Rugby World Cup 2023

PrincessFiona

Lincsaddick said:

all this convoluted chat about the intricacies of the seeding and the draw, and so little about the actual GAMES .. worrying lol 

Not intricacies, but absolute basics of setting up a tournament fairly and professionally

Nug

killerandflash said:

Just about all sports use seedings to spread the teams around at major events. Imagine if the Football World Cup draw wasn't seeded and you ended up with

Group 1 - France, England, Argentina, Brazil
Group 2 - Sweden, South Korea, Paraguay, Egypt

i.e. the top 4 ranked countries at the moment all in one group. It would make for an exciting group stage, but having 2 of the top 4 in the world going out so early feels wrong.

But that’s not the case is it? Arguably one team in the top 8 had a tough group, Scotland. Apart from Fiji the best teams in the world are in the QF’s. Why bother having any smaller teams if all you’re gonna do is give the top 8 teams easy passage? And I’m not coming at this from an England point of view I dislike English rugby intensely and hope they lose to Fiji.

edit: I don’t disagree with some form of seeding to spread out the better teams, which this has done just don’t see why people are obsessed with it being the most important factor in teams playing each other, that’s sport right seeing some upsets.

KBslittlesis

Oh good.
Fiona and Chizz are at it again on another thread 🙄

PrincessFiona

Nug said:

killerandflash said:

Just about all sports use seedings to spread the teams around at major events. Imagine if the Football World Cup draw wasn't seeded and you ended up with

Group 1 - France, England, Argentina, Brazil
Group 2 - Sweden, South Korea, Paraguay, Egypt

i.e. the top 4 ranked countries at the moment all in one group. It would make for an exciting group stage, but having 2 of the top 4 in the world going out so early feels wrong.

But that’s not the case is it? Arguably one team in the top 8 had a tough group, Scotland. Apart from Fiji the best teams in the world are in the QF’s. Why bother having any smaller teams if all you’re gonna do is give the top 8 teams easy passage? And I’m not coming at this from an England point of view I dislike English rugby intensely and hope they lose to Fiji.

edit: I don’t disagree with some form of seeding to spread out the better teams, which this has done just don’t see why people are obsessed with it being the most important factor in teams playing each other, that’s sport right seeing some upsets.

How is this different to other sports though, would you like the football groups that killerandflash gave?

PrincessFiona

KBslittlesis said:

Oh good.
Fiona and Chizz are at it again on another thread 🙄

Are you the arbiter of what can and can't be discussed? Although I use the word 'discussed' loosely re Chizz. Plenty of other similar on other threads. No doubt if it were England it would be a completely different matter 

Nug

PrincessFiona said:

Nug said:

killerandflash said:

Just about all sports use seedings to spread the teams around at major events. Imagine if the Football World Cup draw wasn't seeded and you ended up with

Group 1 - France, England, Argentina, Brazil
Group 2 - Sweden, South Korea, Paraguay, Egypt

i.e. the top 4 ranked countries at the moment all in one group. It would make for an exciting group stage, but having 2 of the top 4 in the world going out so early feels wrong.

But that’s not the case is it? Arguably one team in the top 8 had a tough group, Scotland. Apart from Fiji the best teams in the world are in the QF’s. Why bother having any smaller teams if all you’re gonna do is give the top 8 teams easy passage? And I’m not coming at this from an England point of view I dislike English rugby intensely and hope they lose to Fiji.

edit: I don’t disagree with some form of seeding to spread out the better teams, which this has done just don’t see why people are obsessed with it being the most important factor in teams playing each other, that’s sport right seeing some upsets.

How is this different to other sports though, would you like the football groups that killerandflash gave?

They aren’t like that though are they? There aren’t five of the top teams in one group and 5 tier 2 nations in another. It’s obvious you feel Scotland got hard done by and if I were a Scottish fan maybe I’d feel the same. Obviously we aren’t going to agree and as someone said earlier we should focus on the great games ahead as it’s going round and round in circles.

KBslittlesis

PrincessFiona said:

KBslittlesis said:

Oh good.
Fiona and Chizz are at it again on another thread 🙄

Are you the arbiter of what can and can't be discussed? Although I use the word 'discussed' loosely re Chizz. Plenty of other similar on other threads. No doubt if it were England it would be a completely different matter 

Please.
You two just love winding each other up.
And what's England got to do with it? 
I'm an Ireland supporter in Rugby Union & I come here to talk about the world cup, not to witness you two take shots at each other as you seem to do in every thread you both inhabit.
It's dull.
And I'm entitled to point it out.
Whether you chose to do owt about it is up to you.

NornIrishAddick

Lincsaddick said:

all this convoluted chat about the intricacies of the seeding and the draw, and so little about the actual GAMES .. worrying lol 

And that, on the whole, it's been a fabulous tournament so far.

As an Ireland fan, having a really tough QF opponent is really helpful, we can believe ourselves underdogs in any matches that remain for us.

And, World Cup Quarter Finals being what they are for Ireland....

Chizz

KBslittlesis said:

PrincessFiona said:

KBslittlesis said:

Oh good.
Fiona and Chizz are at it again on another thread 🙄

Are you the arbiter of what can and can't be discussed? Although I use the word 'discussed' loosely re Chizz. Plenty of other similar on other threads. No doubt if it were England it would be a completely different matter 

Please.
You two just love winding each other up.
And what's England got to do with it? 
I'm an Ireland supporter in Rugby Union & I come here to talk about the world cup, not to witness you two take shots at each other as you seem to do in every thread you both inhabit.
It's dull.
And I'm entitled to point it out.
Whether you chose to do owt about it is up to you.

You're right. I apologise (to you and all other posters on here). I shouldn't react to people who post without good faith. Admonishment taken. 

MrWalker

TelMc32

NornIrishAddick said:

Lincsaddick said:

all this convoluted chat about the intricacies of the seeding and the draw, and so little about the actual GAMES .. worrying lol 

And that, on the whole, it's been a fabulous tournament so far.

As an Ireland fan, having a really tough QF opponent is really helpful, we can believe ourselves underdogs in any matches that remain for us.

And, World Cup Quarter Finals being what they are for Ireland....

I’m not sure we think of ourselves as underdogs any more @NornIrishAddick  😉

I think BOD said it best at the weekend. His team had several players with that winning mentality, but in this one the whole squad have that belief and the strength in depth is incredible. I honestly can’t wait to see Saturday’s game…and then the next two Saturdays too. 

KBslittlesis

TelMc32 said:

NornIrishAddick said:

Lincsaddick said:

all this convoluted chat about the intricacies of the seeding and the draw, and so little about the actual GAMES .. worrying lol 

And that, on the whole, it's been a fabulous tournament so far.

As an Ireland fan, having a really tough QF opponent is really helpful, we can believe ourselves underdogs in any matches that remain for us.

And, World Cup Quarter Finals being what they are for Ireland....

I’m not sure we think of ourselves as underdogs any more @NornIrishAddick  😉

I think BOD said it best at the weekend. His team had several players with that winning mentality, but in this one the whole squad have that belief and the strength in depth is incredible. I honestly can’t wait to see Saturday’s game…and then the next two Saturdays too. 

I must live in a strange part of Ireland then as there aren’t many here who think we’ll win. Or if they secretly do, they certainly aren’t saying it out loud 🫣😫😂😂😂😂

palarsehater

TelMc32 said:

NornIrishAddick said:

Lincsaddick said:

all this convoluted chat about the intricacies of the seeding and the draw, and so little about the actual GAMES .. worrying lol 

And that, on the whole, it's been a fabulous tournament so far.

As an Ireland fan, having a really tough QF opponent is really helpful, we can believe ourselves underdogs in any matches that remain for us.

And, World Cup Quarter Finals being what they are for Ireland....

I’m not sure we think of ourselves as underdogs any more @NornIrishAddick  😉

I think BOD said it best at the weekend. His team had several players with that winning mentality, but in this one the whole squad have that belief and the strength in depth is incredible. I honestly can’t wait to see Saturday’s game…and then the next two Saturdays too. 

The semi final if Ireland win is On a Friday night  

MrOneLung

I think the pressure is all on NZ in your game. 

Although obviously the fact Ireland have never won a knockout game may weigh heavily on them 

Sillybilly

Agree with the comments regarding the draw being unfortunate. However the only real consequence of any note has been Scotland’s early exit but when you see what Ireland did to them I don’t think there has been any significant impact other than denying we Scots a quarter final appearance to get miserable about. For me this first month has been a colossal waste of time. The fun starts next weekend. 

PrincessFiona

Nug said:

PrincessFiona said:

Nug said:

killerandflash said:

Just about all sports use seedings to spread the teams around at major events. Imagine if the Football World Cup draw wasn't seeded and you ended up with

Group 1 - France, England, Argentina, Brazil
Group 2 - Sweden, South Korea, Paraguay, Egypt

i.e. the top 4 ranked countries at the moment all in one group. It would make for an exciting group stage, but having 2 of the top 4 in the world going out so early feels wrong.

But that’s not the case is it? Arguably one team in the top 8 had a tough group, Scotland. Apart from Fiji the best teams in the world are in the QF’s. Why bother having any smaller teams if all you’re gonna do is give the top 8 teams easy passage? And I’m not coming at this from an England point of view I dislike English rugby intensely and hope they lose to Fiji.

edit: I don’t disagree with some form of seeding to spread out the better teams, which this has done just don’t see why people are obsessed with it being the most important factor in teams playing each other, that’s sport right seeing some upsets.

How is this different to other sports though, would you like the football groups that killerandflash gave?

They aren’t like that though are they? There aren’t five of the top teams in one group and 5 tier 2 nations in another. It’s obvious you feel Scotland got hard done by and if I were a Scottish fan maybe I’d feel the same. Obviously we aren’t going to agree and as someone said earlier we should focus on the great games ahead as it’s going round and round in circles.

It's not just about Scotland though as I have said at least 4 times. I don't 'feel' Scotland have been hard done by, the draw was too early and unfair - World Rugby have even agreed and admitted it!

PrincessFiona

Sillybilly said:

Agree with the comments regarding the draw being unfortunate. However the only real consequence of any note has been Scotland’s early exit but when you see what Ireland did to them I don’t think there has been any significant impact other than denying we Scots a quarter final appearance to get miserable about. For me this first month has been a colossal waste of time. The fun starts next weekend. 

No, it has affected the balance of the quarter finals. Only 2 of the top 4 can progress to the semis

Sillybilly

PrincessFiona said:

Sillybilly said:

Agree with the comments regarding the draw being unfortunate. However the only real consequence of any note has been Scotland’s early exit but when you see what Ireland did to them I don’t think there has been any significant impact other than denying we Scots a quarter final appearance to get miserable about. For me this first month has been a colossal waste of time. The fun starts next weekend. 

No, it has affected the balance of the quarter finals. Only 2 of the top 4 can progress to the semis

Agreed but the two quarter finals that should have been semi finals will probably decide the finalists when all is said and done. If you see what I mean……

PrincessFiona

KBslittlesis said:

PrincessFiona said:

KBslittlesis said:

Oh good.
Fiona and Chizz are at it again on another thread 🙄

Are you the arbiter of what can and can't be discussed? Although I use the word 'discussed' loosely re Chizz. Plenty of other similar on other threads. No doubt if it were England it would be a completely different matter 

Please.
You two just love winding each other up.
And what's England got to do with it? 
I'm an Ireland supporter in Rugby Union & I come here to talk about the world cup, not to witness you two take shots at each other as you seem to do in every thread you both inhabit.
It's dull.
And I'm entitled to point it out.
Whether you chose to do owt about it is up to you.

I don't like winding anyone up - I just correct Chizz! And point out when I have said is mis-quoted or incorrectly interpreted. It would help if Chizz (and others who do the same) would actually read and think about what I (and others) comment though!!

I only post on a few threads and am not aware of any problems on the Holiday or TV Series threads which are the main ones. I often don't even use CL for weeks, sometimes months at a time.

If it is dull, don't read our comments then - just as I don't read some threads or comments

PrincessFiona

As this is NOT just about Scotland (have I mentioned this before?), Andy Nicol sums it up very well -  

For those who can't work out 'what this has got to do with England', how different would the comments be of the unfair/uneven draw affected England. If it was in the football, it would be exponentially worse! Before the tournament, Stuart Hogg predicted England would be dark horses, partly because of the favourable draw

Rothko

That's how draws work Andy. 

Anyway, the tournament has no real momentum does it, I know the need for rest, but the group stage has taken what feels like an age, and have to hope it grabs some attention with the knock outs. 

PrincessFiona

Rothko said:

That's how draws work Andy. 

Anyway, the tournament has no real momentum does it, I know the need for rest, but the group stage has taken what feels like an age, and have to hope it grabs some attention with the knock outs. 

It isn't even the seeding is done properly. Can just see Alcoraz and Djokovic playing each other in the quarters at Wimbledon - not!

I agree about the momentum - and I think it is why the bad skewing of the quarters is even worse

KBslittlesis

PrincessFiona said:

KBslittlesis said:

PrincessFiona said:

KBslittlesis said:

Oh good.
Fiona and Chizz are at it again on another thread 🙄

Are you the arbiter of what can and can't be discussed? Although I use the word 'discussed' loosely re Chizz. Plenty of other similar on other threads. No doubt if it were England it would be a completely different matter 

Please.
You two just love winding each other up.
And what's England got to do with it? 
I'm an Ireland supporter in Rugby Union & I come here to talk about the world cup, not to witness you two take shots at each other as you seem to do in every thread you both inhabit.
It's dull.
And I'm entitled to point it out.
Whether you chose to do owt about it is up to you.

I don't like winding anyone up - I just correct Chizz! And point out when I have said is mis-quoted or incorrectly interpreted. It would help if Chizz (and others who do the same) would actually read and think about what I (and others) comment though!!

I only post on a few threads and am not aware of any problems on the Holiday or TV Series threads which are the main ones. I often don't even use CL for weeks, sometimes months at a time.

If it is dull, don't read our comments then - just as I don't read some threads or comments

Ah I see.
You’re always right.

I’m not playing this game, I’m out.

North Lower Neil

There's always a 'Group of Death' at tournaments, rugby, football, whatever.  Just luck of the draw.

2015 England were affected, getting Australia and Wales, the criticism was over the performance not the draw.

PrincessFiona

KBslittlesis said:

PrincessFiona said:

KBslittlesis said:

PrincessFiona said:

KBslittlesis said:

Oh good.
Fiona and Chizz are at it again on another thread 🙄

Are you the arbiter of what can and can't be discussed? Although I use the word 'discussed' loosely re Chizz. Plenty of other similar on other threads. No doubt if it were England it would be a completely different matter 

Please.
You two just love winding each other up.
And what's England got to do with it? 
I'm an Ireland supporter in Rugby Union & I come here to talk about the world cup, not to witness you two take shots at each other as you seem to do in every thread you both inhabit.
It's dull.
And I'm entitled to point it out.
Whether you chose to do owt about it is up to you.

I don't like winding anyone up - I just correct Chizz! And point out when I have said is mis-quoted or incorrectly interpreted. It would help if Chizz (and others who do the same) would actually read and think about what I (and others) comment though!!

I only post on a few threads and am not aware of any problems on the Holiday or TV Series threads which are the main ones. I often don't even use CL for weeks, sometimes months at a time.

If it is dull, don't read our comments then - just as I don't read some threads or comments

Ah I see.
You’re always right.

I’m not playing this game, I’m out.

Not what I said. But when it is fact. Obviously not when opinion

PrincessFiona

North Lower Neil said:

There's always a 'Group of Death' at tournaments, rugby, football, whatever.  Just luck of the draw.

2015 England were affected, getting Australia and Wales, the criticism was over the performance not the draw.

Indeed. World Rugby didn't learn from their mistake but hopefully will next time

In case anyone missed it, its not just about the group with 3 of the top 5 in it! I think this has been mentioned once or six time before

kinveachyaddick

The tournament has been very stop-start so far and hasn't grabbed my attention fully despite some superb games. (And i know this was to give each side equal recovery time which is 100% right but has to be groups of four in 2027 so no free weekends which has been a throwback to the Five Nations!).

Similarly, it's a real shame to the QFs crammed into two days. Again, I know it's for recovery time but surely one at least could have been on Friday night then two on Saturday and the final one on Sunday at 4pm. 

NornIrishAddick

KBslittlesis said:

TelMc32 said:

NornIrishAddick said:

Lincsaddick said:

all this convoluted chat about the intricacies of the seeding and the draw, and so little about the actual GAMES .. worrying lol 

And that, on the whole, it's been a fabulous tournament so far.

As an Ireland fan, having a really tough QF opponent is really helpful, we can believe ourselves underdogs in any matches that remain for us.

And, World Cup Quarter Finals being what they are for Ireland....

I’m not sure we think of ourselves as underdogs any more @NornIrishAddick  😉

I think BOD said it best at the weekend. His team had several players with that winning mentality, but in this one the whole squad have that belief and the strength in depth is incredible. I honestly can’t wait to see Saturday’s game…and then the next two Saturdays too. 

I must live in a strange part of Ireland then as there aren’t many here who think we’ll win. Or if they secretly do, they certainly aren’t saying it out loud 🫣😫😂😂😂😂

The Guinness Rugby World Cup ad accurately sums up the position.

Until Ireland actually get beyond a QF stage, we'll always be nervous. 

This weekend we play a New Zealand side that seems to be improving throughout the tournament and will offer a stern test, having a very good chance of beating us [even wording this statement as I have makes me feel that I am being overly cocky and setting us up for a fall].

I accept that Andy Farrell and his team think differently from most of the fans, but there's a clear nervousness among those Irish rugby fans that I know (there's even those super pessimistic types that argue we'll the QF and then lose abjectly in the SF, because we'll have taken it for granted).

MuttleyCAFC

The problem is some teams go down and some teams go up. England got to the Final in the last World Cup for instance and Ireland were decent but not as good as they are now. Also in football, you can get an easier side of the draw to the final. It isn't esy to get right. England could have got Australia in the quarters and that was on paper a more challenging match than Fiji.

Chizz

Officials named for the quarter finals 

Wales v Argentina 

Referee: Jaco Peyper (South Africa)

Assistant Referees: Karl Dickson (England), Andrea Piardi (Italy) 

TMO: Marius Jonker (South Africa)

Ireland v New Zealand  

Referee: Wayne Barnes (England) 

Assistant Referees: Matthew Carley (England), Christophe Ridley (England) 

TMO: Tom Foley (England)

England v Fiji 

Referee: Mathieu Raynal (France)

Assistant Referees: Nic Berry (Australia), Pierre Brousset (France)

TMO: Ben Whitehouse (Wales)

France v South Africa 

Referee: Ben O’Keeffe (New Zealand)

Assistant Referees: Paul Williams (New Zealand), James Doleman (New Zealand)

TMO: Brendon Pickerill (New Zealand)