabble.
I am still no nearer knowing what Nigel expects from his team. Seriously, what is the plan?
Can somebody with more tactical insight explain it to my feeble brain.
We made out Stockley to be our marquee signing and as others have said above, given him the captaincy makes him appear Mr. Undroppable.
And yet he is such a limited player and worse than that he is so limiting to the teams options.
What is the point of DJ and Kirk?
Don't misunderstand me, I think they both have talent, but what is Nigel expecting from them?
Somebody above described them as wingers.
Now, I know I am an old fogey, but that is hilarious.
I wish they were wingers - players that with a drop of the shoulder, a shimmy, or a trick could beat their man (on the outside) get towards the byeline and deliver quality into the box (you know, like in the old days when a nippy forward would make a near post run or a swashbuckling centre forward would bulldoze his way through and bury a chance.
They are not wingers are they?
I haven't seen Kirk beat a man once and DJ is a "blind alley" specialist.
Are they even wide midfielders? They look like wide forwards.
Ergo, how are they supposed to compliment Stockley?
I'll say it again, what is the plan? Please somebody explain it to me in simple terms.
I had assumed Lee had been brought in to be the link man, tie-ing together midfield and forwards and chipping in with a few goals.
Maybe he is, but he cut a frustrated and forlorn figure yesterday.
Our defence looks anything but solid.
God, I am down in the dumps.
It is way to early to be calling for Nigel's head, but I do share the anger and frustration and maybe in that sense the new regime is paying for the price of the neglect and mismanagement of their predecessors.
That's unfair, but I am as guilty as anybody of expecting instant success and taking at face value Tommy's proud boasts upon takeover.
But this is dogshit and I just want it to be over.