Tahnoon interested in buying Dinamo Bucharest?

Grapevine49 said:

HP I frankly would expect better from you. Is that the best you can offer? Dispute one word I have said as not being factual.

CB - Talk about conflating issues - what precisely has the actions or non actions undertaken by ESI during the transfer window have to do with ABDB?

THEY ARE DIFFERENT BUSINESSES WITH A DIFFERENT BENEFICIAL OWNER.

I will happily discuss the merits or other wise of the ESI performance within the January transfer window when I can find the time indeed if you look back to my comments in January you will see my clear aspirations in the matter. It has absolutely fuck all to do with ABDB.

Where is there one line in any documentation financially linking ABDB to ESI? If you can find one you had better send it to the EFL because I am pretty certain ESI in submitting their credentials to the EFL made clear no such link existed.

Who knows they could revoke the ESI licence and then lets see where that leaves us?

You might understand banking but you’re clueless about PR.

oohaahmortimer said:

Two separate things ABDB are loaded and can afford to buy The Valley
HE Tahnoon Nimer is skint in comparison and is seeking investment from others to be able to buy The Valley 

This for me.

@Grapevine49. Do you know the respective worth of said entities ? It appears that ESI was set up solely to buy CAFC (and therefore requires funding from HE, MS and others) whereas ADBD is the group that invests all the money for one of the Royals, and who we thought were buying us. 

Chris_from_Sidcup said:

golfaddick said:

oohaahmortimer said:

Two separate things ABDB are loaded and can afford to buy The Valley
HE Tahnoon Nimer is skint in comparison and is seeking investment from others to be able to buy The Valley 

This for me.

@Grapevine49. Do you know the respective worth of said entities ? It appears that ESI was set up solely to buy CAFC (and therefore requires funding from HE, MS and others) whereas ADBD is the group that invests all the money for one of the Royals, and who we thought were buying us. 

So why would ESI buy us and ADBD (allegedly) buy Dinamo?

Surely given the money in English football, you'd expect the richer entity to buy us?

Not much money to be made in the third tier. 

Addickted said:

stonemuse said:

Addickted said:

Understand @Grapevine49's comparison between HE's private investment (CAFC) and his professional investments for ADBD.

However, my concern is that we were led to believe that HE had the full backing of ADBD to assist in driving forward his aspirations for CAFC - so there is a direct link between his private and professional investments.

Led to believe by who? Or did we all assume it?

Pretty sure it was suggested by Matt Southall - however, all the links to articles about ESI on the OS go to an empty page!

I am fairly sure he did not suggest this. 

Harry Gregory said:

Chris_from_Sidcup said:

golfaddick said:

oohaahmortimer said:

Two separate things ABDB are loaded and can afford to buy The Valley
HE Tahnoon Nimer is skint in comparison and is seeking investment from others to be able to buy The Valley 

This for me.

@Grapevine49. Do you know the respective worth of said entities ? It appears that ESI was set up solely to buy CAFC (and therefore requires funding from HE, MS and others) whereas ADBD is the group that invests all the money for one of the Royals, and who we thought were buying us. 

So why would ESI buy us and ADBD (allegedly) buy Dinamo?

Surely given the money in English football, you'd expect the richer entity to buy us?

That is exactly what I do not understand. There seems as much smoke and mirrors as there was when the Spivs bought us. I assumed fairly soon that Kevin Cash was the main man as Slater had for many years been his personal legal representative and he was a mate of Jimenez. I see Southall as somewhere between the Jimenez and Slater role but why buy us directly through a created company and buy a Romanian team through the Sheikhs empire is beyond me as surely we would be a better punt for a return eventually?

Only thing i can think of is that ADBD are actually involved with us, but they created ESI as a separate entity to get round any potential problems with Abu Dhabi links to Sheikh Mansour. In Romania i doubt they care about links to Man City.

Although our perceived lack of January squad investment means i'm probably wrong there!

The credentials of Tahnoon Nimer are one thing, but the credentials of Matt Southall, Lee Amis and others are another. There’s no obvious evidence that these two have such credentials and plenty to suggest they don’t. There’s also a great deal of noise within football about Southall and what is going on at Charlton. It is the subject of much external discussion and fans would not be encouraged if they were party to it. Suffice to say it is not being contradicted from within the club.

@grapevine49 asks, in terms, whether a prudent investor would rush in to buy the freeholds - a better question is whether a prudent investor would agree to pay £50m, which is roughly twice what other people, including Kieran Maguire, think the club is worth. And if there is no such commitment then fans have been misled, haven’t they?

ESI’s efforts have been focused on selling on parts of a business that currently has no value - a probable £1 purchase with a circa £50m debt attached to its assets - in order to acquire the freeholds at an inflated price. Unsurprisingly, they appear to be struggling to do that.

Either Nimer is behind this fanciful approach, in which case questions need to be asked about his judgement, or he has been led up the garden path by Southall, in which case the same questions apply.

TYPING IN CAPITALS DOESN'T MAKE YOUR POINT COME ACROSS ANY BETTER 

Airman Brown said:

The credentials of Tahnoon Nimer are one thing, but the credentials of Matt Southall, Lee Amis and others are another. There’s no obvious evidence that these two have such credentials and plenty to suggest they don’t. There’s also a great deal of noise within football about Southall and what is going on at Charlton. It is the subject of much external discussion and fans would not be encouraged if they were party to it. Suffice to say it is not being contradicted from within the club.

@grapevine49 asks, in terms, whether a prudent investor would rush in to buy the freeholds - a better question is whether a prudent investor would agree to pay £50m, which is roughly twice what other people, including Kieran Maguire, think the club is worth. And if there is no such commitment then fans have been misled, haven’t they?

ESI’s efforts have been focused on selling on parts of a business that currently has no value - a probable £1 purchase with a circa £50m debt attached to its assets - in order to acquire the freeholds at an inflated price. Unsurprisingly, they appear to be struggling to do that.

Either Nimer is behind this fanciful approach, in which case questions need to be asked about his judgement, or he has been led up the garden path by Southall, in which case the same questions apply.

You know what you know Airman and obviously have to be careful about what you say, but I am beginning to worry/think that there’s a bit of a disconnect here.

Hope I’m wrong and Nimer is on board, has a plan and everything will be moving forward in the summer, regardless if we get relegated (a dog is for life, not just for Xmas) 

Grapevine49 said:

I will be commenting more fully on the nature of events in the next few days through other threads but some of you need to calm down. Social media has become a tool for unwarranted panic.

As far as I can determine ABDB is the name in the frame for the Romanian investment.

ABDB as a separate entity has no financial interest in Charlton Athletic Football Club.

His Excellency Tahnoon Nimer has a day job.

He is Chairman of ABDB.

As I said I will try to add some perspective to the churn that has recently evolved in the coming days. It will likely be lengthy, detailed and I will give you no more guarantees about our future than anyone else but the hysteria serves absolutely no one.

Some of you however need to take a serious look at yourselves, at the history of this club and your expectations in relation to todays Professional Football Industry. Just how many times do we have to travel the same loop before it registers.

This industry stopped being a corner shop enterprise zone decades ago.

No one but no one turns round a business which has been in decline for over a decade, unless the slate has been swiped clean through administration, in a matter of weeks.

To get this right is going to take the long strategic planning and investment of which the club has been completely devoid for far, far too long, certainly considerably longer than 10 weeks.

A bientot       

Right, I don’t think you can turn things around in ten weeks, but ESI have managed in that timeframe to create a situation such that things are now much worse on the pitch (given that we are now in the relegation zone) and off the pitch (with the separation of club and stadium ownership). That’s a fairly impressive level of incompetency.

Stan Kroenke picks up the shiny phone in his Emirates office. 

He speed dials Ed Woodward. 

Stan: Ed, it's me Stan. Listen, Matt Southall wears Hello Kitty pajamas under his suit, pass it on.

Ed: ... Matt who?

Grapevine49 said:

I am sorry to shout but what do you not understand?

HOW DOES AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT CORPORATE ENTITY BUYING INTO A ROMANIAN FOOTBALL CLUB HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH CHARLTON ATHLETIC FOOTBALL CLUB.

HETahnoon Nimer has a duty as a Director and beneficial owner to serve the interests of Charlton Athletic Football Club.

HE Tahnoon Nimer has a duty as Chairman of ABDB to serve its interests in representing that organisation in the pursuit of its investment targets.

One is a personal professional commitment the other is a professional professional commitment.

I was under the impression when ESI were asked about this rumour in January they advised they could not comment  as they had no connection to ABDB. Do you understand those words?

So it is neither bonkers or a pisstake.

It is standard friggin practice.

Working Retail and Corporate Banking where a client has his Business and Personal Accounts you have two entirely different conversations.

When talking about the Business the focus is on the banks services to and the individuals duty and performance in serving that Business. Their personal interests in both areas are entirely secondary.

If they wish to discuss their personal financial requirements it is an entirely different conversation.

You and they would conflate the two at your peril because all too often there is a danger of creating a conflict of interest which will serve no one.

Now IF HE has misled ESI and us you have a valid argument but you have no evidence such is the case.

When will this never ending rush to judgement without the facts ever end. It is reckless and counter productive.

@Grapevine your reasoning and rationale is correct.  However, you are coming at it from the position of an experienced banker and seeing the cold, harsh realities of the modern corporate football industry. 

 You are ahead of the curve in that respect in your thinking and acceptance of what something that we have all loved since childhood has now become.

Most of our initial posts on this matter from the Instagram post (certainly mine) was from the knee- jerk reaction of a football fan first and foremost travelling home from a bitter, hard-hitting consequential defeat and despite how logical and brutally correct your explanation may be it still felt like a very heavy kick in the proverbials seeing that our hopes for the new ownership may not be what we had so hoped for and having previously been bitten so visciouslsy by a similar model.

Charlton is a key part of my life and most on here.  It is elevated to a platform of importance that soars beyond rationality, real priority and often sanity.   How many times will some of us had a loved one, friend or colleague look at us with bemusement as we pay a fortune to get up at 4am to traipse to some far flung outpost for a day’s heartbreak or invest time, finances and resources to an institution that can completely obliterate our happiness based on the outcome of 22 men kicking a football and increasingly over the years the off the field workings that heavily influence the loading of the dice as to how successful your 11 men will be at kicking that football.

 

I saw the Instagram picture whilst travelling back with fellow glum supporters who had had their week’s ruined based on the lapse of concentration of our committed but under resourced squad due to a previously indifferent, cold and clinical businessman in Belgium who believed he could use his corporate wiles to  make a go of a football club.  And when it failed and generations of us fans who did not buy into his cold business perspective of how to run our 100 plus year old institution the conflict between the objective cold hard reality of modern corporate football culture vs the subjective sentimentality, emotion and passionate footballing worldview of supporters was played out in real time painfully graphic detail for every Charlton fan.

The underlying sense of fear and trepidation (whether warranted or not, and time will tell on this) that we may be entering into a repeat situation of course fans the flames and makes us more sensitive and forceful in our reactions and their immediacy. When we see what we have been through in our history and what happens with the likes of Bury...no possiiblity is too far of a stretch in our subconscious.

Louis is not a sensationalist journalist and I find his output extremely diplomatic, balanced and professional.  But instagram snippet outlines that despite however correct and “that’s the reality of it” your points may be it doesn’t make it right or easy to swallow.

If fans are expected to accept that this is the modern game and our clubs are commodities to be invested in as part of a diverse portfolio via different global vehicles then maybe the reality is that we have to accept it.   However the flaw with that is by that logic and rationale as customers or shareholders we would expect a satisfactory return on our investment (financial, time and other) and the market would deem that we would all gravitate away from the Charltons and to the Liverpools, Man City’s and Barcelonas. 

 

It can’t be both ways….football fans cannot be expected to accept their clubs as corporate entities being run in line with corporate business principles and market forces- but then expected to maintain loyalty and commitment and patronage to under resourced, ill managed and under  performing businesses in perpetuity.  It would not happen in the business world yet the emotional draw, history and nature of supporting football sees that we are increasingly expected to.

 

So whilst yes, I am cynical of modern football and my calmed head tells me that it is the reality of the game these days and from a business sense it is not inexplicable or intentionally disrespectful, my heart and stomach won’t let me accept that it is right, particularly in the immediacy of a crushing defeat that is materially detrimental to the immediate and potential long term well being of something we cherish so dear.

 

And that is something the money men and corporate suits who continue to manipulate and bastardise our game will never ever understand.

We are still there not because we endorse what they do, but because we can never walk away from what we have loved all our lives.

I bet Andrew Muir is laughing into his scarf.

We have been sold up the river & imho are in a worst state than we were 3 months ago.

ESI have no more funding than the Aussies did.

Dazzler21 said:

Just to confirm there is no ABDB

But there is ADBD.

There is ABDB, they done Take A Chance and Waterloo