Dog attacks

T_C_E

It’s interesting how many comments a post on “Dog attacks “ will get on this forum up against say, a post about one of my dogs meeting up again with a child who’s now training to become a teacher. 

It’s not a dig at this forum or it’s members but it’s a fact of life , my dogs helping children for 13 years is not news but if god forbid it ever went wrong the papers would be all over me🤷‍♂️

Wellred

T_C_E said:

It’s interesting how many comments a post on “Dog attacks “ will get on this forum up against say, a post about one of my dogs meeting up again with a child who’s now training to become a teacher. 

It’s not a dig at this forum or it’s members but it’s a fact of life , my dogs helping children for 13 years is not news but if god forbid it ever went wrong the papers would be all over me🤷‍♂️

Perhaps now you have let us know about it will get some response & there are loads of brilliant dogs about that help all sort of people get on in life but this was started as I thought there has been an increase in dog attacks since the pandemic
But well done for for training & using your dog to help others 

Chunes

T_C_E said:

It’s interesting how many comments a post on “Dog attacks “ will get on this forum up against say, a post about one of my dogs meeting up again with a child who’s now training to become a teacher. 

It’s not a dig at this forum or it’s members but it’s a fact of life , my dogs helping children for 13 years is not news but if god forbid it ever went wrong the papers would be all over me🤷‍♂️

It's true of any news, really. 

Redmidland

As many of you know Mrs RM and I breed German Shepherds, we actually have 6 at home. All of them are trained in different  disciplines, BUT, all of them have basic training as a minimum requirement before Mrs RM gives any further specialised training, I.e obedience, man work, scentwork, man trailing, agility.
We check anyone who buys a puppy from us before we even agree to let them view the litter.
Sadly, there are many poor breeders who are only in it for the money.
There are NO bad dogs.... just very bad breeders and completely incompetent, untrustworthy, ignorant owners!!
Angie, my Mrs, runs local dog training classes from puppy upwards including 'reactive dogs'. In every case, so far, it's been the owners not having any control over their dog, it's not only eye-opening, but also heartbreaking, as should the dog do something wrong in public, the dog will be PTS, through no fault of its own.
My advice would be, if you're going to buy a dog , any breed, ask yourself why? do you have the time to INVEST in the puppy, do you have the patience, and do you realise this is a life long commitment? If you answer NO to any of the above, DONT buy a dog!!
If any of you need any advice you can contact me, and I'm sure @TCE, will happily give advice as well.

Wellred

Redmidland said:

As many of you know Mrs RM and I breed German Shepherds, we actually have 6 at home. All of them are trained in different  disciplines, BUT, all of them have basic training as a minimum requirement before Mrs RM gives any further specialised training, I.e obedience, man work, scentwork, man trailing, agility.
We check anyone who buys a puppy from us before we even agree to let them view the litter.
Sadly, there are many poor breeders who are only in it for the money.
There are NO bad dogs.... just very bad breeders and completely incompetent, untrustworthy, ignorant owners!!
Angie, my Mrs, runs local dog training classes from puppy upwards including 'reactive dogs'. In every case, so far, it's been the owners not having any control over their dog, it's not only eye-opening, but also heartbreaking, as should the dog do something wrong in public, the dog will be PTS, through no fault of its own.
My advice would be, if you're going to buy a dog , any breed, ask yourself why? do you have the time to INVEST in the puppy, do you have the patience, and do you realise this is a life long commitment? If you answer NO to any of the above, DONT buy a dog!!
If any of you need any advice you can contact me, and I'm sure @TCE, will happily give advice as well.

Sounds like you have a good approach to breading if only all breeders had the same requirements out of control dogs would be a thing of the past
must be rewarding to see your dogs further down the line in good hands & behaving themselves as they should do

Redmidland

Wellred said:

Redmidland said:

As many of you know Mrs RM and I breed German Shepherds, we actually have 6 at home. All of them are trained in different  disciplines, BUT, all of them have basic training as a minimum requirement before Mrs RM gives any further specialised training, I.e obedience, man work, scentwork, man trailing, agility.
We check anyone who buys a puppy from us before we even agree to let them view the litter.
Sadly, there are many poor breeders who are only in it for the money.
There are NO bad dogs.... just very bad breeders and completely incompetent, untrustworthy, ignorant owners!!
Angie, my Mrs, runs local dog training classes from puppy upwards including 'reactive dogs'. In every case, so far, it's been the owners not having any control over their dog, it's not only eye-opening, but also heartbreaking, as should the dog do something wrong in public, the dog will be PTS, through no fault of its own.
My advice would be, if you're going to buy a dog , any breed, ask yourself why? do you have the time to INVEST in the puppy, do you have the patience, and do you realise this is a life long commitment? If you answer NO to any of the above, DONT buy a dog!!
If any of you need any advice you can contact me, and I'm sure @TCE, will happily give advice as well.

Sounds like you have a good approach to breading if only all breeders had the same requirements out of control dogs would be a thing of the past
must be rewarding to see your dogs further down the line in good hands & behaving themselves as they should do

Thank you, we do try our upmost best. If we don't think a person or family is suitable, we just say sorry but No!. We are often contacted about "do we have any puppies as we want a guard dog?". Those people get an immediate No!

Redmidland

Here is a couple of pictures of our pack and 1 of our male dog Zeek, who is trained in multiple disciplines including search and find!
The young puppy is not in these pics, but I'll post separately later on.

Wellred

Redmidland said:

Here is a couple of pictures of our pack and 1 of our male dog Zeek, who is trained in multiple disciplines including search and find!
The young puppy is not in these pics, but I'll post separately later on.

Look good always liked the bread make good working dogs as well as pets if I ever hear of anyone looking for one I know where to come 

KBslittlesis

That tongue! 😍😍😍😍😍
I believe no dogs should be off their leads in public & definitely not in the countryside.
We get owners here who have zero control over their dogs, it’s terrifying.
Some dogs get taught more socialisation when they board with us than they ever get at home 😞

Wheresmeticket

Hmm.  Our dog has sighthound and herding dogs in her DNA.  She has to be able to run off lead every day.  We have taught her recall and also socialised her so that she doesn't bother dogs or people that don't want to engage with her.  It would be abuse to restrict her to on-lead walking only.  We live in a country village and let her off the lead where it is safe to do so (ie in the woods, a couple of NT sites away from roads and habitation.

T_C_E

It’s a popular belief that socialisation for dogs is meeting up with other puppies and having a free for all. 

Socialising a dog starts with every day sights and sounds, a supermarket car park is a great place to start, cars, people, trollies all sorts of comings and goings. 

The first two weeks of a dogs life we keep them in doors WTAF, it’s possible to take a puppy without contact with the floor, I used a rucksack on back to front. 

I’ve no interest in my dogs meeting other dogs in the street, in fact it doesn’t happen. 

Just like I’ve no interest in going up to the man in the street and saying hi, why would I assume on my dogs behalf they want to meet another dog. 

I’d rather my dogs work safely around people of all ages and fifi-trixabelles owners assumes I’m a miserable bastard than put my dogs in the position where they have to correct a dogs poor manners because the owner hasn’t taught them any.
I used to say to students at training, if you see a dog approaching watch the handler, that will tell you all you need to know about the dog’s level of training, the wrapping of the lead three times around the hand says brute force is needed to control the dog. 

As always the dog pays the ultimate price because we can’t get the basics right. 

Huskaris

I'd say that due to COVID there has been a rise in irresponsible dog owners. Some of the people I see round where I live don't have a clue at all. 

Redmidland

Just a couple more pics of Zeek, this time he's trained to protect, on command.  Ang gives the command and he will react accordingly, however if you met him he's as soft as any dog, but it's all about training. This sadly is where bad owners go wrong!

Wellred

Baldybonce said:

Wellred said:

MuttleyCAFC said:

It has been touched on already but as a dog lover and owner I believe that the recall command must be perfected if you are to let your dog off the lead in any public space. It is no good telling somebody who is terrified of dogs that it is alright, your dog is friendly or indeed another dog owner whose dog may have been attacked in the past and be very nervous about other dogs that your dog only wants to play.

Some owners especially these young gang members actually enjoy watching their dog attacking other dogs & people so much so they train them to do so 
They use them as a weapon to intimidate & mug people it's tailed off a bit now but it still happens far to often no wonder these dogs are out of control 

useless trivia..

Tiny at millwall had his dog trained to attack at the command of 'Chelsea'.

Wasn't called Harry by any chance?

Wellred

Redmidland said:

Just a couple more pics of Zeek, this time he's trained to protect, on command.  Ang gives the command and he will react accordingly, however if you met him he's as soft as any dog, but it's all about training. This sadly is where bad owners go wrong!

Wouldn't won't to be on the wrong side of him 
Looks like he's well trained though 

Redmidland

Wellred said:

Redmidland said:

Just a couple more pics of Zeek, this time he's trained to protect, on command.  Ang gives the command and he will react accordingly, however if you met him he's as soft as any dog, but it's all about training. This sadly is where bad owners go wrong!

Wouldn't won't to be on the wrong side of him 
Looks like he's well trained though 

He is believe me, he will only act if given the correct command, other than that he's absolutely fine. The person in the picture is a dog handler in West Mids police and trained to be the 'baddie'!
It takes months to train this, but as I said before he is also trained in obedience, agility, scentwork and the show ring.
The reason for the pics and words on my recent posts is to show what ANY dog can be trained to do with the correct owners. @TCE dogs are just as well trained but in different disciplines.
Dog attacks happen due to arseholes, idiots and lazy bastards who don't give a shite! Makes my blood boil. Its the dogs that will pay the ultimate price!
Rant over!

Wellred

Redmidland said:

Wellred said:

Redmidland said:

Just a couple more pics of Zeek, this time he's trained to protect, on command.  Ang gives the command and he will react accordingly, however if you met him he's as soft as any dog, but it's all about training. This sadly is where bad owners go wrong!

Wouldn't won't to be on the wrong side of him 
Looks like he's well trained though 

He is believe me, he will only act if given the correct command, other than that he's absolutely fine. The person in the picture is a dog handler in West Mids police and trained to be the 'baddie'!
It takes months to train this, but as I said before he is also trained in obedience, agility, scentwork and the show ring.
The reason for the pics and words on my recent posts is to show what ANY dog can be trained to do with the correct owners. @TCE dogs are just as well trained but in different disciplines.
Dog attacks happen due to arseholes, idiots and lazy bastards who don't give a shite! Makes my blood boil. Its the dogs that will pay the ultimate price!
Rant over!

Definitely so many dogs in the wrong hands most end up in dog homes sadly that's why it's good to see it being done the right way 

lolwray

It would appear that the dogs responsible for the fatal attacks of recent are all XL bullies, pit bulls or derivations of bull breeds. These animals in anyone's control are potential killing machines they shouldn't be Kept as domestic pets full stop.i was in a pub the other day ( in rural Hampshire as it happens) and a bloke walked or rather was dragged in by an Xl bully he might as well have had a tiger on a lead. 

To a degree it's training and the owner but frankly there is no good reason to own one of the above..no one ever got mauled to death by a springer spaniel 

Off_it

T_C_E said:

It’s interesting how many comments a post on “Dog attacks “ will get on this forum up against say, a post about one of my dogs meeting up again with a child who’s now training to become a teacher. 

It’s not a dig at this forum or it’s members but it’s a fact of life , my dogs helping children for 13 years is not news but if god forbid it ever went wrong the papers would be all over me🤷‍♂️

I get you, but that's just life isn't it?

I mean, which headline is going to stand out;

- man goes to work at same place for 25 years and does a decent job; or

- man goes to work at same place for 25 years and then decides to decapitate 10 colleagues.

Extreme example, granted, but it's just how we are all wired up. The unusual makes news, and serious dog attacks are still newsworthy because if you look at the number of dogs and the number of attacks it's still relatively rare.

But in all honesty, some people are scum and they bring up shitty dogs and shitty kids.

Carter

XL pitbulls are not a pet, they belong in zoos even, these breeds are never owned by the @Redmidland and @TCE of this world, they are the same as someone with a small floppy dick owning a sports car, it is to compensate for a lack of something. German Shepherds are delightful dogs, I've always loved that breed but, but they are incredibly intelligent dogs and need stimulation which is how people can train them so well, they want to learn and do stuff. 

Staffordshire bull terriers are another breed I love but they are so often bought home by dickheads who have no space for them, say things like "the kids climb all over him and he isn't bothered" invariably because of the lack of training the walks stop as the dog has no concept of boundaries or respect for other animals and people and plays up, gets aggressive, won't return on call, chases, jumps up and if one of those things bites you, you won't be removing it in a hurry. 

Back to XL bullies, idiots get them with the intention of breeding them to sell to other idiots and then keep their compensatory animal in a 2 bed flat, the landlord finds out or someone grasses and the animal is put in a rescue, rescues used to be absolutely chock-full of staffs and id be amazed if the same isn't true of XL bullies now. Weird bit of trivia, Daschounds are on the dangerous dog list, purely due to how much the yappy little pricks bite anyone and everything 

sam3110

Should I be putting my "yappy little pricks" down then @Carter ?

Huskaris

Typically 3 people a year die from dog attacks, in 2022 it was 10, and so far this year, 4, so it is definitely "on the rise" rather than just a news picking it up thing which I didn't realise before. American Bully XL dogs have killed 9 people since 2021.

I have a huge amount of respect for the fantastic dog owners/trainers on here and the amazing work they do, but it sounds a bit like some of the gun nuts in the USA saying that guns don't kill people, people do, which is true, but is also somewhat (potentially deliberately) missing the point. 

The key similarity being that both attitudes seem to end up with an unacceptably large amount of dead people, especially children. Maybe the answer is more big dogs instead? Maybe we need more good people with big dogs?

American Bullies should be banned, and if you don't agree with that, you're beyond help. Outside of that, there needs to be tighter regulation. I worked hard on this about 14 years ago in City Hall, recommending a Canadian system, and it was going very well, until the then London Mayor got doorstepped by a reporter and ended up putting an end to it, which was a poor decision. 

Carter

sam3110 said:

Should I be putting my "yappy little pricks" down then @Carter ?

When or where did I say they should be put down? Its just that, an interesting, weird bit of information that those small yappy animals are on the dangerous list 

Rob7Lee

The lady killed in Surrey in January, by all accounts an experienced handler, was killed by an XL Bully, a dog she owned.

A review of the dangerous dogs act is long overdue, it’s now over 30 years since it was introduced.

AllHailTheHen

There was an XL Bully in Danson Park on Saturday. Gorgeous animal and very friendly albeit my little dog, who was about 1/20th, of his size was giving him a wide berth. As sweet natured as he was you're still a bit on edge around them. If a dog of that size and power decided to turn I'm not sure how you'd stop it

Ironically the only dog to have bitten mine was a daschund. Completely unprovoked too. 

Wellred

AllHailTheHen said:

There was an XL Bully in Danson Park on Saturday. Gorgeous animal and very friendly albeit my little dog, who was about 1/20th, of his size was giving him a wide berth. As sweet natured as he was you're still a bit on edge around them. If a dog of that size and power decided to turn I'm not sure how you'd stop it

Ironically the only dog to have bitten mine was a daschund. Completely unprovoked too. 

That is the difference your dog survived a attack from a dachshund not so sure it would from XL Bully there was another lady killed last week from one a family pet so the dog was use to her 

T_C_E

I won't comment on these attacks, I wasn't there so I have no idea of the circumstances. 
But to give you a clue of how irresponsible people can be, a visiting member of a well known dogs charity attempted to step between two children sitting reading to rag my dog with a stuffed toy dog. *Ragging is when a dog plays tug and then violently shakes its head with the said object* 
Now this is not only and irresponsible but ******* dangerous, yet a visitor to the school thought this would be acceptable, fortunately our dogs have more experience than the idiot concerned and ignored him. I didn't and he certainly was told!
Not the original children, but why would you try to play with a 45kg working dog with children in this close vicinity?
There is no cure for stupid!

McBobbin

Carter said:

XL pitbulls are not a pet, they belong in zoos even, these breeds are never owned by the @Redmidland and @TCE of this world, they are the same as someone with a small floppy dick owning a sports car, it is to compensate for a lack of something. German Shepherds are delightful dogs, I've always loved that breed but, but they are incredibly intelligent dogs and need stimulation which is how people can train them so well, they want to learn and do stuff. 

Staffordshire bull terriers are another breed I love but they are so often bought home by dickheads who have no space for them, say things like "the kids climb all over him and he isn't bothered" invariably because of the lack of training the walks stop as the dog has no concept of boundaries or respect for other animals and people and plays up, gets aggressive, won't return on call, chases, jumps up and if one of those things bites you, you won't be removing it in a hurry. 

Back to XL bullies, idiots get them with the intention of breeding them to sell to other idiots and then keep their compensatory animal in a 2 bed flat, the landlord finds out or someone grasses and the animal is put in a rescue, rescues used to be absolutely chock-full of staffs and id be amazed if the same isn't true of XL bullies now. Weird bit of trivia, Daschounds are on the dangerous dog list, purely due to how much the yappy little pricks bite anyone and everything 

my cousin (a small animal vet) said that Daschunds are the worst for attacks, as they can be very aggressive, and are responsible for most bites. Obviously unlikely to kill anyone, and appreciate that the majority are well trained and well behaved. He said the absolute worst he has to deal with are Sharpeis, but luckily they are rare.

Elthamaddick

we've got 2 small cavapoo's who are soppy as shit and great playing with the kids.

I've always been petrified of bigs dogs though (still am), never mind what breed!!

T_C_E

I said to an owner of a little Daschound that was giving my dog some abuse from the other side of the road, us German should stick together, most upset the woman shouted back "she was born in Maidstone" as I said you cant help stupid.