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Thames Water bill query/help please

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  • golfaddick
    golfaddick Posts: 33,628
    LoOkOuT said:
    clive said:

    That’s Greenwich Council’s new tourism experience, Charlton Falls. Hoping to host events like weddings and bar mitzfas in the area, drawing in people from all around the world interested in this unique natural wonder. 
    Ready made ice rink when it freezes tonight.
  • charltonbob
    charltonbob Posts: 8,255


    Raith_C_Chattonell said:

    "Golden Hello" she deserves a golden shower
  • meldrew66
    meldrew66 Posts: 2,561
    WSS said:
    I must be getting (worringly) severely undercharged. I only pay £17pm for a a 4-bed semi with them. Been the case since I moved here Oct ‘21 and am on a meter.

    Got a new bill in Feb and was £56 .
  • meldrew66
    meldrew66 Posts: 2,561
    edited March 2023
    meldrew66 said:
    WSS said:
    I must be getting (worringly) severely undercharged. I only pay £17pm for a a 4-bed semi with them. Been the case since I moved here Oct ‘21 and am on a meter.

    Got a new bill in Feb and was £56 .
    …were your bills estimated until now then? Does that explain the low charges and the new, increased charge? What does the bill say? There must be a rationale behind your metered payments to date and the recent increase. Surely?
    These posts make me even less reassured about moving to a meter. Turns out bloody Thames Water may:
    (a) still estimate charges - despite the whole point of metered water being charging you based what you use
    (b) under-charge you and, potentially, leave you with a massive debt accrued that can be enforceable for years after
    (c) lead to a big bill if there are any unknown pipe leaks causing high water useage 

    When the TW guy came to assess the fitting of a meter 2 years ago, he explained that they would need to dig up my new brick paved drive. He almost laughed when I checked with him that they would put it back exactly how they found it. On that basis, I said to him that I wasn’t willing to have my drive ruined just to have a meter installed and he then told me that ‘well, that will have to go down as a refusal mate’ - despite him agreeing that he wouldn’t have it done either given how the drive would be ruined.

    After several threatening letter from TW last year about their legal rights to install meters and their ability to put me on an extortionate rate if, for ANY reason a meter can’t be fitted, I reluctantly agreed to another site inspection. This time, a young engineer turned up with a very positive attitude about the whole thing. When I told him about my reluctance to have my drive ruined, he said that he had heard that before and that it wasn’t true and, of course, the drive will be left as they found it. He even said that he thought he had a good idea who that last engineer probably was. 

    So, where I am now is awaiting a date for the drive to be ripped up, meter installed and drive restored. The engineer has sprayed the manhole cover a lovely shade of Chelsea blue so the fitting engineer does the correct job. I asked him not to spray any bricks in the process which he couldn’t quite manage but I’m told the paint ‘washes off’ so not to worry. We’ll see but, clearly, not exactly a convincing start as to the standard of work I might expect.

    As you can imagine, I don’t know who to trust here so I’ve told the engineer that they are not to do anything without me being present and that I will want reassurance from the engineer on site on the day to reconfirm that it will all be made good. Suppose the engineer is the first guy who, clearly, will be replacing some displaced bricks with a slab of concrete? No, no, no, no, no.

    I’ll let you know what happens albeit I understand the meter fitting may be weeks or even months away. In the meantime, I have this feeling of dread every time I pull up on the drive after work. 

    Can anyone else who has had a meter fitted on a brick/paved drive reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily?

  • meldrew66
    meldrew66 Posts: 2,561
    edited March 2023
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
  • valleynick66
    valleynick66 Posts: 4,890
    meldrew66 said:
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
    The meter is on the pavement not your property ordinarily.
  • Dansk_Red
    Dansk_Red Posts: 5,727
    Why can't the meter not be fitted internally? ie where the internal stop cock is.
  • valleynick66
    valleynick66 Posts: 4,890
    Dansk_Red said:
    Why can't the meter not be fitted internally? ie where the internal stop cock is.
    Because then it cant be read (by TW) without a home visit?
  • blackpool72
    blackpool72 Posts: 23,675
    Dansk_Red said:
    Why can't the meter not be fitted internally? ie where the internal stop cock is.
    I think this is because you are responsible for the water from when it leaves the mains.
    So therefore any leak from a pipe under your property is down to you to get repaired. 
    This is how it used to work as I had a large repair bill many years ago.
    This may or may not still be the case but it used to be. 
  • Rob7Lee
    Rob7Lee Posts: 9,595
    meldrew66 said:
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
    Where's the external stop cock? 
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  • clive
    clive Posts: 19,454
    edited March 2023
    Rob7Lee said:
    meldrew66 said:
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
    Where's the external stop cock? 
     Usually, next to water meter, under the lid on the pavement outside the gate/entrance to your front garden.
  • Dansk_Red
    Dansk_Red Posts: 5,727
    valleynick66 said:
    Dansk_Red said:
    Why can't the meter not be fitted internally? ie where the internal stop cock is.
    Because then it cant be read (by TW) without a home visit?

    But it would appear from comments on here they do not read them anyway. 
  • seth plum
    seth plum Posts: 53,448
    Rob said:
    seth plum said:
    valleynick66 said:
    seth plum said:
    A water meter charges you for use rather than guesswork.
    Much more reason to get a water meter than the endlessly pushed spy smart meters from the energy companies.
    Eh! It’s exactly the same thing. Pay for what you use only. 
    If you don’t have a water meter you don’t pay for what you use. Most times you pay much more based on Council tax or something.
    If you have a gas and electricity meter you can read the numbers, submit them, and only pay for what you use.
    Yes, but having a Smart Meter eliminates the need to manually read the numbers and submit them, and you only pay for what you use. 
    A smart meter requires you to clear the space under the stairs with a bad back so the dubious companies can install, then you have to clean up after them and put things back.
    Sod that.
  • clive
    clive Posts: 19,454
    Dansk_Red said:
    valleynick66 said:
    Dansk_Red said:
    Why can't the meter not be fitted internally? ie where the internal stop cock is.
    Because then it cant be read (by TW) without a home visit?

    But it would appear from comments on here they do not read them anyway. 
    My water meter was last read in October last year, it is normally read at least once a year by Thames Water.
  • Dansk_Red
    Dansk_Red Posts: 5,727
    clive said:
    Rob7Lee said:
    meldrew66 said:
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
    Where's the external stop cock? 
     Usually, next to water meter, under the lid on the pavement outside the gate/entrance to your front garden.

    Why don't they put the meter where the stop cock is in the pavement? that is what they do where I live. 
  • Rob7Lee
    Rob7Lee Posts: 9,595
    Dansk_Red said:
    clive said:
    Rob7Lee said:
    meldrew66 said:
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
    Where's the external stop cock? 
     Usually, next to water meter, under the lid on the pavement outside the gate/entrance to your front garden.

    Why don't they put the meter where the stop cock is in the pavement? that is what they do where I live. 
    That's why I asked where it is, not every property has them on the street, some are in the properties front garden and not every house has their own either. We have a run of about 25 houses in Dartford (built very early 1900's) and there's an external stop cock that shuts off blocks of 8 houses at a time so when meters were installed they are all in the front gardens which gives the added benefit of your own external stopcock.
  • clive
    clive Posts: 19,454
    Dansk_Red said:
    clive said:
    Rob7Lee said:
    meldrew66 said:
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
    Where's the external stop cock? 
     Usually, next to water meter, under the lid on the pavement outside the gate/entrance to your front garden.

    Why don't they put the meter where the stop cock is in the pavement? that is what they do where I live. 
    Sorry, that's what i meant to say.
  • valleynick66
    valleynick66 Posts: 4,890
    Dansk_Red said:
    valleynick66 said:
    Dansk_Red said:
    Why can't the meter not be fitted internally? ie where the internal stop cock is.
    Because then it cant be read (by TW) without a home visit?

    But it would appear from comments on here they do not read them anyway. 
    They do but not necessarily for every bill and you as a resident can still read it for yourself. 
  • charlton4ever
    charlton4ever Posts: 1,716
    edited March 2023
    My water meter sends readings by wifi and I have never had to read it
  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    edited March 2023
    My meter is on the pavement outside under a lid which you can open with a crow bar/screwdriver.
    If my water company needed to dig up my drive, I would get it in writing from them beforehand, that the drive will be put back in the same condition as before the work started and on the same day.
    No way would I take the word of some rep, as you will have zero come back when they don't do it.
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  • meldrew66
    meldrew66 Posts: 2,561
    valleynick66 said:
    meldrew66 said:
    Can anyone who has had a water meter fitted on a brick/paved driveway reassure me that I am worrying unnecessarily about them failing to leave the drive how they found it (see my previous post)? Any horror stories I should be aware of? Did they arrange a date with you for the fitting and do it in your presence? Any tips on how to deal with it on the day? I’m thinking that ‘before and after’ photos are a must.
    The meter is on the pavement not your property ordinarily.
    It’s on my drive/land 1 foot from the road pavement
  • meldrew66
    meldrew66 Posts: 2,561
    Covered End said:
    My meter is on the pavement outside under a lid which you can open with a crow bar/screwdriver.
    If my water company needed to dig up my drive, I would get it in writing from them beforehand, that the drive will be put back in the same condition as before the work started and on the same day.
    No way would I take the word of some rep, as you will have zero come back when they don't do it.
    Glad you share my view that anything other than perfect reparation is unacceptable.
  • meldrew66
    meldrew66 Posts: 2,561
    Here it is: 
  • Covered End
    Covered End Posts: 52,006
    I've no idea tbh, but looking at that I wouldn't have thought they would need to lift more than a few bricks and tbh I don't see why they can't fit it under the lid causing no damage.
    But like I say I'm guessing.
  • WishIdStayedinthePub
    WishIdStayedinthePub Posts: 648
    I resisted changing to a water meter for years, which reflects my general lack of trust in authority.

    But I wish I'd done it years ago as it would have saved me a fortune.  My bills came down from about 80 quid a month to 35.

    As for Sarah, I know her.  Very astute observation, @PragueAddick.  As a mutual friend said, "Not one for detail."  Remind you of anyone else?
  • valleynick66
    valleynick66 Posts: 4,890
    meldrew66 said:
    Here it is: 
    Dumb question as difficult to see from picture but are you sure a meter isn’t already there? The cover looks possibly plastic and larger than the old style purely stop cock metal covers. 

    My recollection is that our meters were installed when TW renewed the pipes everywhere in the area - blue plastic pipe threaded through the old / original pipe work.  We had a choice when to switchover to the meter. That’s my vague recollection. 
  • meldrew66
    meldrew66 Posts: 2,561
    valleynick66 said:
    meldrew66 said:
    Here it is: 
    Dumb question as difficult to see from picture but are you sure a meter isn’t already there? The cover looks possibly plastic and larger than the old style purely stop cock metal covers. 

    My recollection is that our meters were installed when TW renewed the pipes everywhere in the area - blue plastic pipe threaded through the old / original pipe work.  We had a choice when to switchover to the meter. That’s my vague recollection. 
    The stop cock is seized under the plastic cover and the hole needs to be made bigger, hence the need to displace the bricks and make a bigger hole before filling it in & repairing the damage.
  • valleynick66
    valleynick66 Posts: 4,890
    meldrew66 said:
    valleynick66 said:
    meldrew66 said:
    Here it is: 
    Dumb question as difficult to see from picture but are you sure a meter isn’t already there? The cover looks possibly plastic and larger than the old style purely stop cock metal covers. 

    My recollection is that our meters were installed when TW renewed the pipes everywhere in the area - blue plastic pipe threaded through the old / original pipe work.  We had a choice when to switchover to the meter. That’s my vague recollection. 
    The stop cock is seized under the plastic cover and the hole needs to be made bigger, hence the need to displace the bricks and make a bigger hole before filling it in & repairing the damage.
    So I guess you need that fixing regardless. Not great if the stopcock isn’t functioning should you have any plumbing issues. 

    Still not sure if that means you already have a meter there or not and are just the unfortunate victim of the stopcock being an issue?

    I guess it’s impossible for TW to give an absolute guarantee of the repair to your drive as will always be best endeavours. Before and after pictures will be a must I guess. 

    Hopefully they can attend to it with minimal damage. 
  • TeslaGirl
    TeslaGirl Posts: 184
    Back to original query... Thames Water do halve your bill if you're on a low income - google Thames Water Help and/or Thames Water Sure.  You just have to tell them you're eligible and they look at income only, not savings.
  • Raith_C_Chattonell
    Raith_C_Chattonell Posts: 5,680
    No help to the original problem I know, but Sarah Bentley and Thames Water featured on this morning's Big Green Money Show.  (40 minute listen).

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001jt68

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