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England Cricket Team Summer 2019 -ICC World Cup and Ashes etc

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  • No "say" but will undoubtedly have "input". Selectors will always ask those who know the most about players.

    But yes he was picked on the back of the World Cup success. But Mr Magoo could have seen that he plays too far in front of him and will always get found out against serious pace with the red ball and four or five close fielders. As I say every single Surrey coach over the course of the last six years knew it too but the selectors still persisted in picking him to open. 

    Good job Mr Magoo, never had a say in picking the ODI team we might not have won the world cup, Jason has played 84 times for England in one day cricket a lot of them with Bayliss as coach who never played for Surrey, I don't think there is any bias towards Surrey, Burns Foakes and Curran have done ok, none of the selectors played for Surrey
  • Agreed Stewart could hardly say "there is a very good reason why Jason hasn't opened for us for six years" but, if he was being totally honest, he should have been a bit more forthright at the outset (and no doubt in his discussions with the selectors which he undoubtedly would have had) in saying that he should not be opening. Saying he was "better suited to the middle order" was a "get out of jail free card " for Roy if and when he failed at opening - so he could be given another opportunity in the middle order to the possible detriment of Denly who had already earned the right to stay at 4. 

    Notwithstanding all of that, what if Stewart does become England coach? Is the slate clean or might there just be a bit of bias albeit of the "unconscious" variety. We'll have to wait and see about that one but anyone who has been around as long as I have has seen how much influence the England coach and captain have - just look at some of the teams we've had littered with players from Surrey/Lancs/Yorks etc etc at various times, many of which should never have been anywhere near wearing an England shirt.

    Sadly for someone like Sam Northeast he's never had that "leg up".
      
    I agree to a certain extent. I think Stewie would have been saying something different in private to the selectors to what he said publicly to the media.

    Sometimes its not about being at an attractive county but also having a face that fits and being part of the in crowd. Look at Burns. Always overlooked for the england youth teams despite weight of runs. Always overlooked for the lions. Despite 6 years of over 1000 championship runs doing well with the captaincy and all round being very impressive he didnt come into england selection conversations until very late. And that despite a dozen or so others had tried and failed to open. He only got a lions call up when the selectors realised he was the only option for the test side and had never played for the lions.

    Foakes is a bit different as he was always highly thought of and played through england youth and the lions setup. But, not part of the in crowd so dropped despite being the best keeper in the country if not world and having a test batting average over 40 (higher than most batsmen in the side).

  • Good job Mr Magoo, never had a say in picking the ODI team we might not have won the world cup, Jason has played 84 times for England in one day cricket a lot of them with Bayliss as coach who never played for Surrey, I don't think there is any bias towards Surrey, Burns Foakes and Curran have done ok, none of the selectors played for Surrey
    Yes but I've also heard that the teas at the Oval and Champagne is the best in the country!
  • Coincidentally I have just received a text from a "trusted source" that Stewart will be the next England coach albeit under a different title.

    Please do not shoot the messenger - especially if he is wrong!
    Not sure how I feel about this. Stewie is brilliant and I'd be disappointed to see him leave surrey. 

    I suspect he will have some kind of manager title rather than coach as he isn't coach at surrey. Although there have always been questions over who does what as he is incredibly hands on. With all the specialist coaches and the likes of Collingwood there as an assistant coach then I think the role is mich more management than coaching anyway.

    Might mean the end of the Yorkshire clique and Bairstow finally having to bat where it's best for the team rather than where it's best for him. Will likely mean Foakes and Pope get a go (as they should whoever is coach) although Stewie may well be keen to avoid being seen as too surrey. 
  • Yes but I've also heard that the teas at the Oval and Champagne is the best in the country!

    Better than Lords?

  • Better than Lords?
    I wouldn't know. It's bacon butty and asti spumante for us Kent supporters
  • edited September 2019
    Interesting thoughts coming out about role of selector... is it an out dated role? Especially considering Ed Smith still has to report to Ashley Giles, seems like a convoluted and unnecessary role. Especially since no other sport has such a structure.

    There’s no doubting Ed Smith is a highly intelligent man, and I was a big fan of his at Kent and was gutted when he left, but is it wise giving some one with no coaching experience and a not very successful international career such a big say in selection? 

    As for smith being a reason why denly has been selected, I always thought denly batted in a similar way to smith, as in, loves to play with a straight bat and when it clicks are/were wonderful players to watch.


  • Imagine being as good as Olliie Pope and not getting picked for england!
  • Sibley and Pope are the next cabs off the rank I think 


  • Imagine being as good as Darren Stevens and not getting picked for england!
    Seriously, interesting that Pope was batting at 4 today, as his problem has been that until this summer England were weak in the top 3, but had a really strong lower middle order where Pope wants to play. The following were all ahead of him
    Root
    Bairstow
    Buttler
    Stokes
    Curran
    Moeen
    Now things have changed, you can imagine a vacancy or 2

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  • Pope is 21, will deffo get his chance. 
  • https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27571263/england-not-good-think-are

    Not sure if this has been posted before. But a great analysis of England’s red ball problems.

  • Seriously, interesting that Pope was batting at 4 today, as his problem has been that until this summer England were weak in the top 3, but had a really strong lower middle order where Pope wants to play. The following were all ahead of him
    Root
    Bairstow
    Buttler
    Stokes
    Curran
    Moeen
    Now things have changed, you can imagine a vacancy or 2

    Pope started batting 4 after his England call up last season and continued to do so this season before and after his bad shoulder dislocation injury. His good form has continued at 4. 

    However he should be picked for England  at 5. That's the best way to do things and how they always were done. Let the new players (other than specialist openers and number 3's) start off at 5 or 6 and then gradually move up the order. We saw it with Bell, KP, Colly and even Trotty made his debut at 4 before moving up the order.
  • Sibley
    Burns
    Root
    Denly
    Pope
    Stokes
    Bairstow
    Curran
    Archer
    Leach
    Broad

    Is the team I'd have played at The Oval.
  • Foakes is better than Bairstow !
  • Sibley
    Burns
    Root
    Denly
    Pope
    Stokes
    Bairstow
    Curran
    Archer
    Leach
    Broad

    Is the team I'd have played at The Oval.
    The lack of spinner would concern me, especially if Stokes can't bowl...

    I do feel Denly has been underbowled in this series though. It would be interesting to see Australia batting on a day 5 pitch where his part time leggies would be more of a threat
  • The lack of spinner would concern me, especially if Stokes can't bowl...

    I do feel Denly has been underbowled in this series though. It would be interesting to see Australia batting on a day 5 pitch where his part time leggies would be more of a threat
    Leach?
  • The whole set up needs a restructure IMO.

    Have an overall “director of cricket” and then separate players, coaches and even selectors for red ball and white ball cricket.

    It’s clear that we are not Australia and our players cannot be the best at one without dragging down the quality of the other.

    The simplest and most drastic way to fix that is to treat these two teams as separate entities as much as possible.

    Red ball form does not get you picked for the white ball team (Cook, Ballance...) and white ball form does not get you picked for the red ball team (Roy, Buttler, Bairstow...).

    That should be the end of it.
    Agreed. And only the world class players (Root Stokes Archer) and all rounders (Moeen, Woakes) should play both and when they do their workload should be very carefully managed.
  • Leach?
    Oops, for some reason I misread Leach as someone else  :o

    In that case it's Curran as 3rd seamer that concerns me if Stokes can't bowl. A 4th seamer really
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  • Agreed. And only the world class players (Root Stokes Archer) and all rounders (Moeen, Woakes) should play both and when they do their workload should be very carefully managed.
    I would include broad as world class
  • Curren and Woakes in for the final test.
    Roy and Overton dropped. 
    Just announced. 
  • Team confirmed 

    Curran & Woakes in for Overton & Roy 
  • Curren and Woakes in for the final test.
    Roy and Overton dropped. 
    Just announced. 
    Which is what I thought would happen

    If Stokes has an injury and can't bowl we need the extra all rounder, which meant that either Roy or Buttler would be dropped
  • Which is what I thought would happen

    If Stokes has an injury and can't bowl we need the extra all rounder, which meant that either Roy or Buttler would be dropped
    Yep.
    And it's confirmed Stokes is playing as a batsman only. 
    He won't be bowling 
  • Team confirmed 

    Curran & Woakes in for Overton & Roy 
    Feel sorry for Overton.
    Clearly a wholehearted cricketer and didn't let himself down in a poor team performance.
  • I would include broad as world class
    In terms of all formats? Whilst he is a legend and a world class test bowler, I wouldn't have him near the limited overs sides. 
  • Feel sorry for Overton.
    Clearly a wholehearted cricketer and didn't let himself down in a poor team performance.
    Agreed but let's be honest, Woakes is a better player if fit. 
  • Feel sorry for Overton.
    Clearly a wholehearted cricketer and didn't let himself down in a poor team performance.
    Yep showed a hell of a lot of guts and character. However has to be judged on his bowling first and foremost and in any world hes not in our best 3 bowlers.
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