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Who will be the new Charlton coach? - p103. Nathan Jones confirmed
Comments
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Completely forgot about Selles, probably because my initial thought was to look more towards the top of the tablefollett said:
Ironically, the man who replaced Jones at Southampton. Ruben Selles at ReadingBexleyheath_Addick said:Are there any teams in league 1 whose manager's last job was in the prem?1 -
Agreed, a close friend of mine is a Millwall ST holder (shocking I know), he said the football under Rowett got progressively worse year on year. Ground out some results (something we need right now, granted) but the manner of getting there was abysmal to watch.Chunes said:I feel like Nathan Jones is a more exciting name than Gary Rowett.1 -
I would like NJ could see the sense of Warnock not fussed by the others don’t like the idea of Neil4
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It would make a nice change to have a manager given enough time to compare how he's performing one season against the previous oneCovered_End_Lad said:
Agreed, a close friend of mine is a Millwall ST holder (shocking I know), he said the football under Rowett got progressively worse year on year. Ground out some results (something we need right now, granted) but the manner of getting there was abysmal to watch.Chunes said:I feel like Nathan Jones is a more exciting name than Gary Rowett.8 -
Oi! I think I'd be good.superdulvertonred said:I would like NJ could see the sense of Warnock not fussed by the others don’t like the idea of Neil
(I wouldn't).6 -
From reading the article posted on NJ feels like he’d want control of transfers too? Given his success at it at Luton0
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Darren Moore, anyone?0
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I think we can safely say the job is not too big for jones, he’s been there and done it in the championship, and dabbled in the prem albeit very short term. If this doesn’t excite us then no one will.We need to as fans wipe the slate clean. Take things step by step, first job survival, second job preparing the squad for next season, then hopefully hit league one hard come August. If we do go with him it’ll finally feel like the beginning of something for me at least.1
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view from a Saints season ticket holder:"Yes well all l can say they must be desperate to be considering Nathan Jones. All he did for us is make sure we got relegated, the team never recovered from his involvement.Sorry l could not be more positive, But as you say who in their right mind would want the job at this time.At least when you are down and out the only way is up and l must say it has been most enjoyable at St Mary's this season at least we have seen them winning, your good times will return."1
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Jones is a proven success and a proven failure. People seem to forget that last bit. My argument with Fleming is that we can correct it within a few games if it isn't having instant results.thenewbie said:
Because Jones is someone who has proven success at this level as a Head coach. Fleming is not. Its a gamble either way and I am not 100% sold on Jones but he's by every metric a safer gamble than Fleming.MuttleyCAFC said:
But what makes you so sure Jones will? I am not having a Fleming love in but I was happy with Saturday and what if he gets a result next week? Even if it is short term, do we throw that away for something that may go right or wrong. If it doesn't work with Fleming we still have time. Maybe one or two games less but we have an extra life as it were.thenewbie said:
And if we give Fleming a chance but he doesn't win any games, whoever we then get in has an even more difficult job and less time to rectify it in. So... no.MuttleyCAFC said:I am not against appointing him but I would like us to give Fleming a chance first. A two defeats (and some wins) or we bring somebody in chance over February. I think that is the common sense approach. I know some people don't share it but if Jones came in and failed that would fcuk us up. Somebody like him should be the lasp gasp option.
Fleming is caretaker and only the caretaker, his only priority right now is to try and stop the rot and provide the basics of continuity.
He's spent a career as assistant to the main coach, he's good at it, he seems quite content.
He is a decent guy from what I've seen but nowhere near the full time job.
Getting someone (anyone really) in over Fleming may go right or wrong yes. But sticking with Fleming may also go right or wrong and hard to justify as anything other than kicking the can down the road.
If we were in midtable doldrums going nowhere then Fleming would get longer. We're not, so he doesn't. Harsh on him maybe but that's the game.3 - Sponsored links:
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NJ sounds *very* boom or bust to me. High ceiling, low floor.He could be the man that leads us to the fringes of the Premier League BUT if he goes off the rails, he could be part of the succession of managers that send us into the fourth tier for the first time ever.
That is in stark contrast to the other front runners IMO who would I would say are more “low ceiling, high floor” appointments in Warnock, Neil, Rowett etc. They probably aren’t taking clubs to the Premier League these days, but they would definitely be able to get us up to the Championship and they certainly wouldn’t let us get relegated from League One.
If they want Jones I appreciate them having 1. the money to do it because it won’t be cheap and 2. the big bollocks to go with a risky appointment that might pay off in spades versus the safe pairs of hands.5 -
My view is that his bad patch at Southampton has no relevance to how he might do with us. The jobs are worlds apart, if we signed a player that was part of that relegation team we’d be thrilled. A sacking isn’t the undoing of every positive the guy has done.lancashire lad said:view from a Saints season ticket holder:"Yes well all l can say they must be desperate to be considering Nathan Jones. All he did for us is make sure we got relegated, the team never recovered from his involvement.Sorry l could not be more positive, But as you say who in their right mind would want the job at this time.At least when you are down and out the only way is up and l must say it has been most enjoyable at St Mary's this season at least we have seen them winning, your good times will return."6 -
Don't get the logic behind that thinking.MuttleyCAFC said:
Jones is a proven success and a proven failure. People seem to forget that last bit. My argument with Fleming is that we can correct it within a few games if it isn't having instant results.thenewbie said:
Because Jones is someone who has proven success at this level as a Head coach. Fleming is not. Its a gamble either way and I am not 100% sold on Jones but he's by every metric a safer gamble than Fleming.MuttleyCAFC said:
But what makes you so sure Jones will? I am not having a Fleming love in but I was happy with Saturday and what if he gets a result next week? Even if it is short term, do we throw that away for something that may go right or wrong. If it doesn't work with Fleming we still have time. Maybe one or two games less but we have an extra life as it were.thenewbie said:
And if we give Fleming a chance but he doesn't win any games, whoever we then get in has an even more difficult job and less time to rectify it in. So... no.MuttleyCAFC said:I am not against appointing him but I would like us to give Fleming a chance first. A two defeats (and some wins) or we bring somebody in chance over February. I think that is the common sense approach. I know some people don't share it but if Jones came in and failed that would fcuk us up. Somebody like him should be the lasp gasp option.
Fleming is caretaker and only the caretaker, his only priority right now is to try and stop the rot and provide the basics of continuity.
He's spent a career as assistant to the main coach, he's good at it, he seems quite content.
He is a decent guy from what I've seen but nowhere near the full time job.
Getting someone (anyone really) in over Fleming may go right or wrong yes. But sticking with Fleming may also go right or wrong and hard to justify as anything other than kicking the can down the road.
If we were in midtable doldrums going nowhere then Fleming would get longer. We're not, so he doesn't. Harsh on him maybe but that's the game.
Should we be giving Fleming the job because we can "correct it within a few games" or should we go for the person who can best deliver, in the regime's opinion, short and long term success?
I think the latter. We can as easily, though not as cheaply, sack Jones or whoever as sack Fleming. Waiting a few games isn't an option for us at the moment IMHO.
PS I like what I've seen of Fleming and can see why he's had a long career as an assistant as he would be the calm one in a crises and could smooth over problems and give individual players a lift. Wouldn't be at all unhappy if he stayed by the new manager's choice.17 -
You must remember that Saints fans were hailing Adkins as GOD when he came to us. We have such short memories as football fans!lancashire lad said:view from a Saints season ticket holder:"Yes well all l can say they must be desperate to be considering Nathan Jones. All he did for us is make sure we got relegated, the team never recovered from his involvement.Sorry l could not be more positive, But as you say who in their right mind would want the job at this time.At least when you are down and out the only way is up and l must say it has been most enjoyable at St Mary's this season at least we have seen them winning, your good times will return."13 -
That the common word on him dahn the den. AvoidCovered_End_Lad said:
Agreed, a close friend of mine is a Millwall ST holder (shocking I know), he said the football under Rowett got progressively worse year on year. Ground out some results (something we need right now, granted) but the manner of getting there was abysmal to watch.Chunes said:I feel like Nathan Jones is a more exciting name than Gary Rowett.0 -
Hang on, so what manager do we want? Someone who doesn’t have the capability of reaching the fringes of the premier league and rotting in the top half of league one every season? I’m not suggesting this is what you mean exactly but I think we need to have a bit of a reality check here. For where we are, Nathan Jones would be a very good appointment for the long term future of this club! Couldn’t give a toss about his Southampton and Stoke days…both clubs were in ruins before the day he joined them!!Callumcafc said:NJ sounds *very* boom or bust to me. High ceiling, low floor.He could be the man that leads us to the fringes of the Premier League BUT if he goes off the rails, he could be part of the succession of managers that send us into the fourth tier for the first time ever.
That is in stark contrast to the other front runners IMO who would I would say are more “low ceiling, high floor” appointments in Warnock, Neil, Rowett etc. They probably aren’t taking clubs to the Premier League these days, but they would definitely be able to get us up to the Championship and they certainly wouldn’t let us get relegated from League One.
If they want Jones I appreciate them having 1. the money to do it because it won’t be cheap and 2. the big bollocks to go with a risky appointment that might pay off in spades versus the safe pairs of hands.1 -
Jones had eight games at Southampton, one win, in the Premiership. Even we give managers more time than that. To use it as a stick to beat him with is a bit much imo.39
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In another universe, we weren't such a basket case club in 2013 and NJ never left us to go and work at Brighton.He should've been promoted to a first team role alongside Chris Powell here and been groomed as his successor. Instead everything went down the plughole and Powell was followed by Riga and Peeters and Luzon and Fraeye and Riga (part 2) and Slade and Karl Robinson.12
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I’m hoping NJ is our Eddie Howe - highly regarded, semi-one club man who first survives a relegation battle and kicks on from there. Remember that Howe failed at Burnley.13
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Nice to see a list of names and be happy with most of them!2
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It was a very good article but I'm on the fence about Nathan.
Yes, he's had some success but some of the stuff he came out with at Southampton sounded like Son of Mickey Apples.
I think because we've had more Managers than most clubs we're all simply conditioned to expect failure at some point.
You just know that if Warnock came in he'd probably lose every game, you just know his luck with previous clubs is going to run out at some point.
Its been said before that Pep or Klopp would struggle with our Mob because it's not that our players lack some quality.... What they lack is heart and passion and you either have it or you don't... That can't be coached.
For my two bob I would prefer Rowett as its not a massive gamble and I think he will steady the ship and boy do we need steadying.
Either way it's pretty depressing.1 -
It's not about turning him down - he absolutely has the most potential of all the candidates which is very exciting. I'm just saying that he has previous for going off the rails (Southampton didn't sack him so quickly without good reason) and if he goes off the rails again, the possibility of League 2 becomes even more real than it already is. That is not true of other candidates where there's a clear path/strategy to having them get us out of this league and then continue building on their work in a few years time with another manager who takes us up yet another level.cafc_se7 said:
Hang on, so what manager do we want? Someone who doesn’t have the capability of reaching the fringes of the premier league and rotting in the top half of league one every season? I’m not suggesting this is what you mean exactly but I think we need to have a bit of a reality check here. For where we are, Nathan Jones would be a very good appointment for the long term future of this club! Couldn’t give a toss about his Southampton and Stoke days…both clubs were in ruins before the day he joined them!!Callumcafc said:NJ sounds *very* boom or bust to me. High ceiling, low floor.He could be the man that leads us to the fringes of the Premier League BUT if he goes off the rails, he could be part of the succession of managers that send us into the fourth tier for the first time ever.
That is in stark contrast to the other front runners IMO who would I would say are more “low ceiling, high floor” appointments in Warnock, Neil, Rowett etc. They probably aren’t taking clubs to the Premier League these days, but they would definitely be able to get us up to the Championship and they certainly wouldn’t let us get relegated from League One.
If they want Jones I appreciate them having 1. the money to do it because it won’t be cheap and 2. the big bollocks to go with a risky appointment that might pay off in spades versus the safe pairs of hands.If this ownership is it for the long haul and can accept the risk that comes with that then more power to them. He could be the best manager we've had in a long long time.3 -
I would love a Charlton manager to get near howes record at burnleyTeeC said:I’m hoping NJ is our Eddie Howe - highly regarded, semi-one club man who first survives a relegation battle and kicks on from there. Remember that Howe failed at Burnley.
w 34
d 19
L w34
win ratio 39%0 -
They soon forgot about being 45 minutes away from the playoffs.Covered_End_Lad said:
Agreed, a close friend of mine is a Millwall ST holder (shocking I know), he said the football under Rowett got progressively worse year on year. Ground out some results (something we need right now, granted) but the manner of getting there was abysmal to watch.Chunes said:I feel like Nathan Jones is a more exciting name than Gary Rowett.6 -
I am not saying give him the job. If he provides an instant lift, I am saying go with it. If it proves to be more than that, then we have the discussion about giving him the job.Henry Irving said:
Don't get the logic behind that thinking.MuttleyCAFC said:
Jones is a proven success and a proven failure. People seem to forget that last bit. My argument with Fleming is that we can correct it within a few games if it isn't having instant results.thenewbie said:
Because Jones is someone who has proven success at this level as a Head coach. Fleming is not. Its a gamble either way and I am not 100% sold on Jones but he's by every metric a safer gamble than Fleming.MuttleyCAFC said:
But what makes you so sure Jones will? I am not having a Fleming love in but I was happy with Saturday and what if he gets a result next week? Even if it is short term, do we throw that away for something that may go right or wrong. If it doesn't work with Fleming we still have time. Maybe one or two games less but we have an extra life as it were.thenewbie said:
And if we give Fleming a chance but he doesn't win any games, whoever we then get in has an even more difficult job and less time to rectify it in. So... no.MuttleyCAFC said:I am not against appointing him but I would like us to give Fleming a chance first. A two defeats (and some wins) or we bring somebody in chance over February. I think that is the common sense approach. I know some people don't share it but if Jones came in and failed that would fcuk us up. Somebody like him should be the lasp gasp option.
Fleming is caretaker and only the caretaker, his only priority right now is to try and stop the rot and provide the basics of continuity.
He's spent a career as assistant to the main coach, he's good at it, he seems quite content.
He is a decent guy from what I've seen but nowhere near the full time job.
Getting someone (anyone really) in over Fleming may go right or wrong yes. But sticking with Fleming may also go right or wrong and hard to justify as anything other than kicking the can down the road.
If we were in midtable doldrums going nowhere then Fleming would get longer. We're not, so he doesn't. Harsh on him maybe but that's the game.
Should we be giving Fleming the job because we can "correct it within a few games" or should we go for the person who can best deliver, in the regime's opinion, short and long term success?
I think the latter. We can as easily, though not as cheaply, sack Jones or whoever as sack Fleming. Waiting a few games isn't an option for us at the moment IMHO.
PS I like what I've seen of Fleming and can see why he's had a long career as an assistant as he would be the calm one in a crises and could smooth over problems and give individual players a lift. Wouldn't be at all unhappy if he stayed by the new manager's choice.
I totally disagree with how easy it would be to sack Jones. There is a reputational element to this as well as a financial one.0 -
The days of getting a manager in with an impeccable record are going. What with the high turnover these days how can anyone expect that.6
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We have had so many of them we ought to be experts on managers.
It doesn’t look like we are.
Judging them on results seems to be the most reliable approach.0 -
Champagne football In this league? Have a word with yourself!Covered_End_Lad said:
Agreed, a close friend of mine is a Millwall ST holder (shocking I know), he said the football under Rowett got progressively worse year on year. Ground out some results (something we need right now, granted) but the manner of getting there was abysmal to watch.Chunes said:I feel like Nathan Jones is a more exciting name than Gary Rowett.
if they win 1-0 every week and it's a borefest most of the time I really couldnt give a flying proverbial5 -
We are not going to get perfection. Our choice is between managers with little or no experience, or managers with some degree of failure on their CV.They’ll be astute ones in the rising camp, and busted flushes in the experienced camp.We’ve just got to hope that at some stage we’ll get a good one. But never write someone off because they’ve had failure elsewhere. Without getting all Jake Humphrey, what you learn and adapt from failure is the most important thing and can hopefully improve you.25
