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POST-MATCH THREAD: Charlton Athletic vs Carlisle United: Saturday 9th March 2024 | KO 15:00

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Comments

  • mendonca said:
    There has been a very big and very necessary course correction and I for one have enjoyed watching it, so credit where it’s due. We are still left with a season that has been an unholy mess, however, and the architects of that are still very much in situ. I’d be very keen to limit their influence on next season, if I was a major shareholder picking up the bills for this. 
    Somebody will need to answer why we have 10+ players in a position that can accommodate 3 at most.

    An overbloat that isn't too dissimilar to Notts Forest's squad situation that was created a couple of seasons ago.
    Assuming we're talking centre-mid, I think we can only count 10+ if we include both the players we have in on loan, and the players contracted to us who are out on loan... but this doesn't seem particularly fair way of measuring squad size, since all will return to their parent clubs at the same time...  

    IMO 3 CMs starting means having 6 CMs in the squad, 3 to start, 3 to cover/rotate.  Excluding the players who are out on loan we currently have 8, of which Taylor and Camara have both been long-term injured this season, justifying use of the loan market to fill their spot (e.g. Bakinson in for Camara).

    Of course this has necessitated finding loans for Fraser, McGrandles and Henry, but I haven't heard anyone crying to have them back.  The bigger challenge is moving them on in the summer, not for squad bloat, but because they probably aren't good enough.
  • JohnnyH2 said:
    DOUCHER said:
    I don't think there's any evidence that the owners aren't doing their bit now - scott's performance, yes, but as far as investment, we have a very bloated squad now that must be costing a lot - if all 6 of our strikers were fit, we'd have 3 of the best target men and 3 of the best finishers in the league - we also have an abundance of central defenders and midfielders - as NJ says, the squad needs trimming in places and and adding to in others and i have every confidence that he'll get that right in the summer and next season we will be at the top end. I think our job now is simply to get behind it, help fill the stadium and help roar the team on. 
    Doesn't have to be asked, it's what supporters do.
    well there were a lot more doing it on saturday than there were when apples was manager but still plenty of empty seats  
  • edited March 11
    Oggy Red said:
    It’s quite bad tbf - completely understandable why he struggles to get a long term contract anywhere. Bouncing from club to club who need a short term solution. I think Chuks might end up going the same way once his deal here runs out.


    Last season Wickham proved his fitness with a decent spell at Forest Green, followed by an unsuccessful period at Cardiff, where he still featured regularly.

    Unlike Chuks, his major injury issues do seem to be in the past 
    I'm still puzzled as to why Wickham hasn't had a club all season.

    OK, I get clubs could be a bit cautious of his injury record..... but he had a full playing season last year, so unless big wage demands were the issue, I would have thought he'd have got fixed up at some club by the end of the summer transfer window.

    Right now he must be relieved to be playing again and have a job at last.


    A number of us were saying the same about Hector when he joined, turned out he’d been looking after his father for a bit (or similar, can’t recall exactly) or like NJ himself maybe Wickham just wanted a few months out to spend time with family etc, maybe?
    Good point, Large.

    Sure, there may have been a situation dictated by his personal circumstances. 
     
    @LargeAddick
     

  • 48 hrs later and I'm only back here to see the clip of Alfie slipping onto his arse.

    *walks away extremely disappointed............
  • 48 hrs later and I'm only back here to see the clip of Alfie slipping onto his arse.

    *walks away extremely disappointed............
    Maybe they're saving it for the bloopers section of the season highlights DVD  Tango?  It's looking pretty sparse up until NJ rode into town.
  • There has been a very big and very necessary course correction and I for one have enjoyed watching it, so credit where it’s due. We are still left with a season that has been an unholy mess, however, and the architects of that are still very much in situ. I’d be very keen to limit their influence on next season, if I was a major shareholder picking up the bills for this. 
    I genuinely take my hat off to you for those comments @Airman Brown it proves that we all in the end want the same thing and that is a club to be proud of ! When this mob came in we all looked to people like yourself with a lot more experience and resources to suss out the downsides and tbh at times I personally got worn down by all the constant negativity. You point about the big change in course is correct and imo it can only be coming from the owners. Forgetting the middle management for a second have the actual ownership started to give you more confidence that their intentions are good and are serious about progression for the club ?
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  • AndyG said:
    There has been a very big and very necessary course correction and I for one have enjoyed watching it, so credit where it’s due. We are still left with a season that has been an unholy mess, however, and the architects of that are still very much in situ. I’d be very keen to limit their influence on next season, if I was a major shareholder picking up the bills for this. 
    I genuinely take my hat off to you for those comments @Airman Brown it proves that we all in the end want the same thing and that is a club to be proud of ! When this mob came in we all looked to people like yourself with a lot more experience and resources to suss out the downsides and tbh at times I personally got worn down by all the constant negativity. You point about the big change in course is correct and imo it can only be coming from the owners. Forgetting the middle management for a second have the actual ownership started to give you more confidence that their intentions are good and are serious about progression for the club ?
    I’ve not questioned the serious money. I don’t see what other motive they can have. What I have questioned is whether they were presented with an accurate picture of the club and its potential, and whether they have understood the level of investment required to get a return taking that into account. Methven’s public comment on this suggested not.

    In my view this administration was set up as a vehicle for the benefit of people like Rodwell, Warrick, Methven, Scott and Lenegan, with Elliott clinging on to their coat tails. I don’t trust any of them, but if I’m wrong - or the main shareholders maintain and strengthen their grip - then so much the better. You certainly don’t need all these “executives” in L1. 

    But Nathan Jones is the right choice as manager for the situation we’re in and we can all see the team is better. Right now that’s all that matters.


    Im sure you are correct in terms of what I refer to as the "middle management" however if I were the owners regardless of how it was "pitched" they are now into a situation where they have invested pretty large sums already and I believe they will recognise that their only chance of seeing any return is to invest what is required to get us up the leagues and then if they want sell us and get their return. I think the club are certainly in a better place now than it has been for a significant number of years in terms of becoming the club we all love
  • edited March 12
    The main reason we won on Saturday was because of the sharpness of two strikers in a partnership. 

    "The harder that Kanu and May work the luckier they get" ?

    Yes, I pinched that from a Gary Player quote and Daniel who I had a one man campaign to not send him out on loan again after Southend has reaped the rewards of learning in the team and getting stronger while gradually improving and getting more confident with games.

    We have two goalscorers who both are hard workers and run miles for the cause.
    The only prediction I got wrong about  Kanu was he would play less games than Mason Burstow for Cafc before being sold so pleased that it's has taken longer for him to adjust to men's football. 

    Charlton weren't at their best after recent two away wins but in League 1 it's a given you must give 100% and that wasn't the case until Nathan Jones turned up.
    😱
  • One thing that has changed, is when they converted their penalty I was still pretty confident/relaxed we would win the game. 
  • BigDiddy said:
    BigDiddy said:
    Vital win, but as others have said, our squad needs a major rebuild

    Those not good enough or do not offer any value, in my view, must leave the club.

    I know I am off topic, but watching today, I thought what a job NJ has to get us into the promotion push next year.

    The problem will be Andy Scott, who is clueless on recruitment, given the chaotic nature of our squad.

    NJ looks a proper manager, but the sorting out of the squad need to start in early May.

    It is a massive challenge, but below is my take on it

    Must keeps 

    - Small
    - EDG 
    - ConCov
    - May 
    - Leaburn
    - Kanu
    - Dobbo [if he plays like today and wants to stay]
    - Anderson [ he will get better]

    Loans - please sort out the mess !

    The rubbish loanees can all go back to their parent club
    The rubbish we have loaned out - that’s a huge issue/problem

    Not good enough, so must go

    Goalkeepers - Isted and AMB
    Thomas - get rid
    Edun - get rid
    Ladapo - get rid
    Bakinson - get rid
    Hector - get rid
    Ness - sell or loan out
    Chin - sell or loan out
    L Watson - get rid 

    The “never fit”, so must go

    Taylor 
    Ramsey 
    Chuks
    Camara

    Jury’s still out….a risk 

    Ghillesphey 
    T Watson 
    Jones 
    Wickham [ his fitness will be the problem]

    Youngsters not quite ready, so loan out?

     Asiimwe - needs game time 
    Campbell - need game time
    Henry - last chance saloon 

    Never let them wear the shirt again [if they are still on our books]

    Payne
    Fraser
    Deejay
    Mcgrandles 
    Kirk
    Fiorini 

    Nice one on padding out the "must go" category with loan players... they will go - like the loan players do every season.



    edit to add (whilst I checked)

    Payne, DJ contracts are up end of season (so essentially no longer CAFC players), Kirk doesn't have a contract with us, Fiorini is another loan so really you are saying Fraser and Mcgrandles.

    You could have just said 'You don't know what you're talking about'.
    In your opinion….
    Obviously. So obviously, it doesn’t need stating. 
  • BigDiddy said:
    BigDiddy said:
    Vital win, but as others have said, our squad needs a major rebuild

    Those not good enough or do not offer any value, in my view, must leave the club.

    I know I am off topic, but watching today, I thought what a job NJ has to get us into the promotion push next year.

    The problem will be Andy Scott, who is clueless on recruitment, given the chaotic nature of our squad.

    NJ looks a proper manager, but the sorting out of the squad need to start in early May.

    It is a massive challenge, but below is my take on it

    Must keeps 

    - Small
    - EDG 
    - ConCov
    - May 
    - Leaburn
    - Kanu
    - Dobbo [if he plays like today and wants to stay]
    - Anderson [ he will get better]

    Loans - please sort out the mess !

    The rubbish loanees can all go back to their parent club
    The rubbish we have loaned out - that’s a huge issue/problem

    Not good enough, so must go

    Goalkeepers - Isted and AMB
    Thomas - get rid
    Edun - get rid
    Ladapo - get rid
    Bakinson - get rid
    Hector - get rid
    Ness - sell or loan out
    Chin - sell or loan out
    L Watson - get rid 

    The “never fit”, so must go

    Taylor 
    Ramsey 
    Chuks
    Camara

    Jury’s still out….a risk 

    Ghillesphey 
    T Watson 
    Jones 
    Wickham [ his fitness will be the problem]

    Youngsters not quite ready, so loan out?

     Asiimwe - needs game time 
    Campbell - need game time
    Henry - last chance saloon 

    Never let them wear the shirt again [if they are still on our books]

    Payne
    Fraser
    Deejay
    Mcgrandles 
    Kirk
    Fiorini 

    Nice one on padding out the "must go" category with loan players... they will go - like the loan players do every season.



    edit to add (whilst I checked)

    Payne, DJ contracts are up end of season (so essentially no longer CAFC players), Kirk doesn't have a contract with us, Fiorini is another loan so really you are saying Fraser and Mcgrandles.

    You could have just said 'You don't know what you're talking about'.
    In your opinion….
    Obviously. So obviously, it doesn’t need stating. 
    Why bother ?
  • edited March 14

  • edited March 14
    AndyG said:
    AndyG said:
    There has been a very big and very necessary course correction and I for one have enjoyed watching it, so credit where it’s due. We are still left with a season that has been an unholy mess, however, and the architects of that are still very much in situ. I’d be very keen to limit their influence on next season, if I was a major shareholder picking up the bills for this. 
    I genuinely take my hat off to you for those comments @Airman Brown it proves that we all in the end want the same thing and that is a club to be proud of ! When this mob came in we all looked to people like yourself with a lot more experience and resources to suss out the downsides and tbh at times I personally got worn down by all the constant negativity. You point about the big change in course is correct and imo it can only be coming from the owners. Forgetting the middle management for a second have the actual ownership started to give you more confidence that their intentions are good and are serious about progression for the club ?
    I’ve not questioned the serious money. I don’t see what other motive they can have. What I have questioned is whether they were presented with an accurate picture of the club and its potential, and whether they have understood the level of investment required to get a return taking that into account. Methven’s public comment on this suggested not.

    In my view this administration was set up as a vehicle for the benefit of people like Rodwell, Warrick, Methven, Scott and Lenegan, with Elliott clinging on to their coat tails. I don’t trust any of them, but if I’m wrong - or the main shareholders maintain and strengthen their grip - then so much the better. You certainly don’t need all these “executives” in L1. 

    But Nathan Jones is the right choice as manager for the situation we’re in and we can all see the team is better. Right now that’s all that matters.


    Im sure you are correct in terms of what I refer to as the "middle management" however if I were the owners regardless of how it was "pitched" they are now into a situation where they have invested pretty large sums already and I believe they will recognise that their only chance of seeing any return is to invest what is required to get us up the leagues and then if they want sell us and get their return. I think the club are certainly in a better place now than it has been for a significant number of years in terms of becoming the club we all love
    More evidence required. A month ago we were in danger of dropping into the bottom four in L1. 

    I don’t think the people you describe as middle management (but who are in fact the day to day decision makers) are any more than average at running a football club. They have brought in one or two people who are definitely below average at it and a bunch of consultants.

    Like I said, I back Nathan Jones and I’ve enjoyed the last few weeks, but really you need to see a lot more sustained progress before being sure the club is on the right path. Many people also believed it was when Southall and Sandgaard turned up. That said I agree that the overall ownership has no obvious interest that doesn’t coincide with that of supporters. It depends what their appetite and focus is, because it’s going to cost them many tens of millions. 
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  • BigDiddy said:
    BigDiddy said:
    BigDiddy said:
    Vital win, but as others have said, our squad needs a major rebuild

    Those not good enough or do not offer any value, in my view, must leave the club.

    I know I am off topic, but watching today, I thought what a job NJ has to get us into the promotion push next year.

    The problem will be Andy Scott, who is clueless on recruitment, given the chaotic nature of our squad.

    NJ looks a proper manager, but the sorting out of the squad need to start in early May.

    It is a massive challenge, but below is my take on it

    Must keeps 

    - Small
    - EDG 
    - ConCov
    - May 
    - Leaburn
    - Kanu
    - Dobbo [if he plays like today and wants to stay]
    - Anderson [ he will get better]

    Loans - please sort out the mess !

    The rubbish loanees can all go back to their parent club
    The rubbish we have loaned out - that’s a huge issue/problem

    Not good enough, so must go

    Goalkeepers - Isted and AMB
    Thomas - get rid
    Edun - get rid
    Ladapo - get rid
    Bakinson - get rid
    Hector - get rid
    Ness - sell or loan out
    Chin - sell or loan out
    L Watson - get rid 

    The “never fit”, so must go

    Taylor 
    Ramsey 
    Chuks
    Camara

    Jury’s still out….a risk 

    Ghillesphey 
    T Watson 
    Jones 
    Wickham [ his fitness will be the problem]

    Youngsters not quite ready, so loan out?

     Asiimwe - needs game time 
    Campbell - need game time
    Henry - last chance saloon 

    Never let them wear the shirt again [if they are still on our books]

    Payne
    Fraser
    Deejay
    Mcgrandles 
    Kirk
    Fiorini 

    Nice one on padding out the "must go" category with loan players... they will go - like the loan players do every season.



    edit to add (whilst I checked)

    Payne, DJ contracts are up end of season (so essentially no longer CAFC players), Kirk doesn't have a contract with us, Fiorini is another loan so really you are saying Fraser and Mcgrandles.

    You could have just said 'You don't know what you're talking about'.
    In your opinion….
    Obviously. So obviously, it doesn’t need stating. 
    Why bother ?
    Why bother what?
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